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#40: Kings v. Avalanche, 1/2/12, S/O Loss, thoughts & tidbits, *** Ref's

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Old
01-03-2012, 01:26 PM
  #76
The Big Giant Head
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Originally Posted by Bandit View Post
We're blaming Penner now? Again?

Both the Kopitar line and the Stoll line are out there working hard, but they have such obvious chemistry issues it's mind boggling how they aren't split up. They're playing as individuals instead of cohesive offensive units. Williams is hogging the puck, Penner doesn't know what to do with himself while he's waiting for Williams to either get stripped or get his shot/pass blocked. Brown is a vortex of suck that saps all skill from Kopitar. The only goal Kopitar has scored in nearly 20 games was when Brown was on the bench. How do the coaches not see this stuff?

And I'll keep saying it because I can't believe it: How does Kompon still have a job? How does an assistant coach that runs one of the ********* powerplays in the league survive TWO head coaches being fired? It defies all logic.
some of this is true but the Brown Kopitar statement is outlandish. Brown and Kopitar do have some chemistry, they may not have the same skill set but they do work better than nearly any other combination of forwards. And is this the game we're playing now? Kopitar sucks because of Brown? laughable. Kopitar is sucking because KOPITAR is sucking, it has nothing to do with Brown. Brown is the only forward thats broken his slump and his been a reliable point producer in the last 8 games. I dont want to sound like too much of a homer for Brown becasue he is one of my favortie Kings but its quite obvious Brown is not the problem with our offense right now.

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Originally Posted by sjmay View Post
Are we watching the same game????

Kopitar and Brown have OBVIOUS chemistry, that's how the first goal was scored.

Stoll's line hemmed in the Avs numerous times and is showing obvious chemistry...

Wow....one game...seriously? Give your head a shake...
I agree. We played a 40min game last night, we dominated 2 periods of play. If kings won 1-0 or 2-0 (goal allowed) then the only BS comments on here would be about us not scoring more than 2 goals again.

Game over...gotta point, move on.


Also, as a side note. My son is 3 and for xmas i bought him his first Kings Jersey and tickets to Thursday game for his first ever hockey game. I just want a great game on Thursday for him. im only asking for 1 goal.

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01-03-2012, 01:38 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Ron View Post
If it's your opinion that a coach should be fired for not delivering what he is supposed to be delivering, that's fine, but to call someone a "cockroach" without knowing him personally is a bit much I think.

A change probably does have to be made, and soon. If not the coach, then at least the philosophy. I saw a lot of indecision on the part of Doughty and Kopitar on the power play last night.
I'm shocked that I actually have to explain this but it's a tongue in cheek reference. Like somebody else posted I'm not really comparing him to an insect. And if you have to know somebody to have an opinion I'd like to know who you know personally on the Kings. If the answer is nobody then you should no longer have an opinion on any King player, you know, take your own advice.

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01-03-2012, 01:42 PM
  #78
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You guys can blame Kompon all you want but these guys need to learn how to put the biscuit in the basket again. From the beginning of the season I've seen a team that usually outworks, outchances, outshoots the other teams but the individual players seem to freeze up when its their big chance. To me it seems like some kind of weird collective mental block.

I'd like to see Sutter get creative and get some of the goal scorers going. I know it sounds ridiculous but there are some great relaxation techniques they should be exploring through yoga, meditation, Chinese Kung Fu among many others. Some of these things have helped me greatly with some of my success in life.

I know these guys are professionals and I bet alot of them are already familiar with some of this stuff but I think they could benefit from some collective coaching in the mental department. I really don't think this team is as weak as many of us were fearing a few weeks ago. A couple of small things here and there could go a long way.

Kings still have their points steak alive under the Sutter era and still lots to be optimistic about.

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01-03-2012, 01:47 PM
  #79
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How do the powers-that-be not realize that, with how good this team is defensively, that if they can just get the PP working that they would win twice as many games?

