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Penner going/puzzling statement

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Old
11-30-2011, 04:48 PM
  #26
Axl Rhoadz*
 
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I don't see what's so puzzling, Penner hasn't been ready to play since the day he joined the Kings.

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11-30-2011, 04:57 PM
  #27
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I agree. Doubt it happens though.
I really want to see Lokitionov get a chance to stick this time. I think he can benefit from being mentored by Richards.

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11-30-2011, 04:59 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
This an easy one to me. You send Clifford down to Manchester and tell him to find his game. He needs to build some confidence. Penner gets one more shot on Loktionov's LW.

Wait 4-5 games and re-evaluate.
I'd do this too.. Honestly I never understood what Clifford's all about anyway.

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11-30-2011, 05:04 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Axl Rhoadz View Post
I don't see what's so puzzling, Penner hasn't been ready to play since the day he joined the Kings.

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11-30-2011, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
This an easy one to me. You send Clifford down to Manchester and tell him to find his game. He needs to build some confidence. Penner gets one more shot on Loktionov's LW.

Wait 4-5 games and re-evaluate.
Don't you think Clifford has been a great deal better the last two or three games? Should we keep riding that wave?

If you want to get Penner going should you stick him with a rookie? If you want to get Loki up and running should you stick him with Penner?

How about Penner on the first line (yes, I know Kopi, but that's the dues you pay as the number one center getting other guys out of slumps) and Brown with Loki? Brown has more speed and is more likely to make more room for the kid.

.... and Clifford Fraser Moreau

(that's a funny sounding line... sounds like a soap opera actor "with Clifford Fraser Moreau starring as Doctor Whit Rollings")

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11-30-2011, 05:17 PM
  #31
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Penner is done. 33 games as a King...2 goals. Westgarth has 1 less in 9 games.

It just isn't a fit. I feel Penner needs to go to the slower Eastern Conference and play for a more offensive minded coach.

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11-30-2011, 05:21 PM
  #32
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There is really no reason to touch the Fourth line what so ever. They actually have an Identity.

Clifford has played better the Last three games. But if it's between him and Loki for who goes down, Clifford should go.

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11-30-2011, 05:21 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
Don't you think Clifford has been a great deal better the last two or three games? Should we keep riding that wave?

If you want to get Penner going should you stick him with a rookie? If you want to get Loki up and running should you stick him with Penner?

How about Penner on the first line (yes, I know Kopi, but that's the dues you pay as the number one center getting other guys out of slumps) and Brown with Loki? Brown has more speed and is more likely to make more room for the kid.

.... and Clifford Fraser Moreau

(that's a funny sounding line... sounds like a soap opera actor "with Clifford Fraser Moreau starring as Doctor Whit Rollings")
Yes, Clifford has been better the last few games. However, he is in the same boat that Voynov was in earlier in the season. If I don't want to waive or trade anyone yet then it's a choice of sending down Loktionov or Clifford. I choose Clifford. We need more creativity on offense at this point.

The real question here is who is going when Penner comes back. Unless you waive a player of make a trade, it's one of the two kids.

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Old
11-30-2011, 05:53 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Penner is done. 33 games as a King...2 goals. Westgarth has 1 less in 9 games.

It just isn't a fit. I feel Penner needs to go to the slower Eastern Conference and play for a more offensive minded coach.

He's basically earning about a million bucks for every goal he scores. Great value!

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11-30-2011, 06:04 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Penner is done. 33 games as a King...2 goals. Westgarth has 1 less in 9 games.

It just isn't a fit. I feel Penner needs to go to the slower Eastern Conference and play for a more offensive minded coach.
And Westy has one more goal than Kopi the past 5 games and he's a plus 1 whereas Kopi is a minus 6.

It's great that Westy finally got his first nhl goal, but let's not get carried away here.

Penner's a proven goal scorer who's struggling and Westy a goon who got his first nhl goal.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:18 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
And Westy has one more goal than Kopi the past 5 games and he's a plus 1 whereas Kopi is a minus 6.

It's great that Westy finally got his first nhl goal, but let's not get carried away here.

Penner's a proven goal scorer who's struggling and Westy a goon who got his first nhl goal.

2 goal in 33 games....'struggling' would be a vast understatement.

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Old
11-30-2011, 06:21 PM
  #37
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Confucius say, Where there's smoke there's usually a person who thinks they smell smoke but it is truly a brain tumor.

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11-30-2011, 07:20 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
Yes, Clifford has been better the last few games. However, he is in the same boat that Voynov was in earlier in the season. If I don't want to waive or trade anyone yet then it's a choice of sending down Loktionov or Clifford. I choose Clifford. We need more creativity on offense at this point.

