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Old
11-19-2011, 03:15 AM
  #1
dkollidas
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Buffalo-Anaheim-Columbus

Buffalo needs a top-6 center, transfer some of our extreme depth on the wings to center, to make ourselves more like a Pittsburgh, or Boston (I know they're not Pittsburgh like in talent, but Kreji, Bergeron, Savard, at least at the start of last year, Seguin, Peverly, Kelly, can all play center), Detroit, Vancouver (Sedin, Kesler, Hodgson, Malhorta).

Roy is a solid center, getting better defensively, and his game has gotten back to normal as he's recovered from injury. Adam is good center, will become a top-6 center, but he'll be in much better position to succeed if he's placed in a 3rd line role for now and in a couple years brought up to the second or first line, he'll be able to carry a line instead of just be a complementary part of one.

Columbus, is in deep. They've invested deeply; in a young goaltender who has played quite badly, a defense that is not talented enough and overpaid (Wizniewski $5.5M/yr, Methot $3.0M/yr), and forwards who have underachieved, not developed or have not meshed, Nash at $7.8M cap hit is too much, Carter has not meshed with the team so far, although partially due to injury, Umberger $4.6M starting next season, and Vermette $3.75 cap hit. Basically, they will have these choices: trading forwards for defensemen, in hopes of covering up their lackluster goaltending. Selling off assets for futures. Or they need to find a goaltender who can do two things. 1. Cover for a bad defense. And 2. Play solidly enough that the rest of the team can focus more on offense and therefore be more aggressive, allowing them to stay in the offensive zone more, and thereby score more goals.

Anaheim is a team that has the cream on the top, but lacks the filling that makes the whole cake. Ryan, Perry, Getzlaf form one of the best lines in all of hockey, Selanne is also a great offensive weapon, despite his age. Vishnovsky is a very, very potent defenseman, Fowler is a future top-pairing guy, and Lydman is a solid, minute eating defenseman, who helps make his partners look better than they are, as we know. Hiller is solid in net. They lack depth, especially at forward. The defense is ok, with Fowler, Vishnovsky, Lydman, and Beauchemin forming a solid top-4, but really after their big 4 on offense, there's a big gap. Saku Koivu has dropped off, and at his progressed age, it's not feasible to think he'll be getting any better. Andrew Cogliano is at best a 3rd liner, but is playing as a top-6 forward. Their depth is not good at all. Picking up Nicklas Hagman on waivers was an attempt, but won't help any in the long run. Peter Holland is a nice prospect, but, he needs time to develop, as most big forwards do, and it will probably be another season before he's ready for full time with the big club. That being said, they're only real option is to trade one of their top forwards for depth, unless they want to keep drafting and developing, but by the time they get enough pieces, Getzlaf will be around 30, and then they'll only have a short run at it.

Therefore, I am proposing a 3-way trade to improve all three teams, and I really believe this will help all three clubs, this season, and in the long run.

To Columbus:

G- Ryan Miller - Gives the Jackets a world-class goaltender to mask the holes they have defensively. Allows the guys up front to play a more aggressive game.
-Cap Hit-$6.25M/3yrs.

D- Luca Sbisa- People feel he's underachieved because he hasn't done much, and has already played in parts of 3 NHL seasons, and this will be his fourth. But he's only 21, has lots of potential, and while he may never be a power play quarterback defenseman, he still has a good chance of being a #3-4 minute eating defenseman who has good mobility, is solid in his own zone, and makes solid passes out of the defensive zone.
-Cap Hit- $2.175M/4yrs.

To Anaheim:

C- Antoine Vermette- A top-9 penalty killing foward who is solid on face-offs, can pot 15-25 goals per season, about 50-60 points, and has great speed. Can also play wing if necessary.
-Cap Hit- $3.75M/4yrs

C- Derrick Brassard- A young, top-6 potential centerman, who was rushed into a role too early in his career. One guy who may do better than most others in the league from a change of scenery.
-Cap Hit- $3.2M/3yrs.

