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Matt Read (thread started in 2011)

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Old
11-25-2011, 12:12 PM
  #176
MsWoof
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Read has been a very pleasant surprise. It would be awesome if he won the calder but I agree, an 18 year old would likely get it over a 25 year old. We'll have to see if one or both hit the wall at some point because Read has never played a lot of games as at high a level as RNH has.

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11-25-2011, 01:36 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by MsWoof View Post
Read has been a very pleasant surprise. It would be awesome if he won the calder but I agree, an 18 year old would likely get it over a 25 year old. We'll have to see if one or both hit the wall at some point because Read has never played a lot of games as at high a level as RNH has.
meh

to me, if he clearly has a better season, he deserves it

a rookie is a rookie

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11-26-2011, 02:03 AM
  #178
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meh

to me, if he clearly has a better season, he deserves it

a rookie is a rookie
Exactly. At this point, RNH (partially because of the role he plays in Edmonton) is the front-runner, but Matt Read has been a surprise to me. It doesn't matter what age the player is. Both were playing at an amateur level last year and now both are top level NHLers this year.

If this were MLB, nobody would bat an eye at a 25 year old rookie winning rookie of the year over an 18 year old.

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02-02-2012, 10:05 PM
  #179
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Tops all rookies with 16 goals! Still lookin good....bustin down those walls!

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02-02-2012, 10:11 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
Read is doing well so far in camp, but as someone already said i dont care how he looks now, its how hes looking in Jan and Feb when hes been smacked around by forwards and defenseman who are bigger then whats he used to playing against.
So far so good...

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02-03-2012, 05:26 PM
  #181
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Especially because he is centering the fourth line against NSH and donīt get a lot of playing time. He finds his scoring chances and make his points. Thats a lot better than a lot of the other Calder candidates!

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02-03-2012, 05:31 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Ironmanrulez View Post
Especially because he is centering the fourth line against NSH and donīt get a lot of playing time. He finds his scoring chances and make his points. Thats a lot better than a lot of the other Calder candidates!
Well once Briere and JVR are back, I can see a line of Read-Briere-JVR.

So that would mean:

Hartnell-Giroux-Jagr
Read-Briere-JVR
Talbot-Couturier-Voracek
Rinaldo-Schenn-Simmonds

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02-03-2012, 05:34 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
meh

to me, if he clearly has a better season, he deserves it

a rookie is a rookie
Agreed. The Calder Trophy isn't the "Most Impressive Prospect" award.

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02-03-2012, 05:40 PM
  #184
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I'm not really feeling Matt Read. He's a bit of fools gold to me. He's fast and skates hard, but I don't think he's got very good hands.
Kinda like Carter was(I don't see how carter scored 40+)..i don't really see him as a goal scorer...I'm seeing 3rd line winger ceiling...
I guess out of all the new guys I see him as the lowest asset.

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02-03-2012, 05:46 PM
  #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by achdumeingute View Post
I'm not really feeling Matt Read. He's a bit of fools gold to me. He's fast and skates hard, but I don't think he's got very good hands.
Kinda like Carter was(I don't see how carter scored 40+)..i don't really see him as a goal scorer...I'm seeing 3rd line winger ceiling...
I guess out of all the new guys I see him as the lowest asset.
Honestly, compared to two high draft picks, he better have a lower ceiling. He obviously has a higher ceiling than Rinaldo, Sesito, and Harry Z though. But thats not fair to him if you compare him to Schenn and Couturier (for the future). At the moment though, he is better than they are but hopefully wont be in the future.

I do disagree with the hands thing. Obivously they arent worldly but I do think they are average. Bad hands would be guys like Powe, Rinaldo etc etc.

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02-03-2012, 05:51 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by achdumeingute View Post
I'm not really feeling Matt Read. He's a bit of fools gold to me. He's fast and skates hard, but I don't think he's got very good hands.
Kinda like Carter was(I don't see how carter scored 40+)..i don't really see him as a goal scorer...I'm seeing 3rd line winger ceiling...
I guess out of all the new guys I see him as the lowest asset.
Not only is Matt Read fast, but he hussles, has a good shot, and most importantly, has good hockey sense. He is almost always in position both offensively and defensively and he fits in well on any line. I don't think Read is a legitimate first line player, but he is a solid second liner and a terrific third liner. His upside isn't nearly as high as some of our other young guys due to the fact that he is already 25, but he should have three or four solid years on this team.

