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Old
01-05-2012, 03:21 PM
  #76
Laus723
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I'm sorry (not really), but if were not widely used and widely known that people actually slip on banana peels, then fine. Again, that has been around in some form since humans discovered bananas, I'm sure. It's used, every time, in a comedic way.

Racial? Joke.

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01-05-2012, 03:25 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Not at all surprised you're OK with this. Absurd. It's easy to slip on a banana peel, Subban went down fast, not racial. Period. People need to grow up? Toughen up?

And don't say different to me. Unless you were raised in a racially sensitive area and lived in this reality.

Trevor Daley and another black player came out and both said they have no idea how such a comment can be construed as racist.
uh. ok, i guess you win!!

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Originally Posted by PanthersRule96 View Post
Did you read my post correctly? Yes, I know why a banana can be construed as racist. How can you agree with me there when that was obviously a racist incident and disagree that there may have been some form of racial undertones implied with Barch's comment? Subban didn't think so, and most people probably don't think so, but there is a gray area, which is why it was called an insensitive remark. Only Barch knows in his own mind if he meant to provoke Subban by using a banana peel reference for anything other than falling. None of us will ever know the truth with that, and if Barch did mean that (I don't think he did), I'm sure he really regrets it now. Neither you nor I can make a definitive assessment. Because you or anyone else says it's not racist doesn't mean it's not so, same as if anyone says it is definitively racist. It was "insensitive," which is the word the league used. He was not sensitive to the fact that Subban was black in making that comment. That is true. It does not mean he is a racist, only that he was dumb in making that comment.
that's pretty much it, in a nutshell. very well articulated, PR.

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01-05-2012, 03:27 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
uh. ok, i guess you win!!



that's pretty much it, in a nutshell. very well articulated, PR.
No, it wasn't. At all. But thanks.

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01-05-2012, 03:35 PM
  #79
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didn't Grape Ape always slip on a banana peel? And he's PURPLE!!!

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01-05-2012, 03:55 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by adam graves View Post
Barch:

My intent, for my sake and my families sake, I never said anything racially driven or used a slur. I've looked on the internet and there are 700 related articles that say I said I used a racial slur. I have to deal with it, my wife has to deal with it walking the dog down the street, my dad."

Hard to say he's not tarnished. Hard to say the next time he's a FA the GM wont think twice.
This sucks big time. One can sense the agony in his choice of words. I feel bad for him. Weighs on him for sure, depressing.

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01-05-2012, 04:22 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
No, it wasn't. At all. But thanks.
now you're going to start a pissing contest over your opinion of a post? you're right, mr editor!

in fact, the league explained the decision clearly:

Quote:
"Mr. Barch has admitted making the remark, but denies that the comment was racially motivated," senior executive vice president of hockey operations Colin Campbell said in a statement. "While we accept Mr. Barch's assertion, as a player in the National Hockey League, he must be held accountable for making a comment that, in the context in which it was made, and in light of the entirety of the circumstances, was offensive and unacceptable."
and PR's explanation is very much inline with the ruling's wording but he's filled in additional holes with some anecdotes, assumptions and cultural bits. most commentators have either ignored this particular story or agree (go about 15 minutes into the podcast) completely. so it would appear that, aside from a few angry (non-black) fans here, most people have surveyed the situation and come away with the same conclusion (e.g., the ruling was correct).

let's just freaking move on already.

incidentally, kerry fraser had an interesting column on tsn about the the general subject today.

what i'd like to know is what happened to the jamaican part? somehow the comment being about subban's jamaican mom disappeared.

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01-05-2012, 04:45 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by panthertod View Post
didn't Grape Ape always slip on a banana peel? And he's PURPLE!!!
Best post of the day.

Thank you. I think it's unfortunate what happened to Barch but I think it's a lesson for him that he can always be misconstrued, so he should be careful.

On a related note, everyone should watch (on TSN) Brian Burke's press conference today talking about toughness in the league and how injuries are directly correlated with the league's attitude towards policing with suspensions rather than self-policing by players. Not saying that the league should tolerate any racism if there was clear intent, but in this case, as I'm sure with many others when players are trash talking each other - why can't the linesmen and refs let the players settle it on the ice? By giving him a misconduct, blowing it up into a media circus, etc. the league is just giving trash talking, hits to the head, etc. more attention than they deserve.