LW- Tyler Ennis- Adds a dynamic, young top-6 forward who is still on his ELC and is a RFA at the end of this season.
-Cap Hit- 0.875M/1Yr

-Columbus' 2012 Second round pick-

(Note* I originally had just Nash going to Anaheim from Columbus, instead of Brassard, Vermette and the pick. I guess I just feel that Nash is more of the same, and that a team like Anaheim is dying for depth, and that these guys can add that, and the 2nd rounder is to even it out, and it's basically a 1st rounder considering how badly Columbus is performing right now.)



To Buffalo:

W/C- Bobby Ryan- IF he could play center. I'm not sure, but if he does, he'd give the Sabres EXACTLY what they need.
-Cap Hit-$5.100M/4yrs.
G- Steve Mason- A young goalie who still has upside, and can be a solid back-up to Enroth who still can challenge for starts if his game improves in Buffalo.
-Cap Hit-$2.900M/2yrs.




So, here are the rosters after the trade (Healthy):

Anaheim:

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Tyler Ennis ($0.875m) / Ryan Getzlaf ($5.325m) / Corey Perry ($5.325m)
Derick Brassard ($3.200m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Teemu Selanne ($4.000m)
Jason Blake ($4.000m) / Antoine Vermette ($3.750m) / Andrew Cogliano ($2.390m)
Niklas Hagman ($1.500m) / Brandon McMillan ($0.875m) / George Parros ($0.875m)

DEFENSEMEN
Lubomir Visnovsky ($5.600m) / Toni Lydman ($3.000m)
Kurtis Foster ($1.800m) / Cam Fowler ($1.400m)
Francois Beauchemin ($3.800m) / Sheldon Brookbank ($0.750m)

GOALTENDERS
Jonas Hiller ($4.500m) / Dan Ellis ($1.500m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $56,965,000; BONUSES: $642,500
CAP SPACE (20-man roster): $7,335,000

Columbus:

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
R.J. Umberger ($4.600m) / Jeff Carter ($5.272m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Kristian Huselius ($4.750m) / Ryan Johansen ($1.945m) / Vaclav Prospal ($2.500m)
Matt Calvert ($0.891m) / Samuel Pahlsson ($2.650m) / Mark Letestu ($0.625m)
Alexandre Giroux ($0.825m) / Cody Bass ($0.600m) / Derek Dorsett ($0.562m)

DEFENSEMEN
James Wisniewski ($5.500m) / Fedor Tyutin ($4.500m)
Nikita Nikitin ($0.600m) / Luca Sbisa ($2.175m)
Marc Methot ($3.000m) / Grant Clitsome ($1.250m)
Radek Martinek ($2.200m)

GOALTENDERS
Ryan Miller ($6.250m) / Mark Dekanich ($0.575m)

BUYOUTS: Mike Commodore ($1.541m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,613,560; BONUSES: $1,212,500
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $3,686,440

Buffalo:
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Thomas Vanek ($7.142m) / Bobby Ryan ($5.100m) / Jason Pominville ($5.300m)
Ville Leino ($4.500m) / Derek Roy ($4.000m) / Drew Stafford ($4.000m)
Nathan Gerbe ($1.433m) / Luke Adam ($0.875m) / Brad Boyes ($4.000m)
Jochen Hecht ($3.525m) / Paul Gaustad ($2.300m) / Patrick Kaleta ($0.907m)
/ Cody McCormick ($1.200m)

DEFENSEMEN
Tyler Myers ($1.300m) / Robyn Regehr ($4.020m)
Christian Ehrhoff ($4.000m) / Jordan Leopold ($3.000m)
Andrej Sekera ($2.750m) / Mike Weber ($0.950m)

GOALTENDERS
Jhonas Enroth ($0.675m) / Steve Mason ($2.900m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,878,690; BONUSES: $512,500
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $421,310

-Gragniani in Rochester due to cap contraints, unless they chose to send down/demote/waive someone else.

Thoughts?

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Old
11-19-2011, 03:55 AM
  #2
Corto
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Would never happen.

No playoff team would feel confident with Enroth/Mason as their duo come April...

