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Draft: Danger - Bertrand Raymond

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Old
11-30-2011, 12:48 PM
  #51
MathMan
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Originally Posted by Halifaxhab View Post
with PK and Weber, made for a great draft year. Add in Stejskal and Conboy who could turn into solid depth players in the NHL from late rounds 2007 was probably the deepest in terms of Timmons picks
2005 dug up Price, Latendresse, d'Agostini, and Sergei Kostitsyn. Not a bad haul either.

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Old
11-30-2011, 12:53 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
2005 dug up Price, Latendresse, d'Agostini, and Sergei Kostitsyn. Not a bad haul either.
Agreed.

But I do believe that Timmons gets flustered in 1st rounds because he likes so many players and does get pressured to hit that homerun. He makes an educated guess and sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. But overall he is a very good judge of talent

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11-30-2011, 01:03 PM
  #53
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The 2003 and 2006 drafts "killed" the Habs (in terms of Stanley Cup contending team.)

In 2003, if you need a big center, you don't draft A.K. in the first, nor Uruqhart in the second... Getzlaf or Carter, Bergeron or Shea Weber, should wear the CH... You can even grab Backes instead of Lapierre !!!!

In 2006, If you have already Getzlaf and Weber, you don't have to draft Fischer, and you go with Giroux in the 1st. You don't draft Maxwell, and grab Lucic. In the third, you can certainly draft better than White: Marchand and Clutterbuck were still available.

And with all the other good picks, you got a Cup contender. No need to get the Cammy, Gomez, Gionta, Tanguay, etc....

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Old
11-30-2011, 01:09 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Halifaxhab View Post
But I do believe that Timmons gets flustered in 1st rounds because he likes so many players and does get pressured to hit that homerun.
Compare Timmins' first round performance to that of other teams sometime. He actually does very well there too. He only has that reputation because people are fixated on the 2003 draft year (even though he got a solid NHLer that year) and have unrealistic expectations of first rounders, expecting them all to be impact players when about a third don't even become regular NHLers.

Timmins is also slammed because of the picks he didn't make, cherry-picking the best player available picked after him -- which is tantamount to expecting him to do better than the 29 other teams put together.

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11-30-2011, 01:19 PM
  #55
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I like Raymond he's always funny.

Even if he's a cheap (in every way) knockoff of Rejean Tremlay

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Old
11-30-2011, 01:21 PM
  #56
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yes he made a mistake, but Timmins has done very well in the last couple of years and never get's credit for the later rounds steals that he drafted. He missed Giroux but so did other teams

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Old
11-30-2011, 01:25 PM
  #57
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Bring back the Quebec Nordiques!

And take Bertand Raymond with you...

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Old
11-30-2011, 01:37 PM
  #58
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I hate when people, especially journalists, bash our team for mistakes made 5 years before. Nobody knew who Giroux was at the draft. Timmins would have been criticised for taking another small center who was ignored by all the CHL one year before.

Few people were happy with the selection of Carey Price. I remember being quite mad at the time as I wanted Kopitar. But Raymond uses this situation to bash Timmins again, saying he would have drafted Pouliot if he was available. I'm sure that, in 2005, Raymond was probably criticizing the habs for drafting Price when we already had Theodore and not draft Gilbert Brulé, a player with a francophone name. But he'll never talk about his mistake. He's perfect. He knows everything. He's not allowed to make mistakes. I hate these people.

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Old
11-30-2011, 01:46 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
just the other day i was having an argument with a french guy from montreal. he was adamant that AK was a ****ing useless, lazy bum this season, he couldn't wait to 'give him away'...
How do you know Jacques Martin?

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11-30-2011, 01:48 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
Compare Timmins' first round performance to that of other teams sometime. He actually does very well there too. He only has that reputation because people are fixated on the 2003 draft year (even though he got a solid NHLer that year) and have unrealistic expectations of first rounders, expecting them all to be impact players when about a third don't even become regular NHLers.

Timmins is also slammed because of the picks he didn't make, cherry-picking the best player available picked after him -- which is tantamount to expecting him to do better than the 29 other teams put together.
If his drafting has been so stellar, why isn't the team better?

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Old
11-30-2011, 01:48 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Demers of the Sharks said the same thing. When asked what is the first thing that comes to mind when I say Montreal, he responded ''the media''.
But maybe he meant Red Fisher & the English media.

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Old
11-30-2011, 02:06 PM
  #62
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the price pick was great and the subban pick will be considered a 'steal' in a few years based on where he was taken
PS..i'm not a timmins apologist

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Old
11-30-2011, 02:11 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
If his drafting has been so stellar, why isn't the team better?
The team is actually quite good, but it takes much, much more than good drafting to build a team, despite what the media likes to pretend.

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Old
11-30-2011, 02:20 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by pelletier666 View Post
Bertrand Raymond is such a sad case. I'm so fed up of him, his continuous Habs rant.
He's a french version of Dave Stubbs.
I emailed Dave with this comment in Wallpaper format

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11-30-2011, 02:23 PM
  #65
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God i hate this Guy... Never happy

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Old
11-30-2011, 02:27 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
The team is actually quite good, but it takes much, much more than good drafting to build a team, despite what the media likes to pretend.
Quite good? Really?

