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Old
12-05-2011, 01:03 PM
  #1
Josh Deitell
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New lines

Per Rich:

Gagne-Kopitar-Williams
Brown-Stoll-Hunter
Penner-Loktionov-Moreau
Clifford-Fraser-Westgarth

http://lakingsinsider.com/2011/12/05...e-new-lines-2/

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:08 PM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Deitell View Post
Per Rich:

Gagne-Kopitar-Williams
Brown-Stoll-Hunter
Penner-Loktionov-Moreau
Clifford-Fraser-Westgarth

http://lakingsinsider.com/2011/12/05...e-new-lines-2/
Interesting. I'm glad to see the first line the way it is. I hope it jump starts all three of those guys, as they found success earlier this year. Brown back on left wing is nice, as he looked great the game or two he played there a few games ago. The third line is just...odd.


Not to speculate but Dennis Bernstein tweeted:

Quote:
while Board of Govenors at Pebble Beach would have been cool, better story option for @TheFourthPeriod crew in LA this afternoon.
So I then tweeted back asking if something was going down in Kings land this afternoon and he wrote back:

Quote:
one of the more enjoyable LA Kings related assignments to occur this afternoon. haha

Hmmmmm........

ETA: I tweeted back Coaching news? or something like that and he said:

Quote:
probably as far from coaching as possible lol. If you're wating for a bench change, you gonna wait long.
Darn, only one can hope.

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:22 PM
  #3
KINGS17
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Murray trying to find the key to getting Williams and to a lesser extent Kopitar going again? We need everyone on that top line producing.

Loktionov better start figuring out that he needs to create more shots for himself. I can't see that 2nd line completing more than one pass in a row.

Bernstein is probably excited about meeting some of the ice girls.

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:24 PM
  #4
Sydor25
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Meh, another loss and Terry goes to the blender. Great coaching!

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:25 PM
  #5
kingpest19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBernierFan View Post
Interesting. I'm glad to see the first line the way it is. I hope it jump starts all three of those guys, as they found success earlier this year. Brown back on left wing is nice, as he looked great the game or two he played there a few games ago. The third line is just...odd.


Not to speculate but Dennis Bernstein tweeted:



So I then tweeted back asking if something was going down in Kings land this afternoon and he wrote back:




Hmmmmm........

ETA: I tweeted back Coaching news? or something like that and he said:



Darn, only one can hope.
Maybe a little bit but it gives Lokti two big bodies on the ice with him that can grind and possibly open up some more space for him to be more creative.

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:25 PM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBernierFan View Post
Interesting. I'm glad to see the first line the way it is. I hope it jump starts all three of those guys, as they found success earlier this year. Brown back on left wing is nice, as he looked great the game or two he played there a few games ago. The third line is just...odd.


Not to speculate but Dennis Bernstein tweeted:



So I then tweeted back asking if something was going down in Kings land this afternoon and he wrote back:




Hmmmmm........

ETA: I tweeted back Coaching news? or something like that and he said:



Darn, only one can hope.
He wishes he knew anything going on in the Kings org.

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:30 PM
  #7
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Contrary to Rich's report, Mitchell IS skating today.

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:32 PM
  #8
Sydor25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruel11 View Post
He wishes he knew anything going on in the Kings org.
Bernstein is a tool, but I believe him when he says that there isn't much of a chance that Murray gets fired mid-season, Lombardi doesn't have the stones. It's too risky.

Also, Quick looks to be in the zone this season and the Kings should hover around the 8th seed all season.


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Originally Posted by Live in the Now View Post
Contrary to Rich's report, Mitchell IS skating today.
Yellow jersey or by himself?

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12-05-2011, 01:34 PM
  #9
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Bernstein is a tool, but I believe him when he says that there isn't much of a chance that Murray gets fired mid-season, Lombardi doesn't have the stones. It's too risky.

Also, Quick looks to be in the zone this season and the Kings should hover around the 8th seed all season.




Yellow jersey or by himself?
Doesn't say, but I think by himself.