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Old
11-19-2011, 06:34 AM
  #3
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Definitely one of those never happen in a million years kind of proposal but hypothetically I would want Getzlaf instead of Ryan... Nice work on the post tho!

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11-19-2011, 08:13 AM
  #4
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We'd be a worse team.

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Old
11-19-2011, 09:38 AM
  #5
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So for Miller/Ennis we get Ryan/Mason? No thanks, besides the last winger that we were hoping could play center hasn't worked out so far.

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11-19-2011, 09:44 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkollidas View Post
To Buffalo:

W/C- Bobby Ryan- IF he could play center. I'm not sure, but if he does, he'd give the Sabres EXACTLY what they need.
So the lynchpin of this 7 player, 3 way trade is Ryan, who MIGHT fill the need the Sabres have?

Nice work on the post, but very poorly thought out.

I give it 3/10 XBOXes, only because you wrote coherently. It makes the Sabres a worse team.

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Old
11-19-2011, 07:02 PM
  #7
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Originally Posted by Beerz View Post
We'd be a worse team.
+1

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Old
11-20-2011, 01:19 AM
  #8
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No way would I trade Miller.

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Old
11-20-2011, 01:57 AM
  #9
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Ville Leino, if he could play center

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Old
11-20-2011, 02:09 AM
  #10
Afinogretzky
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Ryan >>> Ennis
Miller >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mason

If that's Getzlaf then I might pull the trigger. We surely we haven't seen **** from Enroth to justify trading our #1 goalie 18 months removed from a Vezina/Olympic MVP. If Enroth can put up .925+ the whole season, Darcy might have a couple tough decisions to make.

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Old
11-20-2011, 06:00 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beechsack View Post
I give it 3/10 XBOXes, only because you wrote coherently. It makes the Sabres a worse team.
I lol'd.

But yeah, not a great trade for the Sabres. Like someone else said, maybe if it were an actual center like Getzlaf, then it'd be worth considering. Maybe.

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11-20-2011, 06:02 PM
  #12
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You lost me when you suggested a 3 team deal.....



Plus, the deal does nothing to address the Sabres biggest weaknesses which are at center and defense, IMO.

It adds to an area of strength and subtracts Miller and adds Mason who is an absolute mess right now.

All around, NFW.

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11-20-2011, 06:10 PM
  #13
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you start off by saying Buffalo needs a top 6 center and you trade Ryan Miller for a winger?


Shaking my head....why god

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Old
11-21-2011, 01:46 AM
  #14
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Miller isn't going anywhere. I'm not sure why he is in almost every trade idea I've seen.

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11-21-2011, 03:38 AM
  #15
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essentially you're giving up tyler ennis and ryan miller for bobby ryan.

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Old
11-21-2011, 03:51 AM
  #16
dkollidas
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The main reason I proposed getting Ryan was because I was reading on the boards that he was playing center, and that he played there in junior as well. I'm not sure if that was correct but I also figured he's a big, young power forward who can bang. But the more I read about him on the Ducks board, the less I liked the idea of making a move for him.

The reason I proposed trading Miller is that I feel the club has gotten sick of him. This is complete and total speculation on my part but I really feel that there was no reaction to the Lucic thing because of Miller. If the Sabres really really liked him, they would've given Lucic and Chara more of a fight than what was done, it was sad.

I also feel this team needs a major shakeup. They're too complacent. And many will say to get a new coach, but I like Lindy, feel he's a great coach and that they will regret it if they let him go. Therefore I feel someone from the "core" needs to be moved in order to make this team better, now and in the long haul. It won't be Vanek or Pominville, look at how they're playing. Stafford just signed a new deal so it's unlikely. Myers was also just re-signed, and has been much better since his benching.

That leaves two guys... Roy and Miller
Yes, Roy has been playing better of late, but I personally do not feel the guy is a number one center, and never will be. And in order to trade for a true number one center in this league, you have to give some kind of a center up as well in the deal. This makes Roy expendable if you can get a top-flight centerman in the deal. Yes, it's somewhat of a lateral move, but if you can gain a top-5/10 center, you're much better off in my opinion.

