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Canucks Injury Thread: Sedin indefinite (concussion), Rome out 7-10 days (knee)

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Old
01-03-2012, 12:29 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Mr. Canucklehead View Post
Good news!
Last night between periods the Sportsnet panel (Murphy/MacIntyre/Gollum) said it sounded like Booth was still awhile away from returning.

Jim Jamieson of the Province has tweeted the same:

@JamiesonCanucks Jim Jamieson
#canucks Also, Booth (knee) skated for third straight day, is still a ways away from playing, as is Rome (thumb).
http://twitter.com/#!/JamiesonCanuck...11157516812288

@JamiesonCanucks Jim Jamieson
#Canucks David Booth doesn't sound like he's close to returning after MCL sprain 4 weeks ago: "Being off for 3 weeks feels like 3 months."
http://twitter.com/#!/JamiesonCanuck...13105120886784

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01-03-2012, 12:33 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Bobby Lou View Post
I'm no cap-genius like some around here, so can someone explain to me why Byron Bitz needs to be placed on waivers? Hasn't the guy been on our roster, eating cap space the entire year? We signed him as a free agent, and he has never been demoted to the AHL as far as I can figure. Seems weird we may lose this guy to the waiver wire after paying his medical bills and salary for half a season.
They arent re-entry waivers, he is placed on waivers....like they dont want him!

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Old
01-03-2012, 12:33 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
If Booth comes back against Boston...

Best. Birthday. Present. Ever.
http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/B...540/story.html

Quote:
"It's really frustrating and I wish it didn't happen," said Booth. "I thought I was playing better and now it's a process of getting back there. This was my third day on the ice and I've only been skating for about 15 minutes. I can't do the reaction stuff, stops and starts and changing direction. ... I've been off three weeks, or whatever it was, and it feels like three months."

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Old
01-03-2012, 12:37 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
They arent re-entry waivers, he is placed on waivers....like they dont want him!

Well, what the hell...

Maybe he's literally done...career ending type stuff. Buying him out or something? I dunno...this seems freaking weird if true.

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Old
01-03-2012, 12:39 PM
  #55
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Well ****....what a downer

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01-03-2012, 12:39 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Bobby Lou View Post
Well, what the hell...

Maybe he's literally done...career ending type stuff. Buying him out or something? I dunno...this seems freaking weird if true.
They're waiving him down to the AHL to make capspace. It also allows Gillis to use his Bitz' banked LTIR space to go after more salary at the deadline.

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01-03-2012, 12:41 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Bobby Lou View Post
I'm no cap-genius like some around here, so can someone explain to me why Byron Bitz needs to be placed on waivers? Hasn't the guy been on our roster, eating cap space the entire year? We signed him as a free agent, and he has never been demoted to the AHL as far as I can figure. Seems weird we may lose this guy to the waiver wire after paying his medical bills and salary for half a season.
That is how it works. If a player is injured before being assigned to the AHL he is on the NHL team roster. That is a chance you take when you sign a player with an injury history.

The Bruins chose not to qualify him which resulted in Bitz being UFA and the Canucks signed him.

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01-03-2012, 12:42 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
They're waiving him down to the AHL to make capspace. It also allows Gillis to use his Bitz' banked LTIR space to go after more salary at the deadline.
What banked LTIR space?

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01-03-2012, 12:42 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
Last night between periods the Sportsnet panel (Murphy/MacIntyre/Gollum) said it sounded like Booth was still awhile away from returning.

Jim Jamieson of the Province has tweeted the same:

@JamiesonCanucks Jim Jamieson
#canucks Also, Booth (knee) skated for third straight day, is still a ways away from playing, as is Rome (thumb).
http://twitter.com/#!/JamiesonCanuck...11157516812288

@JamiesonCanucks Jim Jamieson
#Canucks David Booth doesn't sound like he's close to returning after MCL sprain 4 weeks ago: "Being off for 3 weeks feels like 3 months."
http://twitter.com/#!/JamiesonCanuck...13105120886784
It just sounds like his conditioning is off, which is to be expected after that long. I don't think it should take that long for him to be back in the swing of things. Get the legs and lungs back, then work on the timing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Lou View Post
Well, what the hell...

