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Punched Out: The Life and Death of a Hockey Enforcer (main New York Times story)

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Old
12-06-2011, 01:25 PM
  #26
Fleury4ever
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Originally Posted by Dubi17 View Post
man did you guys see the part about how the rangers organization refused to answer any of Boogard's dad's questions about his treatment and they wouldn't let him talk to sather. all they gave him was a 4 sentence email
Lawyers man, lawyers...

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12-06-2011, 01:25 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
Anyone else checking out the Journal that the Times screenshotted?

I know this story is mentioned in the articles but reading it in his handwriting makes it hit harder...

On page 2 of his journal...



Felt good for the Boogeyman that he broke "Churchy's" nose in their first fight!

It's all so interesting and so sad.

EDIT - The Journal is an amazing read
Reading the journal of his now...very good read.

Such a sadder story then I ever thought. I hated reading about how the Rangers Dr's catered to his every need with the pills. This makes everything much more real and makes me worry about our current players we know and love a lot more.

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12-06-2011, 01:59 PM
  #28
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Very disappointed in how the Rangers treated Boogaard. They knew he had substance abuse issues yet the doctors prescribed him pills anyway. This is just a sad story on so many levels.

Sather's refusal to speak to Len Boogaard is disgusting. By not being forthcoming, it really makes it seem like the Rangers are covering up something.

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12-06-2011, 02:14 PM
  #29
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I honestly cannot watch a fight the same way as I used to.

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12-06-2011, 02:29 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by AJBergy86 View Post
Not a fan of the title, and not a fan of having the sport cast in to that type of light. It is a good article but they make it look like hockey is just boxing on ice or something like that. Boogy was not a good hockey player, but he was a damn good fighter and that is why he had a spot in the NHL.
That pretty much sums up the reality of the situation for guys like Boogey to make it in the league. The outsiders looking in who really don't know jack s*** about the game and aren't really hockey fans are always going to be critical of the fact that fighting is still legal in hockey.

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12-06-2011, 02:32 PM
  #31
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That pretty much sums up the reality of the situation for guys like Boogey to make it in the league. The outsiders looking in who really don't know jack s*** about the game and aren't really hockey fans are always going to be critical of the fact that fighting is still legal in hockey.

It's not just the outsiders any more.

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Old
12-06-2011, 02:32 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
Very disappointed in how the Rangers treated Boogaard. They knew he had substance abuse issues yet the doctors prescribed him pills anyway. This is just a sad story on so many levels.

Sather's refusal to speak to Len Boogaard is disgusting. By not being forthcoming, it really makes it seem like the Rangers are covering up something.
Not really surprised that Sather didn't speak with Len Boogaard. He is well indoctrinated in the corporate way that MSG handles things. It definitely is very disappointing!

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Old
12-06-2011, 05:21 PM
  #33
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nmnm


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Old
12-06-2011, 06:34 PM
  #34
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its just very concerning that tough guys cover up the fact that they get concussions just because they are afraid they won't have a roster spot if they are prone to injuries. they also cover up injuries so people will fear and respect them.

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12-06-2011, 07:50 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by NYR Wolf View Post
I could not agree more. Staged fights are useless anyway. I worry about guys like Prust.
I worry about Prust also. He's a very useful player but seems to be drifting into more of a designated fighter role. I'd rather he focus on where he can really help the team, with his energy, penalty killing, etc. I'm also afraid he's going to have a staged fight with the wrong guy sooner or later.

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Old
12-06-2011, 07:53 PM
  #36
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I think a lot of people have been looking at this backwards; saying that his substance abuse stemmed from him being an NHL enforcer. But I've never seen anyone call for it to be examined the opposite way - his pugilistic nature led him (albeit, loosely) to need/want whatever substances. I don't want to say he was a fighter from birth, and there may have been an early family/life event that steered him towards that type of life style.

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12-06-2011, 09:43 PM
  #37
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was wondering if anyone caught the 10 o clock news on fox tonight. It mentioned Boogard and that the latest findings was that his brain showed some type of degenerative damage sustained from repetitive trauma, which has been seen in other deceased NHL players. sry if this was already mentioned elswhere. I dont remember the medical terminology of what the reporter called it the ailment.