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02-03-2012, 05:58 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Honestly, compared to two high draft picks, he better have a lower ceiling. He obviously has a higher ceiling than Rinaldo, Sesito, and Harry Z though. But thats not fair to him if you compare him to Schenn and Couturier (for the future). At the moment though, he is better than they are but hopefully wont be in the future.

I do disagree with the hands thing. Obivously they arent worldly but I do think they are average. Bad hands would be guys like Powe, Rinaldo etc etc.
Yes I agree for the most part. Yea I meant out of JVR, vora, simmer, Couts, and Schenn he's after them IMO. But above the 4th liners.

Just seems people are hyping him a little high IMO because he's scored 16. I don't think he's been a bad player at all...

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02-03-2012, 06:03 PM
  #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by achdumeingute View Post
I'm not really feeling Matt Read. He's a bit of fools gold to me. He's fast and skates hard, but I don't think he's got very good hands.
Kinda like Carter was(I don't see how carter scored 40+)..i don't really see him as a goal scorer...I'm seeing 3rd line winger ceiling...
I guess out of all the new guys I see him as the lowest asset.
He is on pace for a 56 point, 28 goal rookie season with his lines being shuffled like every other night.

I do not know many 56 point forwards I would consider third line wingers at best, let alone rookie 56 point forwards I would consider third line wingers.

Your talent analysis is really, really poor by the way. His hands are average more than likely actually above average. He has an above average shot, above average instincts, he is blazing fast, works hard, is excellent defensively.

I do not know what more you want out of a rookie undrafted free agent.

And about that subtle shot that you just took at Carter, I would be ecstatic if Read became another Carter (just without the choking in the clutch and the injury problems). I know we all hate Carter now and we are supposed to laugh at how bad we ripped Columbus off, but come on. The guy is a minimum thirty-thirty player when healthy while playing great two way hockey. Carter has really good hands and a really good shot.

I really do hope that Matt Read is "fools gold" just like Carter is in your mind. If Read puts up thirty goals a year, I could care less if he does not look like the most skilled player in the NHL or does not create highlight reel plays. A goal is a goal.

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02-03-2012, 06:06 PM
  #189
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If I were ranking our young players:

1. Couturier
2./3. Schenn and JVR (very close)
4. Read
5. Voracek

Yes, I would take Read over Voracek. Read is better defensively, has a better shot, has the same speed, is a lot cheaper over the next three years, I could go on.

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02-03-2012, 06:08 PM
  #190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by achdumeingute View Post
I'm not really feeling Matt Read. He's a bit of fools gold to me. He's fast and skates hard, but I don't think he's got very good hands.
Kinda like Carter was(I don't see how carter scored 40+)..i don't really see him as a goal scorer...I'm seeing 3rd line winger ceiling...
I guess out of all the new guys I see him as the lowest asset.
Can't tell if serious.

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Old
02-03-2012, 06:53 PM
  #191
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Do any of you look the skill competitions?

Only jamie benn had a more accurate shot than this guy!

My scout report on him:


1. Fast as hell --> top20 in the league
2. Accurate and fast shooting --> top50 in the league
3. quick release ---> above average
4. really good defensive game overall ---> above average
5. good pk play ---> above average
6. very good hockey sense ---> above average
7. can play up and down the line up ---> above average
8. has great work ethic, never upset with coaches decisions ---> above average
9. passing game and playmaking ablities solid ---> average
10. Can play LW - C- RW ----> above average
11. Cap hit 900.000 ----> Top10 in terms of revenue

__________________________________________________ ________--

For me his upside is to be one of the best 2nd line winger in the league. Especially because of his flexibility positional and his all around game. I donīt see any weakness in his play. Maybe his size and his body work. But his physical game is better than average for his size, remainds me a bit of Giroux before his concussion.


