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The Fire Murray/Carlyle Thread (Edit: Carlyle Fired)

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Old
11-18-2011, 02:35 PM
  #101
JabbaJabba
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Originally Posted by OccupySheen View Post
Cogliano actually looks good on the second line its to early to write him off he clearly adds something to the team...

I'd like to see Holland up as the permanent 3rd line center for the year. Same for Palmieri these guys can help us now, put them with a veteran, maybe Hagman and ride the kids out unless they show they cant play.

Send down Mcmillan to find his game.

if we dont get a spark from the kids then you look at a big time trade or you wait til the trade deadline and start moving vets.

Koivu, Lydman, Visnosvky, Blake, Beauchemin...all would have value
I agree with what you are saying except traiding Beauchemin at the deadline.

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11-18-2011, 03:37 PM
  #102
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Lydman and Vis and blake maybe. No way Beauch.

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11-18-2011, 03:42 PM
  #103
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We would never get the same value for Beauchemin that we gave up for him.

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11-18-2011, 03:43 PM
  #104
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We would never get the same value for Beauchemin that we gave up for him.
This. if we sacrifice Lupul and gardiner for 1 year of beauch I will be pissed.

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11-18-2011, 04:06 PM
  #105
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Vis will have great value
Lydman as well but slightly less
Blake no value even with his expiring contract
Koivu if we are lucky a late 3 rd pick
Agree no on Beauch

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11-18-2011, 04:06 PM
  #106
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I'm on board with firing both obviously if just one Murray has been brutal as a fml

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11-18-2011, 04:12 PM
  #107
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No surprise btw last year we had a soft team not as bad as now and Murray finally decided to add toughness getting Ruutu and winchester and no surprise they finished strong, were fun to watch and won games. Again the pos refuses to get tough players and look at the results.
Let me make it clear before my words get twisted the main reason was the play of rpg and the top 4 of the defense but the toughness helped create space for the high end players and with hitting softened up the opposing D.
Boston is the showing the league you could play a intimidating game and win

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11-18-2011, 04:25 PM
  #108
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No surprise btw last year we had a soft team not as bad as now and Murray finally decided to add toughness getting Ruutu and winchester and no surprise they finished strong, were fun to watch and won games. Again the pos refuses to get tough players and look at the results.
Let me make it clear before my words get twisted the main reason was the play of rpg and the top 4 of the defense but the toughness helped create space for the high end players and with hitting softened up the opposing D.
Boston is the showing the league you could play a intimidating game and win
Anaheim finished strong because their best players were their best players. A tough player can create space for the skill players, but not when they aren't on the ice together. Winchester going out on the ice and being physical doesn't create space for a player like Perry, because they aren't on the same line. That would be like Dan Sexton creating space for Getzlaf, because he's fast and speed backs players off, even though they never played together.

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11-18-2011, 04:46 PM
  #109
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I don't see the point of dealing Lydman or Visnovsky, not unless the team is rebuilding or they get an offer that is just too good to pass up. It's bad enough that the 2nd line will need a shake up and that Beauch must be re-signed. Not to mention that Lubo at $3 mil can be a huge bargain. The holes left by Lubo, Toni and Teemu can't be filled over a summer, and then you add in that Beauch possible goes elsewhere and that an upgrade is needed for Koivu. That's a pretty hard task, even for a team that can spend up to the cap. If the Ducks are serious about contending for a playoff spot in 12/13, it wouldn't make sense to trade them, especially not both of them.

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11-18-2011, 04:47 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Sojourn View Post
Anaheim finished strong because their best players were their best players. A tough player can create space for the skill players, but not when they aren't on the ice together. Winchester going out on the ice and being physical doesn't create space for a player like Perry, because they aren't on the same line. That would be like Dan Sexton creating space for Getzlaf, because he's fast and speed backs players off, even though they never played together.
Winchester took shifts on the top line but creating space is not just done when on the ice together its done by punishing opposing d slowing them down

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11-18-2011, 04:54 PM
  #111
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Winchester took shifts on the top line but creating space is not just done when on the ice together its done by punishing opposing d slowing them down
In a 60 minute game that's a stretch. In a 7-game series? Yeah, maybe then you have an argument. You're talking about two players, who got maybe 10 minutes a game, and were likely only on the ice against bottom six players and 3rd pairings.

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11-18-2011, 04:59 PM
  #112
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Winchester took shifts on the top line but creating space is not just done when on the ice together its done by punishing opposing d slowing them down
Winchester and, especially Ruutu, were scratched here and there, they hardly had much of an impact. I'm sure that if Murray and Carlyle thought so, they would make an attempt to re-sign them. Instead Ruutu can't find himself a new job in the NHL and Winchester was one of the very last free agents to get a contract.