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01-03-2012, 02:01 PM
  #80
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I'm not going even hoping for a better PP just yet. I'd just like our guys to hit the net first. Constant wide shots when they just need to be put on net for rebounds

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01-03-2012, 02:01 PM
  #81
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I think we should try the Penner Kopi Williams line, last year b4 Kopis injury, that line was looking dangerous.

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01-03-2012, 02:24 PM
  #82
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Kings are sitting at a 6.7% shooting percentage. The next lowest is Columbus at 7.5% and the league average is 9.1%. That's pathetic.

Shot mentality doesn't work and Sutter isn't making enough changes fast enough to the offense. I understand the slow build while he gets familiar, but it's time for him to make some serious changes to the offense. Getting rid of the umbrella PP is priority number one. Getting Jack and Drew to throw low wrist shots at the net instead of the huge slap shot wind ups will help too. He needs to start a 2 second rule when practicing the PP, no player should have the puck for more than 2 seconds before passing or shooting, making it a huge priority in practice so that it becomes the norm in games, quick puck movement is the key to most successful PPs. The Kings just hang on too long and stand around, making it very easy to defend the PP.


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01-03-2012, 02:38 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Kings are sitting at a 6.7% shooting percentage. The next lowest is Columbus at 7.5% and the league average is 9.1%. That's pathetic.

Shot mentality doesn't work and Sutter isn't making enough changes fast enough to the offense. I understand the slow build while he gets familiar, but it's time for him to make some serious changes to the offense. Getting rid of the umbrella PP is priority number one. Getting Jack and Drew to throw low wrist shots at the net instead of the huge slap shot wind ups will help too. He needs to start a 2 second rule when practicing the PP, no player should have the puck for more than 2 seconds before passing or shooting, making it a huge priority in practice so that it becomes the norm in games, quick puck movement is the key to most successful PPs. The Kings just hang on too long and stand around, making it very easy to defend the PP.

The honeymoon is over? Sorry but this is exactly what I predicted when he was hired. I figured he get them motivated and get them back into the form that TM had them at before this season and not much better. And don't expect much to change unless the 1) fire the PP/offensive coach and 2) Sutter deviates from his history of playing a defensive style like Murray does. Yeah he has opened it up a bit but at the end of the day, not much has changed except the personality of the coach and the way he handles players.

Go ahead and look at Sutter's history of GF, it looks a lot like our former coach. I don't know why everyone was so excited for his hiring. Sure he has more personality and probably will get more out of the players but I don't think he is going to turn this team into a top 10 offense which has become the de facto statistic around here to determining if you are a contender or not.

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01-03-2012, 02:50 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Buddy The Elf View Post
The honeymoon is over? Sorry but this is exactly what I predicted when he was hired. I figured he get them motivated and get them back into the form that TM had them at before this season and not much better. And don't expect much to change unless the 1) fire the PP/offensive coach and 2) Sutter deviates from his history of playing a defensive style like Murray does. Yeah he has opened it up a bit but at the end of the day, not much has changed except the personality of the coach and the way he handles players.

Go ahead and look at Sutter's history of GF, it looks a lot like our former coach. I don't know why everyone was so excited for his hiring. Sure he has more personality and probably will get more out of the players but I don't think he is going to turn this team into a top 10 offense which has become the de facto statistic around here to determining if you are a contender or not.
i dont think we'll be seeing him deviate too much from his previous coaching style considering when he was first hired he said, "this is a 3-2 league now". I'd say if i could jump into his head, he only thinks he needs to improve this team to scoring 3 goals a game rather than 2.

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01-03-2012, 02:50 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buddy The Elf View Post
The honeymoon is over? Sorry but this is exactly what I predicted when he was hired. I figured he get them motivated and get them back into the form that TM had them at before this season and not much better. And don't expect much to change unless the 1) fire the PP/offensive coach and 2) Sutter deviates from his history of playing a defensive style like Murray does. Yeah he has opened it up a bit but at the end of the day, not much has changed except the personality of the coach and the way he handles players.

