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Caps at Blue Jackets. 7pm. Nationwide Arena. 12.31.2011

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Old
01-01-2012, 11:57 PM
  #351
Mr Gone
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Originally Posted by sonsofcain View Post
Has even one single thing that's happened while he's been the coach led you to believe this?
They seem to be playing with a little more of an edge. And that is a lot seeing how soft the team is. They are not quite the barbi twins in Van. But they are not going to make anyone pay for going to the boards or whacking the goalie.

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01-02-2012, 01:00 AM
  #352
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You guys are still waiting for tx to show how 2 + 2 = 5, huh? Even a bull gives up when he comes to a stone wall.
What are you talking about? It makes perfect sense. Green sucks brutally at defense, we all know that, so you need to put up an exceptional defensive pro to cover for all of his amateur mistakes, like Jeff Plus Fifty Schultz. Can you imagine Orlov being remotely as good at hockey as Jeff Plus Fifty Schultz? I certainly can't. And that doesn't even take into account Orlov's lack of veteranship that Jeff Plus Fifty Schultz has in spades from being a veteran. What if there comes a moment when the game rests on Green's partner having to make a veterany decision? Orlov will certainly blow it! Hell, putting an inexperienced completely inept hockey player like Orlov with a defensively absent rover like Green will result in them just chipping pucks at their own net from the moment they hit the ice and making Vokoun give them the death stare.

But yeah, Orlov-Green or Orlov-Wideman would be a total disaster because that's what typecasting players without actually watching them play tells us. Now Hamrlik-Green and Schultz-Wideman/Erskine-Wideman, just hand us the cup now.

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01-02-2012, 04:30 AM
  #353
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Originally Posted by Funkyalligator View Post
Indeed Green needs to do a better job protecting himself but the man on man D will help with that plus the cheap hits won't be allowed to go unpunished by DH.
What are you talking about? Last years injury as getting hit by a puck and this years are uncertain.

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01-02-2012, 07:47 AM
  #354
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Originally Posted by Liberation View Post
What are you talking about? Last years injury as getting hit by a puck and this years are uncertain.
last season's playoff injury was a hip pointer. a contact injury. this year's groin injury was a knee to the inner thigh...a contact injury.

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01-02-2012, 08:45 AM
  #355
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@ TXPD - which of our fleet of RD do you think is our best defensively?

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01-02-2012, 09:16 AM
  #356
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@ TXPD - which of our fleet of RD do you think is our best defensively?
carlson. he has suffered some sophmore slumpness, but he is the guy. he is the biggest and strongest of the 3 and he has unusually strong chem with the best defensive LD, alzner.

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01-02-2012, 10:26 AM
  #357
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Originally Posted by Liberation View Post
What are you talking about? Last years injury as getting hit by a puck and this years are uncertain.
Tpxd called the knee to groin and than there was an elbow to the head that kept him out for significant time last year.

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01-02-2012, 10:40 AM
  #358
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
carlson. he has suffered some sophmore slumpness, but he is the guy. he is the biggest and strongest of the 3 and he has unusually strong chem with the best defensive LD, alzner.
Interesting - but I figured you wouldn't take the bait to make your point.

So you think Carlson hands down is flat out better than Green defensively, not even close enough to mention you are not sure? Wow. He is still just a kid, leading our team in turnovers.

Is your proof because Bruce let him cut his teeth defensively last year? Do you think Alzner may have carried that pair in any way, defensively?

I have seen some signs of improvement from Carlson, but I think Green at full health has the greenhorn beat. Green is a better body checker, has better stick work, I think Green is stronger man up, and is better at reading plays. Carlson I love him but he is still getting turnovers sorted out. Green has half as many per game, and twice as many takes than your boy. Green has more hits per game.

Give Green a guy like Alzner all last year and I bet you wouldn't be so sure. I don't think you have seen the best chemistry there is to be had on our blue.

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01-02-2012, 10:40 AM
  #359
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Originally Posted by Liberation View Post
What are you talking about? Last years injury as getting hit by a puck and this years are uncertain.
You calling NY Rangers Derek Stepan a puck. As I recall it, Green had been out for a while with an injury and had just returned when the Rangers came to the Verizon Center and Derek Stepan went up high on Green with an elbow. Green immediately left the ice and went to the locker room and did not return. I was at the game and you could see the Caps immediately become deflated after Green's injury. Within seconds I believe Steve Eminger of all people scored the first goal and the Rangers went on to win something like 7-1.

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01-02-2012, 11:34 AM
  #360
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I think Green does some things better than Carlson defensively. The biggest problem for both of them is probably their decision-making, though, and Green may be more subject to those mistakes than Carlson still. Green's also much better offensively though.

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01-02-2012, 12:02 PM
  #361
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Originally Posted by sonsofcain View Post
I think Green does some things better than Carlson defensively. The biggest problem for both of them is probably their decision-making, though, and Green may be more subject to those mistakes than Carlson still. Green's also much better offensively though.
Green like Ovechkin, is capable of those games where he can put the team on his back and carry them to a win. Semin has those skills as well, but they are not as evident as they are with Green and Ovechkin.

