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Old
11-27-2011, 01:02 PM
  #351
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
If you can't decipher the difference between Hammer and Webber, then I don't know what to tell you. Hamr plays with a mean streak. He's a ****** on the ice. I'm not saying he's Pronger out there, but he plays far tougher than anyone else in the lineup, period.
if you can't decipher that Hamr is slow as **** and webber is twice the player now because 1 he is faster 2 he is our top weapon on the power play as of today 3 he is only going to get better. What the hell is your problem with weber?..He has been out best dman this yr other than Gorges. Give it up

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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Yeah right...

It was a call that could've gone either way. But we sit here and freak out about it.

It was a great game and calls went both ways. No penalty on Max? Okay, doesn't make sense to me but so be it. Two goals called back on the Pens? Yeah, I'd say both deserved to be called back so good on the officials for that. And then we have the controversial goal at the end.

I can understand Price being ticked off but those kinds of calls/non-calls happen all the time. Frustrating? Sure. But to say that we lost the game because of the refs is just plain whining.

We played well, we had a chance at winning and we lost. It wasn't because of the refs.
wow you really just come on here to shoot down peoples opinions don't you? Its not whining THE PUCK SHOULD HAVE BEEN BLOWN DEAD..Are you that passive of a person to not even realize something so basic was not called?..man give me a break..ignored


Last edited by overlords: 11-27-2011 at 01:12 PM.
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Old
11-27-2011, 01:38 PM
  #352
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Originally Posted by holyhabs87 View Post
RDS has no problems with people saying the f bomb or airing players saying it. It's happened numerous times.
Thing is, it's funny that on english tv they censor it when you can CLEARLY read lips. The crosby goal in his first game back was followed by a very obvious "F yeah!". Who do they think they are fooling? Yes, I'm sure an 8 year old who knows those words can't figure that one out. Maybe Crosby shouldn't react like that if he's such an ambassador (just to be clear I'm being sarcastic). Pro players swear. Hiding it is dumb.

Anyway, aside from the egregious error by the refs (I've lost my voice from booing at the game), I see the boards are flooded with Pacioretty is the biggest hypocrite, should have died on the chara hit, dirtiest player, etc.

From all the replays this is what I see (and what is actually being commentated by CBC!):
- Letang cuts across
- Looks up, sees Patches. At that moment if they make contact it's 100% shoulder to shoulder despite the height difference
- Letang opts to shoot (millisecond response) which causes him to lower his head to be lined up with Patches shoulder.
- MP doesn't leave his feet, goes straight in his line of motion and catches Latang bent forward just enough to his his nose

The whole point of the check is what? Separate the man from the puck. Also to prevent the guy from taking a shot. If Letang sees him and decides to take the hit, then he's basically putting his head, knowingly in line with Pacioretty's shoulder. It happened fast and if there was no shot, play would be "Letang gets plastered by Pacioretty on clean hit". I don't like players being hurt, but IIRC Shanahan told Alfie that players are supposed to brace themselves for contact (in a very ironic situation).

God I hate the Toronto media (which is synonymous with the Boston media).

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11-27-2011, 02:10 PM
  #353
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Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
Thing is, it's funny that on english tv they censor it when you can CLEARLY read lips. The crosby goal in his first game back was followed by a very obvious "F yeah!". Who do they think they are fooling? Yes, I'm sure an 8 year old who knows those words can't figure that one out. Maybe Crosby shouldn't react like that if he's such an ambassador (just to be clear I'm being sarcastic). Pro players swear. Hiding it is dumb.

Anyway, aside from the egregious error by the refs (I've lost my voice from booing at the game), I see the boards are flooded with Pacioretty is the biggest hypocrite, should have died on the chara hit, dirtiest player, etc.

From all the replays this is what I see (and what is actually being commentated by CBC!):
- Letang cuts across
- Looks up, sees Patches. At that moment if they make contact it's 100% shoulder to shoulder despite the height difference
- Letang opts to shoot (millisecond response) which causes him to lower his head to be lined up with Patches shoulder.
- MP doesn't leave his feet, goes straight in his line of motion and catches Latang bent forward just enough to his his nose

The whole point of the check is what? Separate the man from the puck. Also to prevent the guy from taking a shot. If Letang sees him and decides to take the hit, then he's basically putting his head, knowingly in line with Pacioretty's shoulder. It happened fast and if there was no shot, play would be "Letang gets plastered by Pacioretty on clean hit". I don't like players being hurt, but IIRC Shanahan told Alfie that players are supposed to brace themselves for contact (in a very ironic situation).