The real question here is who is going when Penner comes back. Unless you waive a player of make a trade, it's one of the two kids.
I would, any day of the week, waive hunter/Moreau before sending clifford down. Our botton six is bad enough and just gets worse if we are dressing Hunter/Moreau over Clifford.

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Old
11-30-2011, 07:23 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Penner is done. 33 games as a King...2 goals. Westgarth has 1 less in 9 games.

It just isn't a fit. I feel Penner needs to go to the slower Eastern Conference and play for a more offensive minded coach.
Huh? Westgarth has 1 goal in 75 games as a King. Still not enough for Penner, but it's not like Westgarth is lighting it up (not that he is expected too).

I agree that Penner isn't working with Murray, but he has a career shooting percentage of 13.6% away from Murray. He has a 3.8% with Murray.

Poni had the same problem. He went from a career shooting percentage of 11.4% to 5.3% with Murray.

Oh well, some guys just don't work with Murray. It doesn't mean the player is a bum or terrible, he just doesn't work out. Happens with a lot of coaches.

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11-30-2011, 07:38 PM
  #40
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I guess that the easy solution would be to have Penner go to Manchester for a 2 week "conditioning" assignment.

That would probably irk Mr. Penner, but such is life ...

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Old
11-30-2011, 07:41 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by deeshamrock View Post
Maybe I read too much into it, but the puzzling thing was Terry Murray saying (Per Hammond on LAK INsider) Penner's hand is fine, that wasn't the reason he wouldn't be playing.
He probably is healthy but they want to wait to make a decision on how to open the roster spot for him. Something tells me if the Kings are giving Loktionov another game at center, they are either entertaining the thought of waiving Moreau/Hunter or (more likely) considering sending Clifford down instead of Loktionov. Maybe I'm just hoping that is the case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
Don't you think Clifford has been a great deal better the last two or three games? Should we keep riding that wave?
I said it in another thread but Loktionov > Clifford. If it comes down to one of those two going, I'd rather see Clifford go. Loktionov is more important to this team right now and Clifford could use some time in Manchester.

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11-30-2011, 08:53 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Buddy The Elf View Post
... I said it in another thread but Loktionov > Clifford. If it comes down to one of those two going, I'd rather see Clifford go. Loktionov is more important to this team right now and Clifford could use some time in Manchester.
Of course they have different roles to play and both have a pretty good upside for the future. I like your point about Loki being more important (build through the center, blah blah) but nothing wrong with the warrior that is Clifford. I see some Shane Doan in him.

Lokti... we've seen some flashes of what the future may hold, but I think it may take longer then we think (or hope) to get him up as a regular. He still gets taken off the puck too much for a center - especially in Murray's system. But there's nothing wrong with having him follow Mike Richards around and just absorb.

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11-30-2011, 09:13 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
Of course they have different roles to play and both have a pretty good upside for the future. I like your point about Loki being more important (build through the center, blah blah) but nothing wrong with the warrior that is Clifford. I see some Shane Doan in him.

Lokti... we've seen some flashes of what the future may hold, but I think it may take longer then we think (or hope) to get him up as a regular. He still gets taken off the puck too much for a center - especially in Murray's system. But there's nothing wrong with having him follow Mike Richards around and just absorb.

Tough call if it's between the two. I just think that for these two young players who have undeniable potential, the team has to invest time for them at the NHL level. This may lead to bad mistakes and even ones that cost games (not yet that I know of), but they need to be given time.

NOt really sure what the solution is here. Hope we can keep both up.

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Old
11-30-2011, 09:43 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Kingurentai View Post
Tough call if it's between the two. I just think that for these two young players who have undeniable potential, the team has to invest time for them at the NHL level. This may lead to bad mistakes and even ones that cost games (not yet that I know of), but they need to be given time.

NOt really sure what the solution is here. Hope we can keep both up.
Well to me, the team currently struggles with offense.


Lotkionovs offensive contribution potential far >>>>>> Cliffords.


Answer is easy imo. Clifford, as hard a worker as he is, just doesn't do enough on the offensive side of the puck to warrant his staying currently.

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11-30-2011, 11:18 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
This an easy one to me. You send Clifford down to Manchester and tell him to find his game. He needs to build some confidence. Penner gets one more shot on Loktionov's LW.

Wait 4-5 games and re-evaluate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaygokings View Post
Well to me, the team currently struggles with offense.


Lotkionovs offensive contribution potential far >>>>>> Cliffords.