A suspension is not a more powerful disincentive than a serious beating.

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01-05-2012, 05:01 PM
  #83
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One - if Barch wanted to taunt Subban about falling on ice as if he slipped, what's the right metaphoric taunt?

Two - since Subban said he didn't hear anything, the league could have said the linesman was mistaken and not suspended Barch, which would have made the matter disappear faster.

Three - will there now not be a hearing about Cole's false and insensitive, racially charged accusation about a what a white player said to a black player? Charges of racism, harassment, etc. are serious.

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01-05-2012, 05:19 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
now you're going to start a pissing contest over your opinion of a post? you're right, mr editor!

in fact, the league explained the decision clearly:



and PR's explanation is very much inline with the ruling's wording but he's filled in additional holes with some anecdotes, assumptions and cultural bits. most commentators have either ignored this particular story or agree (go about 15 minutes into the podcast) completely. so it would appear that, aside from a few angry (non-black) fans here, most people have surveyed the situation and come away with the same conclusion (e.g., the ruling was correct).

let's just freaking move on already.

incidentally, kerry fraser had an interesting column on tsn about the the general subject today.

what i'd like to know is what happened to the jamaican part? somehow the comment being about subban's jamaican mom disappeared.
And that's what we're arguing, it's ridiculous. Plain and simple. I don't care whether you think it's OK or not. Why do always think you're the end all??

As a society, we want to end racism. Correct? As a whole, the goal is that we see a human being, not their color. Making such an incident suspendable, completely goes against that goal.

Barch likely saw a human go down quickly when Erik came up to him, and said to that human that it was like he slipped on a banana peel. The league should treat it as such. Instead, it cowered and looked at it as a white man talking to black one. Thus, doing absolutely nothing to help eradicate racism. "Sorry Krys, he's black and you brought up a banana..."

Ridiculous. I'm sure you'll give something else, though, cause you're always right.

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01-05-2012, 05:48 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
And that's what we're arguing, it's ridiculous. Plain and simple. I don't care whether you think it's OK or not. Why do always think you're the end all??

As a society, we want to end racism. Correct? As a whole, the goal is that we see a human being, not their color. Making such an incident suspendable, completely goes against that goal.

Barch likely saw a human go down quickly when Erik came up to him, and said to that human that it was like he slipped on a banana peel. The league should treat it as such. Instead, it cowered and looked at it as a white man talking to black one. Thus, doing absolutely nothing to help eradicate racism. "Sorry Krys, he's black and you brought up a banana..."

Ridiculous. I'm sure you'll give something else, though, cause you're always right.
ok. we have progress. let's simplify. the salient details are thus:
  • barch made a mean comment to a black man that involved the word banana
  • bananas are often used in racially tinged jokes about black people
  • as a consequence of the second bullet, our society in general proscribes the first and for good reason - such actions can be interpreted as offensive and hurtful

the league has stated that it doesn't matter what barch's intent was and, given the above, you can see why. it really doesn't make a difference. the comment should not have been made.

so what you're saying, based on the above, is that barch didn't know he was making the comment to a black person, correct? well, i don't think anyone really believes that for a second and barch certainly hasn't claimed that to be the case. yet, that's what your indignant line of defense is hanging on. good luck with that one.

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01-05-2012, 05:50 PM
  #86
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Tallon just stated that the issue was blown out of proportion and the matter is closed.

In Tallon we trust.

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01-05-2012, 05:54 PM
  #87
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The way this was handled was absolutely disgraceful. The league should have never let this drag along for so long, making Barch and his family suffer through this. The panthers owner should have never jumped to conclusions by making a ridiculous PR statement without any of the facts. And when the truth came out, not only should he not have been suspended at all he should be getting an apology.

His crime was insensitivity. This is a league where players are constantly trash talking and insulting one another, using all types of slurs, where the most storied franchise apologizes to the fans for hiring a non-french speaker, where players are allowed to beat each other's brains out for a five minute penalty -- and we are suspending and embarrasing a player and his family for being insensitive? They cleary stated that it was not racial but it was insensitive. If it was racial this would all be different but it clearly was not. What a disgrace. These are grown men playing a man's sport, let them be men.