I don't have anything against size in the line up, and I too think that the Ducks middle six is lacking it. But you don't build your 3rd line around Winchester/Ruutu or Chipchura/Bodie, just see where they are now... Boston had gritty players who could actually make a pass as well, same thing when the Ducks won.


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11-18-2011, 05:26 PM
  #113
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Winchester and, especially Ruutu, were scratched here and there, they hardly had much of an impact. I'm sure that if Murray and Carlyle thought so, they would make an attempt to re-sign them. Instead Ruutu can't find himself a new job in the NHL and Winchester was one of the very last free agents to get a contract.

I don't have anything against size in the line up, and I too think that the Ducks middle six is lacking it. But you don't build your 3rd line around Winchester/Ruutu or Chipchura/Bodie, just see where they are now... Boston had gritty players who could actually make a pass as well, same thing when the Ducks won.

Parros, May and Thornton are not what i call players who are known for their passing skills, Bodie/Chipchura were a great 3rd line in fact ive said again when they were 2/3rd of the 3rd line the team had its best run that season. Murray is not someone who like tough players of course he will not re-sign and in fact does not even draft much toughness.

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11-18-2011, 05:39 PM
  #114
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Parros, May and Thornton are not what i call players who are known for their passing skills, Bodie/Chipchura were a great 3rd line in fact ive said again when they were 2/3rd of the 3rd line the team had its best run that season. Murray is not someone who like tough players of course he will not re-sign and in fact does not even draft much toughness.
May and Thornton were on the 4th line. I wouldn't have a problem with Winchester/Bodie/Chipchura being 4th liners playing limited minutes to provide some energy, but I don't think they would fix the 3rd line.

If Carlyle decides to play Beleskey on the 4th line once Parros is back, I don't think the 4th line is a problem at all from a grit/toughness aspect. I don't like a combination of Blake/Cogliano/McMillan/Gordon on the 3rd line though, so I'm all with you there.

The problem right now isn't just that they are small though, they simply aren't good enough. Gordon can't provide scoring depth at this level, McMillan has taken a step back this season and probably shouldn't be anywhere higher than on the 4th line for the time being. Hagman was a good pick up for the simple fact that he's just plain better than Gordon, McMillan and DSP. Though, I would like a physical 3rd line center who can make a play as I'm not a fan of McMillan playing center.


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Old
11-20-2011, 05:53 PM
  #115
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An educated guess: If the Anaheim Ducks continue to struggle, donít be surprised if Randy Carlyle winds up as the leading candidate to replace Ron Wilson as Leafs coach at the end of this season. And GM Bob Murray has to be regretting the three-year extension he gave Carlyle late last season... Strange thing about the Ducks: They had the consensus best line in hockey coming into this year ó Corey Perry, Ryan Getzlaf and Bobby Ryan ó and yet are the lowest-scoring team in the Western Conference.
It's amusing just how much the Toronto press hates Wilson/is trained to expect the Leafs to lose. Leafs with 24 points and top line leading the league in points with no business doing so and he's still being replaced at the end of the year

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Old
11-20-2011, 05:58 PM
  #116
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At least Toronto for the most part doesn't despise us (that's the impression I get). Then again we gave them Gardiner and Lupul so they might just be being nice to us so we can give them the better end of the deal again

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Old
11-20-2011, 08:44 PM
  #117
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Has a coach ever been fired between periods of a game? HA!

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Old
11-20-2011, 09:57 PM
  #118
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Doesn't even matter if it's not all RC's fault, but at some point you have to make a coaching change

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11-20-2011, 10:05 PM
  #119
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Are there any good coaches even available?

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11-20-2011, 10:09 PM
  #120
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Nope well end up having Murray coach

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11-20-2011, 10:09 PM
  #121
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Are there any good coaches even available?
Not really. Only two coaches I'd want are Bylsma or Babcock.

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11-20-2011, 10:27 PM
  #122
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It might be time to start considering a change.

The team in general should not start this badly year after year.

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11-20-2011, 10:32 PM
  #123
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I'm more worried that BM blows up the team before he gets axed.

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11-20-2011, 10:34 PM
  #124
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I'd rather see a new GM, and if they want to bring in a new coach, go for it.

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11-20-2011, 10:38 PM
  #125
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Get rid of them both. Murray builds his team differently than how Carlyle plays his yet Murray keeps extending him. He's a good coach but geez this issue is lasting too long.

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