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At what point does Kopitar take responsibility?

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Old
12-30-2011, 06:16 PM
  #26
GraniteHead
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The answer is back dated to the day he signed his new deal. The problem is, he's working with talent that just isn't qualified to shoulder the load he must.

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12-30-2011, 06:35 PM
  #27
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The problem is... he DOESN'T take responsibility. Kopitar has gotten a free ride up until this point. He has officially entered his prime and his play with the puck has shown zero improvement since he scored 30 goals two seasons ago. That is unacceptable.

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12-30-2011, 07:12 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by TonySCV View Post
You take the good with the bad with any player. Kopitar's "good" outweighs his "bad", even factoring in this annual mid-season rest stop.
That's very true, but the real question is if Kopitar's "good" is "good" enough to be anything other than the number 1 centerman on a mediocre team.

Almost every forward has struggled, but if you have the most to give, and aren't giving it, coupled with the size of your ATOI and contract, more fingers need to be pointed at Kopitar for not living up to his abilities AND responsibilities.

He may be the teams leading scorer due to a scorching start, but he has also been the teams biggest disappointment.

This team, its players, its media and its fans must start to demand and expect more out of this team than it has in the past. The coach has already been fired, rumors have Lombardi dealing with internal ultamatums - the players need to be handed it when they deserve it. Nobody has done less with more than Anze. That doesn't mean that he hasn't played well, it just means that he HAS to play better. It's the nature of the beast.

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12-30-2011, 07:22 PM
  #29
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Kopi is a beast. He needs a more talented sniper. That is all.

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12-30-2011, 07:23 PM
  #30
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http://lakingsinsider.com/2011/12/30...rk/#more-19193

Sutter: "If the top skill guys are really going, you want to give them big minutes, but we also use those guys to kill penalties, Anze and Brownie and Richie, so with Kopitarís minutes, maybe there are times when you want to give him a little (rest)."


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12-30-2011, 07:28 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
Kopi is a beast. He needs a more talented sniper. That is all.
A sniper on Kopitar's line has no bearing on Kopitar continually wilting under pressure.

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12-30-2011, 07:29 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
Kopi is a beast. He needs a more talented sniper. That is all.
Zero goals in 17 games, no he's not a beast.

He can be. Maybe he just needs a calendar where all the months say October?

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12-30-2011, 07:35 PM
  #33
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He's completely changed his game since Sutter's come on board. He's skating with more freedom and attack. He's controlling the puck for most of his shifts and his line is keeping the opponent pinned for minutes during games. Kopi (and Brown) in my opinion, have been two stand outs the last six or seven. He's got it since he's been cut loose. He just needs someone on his wing that the D have to watch because of the shot. He's never had that. All the great playmaking centers with big points and dominant play have had that other guy as a pairing. Then ice opens up. Kopi's never had that.

Can you imagine him with a Hossa or Iginla?

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12-30-2011, 07:38 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Duc620 View Post
He's completely changed his game since Sutter's come on board. He's skating with more freedom and attack. He's controlling the puck for most of his shifts and his line is keeping the opponent pinned for minutes during games. Kopi (and Brown) in my opinion, have been two stand outs the last six or seven. He's got it since he's been cut loose. He just needs someone on his wing that the D have to watch because of the shot. He's never had that. All the great playmaking centers with big points and dominant play have had that other guy as a pairing. Then ice opens up. Kopi's never had that.

Can you imagine him with a Hossa or Iginla?
Kopitar's not a playmaker. He's a shooter.

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12-30-2011, 07:44 PM
  #35
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Kopitar's not a playmaker. He's a shooter.
Exactly, he's is a touch above average as a passer at best. Add that to the fact that he holds to puck entirely too long and has little deception to his game at all and that doesn't make for a playmaking center.

He is great on the backcheck and excellent and intercepting opposition passes when they are trying to clear their own zone, but when he has the puck on his stick if he isn't driving to the net, he is pretty much useless.

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12-30-2011, 07:54 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Chazz Reinhold View Post
Kopitar's not a playmaker. He's a shooter.
How often do you see Kopitar wind up a big slapper? How often do you see him take the puck over the blue line and fire a wrister? how often do you see him 1 time the puck?

He is most definitely not a shooter, just compare him and Dustin Brown, Brown is a shooter and there is a pretty huge difference in how they play the game. Kopitar is definitely more of a playmaker

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12-30-2011, 07:58 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by bland View Post
That's very true, but the real question is
Whatever the question is, I am sure you have the one and only answer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 123slam View Post
http://lakingsinsider.com/2011/12/30...rk/#more-19193

Sutter: "If the top skill guys are really going, you want to give them big minutes, but we also use those guys to kill penalties, Anze and Brownie and Richie, so with Kopitarís minutes, maybe there are times when you want to give him a little (rest)."

