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Mark Howe to have his #2 retired on March 6

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Old
11-19-2011, 07:44 PM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Libertine View Post
Recchi will make it in the HHOF.
Brind'amour probably will as well

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11-19-2011, 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Libertine View Post
Recchi will make it in the HHOF.
Forgot about Rex.

I was referring more to who *might* have a shot at having their number retired. I don't see Hexy ever getting a HOF nod, but wouldn't mind seeing 27 retired. I could see LeClair or Rico getting a nod in a really, really weak year a few decades from now, strangely I'd mind 37 being retired less than 10 and I'm not sure why. Brindy is a weird case, as is Rex. I think both make the Hall, and they had significant tenures on the team with some notable accomplishments, but I don't think we should retire either number.

Then there are guys like Tocchet & Roenick. JR will be in, but in no way should we retire his number, ditto Forsberg. I think Toc is a longshot for the hall and was a key piece on those Keenan teams, but I don't think he should have his number retired.

Lindros will be interesting, though.

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11-19-2011, 08:41 PM
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No, I don't... due to the relatively low amount of achievements, largely based on his inability to raise them because of his untimely death... and the nature of that death... I, as well as many others I've read/heard, believe the Flyers will never officially retire the number, but it will never be issued again in this Organization, IMO.

Had he lived and played longer or had he put up numbers that could not be denied, there might be an argument... but as it is, it would be hard for the Flyers to reward his lack of judgement and dangerous actions with such a major acknowledgement (officially).
They are not going to retire his number but if they did I would not have a problem with it. The young man made a mistake and paid dearly for it. He is my second favorite Flyer goaltender. I am confident that that number will never be worn again and that is good enough for me.

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11-19-2011, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mja View Post
Forgot about Rex.

I was referring more to who *might* have a shot at having their number retired. I don't see Hexy ever getting a HOF nod, but wouldn't mind seeing 27 retired. I could see LeClair or Rico getting a nod in a really, really weak year a few decades from now, strangely I'd mind 37 being retired less than 10 and I'm not sure why. Brindy is a weird case, as is Rex. I think both make the Hall, and they had significant tenures on the team with some notable accomplishments, but I don't think we should retire either number.

Then there are guys like Tocchet & Roenick. JR will be in, but in no way should we retire his number, ditto Forsberg. I think Toc is a longshot for the hall and was a key piece on those Keenan teams, but I don't think he should have his number retired.

Lindros will be interesting, though.
If he makes the Hall they should hang his number. The problem is if you talk about LeClair or Rico and others then you have to start mentioning Kerr, Propp etc. I have always liked the way the Dallas Cowboys did it with the Ring of Honor. Have the name and number up there. However still have the number available to be worn. You just do not hand that number out to any Tom,Dick or Harry.

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11-19-2011, 09:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeypete49 View Post
If he makes the Hall they should hang his number. The problem is if you talk about LeClair or Rico and others then you have to start mentioning Kerr, Propp etc. I have always liked the way the Dallas Cowboys did it with the Ring of Honor. Have the name and number up there. However still have the number available to be worn. You just do not hand that number out to any Tom,Dick or Harry.
Except for restricting handing out the number (to any Tom, Dick and Harry) that is pretty much the Flyers Hall of Fame.

The Phillies 'Wall of Fame' seems to me to be a looser version... Both are Team/Organization honors well short of Retiring the number. Number retirement is the ultimate honor IMO, and also seemingly in the Flyers' opinion, and HoF induction to me seems to me to be a fair gauge.

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11-20-2011, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
They would be fixed by his appearing at the Winter Classic.


However, if he gets into the Hall of Fame, I assume his number would go up as well.
Unless he refuses to play in the 2nd period, and then gets traded to the Rangers alumni team in the 3rd.

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11-20-2011, 03:32 PM
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it is disappointing that he went into the hall as a wing and not a flyer. bad move by howe imo.

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11-20-2011, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by vandals View Post
it is disappointing that he went into the hall as a wing and not a flyer. bad move by howe imo.
why?

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11-20-2011, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vandals View Post
it is disappointing that he went into the hall as a wing and not a flyer. bad move by howe imo.
It's perfectly understandable why he did that.

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11-20-2011, 03:48 PM
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It's perfectly understandable why he did that.
maybe to you, not to me. just because of his dad? his best body of work and prime of his career was done as a flyer.

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11-20-2011, 03:58 PM
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He did? Honestly, that makes me not want his jersey to be retired. He had more points in one season for the Flyers than he did his entire time as a Red Wing.

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11-20-2011, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by vandals View Post
maybe to you, not to me. just because of his dad? his best body of work and prime of his career was done as a flyer.
He didn't go in as a Wing... nor as a Flyer... IIRC the HHoF doesn't install a player as being from any one particular team.

Are you thinking that his donning the Wings #9 jersey to complete a request his dad made years ago was his entering the Hall as a Wing?

If you look at the HHoF website and literature you I believe will find him in all cases as a Flyer, except for historical photos... While he is not in the Hall as any team's player, it is all but a given that anyone who knows anything considers him a Flyer. He has stated that he will always be a Flyer IIRC and he still resides in the Philly Area I believe... but please keep in mind that he presently is employed by the Detroit Organization and we cannot deny that... also he grew up as a Wings fan and his father, Gordie, was a Detroit legend and will always be looked as a Wing... just as Mark will be as a Flyer.

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11-20-2011, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by JVR21 View Post
He did? Honestly, that makes me not want his jersey to be retired. He had more points in one season for the Flyers than he did his entire time as a Red Wing.
Please read my above post and also look into the matter yourself before change your feelings about him.