God I hate the Toronto media (which is synonymous with the Boston media).
So there are actually lowlife losers saying stuff like that here? If so they should be banned from this site.

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Old
11-27-2011, 02:14 PM
  #354
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Originally Posted by sheed36 View Post
So there are actually lowlife losers saying stuff like that here? If so they should be banned from this site.
technically was on the TSN board, which as you know reviews posts before allowing them to be posted. Which brings me to my last point in that post.

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Old
11-27-2011, 02:18 PM
  #355
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Boston Bruins.
Ummm, they arent sexy and roll off your tongue but Zdeno Chara and Tim Thomas.

A Norris trophy and Vezina trophy winner dont fall in the Superstar status enough for you? Frankly, Montreal does not have a single player currently that matches up with those two. Price and Thomas are close however Chara's impact is bigger than any hab. Will Price be better, possibly but currently its Thomas.

Add in Seguin who likely is going to best any Montreal forward and is over a PPG pace.

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Old
11-27-2011, 02:18 PM
  #356
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
I disagree on Subban and Gorges. They were far from solid and they hadtrouble clearing the zone. If you can review the video, focus on the disallowed Kunitz "goal."
They were the best at getting the puck out. They didn't get trapped in our end for long periods of time. Subban has some growing up to do, and hopefully he does it, but overall he played well. One play is not a game. The Pens D, including Kris Letang, made mistakes too. They happen. But Subban was hard on the puck, and stepped up with a nice physical game (but not over aggressive).

Emelin should definitely be the 6th D on this team & played before both Diaz and Weber. He had some shifts against Crosby, and while that's not a match-up I want to see a lot of, not yet anyway, Emelin did well and played Crosby physically. We need him on this blueline.

Weber is so inconsistent as a player. There are games where I say yeah that kid is an NHL defenceman. He's going to be a top 4 in this league, and other games where he just doesn't. Confidence, I think is an issue with him. He's only played 73 NHL games over the last three years, so there is still time for him, but I get the feeling it's going to be with another organization.

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Old
11-27-2011, 05:35 PM
  #357
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Originally Posted by Kirk Muller View Post
Ummm, they arent sexy and roll off your tongue but Zdeno Chara and Tim Thomas.

A Norris trophy and Vezina trophy winner dont fall in the Superstar status enough for you? Frankly, Montreal does not have a single player currently that matches up with those two. Price and Thomas are close however Chara's impact is bigger than any hab. Will Price be better, possibly but currently its Thomas.

Add in Seguin who likely is going to best any Montreal forward and is over a PPG pace.
I thought we were talking offense.

Seguin is having a great year but you still cannot include him in the same breath as Crosby or Ovechkin.

Chara is one of the best DMen for sure but I would take Price over Thomas any day.

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Old
11-27-2011, 05:40 PM
  #358
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Sens fan here... And even I've got to say you've easily been cheated out a potential victory there...

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Old
11-27-2011, 05:45 PM
  #359
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Boston Bruins.
Tim Thomas
Zdeno Chara
Milan Lucic
Patrice Bergeron

I'm sorry but I (and 28 other teams) would take any of those 4 players over all our players (in their respective positions) except Thomas over Price (due to age).

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11-27-2011, 05:53 PM
  #360
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Originally Posted by Jack Bourdain View Post
Tim Thomas
Zdeno Chara
Milan Lucic
Patrice Bergeron

I'm sorry but I (and 28 other teams) would take any of those 4 players over all our players (in their respective positions) except Thomas over Price (due to age).

Again, although they are great players, still cannot compare Lucic or Bergeron to Crosby, Malkin, Hossa, Kane etc.

I would love to see 3 of the 4 in Habs sweaters.