Yeah, he will take him off the PP. However if it's really lack of effort, like many claim, Sutter's decision really doesn't make any sense. They are talking about Kopitar not having the WILL to do something in offense and yeah, I know that he is being paid 6.8M, but even most determined player can't WILL goals from the bench. Unless of course Sutter knows something that we don't.

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12-30-2011, 08:07 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by sw1tch View Post
How often do you see Kopitar wind up a big slapper? How often do you see him take the puck over the blue line and fire a wrister? how often do you see him 1 time the puck?

He is most definitely not a shooter, just compare him and Dustin Brown, Brown is a shooter and there is a pretty huge difference in how they play the game. Kopitar is definitely more of a playmaker
I mean shooter in the sense that his shot is better than his play making ability. Other than a hail mary to Brown last season, and one to Gagne this season, how often do you see him make great passes? The answer is "not often." He doesn't have that innate ability to make the players around him better with slick passes like Mike Richards does.

Kopitar has an amazing shot. He IS a sniper when he wants to be. The question that remains, however, is: how much does Kopitar want to push himself to get to those areas where he can best utilize his shot?

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12-30-2011, 08:13 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Chazz Reinhold View Post
A sniper on Kopitar's line has no bearing on Kopitar continually wilting under pressure.
And you would know that how? He had Smyth on his wing playing well and Kopitar was great. He had Williams last season on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing great. He had even Brown on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing great. He had Gagne on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing great. He had Williams this season on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing well.

Who doesn't see the pattern here? Now tell me when did Kopitar have a winger in great form and he wasn't playing well? It happened, yes, but not for longer period, when we could say that he was in a slump. Once he has great wingers and he is playing badly, I will believe all the criticisms and if that happens he should immediately be demoted and let Richards play with top line wingers.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sw1tch View Post
How often do you see Kopitar wind up a big slapper? How often do you see him take the puck over the blue line and fire a wrister? how often do you see him 1 time the puck?

He is most definitely not a shooter, just compare him and Dustin Brown, Brown is a shooter and there is a pretty huge difference in how they play the game. Kopitar is definitely more of a playmaker
Kopitar is both, a playmaker and a shooter. I don't see why fighting over which one he is "more" and trying to put only one of both labels on him. Kopitar has shown many times that he has some great shooting ability and he has also shown many times that he can pass just as good as anyone (no he is not an average passer).

The problem is that he is being evaluated now, when he is just not playing very well. So people exaggerate how bad he is at both. When Kopitar is playing top game, people will say how GOOD he is at both playmaking and shooting and you guys will fight again over what kind of a center he is. At the moment your arguments are how BAD he is at both playmaking and shooting. It's very simple.

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12-30-2011, 08:19 PM
  #40
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One of these years Kopitar will get tired of sucking for two months out of the season.

It will probably be when he is 30 years of age or so; has drank all the beer he is going to drink, slept around town all he is going to do.

Only Kopitar can decide he wants to be 100 point player, no coach, fan, winger, owner ETC is going to make him one.

Some day either Kopitar will figure it out, or he won't, the talent is there (is the drive ?).



On a side note=

It's the same with Drew and Jack; both of those guys have shown the ability to take over games. But for some reason they are content with just playing well enough to stay on the roster.
I guess I would be the same if I was making million's of dollars and lived in LA. I mean would you care about anything at that point ?

Also the media doesn't really hold anyone accountable in LA. I am surprised LA media talks about the Kings at all.


Last edited by damacles1156: 12-30-2011 at 08:26 PM.
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12-30-2011, 08:25 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Nex06 View Post
And you would know that how? He had Smyth on his wing playing well and Kopitar was great. He had Williams last season on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing great. He had even Brown on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing great. He had Gagne on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing great. He had Williams this season on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing well.

Who doesn't see the pattern here? Now tell me when did Kopitar have a winger in great form and he wasn't playing well? It happened, yes, but not for longer period, when we could say that he was in a slump. Once he has great wingers and he is playing badly, I will believe all the criticisms and if that happens he should immediately be demoted and let Richards play with top line wingers.
Apparently you don't see that pattern that Kopitar goes into long slumps like this EVERY season, despite who is on his wings.

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12-30-2011, 08:29 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Chazz Reinhold View Post
Apparently you don't see that pattern that Kopitar goes into long slumps like this EVERY season, despite who is on his wings.
When has he had an elite sniper on his wing? That's the point that's trying to be made here...and I agree with it. Kopi has never had a good enough winger. Period. I blame DL fully.

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12-30-2011, 08:33 PM
  #43
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When has he had an elite sniper on his wing? That's the point that's trying to be made here...and I agree with it. Kopi has never had a good enough winger. Period. I blame DL fully.
I love Kopitar, But I am just not going to accept that excuse. He is at the point in his career (Talent wise). Were he should be making his line mates better.

Not the other way around. If the Kings need a premier sniper to make Kopitar not go into a slump ever year. Then Kopitar doesn't need 6.8 Mill on his next contract, doesn't need to be a first line Center,Or the face of the Franchise.