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11-20-2011, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
He didn't go in as a Wing... nor as a Flyer... IIRC the HHoF doesn't install a player as being from any one particular team.

Are you thinking that his donning the Wings #9 jersey to complete a request his dad made years ago was his entering the Hall as a Wing?

If you look at the HHoF website and literature you I believe will find him in all cases as a Flyer, except for historical photos... While he is not in the Hall as any team's player, it is all but a given that anyone who knows anything considers him a Flyer. He has stated that he will always be a Flyer IIRC and he still resides in the Philly Area I believe... but please keep in mind that he presently is employed by the Detroit Organization and we cannot deny that... also he grew up as a Wings fan and his father, Gordie, was a Detroit legend and will always be looked as a Wing... just as Mark will be as a Flyer.
what i read then was incorrect i guess. they said he went into the hof as a wing.

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11-20-2011, 04:11 PM
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He put on his dad's jersey. He didn't "go into the Hall as a Red Wing." You don't get linked to a team in the Hockey Hall of Fame, only in baseball does that happen.

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11-20-2011, 04:29 PM
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FWIW the Flyers denote all the players and non-players that are in the HHoF who played for the Flyers -- such as Howerchuck, Coffey, Sittler, etc -- but highlight those who spend their most seasons as a Flyers... They honor all who played here but take more pride and credit for those who earned their spot while wearing O&B -- Clarke, Parent, Barber, Snider, etc. -- I would assume Parent would be honored also by both Boston and Toronto... and Edmonton would take credit for Coffey and Toronto for Sittler.

For the life of me I cannot again locate the Official Flyers WebPage for the HHoF players but here is the Official HHoF webPage from their own site that shows Mark Howe as a Flyer... their pages for the other teams he played will list him also I would bet.

http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...delphia+Flyers

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11-20-2011, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Hextall89 View Post
Lindros I would do. I maintain the argument that if Cam Neeley has a place in the hall, Lindros should have one.
I see it like that too. Lindros derserves to be in the Hall of Fame.

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11-20-2011, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
He put on his dad's jersey. He didn't "go into the Hall as a Red Wing." You don't get linked to a team in the Hockey Hall of Fame, only in baseball does that happen.
Not sure, but the NFL may also... The thing with the HHoF is that it is really not a Hall for the NHL and encompasses all leagues in the World I believe. Russians from the old USSR days who never played in the NHL are inducted and honored there.

In MLB I believe they have even gone away from allowing the inducted player to select the cap he will be depicted in on the wall and select it for him... IIRC Gary Carter was selected as an Expo rather than as a Met, but I could be mixing him up with another player who they selected the Expos for.

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11-20-2011, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
Not sure, but the NFL may also... The thing with the HHoF is that it is really not a Hall for the NHL and encompasses all leagues in the World I believe. Russians from the old USSR days who never played in the NHL are inducted and honored there.

In MLB I believe they have even gone away from allowing the inducted player to select the cap he will be depicted in on the wall and select it for him... IIRC Gary Carter was selected as an Expo rather than as a Met, but I could be mixing him up with another player who they selected the Expos for.
Andre Dawson and Gary Carter both did not want to be depicted as Expos, but are. They used to let the players pick, but they got concerned that teams were starting to bribe them. They still sort of ask, but the decision is generally made for them.

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11-20-2011, 05:05 PM
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Andre Dawson and Gary Carter both did not want to be depicted as Expos, but are. They used to let the players pick, but they got concerned that teams were starting to bribe them. They still sort of ask, but the decision is generally made for them.
I was not aware of the bribe concern... I believed it was due to some teams, such as the Expos, being slighted by the more glamorous teams who may be more desirable for ones Legacy -- wouldn't it be great to be installed as a Yankee even if you only spent the mop up seasons of one's career there? -- Or to ward off paybacks against a team that moved a player even if they were the team that employed them for the bulk of their career... But mostly, I believed it was to get the poor Expos some sugar.

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11-20-2011, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vandals View Post
maybe to you, not to me. just because of his dad? his best body of work and prime of his career was done as a flyer.
He lived and breathed the Red Wings and Detroit growing up, he learned how to play hockey in Detroit's arena when it wasn't in use, he did play as a Red Wing, and there's a very strong family connection there. I'm not about to fault him for that, and I don't think it diminishes any of his accomplishments here.

Edit: Ah, I've seen the other posts now. It doesn't really matter I guess.

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11-20-2011, 07:16 PM
  #47
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From a Q and A published November 13:

Quote:
Q: You played 10 of your 16 NHL seasons with the Flyers, but spent a lot of time with your father and brother in Houston and Hartford while playing in the WHA. When you think of your career, do you think of yourself as a Flyer?

Howe: “Yeah. I had a great start to my career [in the WHA] down in Houston playing with my dad and brother, and we won a couple championships, but without a doubt my best years were in Philly. We don’t have to pick a jersey for our plaque like they did in baseball, but if I had to, I’d be going in as a Flyer.”

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11-20-2011, 09:04 PM
  #48
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Well, I'd say that completely puts it to rest.

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11-20-2011, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles View Post
From a Q and A published November 13:
Thanks, MSE... that means he must of said it more than once then because what I remember him saying was worded differently -- of course I may be mistaken -- but I could easily imagine him being asked he question in one form or another in many interviews since his selection... I like how he was blunt and didn't even try to make sure not to hurt any feeling in Hockey-town and his present employers... He flat out stated his choice even though he didn't have to do so.

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