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Bull call leads to loss-4-3 TB

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Old
12-30-2011, 12:13 PM
  #376
NotProkofievian
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Yeah, I did some research on the "intent to blow" rule in the nhl rule book. Here it is, a subsection of rule 31.2:

Quote:
As there is a human factor involved in blowing the whistle to stop play, the Referee may deem the play to be stopped slightly prior to the whistle actually being blown. The fact that the puck may come loose or cross the goal line prior to the sound of the whistle has no bearing if the Referee has ruled that the play had been stopped prior to this happening.
Now, the question is, did the Referee rule that the play had been stopped? What was his original ruling.

As I remember it the play was whistled dead, and the original signal on the ice was no goal.

I might be wrong, but...

It sounds like this "continuation" business is just some ******** they made up last night. FWIW, the tsn people agree with me.

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12-30-2011, 12:46 PM
  #377
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How do they know Emelin couldn't have stopped that puck from crossing the line if the whistle hadn't blown? I don't think he could've for reference.

I'm just pissed because in all my years of watching hockey, this is the first time I've ever seen the ref allow a goal after they made the mistake of blowing the play dead early.

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12-30-2011, 01:17 PM
  #378
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
But the thing is he should not be exempt to be pointed. Which is what the defenders are doing. By saying he's not the problem, by saying that he's great, awesome, potential wise the greatest and all...they are not analysing his play this year. And I believe he is just at fault at some others in this team. You did name, I believe, players who did more for this team than Price did. And unfortunately, that's the freakin job of a goalie...to have more pressure and to literally steal games when his team doesn't deserve it. You know, the type of games we kept saying here about OTHER goalies? How many time have I heard by some that we were unlucky and on the wrong end of an incredible goalie performance. Yet, how many times have we said that we had no business of winning and Price totally saved the day? This year? Not a whole lot.

It is a freakin job to have. One of the most unfair job 'cause I believe coaching is worst. Yet, for some reasons, there are way more Price defenders than they were for any coaches we had in the past decade. Which for me can't be explain. Sure we can defend and bash the people who are saying to trade Price, to say that Price is just awful and really bad and all.....but what people are wrongfully doing is that they are going to the extreme, by saying that it's not his fault, that he's the least of our problems and all....For me, RIGHT NOW, he's part of our problems. I'm sorry, but as a player, I don't feel that my goalie is on top of this world right now. So my play might change or be more hesitant.

I also question Pierre Groulx's work in this. I'm no goalie expert, but why that freakin way of being always incredibly square to the shot. I believe that's Price sole and only goal. Which in the end makes him totally off when a shot is slightly deflected. The kid just doesn't believe in his reflexes right now. And it's frustrating to see that with the size he has, that he can be totally deported from one to another with no chance of stopping some shots like that. Needless to say, how many games have we lost in shootouts again? Yes, not entirely his fault we have to do something like scoring....I know. But he stops 1 or 2 more and we make a mistake and end up scoring with our 4th and 5th attempt. So what is it? Players too stress 'cause their goalie can't stop a shot? Or our goalie too stress 'cause its players can't score on empty nets? Which, again, makes me believe he's not MORE to be at fault but sometimes just as equally. Add the fact that we keep talking about him ALREADY being a franchise and incredible top 5 goalie. Add the fact that the organization treated him as such by sending away 2 goalies. And by picking a goalie when we thought we were fine in that departement. And here goes the expectations. We didn't create them. We were force to. So again, I don't get why we can't be solely more critical than just "It's never his fault" type of attitude. He needs to be accountable. And somehow you have the feeling that he's more accountable towards himself than some in this board are for him.
I see Price make incredible saves almost each game because of his reflexes. Yeah hes not superhuman like last year, but he also has a more inexperienced defense this year and an even worse offense. Sorry but there is no way I look at this season as a whole and see Price as a negative. People forget the stretch he had where he was constantly amazing. From Nov 10 - Dec 10 he only had 3 games, where his save Percentage was under 910. The team came out of that stretch under 500. WTF more do you want him to do? Now when you tell me Price is at fault, I can't take it seriously.