#LAKings defenseman Willie Mitchell is about to take the ice. It will be his 1st skate since suffering a lower body injury last Thursday.

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12-05-2011, 01:38 PM
  #10
KINGS17
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Bernstein is a tool, but I believe him when he says that there isn't much of a chance that Murray gets fired mid-season, Lombardi doesn't have the stones. It's too risky.

Also, Quick looks to be in the zone this season and the Kings should hover around the 8th seed all season.




Yellow jersey or by himself?
You ever think it takes more stones to take the heat and not make a change?

Right or wrong Lombardi has created something this season that he believes in and he is going to give it a chance. I suppose we could bring in a new coach and then if the Kings drop 3 or 4 in a row right off the bat, what do you do?

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12-05-2011, 01:41 PM
  #11
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I'm fine with going with Murray until the end of the season. I don't think changing coaches in the middle of the season would help this team in particular. They're a very mentally weak team and this causes a lot of the problems that fans have with the coach. Firing Murray wouldn't be this great panacea that people seem to think it would be.

In short, I don't think the problem is the coach's message, I think it lies within the team. But after the season, yeah, get rid of him please.

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12-05-2011, 01:41 PM
  #12
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sweet, 1 top line, 2 3rd lines and a 4th line. Going to be fun

Brown in the left again i like. The 4th line i like, would rather Richardson or Lewis in the #2rw spot though

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:47 PM
  #13
Sydor25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
You ever think it takes more stones to take the heat and not make a change?

Right or wrong Lombardi has created something this season that he believes in and he is going to give it a chance. I suppose we could bring in a new coach and then if the Kings drop 3 or 4 in a row right off the bat, what do you do?
It doesn't take any stones to continue doing the same thing and expecting different results. I think there is a saying for people that do that... And what heat is Lombardi getting?

Well, 3 or 4 games doesn't tell you much, but the final 50 or so games would give you a huge indication if some major roster changes are in order.

If the Kings continue to score around 2 goals per game after a coaching change, then the Kings never had the roster to win with in the first place. Murray is not the kind of coach that gets the most out of a roster, so if the players really aren't as good as we think, then it doesn't matter if Murray is fired this week versus April.

Would you rather see Kopitar or Brown traded before Murray is removed, this is the kind of roster shakeup that is equivalent to a coaching change? Trading Penner and/or Martinez isn't going to get you a difference maker.


Last edited by Sydor25: 12-05-2011 at 01:55 PM.
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Old
12-05-2011, 01:53 PM
  #14
Sydor25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Live in the Now View Post
I'm fine with going with Murray until the end of the season. I don't think changing coaches in the middle of the season would help this team in particular. They're a very mentally weak team and this causes a lot of the problems that fans have with the coach. Firing Murray wouldn't be this great panacea that people seem to think it would be.

In short, I don't think the problem is the coach's message, I think it lies within the team. But after the season, yeah, get rid of him please.
If you don't think Murray is the coach to get the "mentally weak" team to the Stanley Cup, why waste another season with him? Firing Murray has never been viewed as a great panacea; it's just the best option to see if major roster changes are still needed. If the Kings let Murray finish the season and they miss the playoffs or lose in the first round, how does Lombardi know if major roster changes are needed? Does he just fire Murray in April and hope that the next coach can get it done? Wouldn't you rather see a new voice in the room to see if the roster isn't as "mentally weak" as you think?

I really believe that Lombardi thought he made the right roster changes this off season to get results and so far the Kings are worst. I would love to hear his thoughts on the current situation. For a guy who can't usually shut up about stuff, he hasn't talked about the team much this season. Only piped up to ***** about the officiating again.


Why do you think the team is mentally weak? What gives you that idea?

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:54 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Live in the Now View Post
... I don't think changing coaches in the middle of the season would help this team in particular. They're a very mentally weak team and this causes a lot of the problems that fans have with the coach....
I'm not sure if they are mentally weak or just not fierce enough.

Do you see a difference in that? The mentally weak aspect is a reactive one - how do they respond to adversity? I think they've learned how to deal with bad times and bad breaks. I think they may even be too comfortable dealing with it, if that makes any sense.