Maybe he's literally done...career ending type stuff. Buying him out or something? I dunno...this seems freaking weird if true.
Could be...couldn't they have put him on a conditioning stint if they wanted to protect him and have him in the minors?

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Old
01-03-2012, 12:43 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
They arent re-entry waivers, he is placed on waivers....like they dont want him!
Once he is healthy and if he is to be cleared off the NHL roster that is the process.

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01-03-2012, 12:43 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
What banked LTIR space?
I read that you can use LTIR space retroactively.

Edit: Source, seems to be pretty across the board on it.

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Old
01-03-2012, 12:51 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
I read that you can use LTIR space retroactively.

Edit: Source, seems to be pretty across the board on it.
The pertinent part of that thread you'll want to note is this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mouser View Post
They can retroactively place the player on LTIR, but the club doesn't get any cap benefit for the time between when the player was initially injured and when they placed the player on LTIR. Technically the club doesn't gain any benefit until the LTIR exception is actually used to allow the team payroll to exceed the cap--unused LTIR exception time/$ disappears as it goes unused, it doesn't accumulate like unused payroll room does.
Emphasis mine.

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Old
01-03-2012, 12:54 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
I read that you can use LTIR space retroactively.
No.

You can place a player retroactively on LTIR but with LTIR exception space it is "use it or lose it" since it only kicks in once you have reached the upper limit of the cap. Once player is healthy and he comes off LTIR then you have to reduce your daily cap hit to be cap compliant.
A Club's payroll will include all salaries, signing bonuses and performance bonuses paid to players. Except in the case of bona fide long-term injury (injuries that sideline a player for a minimum of 24 days and 10 games) to one or more of a club's players, Club payrolls will never be permitted to be below the minimum or in excess of the maximum. Clubs at or near the upper limit that have players who incur a bona fide long-term injury will be entitled to replace up to the full value of the injured player's NHL salary (even if such salary would result in the club's team salary exceeding the upper limit). The "replacement salary" will not count against the club's upper limit but will count against the League-wide players' share. Upon return of the injured player, the team must come into immediate compliance with the requirements of the payroll range.
http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=26366

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01-03-2012, 01:01 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Wellwood You View Post
The pertinent part of that thread you'll want to note is this:



Emphasis mine.
Hrm. Fair enough. I skimmed through a couple threads on it and the general consensus was that you could.

My bad guys!

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Old
01-03-2012, 01:03 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
No.

You can place a player retroactively on LTIR but with LTIR exception space it is "use it or lose it" since it only kicks in once you have reached the upper limit of the cap. Once player is healthy and he comes off LTIR then you have to reduce your daily cap hit to be cap compliant.
A Club's payroll will include all salaries, signing bonuses and performance bonuses paid to players. Except in the case of bona fide long-term injury (injuries that sideline a player for a minimum of 24 days and 10 games) to one or more of a club's players, Club payrolls will never be permitted to be below the minimum or in excess of the maximum. Clubs at or near the upper limit that have players who incur a bona fide long-term injury will be entitled to replace up to the full value of the injured player's NHL salary (even if such salary would result in the club's team salary exceeding the upper limit). The "replacement salary" will not count against the club's upper limit but will count against the League-wide players' share. Upon return of the injured player, the team must come into immediate compliance with the requirements of the payroll range.
http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=26366
Curious as to what 'return' is being used in this sense. He's not 'returning' to the NHL roster, he's being waived. But you can't waive and injured player, correct?

Just when you thought you had a good grasp on it.

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01-03-2012, 01:24 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by thepuckmonster View Post
Hrm. Fair enough. I skimmed through a couple threads on it and the general consensus was that you could.

My bad guys!
Do not feel bad I have had to correct a number of "professional hockey writers" on that error - one that Iain MacIntyre continues to make.

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01-03-2012, 01:34 PM
  #67
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Booth is such a class act.