Some of the losses he had during that streak he had a 929, 938, 944, 927, 917 sv%.

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12-30-2011, 01:19 PM
  #379
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBuriedHab View Post
I see Price make incredible saves almost each game because of his reflexes. Yeah hes not superhuman like last year, but he also has a more inexperienced defense this year and an even worse offense. Sorry but there is no way I look at this season as a whole and see Price as a negative. People forget the stretch he had where he was constantly amazing. From Nov 10 - Dec 10 he only had 3 games, where his save Percentage was under 910. The team came out of that stretch under 500. WTF more do you want him to do? Now when you tell me Price is at fault, I can't take it seriously.
I want him playing at an All-star level. He has the talent to do it but has not so far this year.

He isn't the MAIN reason for us being 12th or whatever, that falls to the defensive play(forwards and defense) and the PP, but his play is not what it was last year.

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12-30-2011, 01:34 PM
  #380
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Originally Posted by habsjunkie2 View Post
Huet had the one of the top 5 SV% in the NHL for 3 or 4 years after the lockout, I'm not so sure he was bad at all.

Price is a good goalie, but his status is elevated to godly around here because of his WJHC and Junior days in general along with his selection 5th overall. I like him fine enough, but he's far from the saviour this crowd portrays him as. If the right deal came along to improve our team, I would make it, the difference between very good goalies isn't huge at all, the team in front of them is more important.

BTW, I'm not saying trade Price because of a bad game either, I'm just a believer that no goalie is worth a certain price point and that the key to winning is having sound positional players more importantly than the goaltender, a reason I would never draft a goalie in the top 5, not that I'm complaining with the result, just don't believe in it. This isn't a Price bash post, he's the least of our worries going forward, but he's had some poor games this year and last night was most definitely one of them.
Exactly my point. People laugh when I compared Huet to Price when the reality is Huet was one of the top goalies in the league in his time here in Montreal. Obviously i'm not comparing his time in Chicago or the present.

The fact is Price is overrated based on his draft position and his junior/AHL experiences like you said. The thing is you can't say anything bad about Price in these boards or you will be called a hater, a basher, "no knowledge of hockey" lol.

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12-30-2011, 01:34 PM
  #381
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Originally Posted by BobbyFischer View Post


Fact of the matter is, this is more true than most hab fans would like to admit.
What, your blaming Price ..OMG YOUR SUCH A HATER!!

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12-30-2011, 01:36 PM
  #382
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Originally Posted by DenverHabsFan View Post
Last night was a devastating loss as far as I'm concerned. You can say that every game is important right now but if you are a Habs player looking at the standings after that game, it has to be demoralizing.

Price is rightfully being criticized because Habs played a good game, outshot and outplayed TB and still lost.

I see Price the same way I see Luongo. A good reliable goalie that you can build around but he rarely stands on his head the way Thomas, Lundqvist, Rinne and some other goalies do. That's why people are happy with him most of the time but then he gets this kind of criticism.

He's still very young so he will mature and get better but some around here call him top-5 in the league and that's not an honest assessment right now. Truth is, in a must-win situation, there are several goalies I would pick ahead of him. Hopefully, his next contract reflects that.

Again, I love the guy but he hasn't proven yet that he can deliver a Roy-type performance when everything is on the line.
He's the only top 5 goalie in history of the NHL that's not top 5 in any stat.

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12-30-2011, 01:39 PM
  #383
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Originally Posted by Kenny Powders View Post
This is why I don't come as often as before on this board.




People who know-it-all thinks this organisation, in this time, needs to trade is best player because he let in 2-3 soft goals? Who the **** you think is gonna replace Price, one of the top 5 MVP for his team right now in the league. Who the ****? Clueless ****ing montreal habs fans. People who never played hockey in their life, yet, think they know everything because they watched the game.

get a clue suckers, Price is everything this team needs, everytime I see someone telling we should trade Price is just another ****** on my Ignore list, the board is FUBAR right now and it's sad.
He's not even a top 5 goalie in the league ...now your saying he's a top 5 in MVP voting??! are you out of your mind! looool

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12-30-2011, 01:39 PM
  #384
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I haven't seen too many games over the past two weeks but Price's numbers have taken a dip. I really think we need to put in Budaj a little more now.