Go ahead and look at Sutter's history of GF, it looks a lot like our former coach. I don't know why everyone was so excited for his hiring. Sure he has more personality and probably will get more out of the players but I don't think he is going to turn this team into a top 10 offense which has become the de facto statistic around here to determining if you are a contender or not.
I don't think anyone was really excited about Sutter being hired. Most wanted a new, young coach to change the style of play. Getting rid of Murray was where the excitement was. Most thought that Kompon would be gone too and he is still around coaching the PP.

This home stand is the first time Sutter will have a chance to get some solid practice time with the Kings and this would be the perfect time for him to make some bigger changes with the offense. That was all I was trying to convey with my "rant".

I'm still willing to give Sutter more time, but I just don't get keeping Kompon. The Kings PP has been dismal since the Vancouver series.

I still think Dean and Sutter could be gone before June if the Kings fail to make the playoffs. AEG gave Dean a 3rd opportunity to find a coach and I don't think he gets a fourth. Would AEG really give Dean another off season if the Kings end up where they started 6 years ago?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Big Giant Head View Post
i dont think we'll be seeing him deviate too much from his previous coaching style considering when he was first hired he said, "this is a 3-2 league now". I'd say if i could jump into his head, he only thinks he needs to improve this team to scoring 3 goals a game rather than 2.
But that is exactly where the Kings need to be. 3 is all, just one more per game and the Kings are in the top 10. He doesn't need to get them any higher than 3 per game.

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01-03-2012, 03:06 PM
  #86
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Wow, one loss to Colorado and you nut jobs are at it again....

Seriously, do yourself a favor, go strap on a pair of skates and try out for a team then you can put it all in perspective.

The difference of this team between Murray and Sutter is night and day, and I will admit it, the team needed this. I still think it's on the players, but the players are responding better to Sutter than they did to Murray at any point this season.

Williams took it to the net last night and went THROUGH the damn thing, before Sutter, he keeps it in the corner,

Kopitar takes it to the net much more now and has become more dangerous with Richards on his wing.

Lotkionov, Lewis, and Richardson have dominated the other teams in the two games they have been together.

Stoll, Williams, and Penner have done the same...

LOL wow....it must be hell living in a world where your favorite team can't go 82-0

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01-03-2012, 03:12 PM
  #87
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Sutter has the team playing much better than before. Problem is that we still don't have guys scoring. Dean fixed the coaching problem and now it's time for him to go out and get a scoring winger. Someone who will work hard and get goals. Someone like Parise or Ryan, Iginla, Nash, St Louis...

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01-03-2012, 03:23 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
I don't think anyone was really excited about Sutter being hired. Most wanted a new, young coach to change the style of play. Getting rid of Murray was where the excitement was. Most thought that Kompon would be gone too and he is still around coaching the PP.

This home stand is the first time Sutter will have a chance to get some solid practice time with the Kings and this would be the perfect time for him to make some bigger changes with the offense. That was all I was trying to convey with my "rant".

I'm still willing to give Sutter more time, but I just don't get keeping Kompon. The Kings PP has been dismal since the Vancouver series.

I still think Dean and Sutter could be gone before June if the Kings fail to make the playoffs. AEG gave Dean a 3rd opportunity to find a coach and I don't think he gets a fourth. Would AEG really give Dean another off season if the Kings end up where they started 6 years ago?
When he was hired I remember making these same points to you. I asked you what you expected and the end of the day it sounded like we agreed that he wouldn't improve the offense much but could get the Kings into the playoffs. I still think that is the case. But I for one am not surprised to see the Kings still struggle scoring.

If the Kings miss the playoffs, they should clean house this summer with management and coaches. All the players except Kopitar, Richards, Doughty, Johnson and Quick should be available for the right price.