Barch should sue the league for defamation of character. Viner better make a statement in support of his player, to make up for his buffoonish statement that he made. I am very proud of the way Dineen handled this from the start and how he responded at the end. Viner should learn soemthing from this as what he did was almost as disgraceful as how the league handled it. Barch better be embraced by the team after this, I would hope that our spineless owner doesn't push him out to make a point. He is certainly respected by his teamates and we need him.

Laus, I've had a busy day so I couldn't join or assist you but great job on the main boards making your points and trying to reason with such close minded individuals.

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01-05-2012, 05:55 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
ok. we have progress. let's simplify. the salient details are thus:
  • barch made a mean comment to a black man that involved the word banana
  • bananas are often used in racially tinged jokes about black people
  • as a consequence of the second bullet, our society in general proscribes the first and for good reason - such actions can be interpreted as offensive and hurtful

the league has stated that it doesn't matter what barch's intent was and, given the above, you can see why. it really doesn't make a difference. the comment should not have been made.

so what you're saying, based on the above, is that barch didn't know he was making the comment to a black person, correct? well, i don't think anyone really believes that for a second and barch certainly hasn't claimed that to be the case. yet, that's what your indignant line of defense is hanging on. good luck with that one.
What is wrong with using the word banana?

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01-05-2012, 05:57 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by adam graves View Post
Tallon just stated that the issue was blown out of proportion and the matter is closed.

In Tallon we trust.
Yes it was, and too bac our owner didn't handle it as well as the coach or GM did. I would love to see a statement from him. Will the owner be at the season ticket event next friday? This better come up.

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01-05-2012, 05:59 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
ok. we have progress. let's simplify. the salient details are thus:
  • barch made a mean comment to a black man that involved the word banana
  • bananas are often used in racially tinged jokes about black people
  • as a consequence of the second bullet, our society in general proscribes the first and for good reason - such actions can be interpreted as offensive and hurtful

the league has stated that it doesn't matter what barch's intent was and, given the above, you can see why. it really doesn't make a difference. the comment should not have been made.

so what you're saying, based on the above, is that barch didn't know he was making the comment to a black person, correct? well, i don't think anyone really believes that for a second and barch certainly hasn't claimed that to be the case. yet, that's what your indignant line of defense is hanging on. good luck with that one.
Of course he knew he was black, don't be ridiculous. And that's NOT what I was saying at all...horrible try.

-Bananas have been put together with going down quickly likely since someone slipped on one.
-It's been a comedic schtick for how long? See first point.
-He made a comment to someone who went down quickly that it was like they slipped on a banana.
-Had it been anyone else, this wouldn't be an issue.
-It's not someone else, it's a black player.
-Had the linesman not thrown Barch out, took the comment for how it was intended, this wouldn't be an issue.

--Barch was tossed because the linesman took it to be a potential racist comment. The league is on edge likely thanks to watch groups who've been revved up from the Simmonds incident.

Thus, instead of seeing this as Barch trying to get under Subban's skin and saying he slipped on a banana rather than oil, or outright calling him a turtle, they chose to act on a linesman's reaction.

They're being overly careful. I understand that. However, Barch and the NHLPA have a case to fight this should they choose to, but I'm sure it'll be let go.


Sorry, again not really, but the punishment that game should have sufficed enough. He wasn't allowed back after the first period. Time served, this is overkill.

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01-05-2012, 06:00 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by adam graves View Post
Tallon just stated that the issue was blown out of proportion and the matter is closed.

In Tallon we trust.
Zero thinks Tallon is wrong, though...apparently.

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01-05-2012, 06:06 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Zero thinks Tallon is wrong, though...apparently.
Some posters are better on the ignore list, you live a lot longer.

Btw I echo slick cat....fantastic job by you on the general board !

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01-05-2012, 06:10 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Slick Cat View Post
The way this was handled was absolutely disgraceful. The league should have never let this drag along for so long, making Barch and his family suffer through this. The panthers owner should have never jumped to conclusions by making a ridiculous PR statement without any of the facts. And when the truth came out, not only should he not have been suspended at all he should be getting an apology.