I guess I was just a little surprised to see fox cover the story

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Old
12-06-2011, 10:06 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Only Bieber View Post
was wondering if anyone caught the 10 o clock news on fox tonight. It mentioned Boogard and that the latest findings was that his brain showed some type of degenerative damage sustained from repetitive trauma, which has been seen in other deceased NHL players. sry if this was already mentioned elswhere. I dont remember the medical terminology of what the reporter called it the ailment.

I guess I was just a little surprised to see fox cover the story
yeah its called C.T.E. its what they found out bob probert had. they talk about it in part 3 of the article, "A Brain Going Bad"

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Old
12-07-2011, 12:25 PM
  #39
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AGrossRecord #NYR players instructed not to comment on Times report on Boogaard and degenerative brain ailment.

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Old
12-07-2011, 12:35 PM
  #40
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It certainly does make me rethink my enjoyment of fighting in hockey, especially having suffered a pretty severe concussion myself (unrelated to hockey/fighting).

I enjoy the spontaneous things... like Dubi/Ovi last year... but its the guys who just fight that I don't understand... those fights don't do anything for me.

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Old
12-07-2011, 12:36 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
sounds like there's a lawsuit going on or something

interesting read/watch

however, i dont like the general tone of the report. Essentially it came off as, "Evil NHL forces children into hand-to-hand combat"

no one's being forced. If you cant make it in hockey by anyother means, and you dont like the idea of getting punched in the head every night, then choose a different career path

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Old
12-07-2011, 01:06 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by mullichicken25 View Post
sounds like there's a lawsuit going on or something

interesting read/watch

however, i dont like the general tone of the report. Essentially it came off as, "Evil NHL forces children into hand-to-hand combat"

no one's being forced. If you cant make it in hockey by anyother means, and you dont like the idea of getting punched in the head every night, then choose a different career path
I agree with this. These guys are choosing these paths, and they are making big money doing it. I think that the staged fights between "enforcers" who are unable to play a regular shift are stupid, and interupt the flow of the game, but the spontanious ones or ones where **** just boils over the top imo are just a part of the game. This game is extremely emotional, much more then any other sport imo and sometimes things get a little rough. I find that entertaining in the spirit of competition, but just watching 2 guys go at it for no reason is just stupid. I played hockey and whenever the designated fighter of the team got in a fight, it did not really rally us up, most of the time we just banged on the boards and got back to playing hockey.

Boogy knew what he was doing from the age of 16. He chose to play a gladiator's role and was very good at it while making a lot of money. He was not forced to do anything he did not want to. Also the drug issues could have stemmed from anything starting at his rough childhood where he was bullied to the pain that came with his job. As a teenager he was an alcoholic and that slowly turned in to painkillers. At first he was taking them for pain, but as you can see on the night that he died he was taking them to party. He was an addict plain and simple and it is very sad to say that because he was really a very nice guy.

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Old
12-07-2011, 03:34 PM
  #43
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n most countries--at least in this century--children are not allowed to make decisions that will hurt them in the short or long run. Boogaard was a child when he "made" this decision and he (and his parents) didn't know the consequences of that decision.

At the very least, fighting should be banned in all leagues where children under the age of 18 play.

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Old
12-07-2011, 05:07 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Dubi17 View Post
its just very concerning that tough guys cover up the fact that they get concussions just because they are afraid they won't have a roster spot if they are prone to injuries. they also cover up injuries so people will fear and respect them.
That's why ALL players cover up injuries. Short of being a superstar, you don't want to lose your roster spot.

It's not a good thing, but it's how sports works. Being injury prone reduces your value, so players try their best to play through injuries.

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Old
12-07-2011, 05:30 PM
  #45
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I loved Boogaard for what he did. I love all fighters for what they do.

If you take fighting out, you have to take hitting out. There goes the history of the game. If you don't want to be a fighter and lack the skill it takes to play in the pros, get a different job like the rest of us and join a beer league.

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12-07-2011, 06:12 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by CHGoalie72 View Post
I loved Boogaard for what he did. I love all fighters for what they do.