I'm not blaming Price by any stretch as I think he's been our best player for most of the year but he's facing way too many shots. This is a lost season anyway, there's no point in having him play 70+ games.

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12-30-2011, 01:42 PM
  #385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habsjunkie2 View Post
Huet had the one of the top 5 SV% in the NHL for 3 or 4 years after the lockout, I'm not so sure he was bad at all.

Price is a good goalie, but his status is elevated to godly around here because of his WJHC and Junior days in general along with his selection 5th overall. I like him fine enough, but he's far from the saviour this crowd portrays him as. If the right deal came along to improve our team, I would make it, the difference between very good goalies isn't huge at all, the team in front of them is more important.

BTW, I'm not saying trade Price because of a bad game either, I'm just a believer that no goalie is worth a certain price point and that the key to winning is having sound positional players more importantly than the goaltender, a reason I would never draft a goalie in the top 5, not that I'm complaining with the result, just don't believe in it. This isn't a Price bash post, he's the least of our worries going forward, but he's had some poor games this year and last night was most definitely one of them.
He is technically sound and has a head on his shoulders. You are clearly someone who wants everything and hasn't figured out that nothing is perfect. You will go through life forever tormented because nothing will satisfy you.

So.. good luck with that.

The current situation with the habs has nothing to do with our players. It's their environment. 20 Wayne Gretzkys would be playing like **** right now in such instability and uncertainty..

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12-30-2011, 01:46 PM
  #386
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBuriedHab View Post
I see Price make incredible saves almost each game because of his reflexes. Yeah hes not superhuman like last year, but he also has a more inexperienced defense this year and an even worse offense. Sorry but there is no way I look at this season as a whole and see Price as a negative. People forget the stretch he had where he was constantly amazing. From Nov 10 - Dec 10 he only had 3 games, where his save Percentage was under 910. The team came out of that stretch under 500. WTF more do you want him to do? Now when you tell me Price is at fault, I can't take it seriously.

Some of the losses he had during that streak he had a 929, 938, 944, 927, 917 sv%.
Basically, this year, Price's best games happen when the team is playing like crap and his worse when they are actually playing well. So they all end up as losses. Last year, the team played well during his good games so those were almost automatic wins. And his bad games (and he did have bad games last year) were when the team was also bad so it didn't stand out as much. Like I said earlier it represents the season: everything that could have gone wrong, has gone wrong. Might be a blessing is disguise, let's enjoy the lottery pick.

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12-30-2011, 01:47 PM
  #387
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
But the thing is he should not be exempt to be pointed. Which is what the defenders are doing. By saying he's not the problem, by saying that he's great, awesome, potential wise the greatest and all...they are not analysing his play this year. And I believe he is just at fault at some others in this team. You did name, I believe, players who did more for this team than Price did. And unfortunately, that's the freakin job of a goalie...to have more pressure and to literally steal games when his team doesn't deserve it. You know, the type of games we kept saying here about OTHER goalies? How many time have I heard by some that we were unlucky and on the wrong end of an incredible goalie performance. Yet, how many times have we said that we had no business of winning and Price totally saved the day? This year? Not a whole lot.

It is a freakin job to have. One of the most unfair job 'cause I believe coaching is worst. Yet, for some reasons, there are way more Price defenders than they were for any coaches we had in the past decade. Which for me can't be explain. Sure we can defend and bash the people who are saying to trade Price, to say that Price is just awful and really bad and all.....but what people are wrongfully doing is that they are going to the extreme, by saying that it's not his fault, that he's the least of our problems and all....For me, RIGHT NOW, he's part of our problems. I'm sorry, but as a player, I don't feel that my goalie is on top of this world right now. So my play might change or be more hesitant.