But Like I said Kopitar is really the only guy that can make it happen.

We have seen Kopitar do it, he does make some slick plays to Brown. He just needs to do be more consistent.

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12-30-2011, 08:35 PM
  #44
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When has he had an elite sniper on his wing? That's the point that's trying to be made here...and I agree with it. Kopi has never had a good enough winger. Period. I blame DL fully.
Has he ever had a season when he hasn't disappeared for around 6 weeks?

What is the difference between his wingers in October and his wingers in December?

Yeah, I suppose if the Kings could get him some decent wingers like Dupuis and Kunitz he would become a superstar in this league.

It appears that he simply lacks the will to impose his will on the opposition. When he gets into the zone he takes it to the boards far too often. Believe me the defensemen are happy to give him the outside and let him skate behind the net, then pass it to the point.

Rarely does he try a wrap-around or take the puck right to the blue paint where good things can happen. I hope Sutter changes that.

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12-30-2011, 08:37 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
I love Kopitar, But I am just not going to accept that excuse. He is at the point in his career (Talent wise). Were he should be making his line mates better.

Not the other way around. If the Kings need a premier sniper to make Kopitar not go into a slump ever year. Then Kopitar doesn't need 6.8 Mill on his next contract and doesn't need to be a first line Center. Or the face of the Franchise.
When a line goes against the Kopitar line, who else do they have to worry about except Kopitar? Richardson? HA! Brown? He doesn't need more attention from the opposition than any other standard player does. Throw in an elite winger that defenders will also have to worry about, and that frees up space for him AND Kopi.

Don't buy the "excuse" if you want. I just don't see how you can come to such a conclusion without proof...which DL hasn't given us.

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12-30-2011, 08:38 PM
  #46
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And you would know that how? He had Smyth on his wing playing well and Kopitar was great. He had Williams last season on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing great. He had even Brown on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing great. He had Gagne on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing great. He had Williams this season on his wing playing well and Kopitar was playing well.

Who doesn't see the pattern here? Now tell me when did Kopitar have a winger in great form and he wasn't playing well? It happened, yes, but not for longer period, when we could say that he was in a slump. Once he has great wingers and he is playing badly, I will believe all the criticisms and if that happens he should immediately be demoted and let Richards play with top line wingers.



Kopitar is both, a playmaker and a shooter. I don't see why fighting over which one he is "more" and trying to put only one of both labels on him. Kopitar has shown many times that he has some great shooting ability and he has also shown many times that he can pass just as good as anyone (no he is not an average passer).

The problem is that he is being evaluated now, when he is just not playing very well. So people exaggerate how bad he is at both. When Kopitar is playing top game, people will say how GOOD he is at both playmaking and shooting and you guys will fight again over what kind of a center he is. At the moment your arguments are how BAD he is at both playmaking and shooting. It's very simple.
Yeah, I guess we need a larger sample size than approximately 6 weeks, every season for 6 seasons.

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12-30-2011, 08:40 PM
  #47
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Don't get me wrong though guys, I'm pissed about Kopi's "absence" as well...and I do agree that he could do more. I just want to see him with better linemates. Everytime someone says he can score 100 pts on Chicago or Vancouver, that **** hurts. It needs to happen in LA.

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12-30-2011, 08:42 PM
  #48
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When a line goes against the Kopitar line, who else do they have to worry about except Kopitar? Richardson? HA! Brown? He doesn't need more attention from the opposition than any other standard player does. Throw in an elite winger that defenders will also have to worry about, and that frees up space for him AND Kopi.

Don't buy the "excuse" if you want. I just don't see how you can come to such a conclusion without proof...which DL hasn't given us.
Crosby

He isn't super more talented than Kopitar, Will and Desire.

Crosby is a 90 point player with scrubs on his wing(Kunits and Dupuis for god's sake). Will and Desire.

If Kopitar had half of Crosby's Will and Desire... Well we wouldn't be making these threads.

Kopitar has to decide to do it, No winger is going to make him into a premier Center.

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12-30-2011, 08:44 PM
  #49
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Crosby

He isn't super more talented than Kopitar, Will and Desire.

Crosby is a 90 point player with scrubs on his wing. Will and Desire.
Seriously? He's echelons above Kopi's level. Better fitness, better speed, better passing/playmaking ability, better "hero" ability to put the game on his shoulders. You crazy!

Edit: You added more to your post, which I agree with. It is will and desire, but Crosby is 10x the talent Kopi is.

Also, I know we've all seen Kopitar try to take over games (sometimes, not as often as we would like), and everytime he does so, I feel like his wingers just **** it up for him. .02.

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12-30-2011, 08:46 PM
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Kopitar has taken over the games. Richardson is non an NHL starter and the fact that he's on the first line beefing every opportunity is telling enough. Nevermind the fact that he scored a goal the other day. Everyone knows Richardson didn't touch that puck including himself from what he said in his interview. It was Voinov's goal.

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