If I was a season ticket holder and I had access to the Breakfast, the one question I would love to ask and I hope somebody does and words it exactly like this (double check facts first) "Every Stanley Cup winner since the lockout has been in the top 1/3rd of the league in Goals For but two of those winners were in the bottom 2/3rd's of the league in Goals Against. This would suggest that defense, while still important, isn't as important as offense in the "new NHL". Do agree with this premise? If so, what are you doing to improve the offense to make them a contender and why has this been neglected in the past both with personnel decisions and coaching decisions? If not, why do you disagree the premise when the stats say otherwise?"

I'd just really like to hear his response to that. I mean a guy who is always analyzing stats etc should be aware of such statistics and I can't imagine he just dismisses that. That would be incredibly naive. The fact that he acknowledges goal scoring as an issue suggests to me that he is aware of it but why hasn't this been a bigger priority at least the past few seasons when there has been more of a track record to base this notion off of?

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01-03-2012, 03:24 PM
  #89
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Are we watching the same game????

Kopitar and Brown have OBVIOUS chemistry, that's how the first goal was scored.
No, the goal was scored because Kopitar put the puck on the net and Brown happened to be standing there. I suggest you watch what happens when they're carrying the puck up the ice. Brown is either hogging it all the way, or not getting into a position to support Kopitar.

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Originally Posted by sjmay View Post
Stoll's line hemmed in the Avs numerous times and is showing obvious chemistry...
Again, whatch what happens when they're carrying the puck. Indecision and offsides galore.

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Originally Posted by sjmay View Post
Wow....one game...seriously? Give your head a shake...
Not one game, the last several years, every time they're put together. Shake your own head.


Last edited by Bandit: 01-03-2012 at 03:31 PM.
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01-03-2012, 03:27 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Kopi11 View Post
Sutter has the team playing much better than before. Problem is that we still don't have guys scoring. Dean fixed the coaching problem and now it's time for him to go out and get a scoring winger. Someone who will work hard and get goals. Someone like Parise or Ryan, Iginla, Nash, St Louis...
ok, so all those guys minus Parise require a trade. How many holes do we have to open to fill another? And i know you're just naming wingers but St.Louis is not the answer to our problem. Theres no winger solution at this point that going to help. The current team needs to pull themselves together and get it done.

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01-03-2012, 03:30 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Buddy The Elf View Post
When he was hired I remember making these same points to you. I asked you what you expected and the end of the day it sounded like we agreed that he wouldn't improve the offense much but could get the Kings into the playoffs. I still think that is the case. But I for one am not surprised to see the Kings still struggle scoring.
There was still hope that the Kings would get back to their career averages, this is all the Kings needed to get into the top 10. It's too late for them to get their this season, but if they could get above 3 goals per game for the next 42 games, then they will be in a better position to succeed in the playoffs.

The PP is still costing the Kings points and Sutter needs to address that in a big way. He's made some solid changes to the 5-on-5 style and agressiveness, but hasn't added that to the PP. If the Kings score 1 PP goal last night (of couse they did score that PP goal, the ref and Toronto took it away), they get 2 points.

The potentail is still there for the Kings to be a top 10 offense and defense, they just need that push from the coach. Sutter may be able to do it in the short term, but I don't think he is the long term solution (never did).

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01-03-2012, 03:30 PM
  #92
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Kopitar sucks because of Brown? laughable. Kopitar is sucking because KOPITAR is sucking, it has nothing to do with Brown.
I suggest you see the thread I started about Kopitar, I've clearly stated that it doesn't give him a free pass. That doesn't change the fact that they play terribly together. I think some of you have been watching ****** hockey for so long you've forgotten what it's like to watch a line that can actually read and react to each other to create and finish scoring chances instead of just flinging it at the goalie and hoping for a lucky bounce.

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01-03-2012, 03:34 PM
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Up to the second - Dallas projected in the #8 spot at 95 points, San Jose projected to take the Pacific with 103 points.

So, to make the playoffs as the #8 seed, the Kings need 96 points (or 95 and a prayer) -- 51 points in the remaining 42 games, a record of 25-16-1 (percentage of .607).