I also question Pierre Groulx's work in this. I'm no goalie expert, but why that freakin way of being always incredibly square to the shot. I believe that's Price sole and only goal. Which in the end makes him totally off when a shot is slightly deflected. The kid just doesn't believe in his reflexes right now. And it's frustrating to see that with the size he has, that he can be totally deported from one to another with no chance of stopping some shots like that. Needless to say, how many games have we lost in shootouts again? Yes, not entirely his fault we have to do something like scoring....I know. But he stops 1 or 2 more and we make a mistake and end up scoring with our 4th and 5th attempt. So what is it? Players too stress 'cause their goalie can't stop a shot? Or our goalie too stress 'cause its players can't score on empty nets? Which, again, makes me believe he's not MORE to be at fault but sometimes just as equally. Add the fact that we keep talking about him ALREADY being a franchise and incredible top 5 goalie. Add the fact that the organization treated him as such by sending away 2 goalies. And by picking a goalie when we thought we were fine in that departement. And here goes the expectations. We didn't create them. We were force to. So again, I don't get why we can't be solely more critical than just "It's never his fault" type of attitude. He needs to be accountable. And somehow you have the feeling that he's more accountable towards himself than some in this board are for him.
To be fair to Price though, he was absolutely awesome from late October until about the coaching change.

Yeah, he had a rough start to the season and you can definitely point to him as one of the reasons for our poor start. And (although I haven't seen many games lately) lately his stats have tailed off so he seems to be dipping again. When he was red hot we were winning and now he's dipped and we're back into a tailspin. This team lives and dies by that guy.

Personally, I think we've gone to the well too often with him. We played the hell out of him last year and we're doing the same again this season. It's fine to play him a lot but it's kind of crazy when you compare the number of shots he's faced over the past few years to other starters.

Maybe I am being an apologist with him. But I see him as the biggest building block to our future and I'd hate to see him get abused the way he did (undeservedly) a couple of years back. I kind of look at him the same way I look at Subban. Could he have been better this year? Sure. But he's the least of our problems right now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBuriedHab View Post
I see Price make incredible saves almost each game because of his reflexes. Yeah hes not superhuman like last year, but he also has a more inexperienced defense this year and an even worse offense. Sorry but there is no way I look at this season as a whole and see Price as a negative. People forget the stretch he had where he was constantly amazing. From Nov 10 - Dec 10 he only had 3 games, where his save Percentage was under 910. The team came out of that stretch under 500. WTF more do you want him to do? Now when you tell me Price is at fault, I can't take it seriously.

Some of the losses he had during that streak he had a 929, 938, 944, 927, 917 sv%.
That's exactly what I'm talking about. And it goes back earlier than Nov 10th too. He was amazing for a long time and got us back into the playoff hunt.
Quote:
Originally Posted by habsjunkie2 View Post
Price is a good goalie, but his status is elevated to godly around here because of his WJHC and Junior days in general along with his selection 5th overall. I like him fine enough, but he's far from the saviour this crowd portrays him as. If the right deal came along to improve our team, I would make it, the difference between very good goalies isn't huge at all, the team in front of them is more important.
You can't ignore his age. I'm sorry man, but people like to think of him as a vet because he's been around for so long already but most 24 year old goalies are just getting into the league right now.

He had a tough year two years ago despite playing reasonably well. He's been fire tested by Montreal and come out on top. We've got the best young goalie in hockey and the hard part is almost over. If we actually build a decent core around this guy, we have a good shot at doing some damage down the road.

As it stands now, Price is a cup capable goalie. Put him on the right team and I have no doubt he could handle it. Those guys are tough to find. Even elite goalies (Luongo) choke under the pressure. When you find a guy who's strong enough and talented enough to handle it, you hang onto him. Esp, when you've gone through all the pain of developing him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by habsjunkie2 View Post
BTW, I'm not saying trade Price because of a bad game either, I'm just a believer that no goalie is worth a certain price point and that the key to winning is having sound positional players more importantly than the goaltender, a reason I would never draft a goalie in the top 5, not that I'm complaining with the result, just don't believe in it. This isn't a Price bash post, he's the least of our worries going forward, but he's had some poor games this year and last night was most definitely one of them.
Fair enough man, but I consider the guy untradeable. We've invested so much in him already and he's the best young goalie in the league. Some nights he's the only thing worth watching. Why even consider dealing him away?