His crime was insensitivity. This is a league where players are constantly trash talking and insulting one another, using all types of slurs, where the most storied franchise apologizes to the fans for hiring a non-french speaker, where players are allowed to beat each other's brains out for a five minute penalty -- and we are suspending and embarrasing a player and his family for being insensitive? They cleary stated that it was not racial but it was insensitive. If it was racial this would all be different but it clearly was not. What a disgrace. These are grown men playing a man's sport, let them be men.

Barch should sue the league for defamation of character. Viner better make a statement in support of his player, to make up for his buffoonish statement that he made. I am very proud of the way Dineen handled this from the start and how he responded at the end. Viner should learn soemthing from this as what he did was almost as disgraceful as how the league handled it. Barch better be embraced by the team after this, I would hope that our spineless owner doesn't push him out to make a point. He is certainly respected by his teamates and we need him.

Laus, I've had a busy day so I couldn't join or assist you but great job on the main boards making your points and trying to reason with such close minded individuals.
Quote:
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Some posters are better on the ignore list, you live a lot longer.

Btw I echo slick cat....fantastic job by you on the general board !
Thanks guys. Did what I could.

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01-05-2012, 06:17 PM
  #94
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While both involve a banana (good lord that sounds ridiculous ), they are nothing alike.

Would someone throw a banana to taunt a white person?

Would someone joke about falling on a banana peel to a white person?

Barch used a common phrase to taunt an opposing player who happens to be black. I would argue that him making a conscious effort to speak differently to or in regards to Subban would have been more racist because at that point it is acknowledging a difference between them.
This. Every single one of you on here saying that Barch shouldn't have made the banana peel joke because Subban is black is advocating he treat him differently because he is black. That's racist. You all look at PK Subban and see a black NHL'er to be treated differently so as not to offend him. Krys Barch sees him as another NHL'er to be a total ass to to try and get under his skin. Which of those is racist it sure isn't Barch. Still can't believe he got a game misconduct and another game. Colin Campbell is a moron.

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01-05-2012, 06:20 PM
  #95
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This. Every single one of you on here saying that Barch shouldn't have made the banana peel joke because Subban is black is advocating he treat him differently because he is black. That's racist. You all look at PK Subban and see a black NHL'er to be treated differently so as not to offend him. Krys Barch sees him as another NHL'er to be a total ass to to try and get under his skin. Which of those is racist it sure isn't Barch. Still can't believe he got a game misconduct and another game. Colin Campbell is a moron.
Exactly what I'm trying to say.

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01-05-2012, 07:06 PM
  #96
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didn't Grape Ape always slip on a banana peel? And he's PURPLE!!!

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01-05-2012, 07:15 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by PBPantherfan View Post
This. Every single one of you on here saying that Barch shouldn't have made the banana peel joke because Subban is black is advocating he treat him differently because he is black. That's racist. You all look at PK Subban and see a black NHL'er to be treated differently so as not to offend him. Krys Barch sees him as another NHL'er to be a total ass to to try and get under his skin. Which of those is racist it sure isn't Barch. Still can't believe he got a game misconduct and another game. Colin Campbell is a moron.
I suspect that Subban feels the same way.

The suspension is the NHL's way of making this go away.
- No suspension -> articles about NHL insensitivity.
- Longer suspension -> articles about NHL players suspended for "racist comment".
- One game suspension... for "insensitivity"... boring and not worthy of prolonged attention or discourse.

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01-05-2012, 07:25 PM
  #98
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I suspect that Subban feels the same way.

The suspension is the NHL's way of making this go away.
- No suspension -> articles about NHL insensitivity.
- Longer suspension -> articles about NHL players suspended for "racist comment".
- One game suspension... for "insensitivity"... boring and not worthy of prolonged attention or discourse.
Eh, good point. I'm sure the NHL conferred with 'watch groups' as well. Still not a fan of it, though.

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01-05-2012, 07:58 PM
  #99
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I think I broke my skull by facepalming to hard.

What a d*** move by the nhl. I hope the referee feels like crap for probably ruining Barch career.
There are worst trash talk in a Pee-Wee league ...

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01-05-2012, 08:15 PM
  #100
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I think I broke my skull by facepalming to hard.

What a d*** move by the nhl. I hope the referee feels like crap for probably ruining Barch career.
There are worst trash talk in a Pee-Wee league ...
I doubt this ruins Barch's career.

I think most reasonable people see this for what it is.

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