If you take fighting out, you have to take hitting out. There goes the history of the game. If you don't want to be a fighter and lack the skill it takes to play in the pros, get a different job like the rest of us and join a beer league.
i think you have missed the point. That being that fighting (ie being punched repeatedly in the head with bare hands) is directly related to brain injuries that lead to addiction, depression and suicide.

That has nothing to do with hitting. Hits are fine - as long as they're not headshots.

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Old
12-07-2011, 06:38 PM
  #47
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Watched the three episodes now and I must admit that I have mixed emotions about the whole fight/no fight dilemma. The story here brings out very valid points in why fighting should be taken out of the game, but on the historic side it will be difficult I think. Perhaps there might be a solution to it to hand out game miss conducts like in Europe? With a 3 game ban (or something?)... Just to ease the pain or heavy schedule the enforcers are facing from a day to day basis. Perhaps it might present the teams to decide when to use their "fight-card" (well their ace fighter anyways) at a correct time of some sort? - I'm not saying this is a good suggestion, just a suggestion to build on?

I love the fight in hockey, but I really don't want players to loose their lives because of it..... Something should be at least considered.


Oh, and btw... Is it me or is Bettman always making an ass out of himself? The way he speaks on the topic makes me want to see him in a bear knuckle brawl and get hammered!

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Old
12-07-2011, 09:57 PM
  #48
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though I'm clearly not a Rangers fan, I was a Boogey fan, from his days in Minnesota. but I'm also a long time hockey fan, so any tragedy that touches this sport touches me.

I watched all 3 episodes- and not really sure what to think. Yes, very sad, especially Part I, where they shared his journal/personal notes from minor hockey days. Very sad that he was pretty much steered into the fighter role, and probably based on his size. I live in WHL (Canadian junior) territory, and was a season ticket holder for 4 years when we had a franchise here. Seems to me the WHL is known for big tough kids- the Western Canadian farm boys- and fighting was huge in the 90's. a little less now, I think. But those kids are molded at an early age. Our team had a 15 year old enforcer. He went on to play a few years in minor leagues, as an enforcer. This is the same league Boogaard came from.

As for Boogaard, it's sad that he suffered in silence, so to speak. He needed to keep his job in the NHL, and his path was clear: Fight or go home. The articles did describe some of his injuries (shoulder, hands, etc), but the damage to his brain was unbelievable for a guy who hadn't even turned 30 yet. His future quality of life was not going to be good with those brain injuries.

It seems to me that the aim of Article 3 was to make the whole series a "let's get fighting out of hockey" message- even though Bettman himself said they won't try. "You can't taking punching out of boxing, you can't take fighting out of hockey."
I'm a lifelong hockey fan, and I can see that some fighting still has a place in hockey. Staged/pre-meditated fights (like the obvious retaliation fight between Lucic and Gaustad after the Miller incident) are a joke. They both should have been given match penalties, as that fight was practically advertised as the "undercard" for the evening.

The NHL is taking a more pro-active approach to handling concussions- like the "quiet room" treatment and better awareness, and the NHL safety committee is always looking at improving equipment and such. And with the NHL's new focus on reducing head injuries by nailing offenders with suspensions, it seems like the league is at least trying. Not sure if the message is getting through, though. The game seems more violent now than when I was growing up, but then, the players are bigger and faster now, so the collisions are proportionately more violent.

I'm not sure that those measures or 2 trips to rehab (maybe more we haven't heard about) would have helped Boogey. He had just left rehab a day or 2 before his fatal party cocktail of Percocet and alcohol, so obviously, rehab wasn't working for him.

Sad, sad, sad. I wish his family peace.

Lauri from Tacoma

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Old
12-07-2011, 11:14 PM
  #49
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So last yr when i posted that Torts hated boogy and treated him like Sh#t you all bashed me. Then last year when I was able to speak to Torts alone and he told me Boogy was done in NY and would never be back with the Rangers you all had comments.. Now with the times running a column you are all feeling sorry and upset? i broke this a yr ago people

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Old
12-07-2011, 11:19 PM
  #50
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I feel bad he died and suffered through what he did.

I had no problem with Torts wanting him off the roster- I wanted him off the roster. And if he hadn't died, I would still want him off the roster. It's just tragic that he died doing what he was good at.

What did you break?

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