Last edited by Lafleurs Guy: 12-30-2011 at 01:57 PM.
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12-30-2011, 01:51 PM
  #388
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To be fair to Price though, he was absolutely awesome from late October until about the coaching change.

Yeah, he had a rough start to the season and you can definitely point to him as one of the reasons for our poor start. And (although I haven't seen many games lately) lately his stats have tailed off so he seems to be dipping again. When he was red hot we were winning and now he's dipped and we're back into a tailspin. This team lives and dies by that guy.

Personally, I think we've gone to the well too often with him. We played the hell out of him last year and we're doing the same again this season. It's fine to play him a lot but it's kind of crazy when you compare the number of shots he's faced over the past few years to other starters.

Maybe I am being an apologist with him. But I see him as the biggest building block to our future and I'd hate to see him get abused the way he did (undeservedly) a couple of years back. I kind of look at him the same way I look at Subban. Could he have been better this year? Sure. But he's the least of our problems right now.

That's exactly what I'm talking about. And it goes back earlier than Nov 10th too. He was amazing for a long time and got us back into the playoff hunt.
He is the least of our problems ..that said he could be traded to mask the other weaknesses we have in the team.

For example, trade him for a #1 center or #1 defenseman. Get solid goalie in seperate deal.

I belive this would make us a better team.

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12-30-2011, 01:58 PM
  #389
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He is the least of our problems ..that said he could be traded to mask the other weaknesses we have in the team.

For example, trade him for a #1 center or #1 defenseman. Get solid goalie in seperate deal.

I belive this would make us a better team.
Except no goalie will get you a 1 center or a 1 dman.

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12-30-2011, 02:21 PM
  #390
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He is the least of our problems ..that said he could be traded to mask the other weaknesses we have in the team.

For example, trade him for a #1 center or #1 defenseman. Get solid goalie in seperate deal.

I belive this would make us a better team.
Why create one hole to fill another? If you're going to build a team, build off the blocks you have now. Neither Price nor Subban should be dealt.

Do you think a 28 or 29 year old Price will be better than he is now? I think so. Ditto with Subban. Why be impatient with these guys? They've both shown that they have the talent to succeed so leave them be and let them develop. It makes no sense to draft and then develop players only to trade them away right before they hit their prime.

We need to STOP looking for quick fixes. It's not the answer and it never was. We should go after picks and prospects, not vets. Draft the centerman we want. Trade for the prospects that we can build with... That's the way to do it.

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12-30-2011, 02:26 PM
  #391
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Except no goalie will get you a 1 center or a 1 dman.
Never know unless we try ... I believe Carter and/or Richards would of been avaialble if Price was put on the table.

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12-30-2011, 02:27 PM
  #392
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Why create one hole to fill another? If you're going to build a team, build off the blocks you have now. Neither Price nor Subban should be dealt.

Do you think a 28 or 29 year old Price will be better than he is now? I think so. Ditto with Subban. Why be impatient with these guys? They've both shown that they have the talent to succeed so leave them be and let them develop. It makes no sense to draft and then develop players only to trade them away right before they hit their prime.

We need to STOP looking for quick fixes. It's not the answer and it never was. We should go after picks and prospects, not vets. Draft the centerman we want. Trade for the prospects that we can build with... That's the way to do it.
Because we are good at developing goalies but not good at developing defenseman or forwards.

I believe the gap between good forwards and high end superstar is bigger than Price compared to a "solid" goalie.

I'm not looking for a quick fix. I'm looking for a long-term fix. Obviously i'm not trading Price for a 30 year old Center.

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12-30-2011, 02:33 PM
  #393
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He's not even a top 5 goalie in the league ...now your saying he's a top 5 in MVP voting??! are you out of your mind! looool
wtf are you talking about with MVP voting.