IMO he will be a:

30+ G 30+ A 60 Points player with a lot of PK time. If he will play a lot of PP Time he will be more of a 35+ 35+ PLayer.

70 Points with a lot of PK time who can play throughout the whole lineup as emergency call is just priceless!!

Tell me one player who can do that in the whole NHL!!

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02-03-2012, 07:18 PM
  #192
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Hey guys, I was wondering, in three years, what do you guys think will be Matt Read's role on the Flyers? Do you guys see him as a third line energy guy who can chip in or a top-six guy? What's his potential? Thanks.

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02-03-2012, 08:10 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by GoKingsGoo View Post
Hey guys, I was wondering, in three years, what do you guys think will be Matt Read's role on the Flyers? Do you guys see him as a third line energy guy who can chip in or a top-six guy? What's his potential? Thanks.
I'm fairly confident he will be a 20-25 goal, 50 pt player for the foreseeable future.

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02-03-2012, 08:59 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by broadwaybro86 View Post
If I were ranking our young players:

1. Couturier
2./3. Schenn and JVR (very close)
4. Read
5. Voracek

Yes, I would take Read over Voracek. Read is better defensively, has a better shot, has the same speed, is a lot cheaper over the next three years, I could go on.
I also would have him over Voracek and actually prefer him to JvR.

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02-03-2012, 09:29 PM
  #195
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Originally Posted by broadwaybro86 View Post
He is on pace for a 56 point, 28 goal rookie season with his lines being shuffled like every other night.

I do not know many 56 point forwards I would consider third line wingers at best, let alone rookie 56 point forwards I would consider third line wingers.

Your talent analysis is really, really poor by the way. His hands are average more than likely actually above average. He has an above average shot, above average instincts, he is blazing fast, works hard, is excellent defensively.

I do not know what more you want out of a rookie undrafted free agent.

And about that subtle shot that you just took at Carter, I would be ecstatic if Read became another Carter (just without the choking in the clutch and the injury problems). I know we all hate Carter now and we are supposed to laugh at how bad we ripped Columbus off, but come on. The guy is a minimum thirty-thirty player when healthy while playing great two way hockey. Carter has really good hands and a really good shot.

I really do hope that Matt Read is "fools gold" just like Carter is in your mind. If Read puts up thirty goals a year, I could care less if he does not look like the most skilled player in the NHL or does not create highlight reel plays. A goal is a goal.
Other than the hands and the above average shot I agree with what you said about Read. Powe had similar other traits to this...I do think Read is better offensively than Powe though by a mile.

He isn't really good in our forecheck game, he gets knocked off the puck easily (but so does Briere), and I don't see the same offensive ability that I see in Voracek...who has stellar vision and has been excellent in traffic with the puck.
My point was that I think his stats are a little over his head. Obviously if he finishes the year at the same pace I'll be wrong, and happy to be so.
I also don't hate Jeff Carter, and he was (still is) a valuable player...but some of the talk about him is that he's some sort of sniper. I haven't reviewed any of his goals lately, but I don't remember Carter ever really picking corners...he took a TON of shots to probably accomplish his goals.
In comparison, its really easy to call someone like Jagr a sniper...fast release, hard shot, and guy hits corners all the time. Obviously he's a HOF...and I'm not expecting that out of either Carter or Reid, but I was just trying to make a comparison.

I also don't think its really pertinent to bring his cap number into this...from just a talent standpoint. I'm not advocating getting rid of him or anything...nor do I think he's a bad player.

Id go:
1. Couts/Schenn - so close...both have been fantastic.
2. JVR (really down year for him, but the potential is immense)
3. Voracek - He's like Giroux lite, without the goal scoring...he has the ability to bring that up though.
4. Simmonds (I hate putting him this low. He's been one of the better forwards for a month. Does nothing but cause problems and create opportunities out there. I didn't think he'd be this good).
5. Read.


