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Has this team quit on Ruff?

View Poll Results: Have the Sabres quit on Ruff?
Yes 19 33.93%
No 37 66.07%
Voters: 56. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
12-08-2011, 09:18 AM
  #26
omglolnub
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Most teams struggle or at least aren't at their best when top players are out. Lets not forget that the Pens with their two best players out finished in 8th and were knocked out of the playoffs in round one. Thats certainly a drop off from what would be expected with Crosby and Malkin in the linup. So lets not pretend they were the same team.
Actually, they finished in 4th and with the Flyers tailspin, almost won the Atlantic...lol :

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12-08-2011, 09:24 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Sabre11 View Post
I believe Ruff is a good coach but the players he has (especially the "Core") doesn't fit in his coaching style and system.
What exactly is his style and system?

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Old
12-08-2011, 09:31 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Buffalo87 View Post
You don't become the winningest coach with one team in NHL history by being a bad coach. He's only had 2 really great teams and the in 06 the only reason they didn't win the Cup is because they suffered a rash of injuries that nobody could have coached them out of.
You become the winningest coach by being employed forever... that's not much of an accomplishment.

He's so good, that he's been able to win a 5 team Northeast Division TWICE in 13 years...

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12-08-2011, 09:45 AM
  #29
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You become the winningest coach by being employed forever... that's not much of an accomplishment.

He's so good, that he's been able to win a 5 team Northeast Division TWICE in 13 years...
And how exactly do you remained employed forever? The fact that Ruff has been around for a long time is supposed to somehow diminish his accomplishment? That's an accomplishment in and of itself.

You can sit here and said the front office is stupid and doesn't know when to fire a guy and has some kind of attachment to Ruff (and I fully expect that response), but at the end of the day there is a reason we are sitting here in front of our computer having this debate and those guys are in management in the NHL.

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12-08-2011, 09:45 AM
  #30
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Ruff is a good coach, he knows his game hes a former Jack Adams winner. The players he has been given and the tight financially strapped system he has been in previously has limited him. I think I would like to see a more proactive GM come in before getting rid of Lindy.

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12-08-2011, 09:46 AM
  #31
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I will add that being mediocre every year and losing in the first round of the playoffs is not good enough.

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12-08-2011, 09:50 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Buffalo87 View Post
And how exactly do you remained employed forever? The fact that Ruff has been around for a long time is supposed to somehow diminish his accomplishment? That's an accomplishment in and of itself.

You can sit here and said the front office is stupid and doesn't know when to fire a guy and has some kind of attachment to Ruff (and I fully expect that response), but at the end of the day there is a reason we are sitting here in front of our computer having this debate and those guys are in management in the NHL.
Because our management has become complacent with mediocrity year after year. We would have at least Briere or Drury if we had management that actually cared about winning. They didn't care about putting a winning product on the ice, all they cared about was their paycheck. Pegula is at the top now, he wants to win, probably as bad as any of us.

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12-08-2011, 09:56 AM
  #33
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Ruff's tenure is like any smart employee, does enough to not get fired. The artful dodger.

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12-08-2011, 09:58 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Kishire View Post
Because our management has become complacent with mediocrity year after year. We would have at least Briere or Drury if we had management that actually cared about winning. They didn't care about putting a winning product on the ice, all they cared about was their paycheck. Pegula is at the top now, he wants to win, probably as bad as any of us.
Is this a point for or against Ruff? They consistently provide him with mediocrity, yet it's his fault the team hasn't won the Cup?

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12-08-2011, 10:01 AM
  #35
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Is this a point for or against Ruff? They consistently provide him with mediocrity, yet it's his fault the team hasn't won the Cup?
Ruff is a good coach, but he has won nothing, we've had our opportunities to win, he hasn't brought us there. There isn't a single coach out there who has stayed in longer for doing so little.

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12-08-2011, 10:03 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by LabattBlue View Post
What exactly is his style and system?
This is a question I've asked ever since D/B left.
I want to say it's a fast paced transition game focused on strong backchecking and a sound defensive game, even from the forwards.......
Only, that's not what I am seeing lol

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12-08-2011, 10:14 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Kishire View Post
Ruff is a good coach, but he has won nothing, we've had our opportunities to win, he hasn't brought us there. There isn't a single coach out there who has stayed in longer for doing so little.
Barry Trotz? What has Nashville ever done?

Last year was the first year Nashville has made it out of the 1st round in his 12 year tenure. Made the playoffs exactly half of those years, and making it out of the first round once in 12 years. ONCE. Never winning the division either. You can say that's because they play in a division with Chicago and Detroit and you would not be wrong, but different teams have dominated the NE at different times as well so it's irrelevant.

Don't get me wrong, he's a great coach and does well with what the organization gives him.

But within the framework of this debate, you're stating the management does enough to be mediocre, and Ruff does alright with what's been given to him.

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12-08-2011, 10:48 AM
  #38
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I don't think the players have quit on Ruff. I do think what Ruff is doing right now is not working. I think he is getting out-coached, and I think the players are starting to lose confidence in him.

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12-08-2011, 11:15 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffalo87 View Post
And how exactly do you remained employed forever? The fact that Ruff has been around for a long time is supposed to somehow diminish his accomplishment? That's an accomplishment in and of itself.

You can sit here and said the front office is stupid and doesn't know when to fire a guy and has some kind of attachment to Ruff (and I fully expect that response), but at the end of the day there is a reason we are sitting here in front of our computer having this debate and those guys are in management in the NHL.
Have an owner go to jail, have a new owner with constraints, be a former player, have a 3rd owner that's a fan boy ?