They get easily distracted and happy when things are going well... lot's of smiles and grins and jokes. That's just as bad, if not worse considering the lack of respect displayed to opponents (with long memories) as being too down when things are bad.

I think they need to be more consistent, more proactive and fierce in their individual and team approach to games. They have yet to show that burning in the gut intensity it takes to win in this league.

Richards, Scuderi, Mitchell, and Quick are the only guys to show that consistently.

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Old
12-05-2011, 01:55 PM
  #16
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
It doesn't take any stones to continue doing the same thing and expecting different results. I think there is a saying for people that do that...

Well, 3 or 4 games doesn't tell you much, but the final 50 or so games would give you a huge indication if some major roster changes are in order.

If the Kings continue to score around 2 goals per game after a coaching change, then the Kings never had the roster to win with in the first place. Murray is not the kind of coach that gets the most out of a roster, so if the players really aren't as good as we think, then it doesn't matter if Murray is fired this week versus April.

Would you rather see Kopitar or Brown traded before Murray is removed, this is the kind of roster shakeup that is equivalent to a coaching change? Trading Penner and/or Martinez isn't going to get you a difference maker.
Didn't realize that we had played that many games with this roster.

How do you know that? You are looking to make a change just for the sake of change. I would rather see a more calculated move than what you advocate.

Of course I don't want to see Kopitar or Brown traded, but I would like to see Kopitar playing like the #1 center we always see in October most of the time. This 20-game fade he does every season is getting old. What does that have to do with coaching?

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12-05-2011, 01:59 PM
  #17
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Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
I'm not sure if they are mentally weak or just not fierce enough.

Do you see a difference in that? The mentally weak aspect is a reactive one - how do they respond to adversity? I think they've learned how to deal with bad times and bad breaks. I think they may even be too comfortable dealing with it, if that makes any sense.

They get easily distracted and happy when things are going well... lot's of smiles and grins and jokes. That's just as bad, if not worse considering the lack of respect displayed to opponents (with long memories) as being too down when things are bad.

I think they need to be more consistent, more proactive and fierce in their individual and team approach to games. They have yet to show that burning in the gut intensity it takes to win in this league.

Richards, Scuderi, Mitchell, and Quick are the only guys to show that consistently.
Was going to type exactly this and then you got to it at the end. I agree. Quick is just picking up this aspect of his game this season. We need Kopitar and Brown to follow suit in the worst way.

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Old
12-05-2011, 02:00 PM
  #18
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In the battle of trading your stars versus changing a coach the coach rarely wins.


See; Carlyle, Randy and/or Boudreau, Bruce

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12-05-2011, 02:06 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
Didn't realize that we had played that many games with this roster.

How do you know that? You are looking to make a change just for the sake of change. I would rather see a more calculated move than what you advocate.

Of course I don't want to see Kopitar or Brown traded, but I would like to see Kopitar playing like the #1 center we always see in October most of the time. This 20-game fade he does every season is getting old. What does that have to do with coaching?
Why do you think it takes 82 games for a few new players to make an impact with their new team? Seems like a lot of players start well with the Kings and then fade. Penner and Gagne are the latest.

Why make any changes then? Why trade for Mike Richards? Why sign Gagne? Why trade for Penner? Lombardi has made a ton of changes over the years and I didn't hear you complaining about how long it takes for them to "assimilate". Usually more offense skill=more offense, why does that have to be different in LA?

When is okay to make changes? When they are so far back of a playoff spot that it doesn't matter anymore? Are the Kings still "ahead" of schedule?

How do you know that coaching isn't the issue with Brown and Kopitar's inability to breakout? They are reaching their prime years and I don't see the fire in them yet. Could it be that Murray is too passive and allows the inmates to control the asylum? Nobody really knows, but 3+ seasons of Murray hasn't shown any improvement. How many more season do you give him?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
Was going to type exactly this and then you got to it at the end. I agree. Quick is just picking up this aspect of his game this season. We need Kopitar and Brown to follow suit in the worst way.
You mean a defense only coach is getting the best from his defensive players and goaltender? Shocking.