MVP = Most valuable player

Whos the MVP in this team, freaking Carey Price and no one is close to even get the title.

and Carey is a top 5 MVP in the NHL, because he has no team in front of him. Just like Malkin is carrying Pittsburgh without Crosby.

And ur a fool saying Price isnt a top 5 goalie in the league. Stop looking at stats.

Thomas
Rinne
Lundqvist
Price / Miller
Quick / Fleury


but yeah, Blindfold by the fact price isnt carrying this ****** team eh!

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12-30-2011, 02:33 PM
  #394
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Never know unless we try ... I believe Carter and/or Richards would of been avaialble if Price was put on the table.
FYI, neither are number 1 centers and I would never trade Price for such a low return.

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12-30-2011, 02:33 PM
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Don't see how we win in Florida, a much better team than the Bolts

No, piece of cake, they have some key injuries.
The Bruins didn't receive any credit from anyone beating them 8-0 anyways....

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12-30-2011, 02:36 PM
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FYI, neither are number 1 centers and I would never trade Price for such a low return.
Carter was considered a #1 center before this season.

Mason in CBJ isn't doing well for a few season now. Maybe they are willing to listen about a Rick Nash and/or Jeff Carter trade.

What about Anaheim ...Hiller hasn't been good this season and there's rumors about Bobby Ryan.

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12-30-2011, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Kenny Powders View Post
wtf are you talking about with MVP voting.

MVP = Most valuable player

Whos the MVP in this team, freaking Carey Price and no one is close to even get the title.

and Carey is a top 5 MVP in the NHL, because he has no team in front of him. Just like Malkin is carrying Pittsburgh without Crosby.

And ur a fool saying Price isnt a top 5 goalie in the league. Stop looking at stats.

Thomas
Rinne
Lundqvist
Price / Miller
Quick / Fleury


but yeah, Blindfold by the fact price isnt carrying this ****** team eh!

Yes instead of 30th , we are 25th ! He's a legend!!

Your a fool for saying Price is top 5 ..any fan , even the pro-price fans here would never say he's a top 5 goalie in the league right now!

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Old
12-30-2011, 02:39 PM
  #398
SonOfGom
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Price is an average to solid goaltender, lets trade him for a #1 centre.

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Old
12-30-2011, 02:41 PM
  #399
EllertoKostitsynGoal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Why create one hole to fill another? If you're going to build a team, build off the blocks you have now. Neither Price nor Subban should be dealt.

Do you think a 28 or 29 year old Price will be better than he is now? I think so. Ditto with Subban. Why be impatient with these guys? They've both shown that they have the talent to succeed so leave them be and let them develop. It makes no sense to draft and then develop players only to trade them away right before they hit their prime.

We need to STOP looking for quick fixes. It's not the answer and it never was. We should go after picks and prospects, not vets. Draft the centerman we want. Trade for the prospects that we can build with... That's the way to do it.
Exactly, looking for quick fixes is what got us where we are now. We have better drafting than 3/4 of the NHL but it never shows because our management have ZERO patience with young players. They want their 8th place finish over long term sucess. We have pieces to build a great core, now it's all about surrounding them right. Just need a management team that can aknowledge that Subban,Price,Eller,Pacioretty etc... aren't just the future of this team but the current core (not Cammy,Gionta,Gomez etc...).

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Old
12-30-2011, 02:45 PM
  #400
Subban76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SonOfGom View Post
Price is an average to solid goaltender, lets trade him for a #1 centre.
Price is already top 10, easily, and close to top 5 and will be a top 3 in a few years when goalies hit their prime which is around 30.

LOL at Price being an average goalie comments. All the top goalies you think of where either backups, rookies, in the AHL or with worse stats at Price's age.

A little perspective when you anlayze players always help to judge them fairly. We are building a winner for in a few years. Price will probably top 3 in this league soon, why would we trade that?

I don't get some of you. Always looking for the quick fix. Trading Price would be the Habs biggest mistake since tarding Roy. Remember last time we tarded sucha good goalie?

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