Only in Buffalo is doing a barely above average job good enough to remain a coach for 13 years.

Ruff should've been fired after finishing 5th in the northeast 3 seasons in a row. The new owner (golisano) should've brought in new management, which in turn should've brought in a new coaching staff...

Unfortunately, that did not happen... and a team LOADED with speed and offensive talent made Ruff look good again for a brief period of time.

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12-08-2011, 11:24 AM
  #40
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Barry Trotz? What has Nashville ever done?

Last year was the first year Nashville has made it out of the 1st round in his 12 year tenure. Made the playoffs exactly half of those years, and making it out of the first round once in 12 years. ONCE. Never winning the division either. You can say that's because they play in a division with Chicago and Detroit and you would not be wrong, but different teams have dominated the NE at different times as well so it's irrelevant.

Don't get me wrong, he's a great coach and does well with what the organization gives him.

But within the framework of this debate, you're stating the management does enough to be mediocre, and Ruff does alright with what's been given to him.
this is a great point. ruff is a world class coach. we have been spoiled not having to really worry about our coaching situation for over a decade. he is very well respected in hockey circles and within the coaching community. if we fire ruff he gets hired as soon as he makes himself available for another coaching job.

i also don't believe the players have quit on ruff. i think we are watching a hockey team which has a very delicate psyche after the lucic incident. this is a team playing without confidence.

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12-08-2011, 11:37 AM
  #41
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this is a great point. ruff is a world class coach. we have been spoiled not having to really worry about our coaching situation for over a decade. he is very well respected in hockey circles and within the coaching community. if we fire ruff he gets hired as soon as he makes himself available for another coaching job.

i also don't believe the players have quit on ruff. i think we are watching a hockey team which has a very delicate psyche after the lucic incident. this is a team playing without confidence.
How does any of this related to Buffalo contending for a cup????

Randy Carlyle is very well respected... AND has actually won something significant like a CUP... he got fired. Bruce Boudreau was scooped up really quickly after he was fired.... WTF do those things have to do with the fact that Ruff hasn't accomplished much of anything other then being here for so long.

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12-08-2011, 11:46 AM
  #42
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How does any of what is on this page about respect or tenure have to do with the thread at hand regarding whether the team has tuned Ruff out?

Get back on track people.

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12-08-2011, 12:07 PM
  #43
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I don't think so.

It's easy to think players have quit when you have rookies and grinders playing in roles that are realistically still over their heads, and players like Giroux and Datsuyk are skating circles around them, Timonen and Lidstrom are outsmaring them, and Jagr and Franzen outmuscling them.

These Sabres are a good team (not elite), with no elite players, but a bunch of good players, and they rely on their depth for a certain amount of success.

With these injuries, the depth is gone, and they really are just struggling through nearly every game.
Very well said. Our defense was outmuscled last game. They were making dumb decisions with the puck, too.

Let's wait till we heal up a bit before throwing out these accusations.

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12-08-2011, 01:00 PM
  #44
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I disagree on this, I know it's been speculated for a very long time that there is some kind of rift there. I 100% believe that Vanek would not have become the player he is right now (and still improving) without Ruff. Ruff knows he can come down on Vanek hard (and he certainly has) and Vanek more often than not responds. I have not seen a single thing this year that implies to me that Vanek has a bad attitude or has quit on Ruff. If anything, I think Vanek's attitude this year is better than I've ever seen.
I agree if it wasn't for Ruff Vanek would probably be a perennial 40+ goal scorer. Instead of developing his scoring further Vanek has been forced to work on only his defensive game.

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12-08-2011, 01:08 PM
  #45
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I agree if it wasn't for Ruff Vanek would probably be a perennial 40+ goal scorer. Instead of developing his scoring further Vanek has been forced to work on only his defensive game.
I'm glad you're not the coach. Why wouldn't you want one of your top players to be solid defensively?

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12-08-2011, 01:09 PM
  #46
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Barry Trotz? What has Nashville ever done?

Last year was the first year Nashville has made it out of the 1st round in his 12 year tenure. Made the playoffs exactly half of those years, and making it out of the first round once in 12 years. ONCE. Never winning the division either. You can say that's because they play in a division with Chicago and Detroit and you would not be wrong, but different teams have dominated the NE at different times as well so it's irrelevant.

Don't get me wrong, he's a great coach and does well with what the organization gives him.

But within the framework of this debate, you're stating the management does enough to be mediocre, and Ruff does alright with what's been given to him.
Another mediocre franchise, are we talking about Buffalo or Nashville? I think Ruff is a good coach, I think it's also time for change.

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12-08-2011, 01:14 PM
  #47
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I think Ruff is a good coach, I think it's also time for change.
Indeed.

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12-08-2011, 01:22 PM
  #48
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Actually, they finished in 4th and with the Flyers tailspin, almost won the Atlantic...lol :
That's right they finished in 4th my bad. But the point still stands. Did they go anywhere or win anything without their top players? No would be the answer.

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12-08-2011, 01:23 PM
  #49
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Agreed. Where is this indictment of Ruff by Vanek? PM's between-the-bench nattering last night?
That whole thing really ticked me off. I think it's fine to give an impression of what's going on in the benches, but to literally quote the coach chastising a specific player is beyond the scope of Pierre McGuire's role, IMHO. We could probably have a whole thread debating that, as opposed to here though.

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12-08-2011, 01:53 PM
  #50
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I said no, but his message might be stale.. Heck, half of the team seems to be injuried all the time too. There are a other possible factors not for discussion here.

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