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01-03-2012, 01:36 PM
  #68
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Booth is such a class act.
Happiest thing since Glitter was invented.

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01-03-2012, 01:41 PM
  #69
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Curious as to what 'return' is being used in this sense. He's not 'returning' to the NHL roster, he's being waived. But you can't waive and injured player, correct?

Just when you thought you had a good grasp on it.
Return in this sense means he is cleared to play or medically fit to play.

Bitz would have to have been healthy enough to play to be waived in the first place otherwise the NHLPA would grieve the waiver because not only does it clear his salary from the cap it also means that since he is on a two-way deal he now will be getting his AHL salary of $105,000 and not his NHL salary of $700,000 (figures from capgeek.com).

There is also an opportunity for teams to work the LTIR because there is no compulsory requirement to actually force a team to move a healthy player off LTIR. If you recall Salo remained on LTIR last season longer than necessary because returning him to the roster would have meant waiving him or another player to clear the caps space necessary. There was robust debate as to whether this constituted a cap circumvention - my opinion was that it did not based on the wording of the CBA.

That problem was solved when another player was injured and placed on LTIR - Edler IIRC. In that case the Canucks sent Salo to Manitoba for a conditioning stint but during that time he remained on the LTIR per the CBA:
http://twitter.com/#!/capgeek/status/33576336995917826

Here is article that looked at the Salo situation:
http://canuckscorner.com/2010/12/29/...s-and-the-cap/

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01-03-2012, 01:47 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
Return in this sense means he is cleared to play or medically fit to play.

Bitz would have to have been healthy enough to play to be waived in the first place otherwise the NHLPA would grieve the waiver because not only does it clear his salary from the cap it also means that since he is on a two-way deal he now will be getting his AHL salary of $105,000 and not his NHL salary of $700,000 (figures from capgeek.com).

There is also an opportunity for teams to work the LTIR because there is no compulsory requirement to actually force a team to move a healthy player off LTIR. If you recall Salo remained on LTIR last season longer than necessary because returning him to the roster would have meant waiving him or another player to clear the caps space necessary. There was robust debate as to whether this constituted a cap circumvention - my opinion was that it did not based on the wording of the CBA.

That problem was solved when another player was injured and placed on LTIR - Edler IIRC. In that case the Canucks sent Salo to Manitoba for a conditioning stint but during that time he remained on the LTIR per the CBA:
http://twitter.com/#!/capgeek/status/33576336995917826

Here is article that looked at the Salo situation:
http://canuckscorner.com/2010/12/29/...s-and-the-cap/
Ah, okay, thanks Wet!

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01-03-2012, 02:15 PM
  #71
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News from Coach V:

Booth will have a CT scan over the next few days. If results are good, he will join the Canucks on the road. Team will have a better update tomorrow in regards to Rome making the next road trip.

Bitz is cleared to play and has been placed on waivers. He is expected to play with Chicago Wolves soon.


Luongo will start against the Wild tomorrow.
Via Vancouver Canucks FB page.

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Old
01-04-2012, 05:36 AM
  #72
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Wonder why we couldn't put Bitz on a conditioning stint to see where he was at first? We did the same with Salo last year.

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01-04-2012, 05:44 AM
  #73
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Wonder why we couldn't put Bitz on a conditioning stint to see where he was at first? We did the same with Salo last year.
One of those guys has been a Canuck since 2002 and is a top 4 d-man.
The other is a free agent signing who hasn't played a game in the NHL since March 27th, 2010 (almost two years ago) and isn't more than a 4th line forward.


IMO, Bitz is going to need a very very long conditioning stint before he's ready to play in the NHL again.

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01-04-2012, 12:31 PM
  #74
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JAY JANOWER @DOUBLEJGLOBALBC
David Booth taking to the ice..has regular jersey on..all smiles whipping around the ice..

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01-04-2012, 01:07 PM
  #75
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Booth is such a class act.
But...but...he only sent a text! BAD, PORTER!

Booth seriously has to be one of the happiest, go-lucky guys I've ever witnessed.

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