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01-02-2012, 12:02 PM
  #362
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I think its tough to grade Green decisions / defensive play since under the Bruce system, he was under heavy pressure to bring offense; to make our entire team function properly. And of course in the face of having to deal with the Rupp's of the league sticking a bullseye on his back. And lastly, being in listless pairings over the years.

Mike Green may have had the 2nd hardest job on the team, behind our G. It should be great for him to come into a team than can score transition goals without him.

I bet Dale loves the guy. I cant wait to see how Dale uses him. At full health he should take over as our number 1 go to all situation guy.

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01-02-2012, 12:11 PM
  #363
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
Interesting - but I figured you wouldn't take the bait to make your point.

So you think Carlson hands down is flat out better than Green defensively, not even close enough to mention you are not sure? Wow. He is still just a kid, leading our team in turnovers.

Is your proof because Bruce let him cut his teeth defensively last year? Do you think Alzner may have carried that pair in any way, defensively?

I have seen some signs of improvement from Carlson, but I think Green at full health has the greenhorn beat. Green is a better body checker, has better stick work, I think Green is stronger man up, and is better at reading plays. Carlson I love him but he is still getting turnovers sorted out. Green has half as many per game, and twice as many takes than your boy. Green has more hits per game.

Give Green a guy like Alzner all last year and I bet you wouldn't be so sure. I don't think you have seen the best chemistry there is to be had on our blue.
* hands down, flat out better makes it sound like i think carlson is great and green sucks. that is obviously not the case.

* boudreau didnt "let carlson cut his teeth defensively" and alzner didnt carry him. carlson clearly has had some sophmore season issues. had alzner been carrying him and he not been capable we would have seen last season what we are seeing this season. carlson's game is coming around.

* green hits harder and is dirtier. he is not stronger. he does not win nearly the number of board battles that carlson does with bigger players.

how do your stats look last season?

* lastly, i want green playing with ovechkin or backstrom(if on two seperate lines as they are now). he is the better offensive player of the caps three puck movers. his impact on this team is the straw that stirs the drink. why would you want to put him on the ice with the checking line and against the opposing top line where his primary responsibility is defense?

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01-02-2012, 01:14 PM
  #364
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Stats last season point to a bunch of turnovers. Is it normal for a shutdown guy to be your turnover leader? So you don't think Bruce made Carlson cut his teeth defensively. Yeah it's a figure of speech subject to interpretation. Shutdown role yet leading team in turnovers = cutting teeth to me.

Was he a defensive stalwart as a prospect? I thought that was more Alzner. You should have no problem pointing out other rookie / 1st year defensemen of 74's ilk that were in shutdown roles their entire first full year.

Green is not stronger.. how do you know... aren't they roughly the same build? I see Green stronger on the boards, but that is just my opine. You know young players often lack strength, right? Did Carlson beef up over the summer?

Lets keep the argument going until we the next GDT we can argue in.

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01-02-2012, 01:44 PM
  #365
txpd
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
Stats last season point to a bunch of turnovers. Is it normal for a shutdown guy to be your turnover leader? So you don't think Bruce made Carlson cut his teeth defensively. Yeah it's a figure of speech subject to interpretation. Shutdown role yet leading team in turnovers = cutting teeth to me.

Was he a defensive stalwart as a prospect? I thought that was more Alzner. You should have no problem pointing out other rookie / 1st year defensemen of 74's ilk that were in shutdown roles their entire first full year.

Green is not stronger.. how do you know... aren't they roughly the same build? I see Green stronger on the boards, but that is just my opine. You know young players often lack strength, right? Did Carlson beef up over the summer?

lets keep the argument going until we the next GDT we can argue in.
* its normal for a puck mover to have a lot of turnovers. a dump in controlled by the opposition is a turnover. the more you have the puck, the more turnovers you commit.

* boudreau didnt make carlson cut his teeth defensively. you actually think boudreau was using the kid as his shutdown RD down the stretch and in the playoffs for a reason other than he was the best choice?

* alzner is a d first defenseman. most coaches match one of those with a puck mover. there's a reason why two d first defense dont tend to play together and when they do, like hannan and erskine or hannan and schultz, its a failure.

* carlson, younger and growing is listed at 6-2 220 and green more developed at 6-2 210. but i just watch them in the corners. carlson is strong on his skates and green is faster.

again we can agree to disagree. i just dont see how you could believe that boudreau would choose to match carlson against gaborik and stamkos and st louis in the playoffs for any reason other than he was the best choice. he chose alzner overf hannan because alzner was better.

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01-02-2012, 06:58 PM
  #366
Mothra
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Originally Posted by Funkyalligator View Post
Tpxd called the knee to groin and than there was an elbow to the head that kept him out for significant time last year.
and the Pronger hit that caused him to miss a few weeks a couple years back.....

52 does tend to make himself a target by holding onto the puck too long or similar things. I think he does realize that teams target him and he has to protect himself better.....he get hit a lot

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