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Old
12-05-2011, 02:07 PM
  #20
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Originally Posted by Jaygokings View Post
In the battle of trading your stars versus changing a coach the coach rarely wins.


See; Carlyle, Randy and/or Boudreau, Bruce
I don't see why the Kings do either one at this point. It's not all about this season. Additional tweaking to the roster may be required, but I'm not looking for major surgery. Had the Kings landed Brad Richards I am wondering if Kopitar would have been slotted to be the #1 LW. Something to think about in the future perhaps.

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12-05-2011, 02:09 PM
  #21
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Why do you think it takes 82 games for a few new players to make an impact with their new team? Seems like a lot of players start well with the Kings and then fade. Penner and Gagne are the latest.

Why make any changes then? Why trade for Mike Richards? Why sign Gagne? Why trade for Penner? Lombardi has made a ton of changes over the years and I didn't hear you complaining about how long it takes for them to "assimilate". Usually more offense skill=more offense, why does that have to be different in LA?

When is okay to make changes? When they are so far back of a playoff spot that it doesn't matter anymore? Are the Kings still "ahead" of schedule?

How do you know that coaching isn't the issue with Brown and Kopitar's inability to breakout? They are reaching their prime years and I don't see the fire in them yet. Could it be that Murray is too passive and allows the inmates to control the asylum? Nobody really knows, but 3+ seasons of Murray hasn't shown any improvement. How many more season do you give him?
Murray's message may not motivate Kopitar and/or Brown. I am not in the room, so I don't know. To answer your question, I am willing to give Murray all the rope he needs this season.

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12-05-2011, 02:11 PM
  #22
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I don't know why some of you can't understand that MOST players if not all the players go through their stages of slump. Do you really think that the kings are the only team to have struggling players?

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12-05-2011, 02:13 PM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
I'm not sure if they are mentally weak or just not fierce enough.

Do you see a difference in that? The mentally weak aspect is a reactive one - how do they respond to adversity? I think they've learned how to deal with bad times and bad breaks. I think they may even be too comfortable dealing with it, if that makes any sense.

They get easily distracted and happy when things are going well... lot's of smiles and grins and jokes. That's just as bad, if not worse considering the lack of respect displayed to opponents (with long memories) as being too down when things are bad.

I think they need to be more consistent, more proactive and fierce in their individual and team approach to games. They have yet to show that burning in the gut intensity it takes to win in this league.

Richards, Scuderi, Mitchell, and Quick are the only guys to show that consistently.
There is a difference, but I think they're both. They respond horribly to adversity and are very lackadaisical with their leads. I don't think those things are coaching problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
If you don't think Murray is the coach to get the "mentally weak" team to the Stanley Cup, why waste another season with him? Firing Murray has never been viewed as a great panacea; it's just the best option to see if major roster changes are still needed. If the Kings let Murray finish the season and they miss the playoffs or lose in the first round, how does Lombardi know if major roster changes are needed? Does he just fire Murray in April and hope that the next coach can get it done? Wouldn't you rather see a new voice in the room to see if the roster isn't as "mentally weak" as you think?
This season has already been wasted on Murray. And a lot of the things wrong with the team I don't believe a coach has control over.

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Old
12-05-2011, 02:15 PM
  #24
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I don't know why some of you can't understand that MOST players if not all the players go through their stages of slump. Do you really think that the kings are the only team to have struggling players?
Yep, it just doesn't happen for 15-20 games for #1 centers year in and year out.

Most teams don't have multiple players slumping at the same time which magnifies the problem. Thinking back over the last 4-5 games I believe Williams had enough good chances to score 3-5 goals. It just isn't happening for him right now.

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12-05-2011, 02:20 PM
  #25
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Originally Posted by Jaygokings View Post
In the battle of trading your stars versus changing a coach the coach rarely wins.


See; Carlyle, Randy and/or Boudreau, Bruce
What about Hitchcock, Ken and Bylsma, Dan etc?

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