To take the Pacific, the Kings need 104 points, or 59 points in the final 42 games, a record of 29-12-1 (percentage of .702)


Last edited by HansH: 01-03-2012 at 04:08 PM. Reason: Missed a Nashville game that actually has them at a better winning clip than I originally thought.
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01-03-2012, 03:50 PM
  #94
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Kings are sitting at a 6.7% shooting percentage. The next lowest is Columbus at 7.5% and the league average is 9.1%. That's pathetic.

Shot mentality doesn't work and Sutter isn't making enough changes fast enough to the offense. I understand the slow build while he gets familiar, but it's time for him to make some serious changes to the offense. Getting rid of the umbrella PP is priority number one. Getting Jack and Drew to throw low wrist shots at the net instead of the huge slap shot wind ups will help too. He needs to start a 2 second rule when practicing the PP, no player should have the puck for more than 2 seconds before passing or shooting, making it a huge priority in practice so that it becomes the norm in games, quick puck movement is the key to most successful PPs. The Kings just hang on too long and stand around, making it very easy to defend the PP.

Come on Sydor, chill out.

We didn't score more than two goals in a game insomething like 13 straight games until TM was fired. We've scored three or more in a game twice under DS if I'm not mistaken and he's only had a few practices due to the long road trip. Let's see how the offense looks at the end of our homestand. I think you should go back to looking at the quality scoring chances per game as an indication of if our offense is on the right path or not.

It's not great, but it's better, and he hasn't even had time to really address issues yet.

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01-03-2012, 03:54 PM
  #95
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No, the goal was scored because Kopitar put the puck on the net and Brown happened to be standing there. I suggest you watch what happens when they're carrying the puck up the ice. Brown is either hogging it all the way, or not getting into a position to support Kopitar.



Again, whatch what happens when they're carrying the puck. Indecision and offsides galore.



Not one game, the last several years, every time they're put together. Shake your own head.
LOL I don't think you understand what chemistry is...

First of all, Brown wasn't standing there, he was skating through, second of all, this isn't the first them they scored like this.

Let me ask you this, Richards and Gagne scored a goal like this and everyone was raving how it was about time because they had so much "chemistry" so Brown and Kopitar do the same thing, and there is no chemistry?

Watch what happens when they carry the puck, the past two games, Williams-Stoll-Penner have been one of the best lines of the season, not sure what games you have been watching to be honest, but when that line can dictate the play to the other team long enough for them to change lines, pretty sure that line is working ok.

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01-03-2012, 03:54 PM
  #96
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I don't know if it's been mentioned, but Williams was a beast last night. Love it.

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01-03-2012, 03:56 PM
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even though we arent scoring, the hockey under Suter is much more enjoyable to watch.
i found my self bored to tears when TM was coach.

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01-03-2012, 03:57 PM
  #98
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This is a pretty funny thread.

Everybody get their pitchforks out. It's time to burn the witch. We're going to fire Sutter now because in the last eight or nine days they've had eight games plus travel and no real practice hours to work with him? What's his record with us? Does anyone remember what happened on New Years Eve? Is he responsible for that?

Did Kompon call Toronto and tell them not to give us that goal so a very tired team could play 2-0 hockey for the second half of the game.

At least be clear headed about what's going on ....

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01-03-2012, 04:26 PM
  #99
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Let me ask you this, Richards and Gagne scored a goal like this and everyone was raving how it was about time because they had so much "chemistry" so Brown and Kopitar do the same thing, and there is no chemistry?
I don't really care to keep arguing this, but if you don't understand the difference between the two I don't know what to tell you. One was a tape to tape pass for a goal, the other was a player doing a wraparound that just happened to bounce to someone else.

"LOL" indeed.

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01-03-2012, 04:36 PM
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I don't really care to keep arguing this, but if you don't understand the difference between the two I don't know what to tell you. One was a tape to tape pass for a goal, the other was a player doing a wraparound that just happened to bounce to someone else.

"LOL" indeed.
LMAO a wraparound and a bounce?

NEvermind, now I know you don't know what the hell you are talking about...

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