Last edited by achdumeingute: 02-03-2012 at 09:39 PM.
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02-03-2012, 09:49 PM
  #196
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Originally Posted by achdumeingute View Post

Id go:
1. Couts/Schenn - so close...both have been fantastic.
2. JVR (really down year for him, but the potential is immense)
3. Voracek - He's like Giroux lite, without the goal scoring...he has the ability to bring that up though.
4. Simmonds (I hate putting him this low. He's been one of the better forwards for a month. Does nothing but cause problems and create opportunities out there. I didn't think he'd be this good).
5. Read.
1. Couturier (Is the QB for our Rookie Line the whole season. Plays great PK. scores often and plays like a vet right now. See one of the most dominating defensive centers in him. Jordan Staal with upside

2. Read (can play everything, D, O, PK, PP, LW;C;RW, scores a lot etc....)
3. Voracek (more of a Jagr lite than a Giroux lite, but lacks point production his whole career)
4. Simmonds (hard worker, tough if he wantīs to, but donīt see that much upside in him
5. Schenn (maybe huge upside, but till now he shows not enough for me. Sure it can be because of injuries, but ask Carter about careers full of injuries... point production matters nothing more)

JVR isnīt a prospect anymore IMO. He must start to produce or trade him!

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02-03-2012, 09:58 PM
  #197
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Originally Posted by Ironmanrulez View Post
1. Couturier (Is the QB for our Rookie Line the whole season. Plays great PK. scores often and plays like a vet right now. See one of the most dominating defensive centers in him. Jordan Staal with upside

2. Read (can play everything, D, O, PK, PP, LW;C;RW, scores a lot etc....)
3. Voracek (more of a Jagr lite than a Giroux lite, but lacks point production his whole career)
4. Simmonds (hard worker, tough if he wantīs to, but donīt see that much upside in him
5. Schenn (maybe huge upside, but till now he shows not enough for me. Sure it can be because of injuries, but ask Carter about careers full of injuries... point production matters nothing more)

JVR isnīt a prospect anymore IMO. He must start to produce or trade him!
JVR is as young as both Voracek and Simmonds. Voracek is also on pace for 46 points..which he's already done 2 times, and had 38 his rookie year.
A couple games ago Schenn tossed a big hit...in the last game he had a great pass under pressure to Simmonds for a quality chance. He oozes potential. He also had a terrible turnover...but again he's young, inconsistency is to be expected.

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02-03-2012, 10:07 PM
  #198
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Originally Posted by achdumeingute View Post
JVR is as young as both Voracek and Simmonds. Voracek is also on pace for 46 points..which he's already done 2 times, and had 38 his rookie year.
A couple games ago Schenn tossed a big hit...in the last game he had a great pass under pressure to Simmonds for a quality chance. He oozes potential. He also had a terrible turnover...but again he's young, inconsistency is to be expected.
Yes but JVR has a contract signed like a First line player on a contender.... So he better starts to produce... Schenn also will make over 3.000.000 next season! That really high, so he also should produce more next season!

And i donīt want resign Voracek for 4.0.... Itīs too much.... Maybe Homer will him a Giroux Contract and not a JVR Contract... Hopefully!!

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02-03-2012, 10:18 PM
  #199
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Originally Posted by Ironmanrulez View Post
Yes but JVR has a contract signed like a First line player on a contender.... So he better starts to produce... Schenn also will make over 3.000.000 next season! That really high, so he also should produce more next season!

And i donīt want resign Voracek for 4.0.... Itīs too much.... Maybe Homer will him a Giroux Contract and not a JVR Contract... Hopefully!!
Meh, i don't really bring salary into a talent/prospect evaluation. If we are talking about cap management then sure....

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02-03-2012, 10:34 PM
  #200
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IMO a talent is payed as a talent. If a player payed like a normal piece or important piece of the team, he should play like one....

Especially in a cap world is it really important.

Sure Real Madrid or Manchester United can pay a talent 10.000.000. without get the effort, because they can spend how money they ever want....

But the Flyers must use their cap space wise, so its also a Cap related discussion IMO

edit: Just when it comes to JVR. Because of his cap hit next year!

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