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Old
11-27-2011, 09:14 PM
  #361
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
No, because there's a difference between a team sneaking into a bottom playoff berth on the strength of a couple of key players, and a team solidifying a top playoff berth early and maintaining it to the end on the strength of basically the entire roster in the absence of key players. I'm sure you can guess which one is the Habs and which one is the Penguins.

But if you want an example of a top tier Habs roster, look at 2007-08, and the number of players that went on to fill important roles on their new teams (some continue to do so). That was a "top-tier" roster in the making that year, no doubt. Basically, imo "top-tier" is defined as much by the guys occupying the "bottom" 3 lines as those on the top one.
A few things.
First off, explain how we sneaked into the POs last season when we never were outside a PO position all year, and finished 6th. You can't actually, because we did not sneak into them. We held a PO position all season, and made them in a comfortable 6th place. Also, unlike the Pens, we struggled with injuries right from day 1, until game 82.

I won't spin around this for ages though, I credit their coaching a lot more than the players. They are very well coached, and I think they would definitely make the POs even without Crosby and Malkin. Top tier without them in the line up for a full season though? I highly doubt it.


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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Sexy is in the eye of the beholder, I guess you could say. And it's obvious that many (if not most) people's eyes here have not beheld much that occurs outside the Bell Centre, so they don't recognize a really good roster unless there are names they're familiar with from Sportscentre clips.
I would hope you don't think I am one of those guys that limits himself to the Habs and Sportscenter.

I can recognize a good roster, and I actually said the Pens had one. I said they are over hyped, which doesn't mean I think they aren't good.

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Old
11-28-2011, 02:02 AM
  #362
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
A few things.
First off, explain how we sneaked into the POs last season when we never were outside a PO position all year, and finished 6th. You can't actually, because we did not sneak into them. We held a PO position all season, and made them in a comfortable 6th place. Also, unlike the Pens, we struggled with injuries right from day 1, until game 82.
Okay, last season was more of a limp. .500 hockey in March, and whatever you say about holding the position, Carolina was coming on hot and we still only finished 5 pts ahead of them in 9th. I wasn't speaking specifically about last year though, as Pittsburgh has had multiple instances of playing great hockey without Crosby, Malkin, or both. But if you want "sneak", I think 2009/10 definitely qualifies, don't you?

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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I won't spin around this for ages though, I credit their coaching a lot more than the players. They are very well coached, and I think they would definitely make the POs even without Crosby and Malkin. Top tier without them in the line up for a full season though? I highly doubt it.
It's fine to have an opinion and doubts, but know that the evidence strongly contradicts yours. I mean, Fleury, Staal, and Letang are pretty good starting points for building an image of "top tier" even without the big 2.

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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I would hope you don't think I am one of those guys that limits himself to the Habs and Sportscenter.

I can recognize a good roster, and I actually said the Pens had one. I said they are over hyped, which doesn't mean I think they aren't good.
Nope, you probably don't. Many that like to argue around here do though, I suspect. I suppose, though, that the real issue here is that you're willing to consider them a good team with a good roster, but refuse to believe your own eyes when you've supposedly been watching a lot of these games with Crosby and/or Malkin missing. Yes, they're well-coached, but hockey isn't just knowledge - it's mostly execution. My definition of a "top-tier" roster hinges on their execution, not their NHL2012 cumulative player rankings. Anyone is free to have a different definition with different criteria, and we'll continue to have discussion.

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Old
11-28-2011, 02:13 AM
  #363
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Originally Posted by Jack Bourdain View Post
Tim Thomas
Zdeno Chara
Milan Lucic
Patrice Bergeron

I'm sorry but I (and 28 other teams) would take any of those 4 players over all our players (in their respective positions) except Thomas over Price (due to age).
Plekanec is probably better than Bergeron at this point.

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Old
11-28-2011, 06:06 AM
  #364
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Okay, last season was more of a limp. .500 hockey in March, and whatever you say about holding the position, Carolina was coming on hot and we still only finished 5 pts ahead of them in 9th. I wasn't speaking specifically about last year though, as Pittsburgh has had multiple instances of playing great hockey without Crosby, Malkin, or both. But if you want "sneak", I think 2009/10 definitely qualifies, don't you?