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Old
11-30-2011, 03:33 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Quite good? Really?
Yes, really. But I evaluate the team based on how it plays, not what its record might be at any given point.

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Old
11-30-2011, 03:38 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
Compare Timmins' first round performance to that of other teams sometime. He actually does very well there too. He only has that reputation because people are fixated on the 2003 draft year (even though he got a solid NHLer that year) and have unrealistic expectations of first rounders, expecting them all to be impact players when about a third don't even become regular NHLers.

Timmins is also slammed because of the picks he didn't make, cherry-picking the best player available picked after him -- which is tantamount to expecting him to do better than the 29 other teams put together.
Don't get me wrong, I feel he's done an amazing job overall for MTL and OTT. He has one of the highest ratios of prospects who have played in the NHL.

When I say he gets flustered, I feel he has one or two players he wants to get at our pick, but doesn't seem able/willing to try and override other managers' decisions who do not have his incite into that batch of prospects.

EDIT:
and yes I want him to do better than the 29 other teams put together....I'm sure you do too. But he does better that 20 teams put together so he doesn't have much farther to go.

Also, it is not necessarily the choices he had made panning out or not that lays all at his feet. Player devellopment has a TON to do in how his picks turn out. That is one area the franchise has been omproving upon....slowly but improving

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Old
11-30-2011, 03:51 PM
  #69
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Raymond has always been misinformed and still is...

Fischer wasn't Timmin's decision. That's the ONE year we drafted positionally cause we were lacking Dmen.
Of course you can blame Timmins for having Fischer on his list... but the other dmen sucked too (Mitera, Wishart, Sanguinetti). We should just have gone BPA as usual of course. For once I blame Gainey on this one (and usually always am on Gainey's side)

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Old
11-30-2011, 04:47 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habitue View Post
The 2003 and 2006 drafts "killed" the Habs (in terms of Stanley Cup contending team.)

In 2003, if you need a big center, you don't draft A.K. in the first, nor Uruqhart in the second... Getzlaf or Carter, Bergeron or Shea Weber, should wear the CH... You can even grab Backes instead of Lapierre !!!!

In 2006, If you have already Getzlaf and Weber, you don't have to draft Fischer, and you go with Giroux in the 1st. You don't draft Maxwell, and grab Lucic. In the third, you can certainly draft better than White: Marchand and Clutterbuck were still available.

And with all the other good picks, you got a Cup contender. No need to get the Cammy, Gomez, Gionta, Tanguay, etc....
Man O man, you're a friggin genius, Habs should hire you!

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Old
11-30-2011, 05:01 PM
  #71
SergeConstantin74
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At the time of Giroux's draft, these same 'journalists' were saying that the team was too small.

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Old
11-30-2011, 05:02 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habitue View Post
T

In 2006, If you have already Getzlaf and Weber, you don't have to draft Fischer, and you go with Giroux in the 1st. You don't draft Maxwell, and grab Lucic. In the third, you can certainly draft better than White: Marchand and Clutterbuck were still available.

And with all the other good picks, you got a Cup contender. No need to get the Cammy, Gomez, Gionta, Tanguay, etc....
To be fair...
Lucic going ahead of White looked silly at that time.

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Old
11-30-2011, 05:02 PM
  #73
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Hey guys look...I can play Raymond's game also!!!

2007 entry draft

The Flyers at 41 overall select Kevin Marshall
The habs at 43 overall select PK Subban

the 2004 nhl entry draft

The Flyers at 149 pick Gino Pisellini
The Habs at 150 pick Mikhail Grabovski

OmGZ the FLYURZ r the StuPiD!1111!!!1!!!

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Old
11-30-2011, 05:06 PM
  #74
ECWHSWI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habitue View Post
The 2003 and 2006 drafts "killed" the Habs (in terms of Stanley Cup contending team.)

In 2003, if you need a big center, you don't draft A.K. in the first, nor Uruqhart in the second... Getzlaf or Carter, Bergeron or Shea Weber, should wear the CH... You can even grab Backes instead of Lapierre !!!!

In 2006, If you have already Getzlaf and Weber, you don't have to draft Fischer, and you go with Giroux in the 1st. You don't draft Maxwell, and grab Lucic. In the third, you can certainly draft better than White: Marchand and Clutterbuck were still available.

And with all the other good picks, you got a Cup contender. No need to get the Cammy, Gomez, Gionta, Tanguay, etc....
you sure seems to know a whole lot about drafting, maybe you can tell us who the Habs should pick the next two or three drafts ?

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Old
11-30-2011, 05:08 PM
  #75
Ozymandias
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Hey guys look...I can play Raymond's game also!!!

2007 entry draft

The Flyers at 41 overall select Kevin Marshall
The habs at 43 overall select PK Subban


the 2004 nhl entry draft

The Flyers at 149 pick Gino Pisellini
The Habs at 150 pick Mikhail Grabovski

OmGZ the FLYURZ r the StuPiD!1111!!!1!!!
When Pronger and Timonen leave in not too long, I wonder who's gonna regret their drafting the most between the Habs and Flyers

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