Answer is easy imo. Clifford, as hard a worker as he is, just doesn't do enough on the offensive side of the puck to warrant his staying currently.
Nah. I keep Cliffy up. You aren't going to give Loktionov Clifford's ice time and you won't give it to Penner either. When Penner comes back, you clear a top nine spot and that is likely Loktionov. I like Loki, but it's not like he's lighting it up either with two assists in seven games. Potential shouldn't get you in the line up. It shouldn't with penner either, but we know he'll be in the line up again at some point due to salary and what DL paid to get him. Loktionov, not the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
Don't you think Clifford has been a great deal better the last two or three games? Should we keep riding that wave?

If you want to get Penner going should you stick him with a rookie? If you want to get Loki up and running should you stick him with Penner?

How about Penner on the first line (yes, I know Kopi, but that's the dues you pay as the number one center getting other guys out of slumps) and Brown with Loki? Brown has more speed and is more likely to make more room for the kid.

.... and Clifford Fraser Moreau

(that's a funny sounding line... sounds like a soap opera actor "with Clifford Fraser Moreau starring as Doctor Whit Rollings")
Cliff has looked much better lately (minus the missed open net against Dallas) so i would keep him up. Frankly, he should be seeing more ice time. hard to get confidence and develop as a 20 year old with 8:30 a game. I know, some will say that's more of a reason to send him down, but he's not any worse than Moreau/Hunter, etc. and this teams bottom six group has looke the best in the most recent games, when Westgarth and Cliffy were playing a physical game, grinding and hitting more. I think the key to our bottom six is to stop being cute and just start hitting people. The odd goal will come as a result (like Westy and Moreau lately).

I also agree with Penner on Kopi's wing. Kopitar is going into his mini-slump he does once a year anyways, so why not try Penner now? The worst that will happen is what's happened the last 5 games for each anyways, but they may create a spark as well, who knows. It could also spread the scoring out a bit too. Win-win potentially with little downside if done for only a few games. Any longer, Penner better be producing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Penner is done. 33 games as a King...2 goals. Westgarth has 1 less in 9 games.

It just isn't a fit. I feel Penner needs to go to the slower Eastern Conference and play for a more offensive minded coach.
Penner's done just fine in the West, as that's the opnly place he's played. His struggles last year in LA were almost 100% his own fault for being in shape... the shape of a ball. Dude was sweating burger grease last year. This year it's been mostly bad luck and coaching, but he's still had a few games were he's been taking time off. Honestly, from what I've seen, he's trying harder this year than he did in most seasons with the Oilers, so it will come if he keeps it up. I think if Penner gets a goal, it could open the flood gates. Getting that goal would be like getting Todd Bertuzzi off your back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winger23 View Post
I would, any day of the week, waive hunter/Moreau before sending clifford down. Our botton six is bad enough and just gets worse if we are dressing Hunter/Moreau over Clifford.
Agreed. Clifford I don't think will learn anything from being in the minors. I'd also consider trading/waiving one of Richardson or Lewis. They haven't been much better and have failed expectations a lot more than hunter and Moreau have.

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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Huh? Westgarth has 1 goal in 75 games as a King. Still not enough for Penner, but it's not like Westgarth is lighting it up (not that he is expected too).

I agree that Penner isn't working with Murray, but he has a career shooting percentage of 13.6% away from Murray. He has a 3.8% with Murray.

Poni had the same problem. He went from a career shooting percentage of 11.4% to 5.3% with Murray.

Oh well, some guys just don't work with Murray. It doesn't mean the player is a bum or terrible, he just doesn't work out. Happens with a lot of coaches.
Good points as always Sydor. I want to see what happens when Penner gets a goal though. Might cause him to breakout. I do think it's a TM problem though, Penner's at his best attacking with speed (he actually has good wheels for a big guy when he has a chance) and TM's perimeter system is not tailored to Penner at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PSP View Post
I guess that the easy solution would be to have Penner go to Manchester for a 2 week "conditioning" assignment.

That would probably irk Mr. Penner, but such is life ...
I was going to suggest that. Just for a game or two, not for the full two weeks. Maybe let him get a goal just so he gets the feeling back. Some no pressure games could help.

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Old
12-01-2011, 02:59 AM
  #46
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i really hope loktionov can make some plays and put some points up and force TM to bench westy or hunter. glad westy got his first goal but loktionov should be in the line up before hunter or westy imo.

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Old
12-01-2011, 04:36 AM
  #47
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This seems optimistic. Based on his performance this season, his injury, and his contract. Who would take him right now?
Montreal.

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Old
12-02-2011, 12:43 AM
  #48
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we can only hope.

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Old
12-02-2011, 01:34 AM
  #49
The Black1963
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I'm thinking Penner's gonna sit another game.

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