It's fine to have an opinion and doubts, but know that the evidence strongly contradicts yours. I mean, Fleury, Staal, and Letang are pretty good starting points for building an image of "top tier" even without the big 2.



Nope, you probably don't. Many that like to argue around here do though, I suspect. I suppose, though, that the real issue here is that you're willing to consider them a good team with a good roster, but refuse to believe your own eyes when you've supposedly been watching a lot of these games with Crosby and/or Malkin missing. Yes, they're well-coached, but hockey isn't just knowledge - it's mostly execution. My definition of a "top-tier" roster hinges on their execution, not their NHL2012 cumulative player rankings. Anyone is free to have a different definition with different criteria, and we'll continue to have discussion.
Yes, we sneaked in two years ago. Considering the number of injuries mixed in with the fact half the team was new, with a new coach, I have issues with. Half our team constituted of AHL players at some point early in the year, this cannot possibly help a new team learn a new system and players find chemistry.

Sure, Staal, Letang and Fleury are great starting points. So is Pk, Price and Plekanec.
As I mentioned earlier, James Neal was a great add for them, they have good depth, but I would not go as far as to say they are a top tier team without Crosby/Malkin.

Just going to have to agree to disagree, you rank them higher than I do by a bit.

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Old
11-28-2011, 06:45 AM
  #365
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They were the best at getting the puck out. They didn't get trapped in our end for long periods of time. Subban has some growing up to do, and hopefully he does it, but overall he played well. One play is not a game. The Pens D, including Kris Letang, made mistakes too. They happen. But Subban was hard on the puck, and stepped up with a nice physical game (but not over aggressive).

Emelin should definitely be the 6th D on this team & played before both Diaz and Weber. He had some shifts against Crosby, and while that's not a match-up I want to see a lot of, not yet anyway, Emelin did well and played Crosby physically. We need him on this blueline.

Weber is so inconsistent as a player. There are games where I say yeah that kid is an NHL defenceman. He's going to be a top 4 in this league, and other games where he just doesn't. Confidence, I think is an issue with him. He's only played 73 NHL games over the last three years, so there is still time for him, but I get the feeling it's going to be with another organization.

With Weber it's very simple, you normally break in your d-men as #5-6 guys with a veteran partner, well for about 15 games this year he's had to handle #3 or 4 minutes and often play with a rookie partner. It's normal for young players to have ups and downs, makes the downs a bit harder when you don't always have a strong veteran(Markov, Gorges etc) to help break them in.

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Old
11-28-2011, 07:15 AM
  #366
Tony Clifton Leaf
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Originally Posted by Le Tricolore View Post
Plekanec is probably better than Bergeron at this point.
It would depend on who's on the rest of your team. If your team already has a # 1 C, then I would rather have Bergeron because he can be a good # 2 C as well as shut-down opponents top-players with the best of them. But if your team doesn't have a # 1 C already, Plekanec would probably be more valuable.

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Old
11-28-2011, 07:40 AM
  #367
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It would depend on who's on the rest of your team. If your team already has a # 1 C, then I would rather have Bergeron because he can be a good # 2 C as well as shut-down opponents top-players with the best of them. But if your team doesn't have a # 1 C already, Plekanec would probably be more valuable.
So can Plekanec?

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Old
11-28-2011, 07:45 AM
  #368
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On the winning goal, how can it not be golaie interference?

The Pens skater hooks his foot behind Price's and turs him around in the crease, Price is facing the net when the puck goes into the net.

How does that work? Seriously?

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Old
11-28-2011, 09:04 AM
  #369
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Yes, we sneaked in two years ago. Considering the number of injuries mixed in with the fact half the team was new, with a new coach, I have issues with. Half our team constituted of AHL players at some point early in the year, this cannot possibly help a new team learn a new system and players find chemistry.

Sure, Staal, Letang and Fleury are great starting points. So is Pk, Price and Plekanec.
As I mentioned earlier, James Neal was a great add for them, they have good depth, but I would not go as far as to say they are a top tier team without Crosby/Malkin.

Just going to have to agree to disagree, you rank them higher than I do by a bit.
I guess I don't necessarily "rank" them highly as much as I submit that the results speak for themselves.

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