I believe Miller is untouchable, but only if another goalie is coming back in the deal who can start over Enroth until Enroth gains the position for himself.

So, my new proposal... Forget Columbus, and let's just deal straight up with Anaheim. They're playing badly and may by mid-season decide a change is necessary.

To Buffalo:
C-Ryan Getzlaf
G-Jhonas Hiller

To Anaheim:
C-Derek Roy
G-Ryan Miller
2012 1st round pick
D-Drew Schiestel

Yes, Buffalo has to add, but that's the cost of getting a top-5 center in this league. Getzlaf is a guy who's capable of scoring 100 points if healthy, and the way Vanek and Pominville are playing, throw him in the middle of that line and watch them go. He adds grit and leadership, size, physicality, and everything else we need. The cap hits are basically the same.


Anaheim:

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Bobby Ryan ($5.100m) / Derek Roy ($4.000m) / Corey Perry ($5.325m)
Jason Blake ($4.000m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Teemu Selanne ($4.000m)
Niklas Hagman ($3.000m) / Andrew Cogliano ($2.390m) / Matt Beleskey ($0.737m)
Devante Smith-Pelly ($0.870m) / Andrew Gordon ($0.537m) / Brandon McMillan ($0.875m)

DEFENSEMEN
Lubomir Visnovsky ($5.600m) / Toni Lydman ($3.000m)
Francois Beauchemin ($3.800m) / Cam Fowler ($1.400m)
Sheldon Brookbank ($0.750m) / Luca Sbisa ($2.175m)
Kurtis Foster ($1.800m) / Drew Schiestel ($0.750m)

GOALTENDERS
Ryan Miller ($6.250m) / Dan Ellis ($1.500m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,360,000; BONUSES: $782,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $3,940,000


Buffalo:

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Thomas Vanek ($7.142m) / Ryan Getzlaf ($5.325m) / Jason Pominville ($5.300m)
Ville Leino ($4.500m) / Luke Adam ($0.875m) / Drew Stafford ($4.000m)
Tyler Ennis ($0.875m) / Paul Gaustad ($2.300m) / Brad Boyes ($4.000m)
Nathan Gerbe ($1.433m) / Cody McCormick ($1.200m) / Patrick Kaleta ($0.907m)

DEFENSEMEN
Andrej Sekera ($2.750m) / Tyler Myers ($5.500m)
Christian Ehrhoff ($4.000m) / Jordan Leopold ($3.000m)
Robyn Regehr ($4.020m) / Marc-Andre Gragnani ($0.550m)
/ Mike Weber ($0.950m)

GOALTENDERS
Jonas Hiller ($4.500m) / Jhonas Enroth ($0.675m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,803,690; BONUSES: $87,500
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $496,310

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Old
11-21-2011, 06:14 AM
  #17
Beerz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkollidas View Post
The main reason I proposed getting Ryan was because I was reading on the boards that he was playing center, and that he played there in junior as well. I'm not sure if that was correct but I also figured he's a big, young power forward who can bang. But the more I read about him on the Ducks board, the less I liked the idea of making a move for him.

The reason I proposed trading Miller is that I feel the club has gotten sick of him. This is complete and total speculation on my part but I really feel that there was no reaction to the Lucic thing because of Miller. If the Sabres really really liked him, they would've given Lucic and Chara more of a fight than what was done, it was sad.

I also feel this team needs a major shakeup. They're too complacent. And many will say to get a new coach, but I like Lindy, feel he's a great coach and that they will regret it if they let him go. Therefore I feel someone from the "core" needs to be moved in order to make this team better, now and in the long haul. It won't be Vanek or Pominville, look at how they're playing. Stafford just signed a new deal so it's unlikely. Myers was also just re-signed, and has been much better since his benching.

That leaves two guys... Roy and Miller
Yes, Roy has been playing better of late, but I personally do not feel the guy is a number one center, and never will be. And in order to trade for a true number one center in this league, you have to give some kind of a center up as well in the deal. This makes Roy expendable if you can get a top-flight centerman in the deal. Yes, it's somewhat of a lateral move, but if you can gain a top-5/10 center, you're much better off in my opinion.

I believe Miller is untouchable, but only if another goalie is coming back in the deal who can start over Enroth until Enroth gains the position for himself.

So, my new proposal... Forget Columbus, and let's just deal straight up with Anaheim. They're playing badly and may by mid-season decide a change is necessary.

To Buffalo:
C-Ryan Getzlaf
G-Jhonas Hiller

To Anaheim:
C-Derek Roy
G-Ryan Miller
2012 1st round pick
D-Drew Schiestel

Yes, Buffalo has to add, but that's the cost of getting a top-5 center in this league. Getzlaf is a guy who's capable of scoring 100 points if healthy, and the way Vanek and Pominville are playing, throw him in the middle of that line and watch them go. He adds grit and leadership, size, physicality, and everything else we need. The cap hits are basically the same.


Anaheim:

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Bobby Ryan ($5.100m) / Derek Roy ($4.000m) / Corey Perry ($5.325m)
Jason Blake ($4.000m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Teemu Selanne ($4.000m)
Niklas Hagman ($3.000m) / Andrew Cogliano ($2.390m) / Matt Beleskey ($0.737m)
Devante Smith-Pelly ($0.870m) / Andrew Gordon ($0.537m) / Brandon McMillan ($0.875m)

DEFENSEMEN
Lubomir Visnovsky ($5.600m) / Toni Lydman ($3.000m)
Francois Beauchemin ($3.800m) / Cam Fowler ($1.400m)
Sheldon Brookbank ($0.750m) / Luca Sbisa ($2.175m)
Kurtis Foster ($1.800m) / Drew Schiestel ($0.750m)

GOALTENDERS
Ryan Miller ($6.250m) / Dan Ellis ($1.500m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,360,000; BONUSES: $782,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $3,940,000


Buffalo:

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Thomas Vanek ($7.142m) / Ryan Getzlaf ($5.325m) / Jason Pominville ($5.300m)
Ville Leino ($4.500m) / Luke Adam ($0.875m) / Drew Stafford ($4.000m)
Tyler Ennis ($0.875m) / Paul Gaustad ($2.300m) / Brad Boyes ($4.000m)
Nathan Gerbe ($1.433m) / Cody McCormick ($1.200m) / Patrick Kaleta ($0.907m)

DEFENSEMEN
Andrej Sekera ($2.750m) / Tyler Myers ($5.500m)
Christian Ehrhoff ($4.000m) / Jordan Leopold ($3.000m)
Robyn Regehr ($4.020m) / Marc-Andre Gragnani ($0.550m)
/ Mike Weber ($0.950m)

GOALTENDERS
Jonas Hiller ($4.500m) / Jhonas Enroth ($0.675m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,803,690; BONUSES: $87,500
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $496,310



Just stop dealing our best Goalie Please.

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Old
11-21-2011, 07:24 AM
  #18
HiddenInLight
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Why for the love of god would we trade our best goalie AND our top center AND our first round pick for a guy who MIGHT be able to play center, and a backup goalie?


Also nice copy/paste job in here and free agents....did you make the same thread in columbus and Aneheim forums too?


Why are you so hell bent with shafting the sabres?

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Old
11-21-2011, 09:13 AM
  #19
dkollidas
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I did just edit it for Getzlaf. And personally I'd trade Miller and Roy and Ennis and a first for Getzlaf and Hiller any day.

I admitted the proposal for Ryan was misguided, so I edited it, took Columbus out of the deal, and while in the deal the Sabres do lose Miller, they get Hiller, who is an established number one goalie and Getzlaf, who's a top-5 or top-10 center in the league.

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Old
11-21-2011, 09:22 AM
  #20
SackTastic
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I give the revised proposal 1/10 XBOXes, because it makes even less sense than the first.

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11-21-2011, 11:05 AM
  #21
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I would trade Miller for Getzlaf in a heartbeat. Hell I don't think I'd even hesitate on throwing in Ennis. But that trade never happens even if the Ducks don't have Hiller because Getzlaf is much more valuable than Miller.

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