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Trade Proposal Thread 4.0 - ***"Christian Thomas is the new Sauer+2nd" Edition***

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Old
01-06-2012, 12:06 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by TonyTheGr8 View Post
Yep, and the thought of Parise makes my mouth water, but I just don't think he is gonna jump ship for us the way Gomez and Holik did. Plus my wife might spontaneously combust if that we're to happen!


I think he is going out West. I could see the Rangers making a trade this off-season for sure though. They have some things to address but they need to keep the cost down.

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01-06-2012, 12:44 PM
  #77
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so are the Rangers gonna move EC for a AHL potential call up or what?

his cap hit is not alot but a waste. Its inevitable he gets waived prior to the deadline as Sather always seems to do that to make roster space in case of a deal........Voros for example was constantly waived just for the option of sending down.......same goes for Todd White( btw is he retired ? )

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01-06-2012, 02:32 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Tuomo Ruutu

Anisimov. Stepan. Gaborik
Ruutu. Richards. Callahan
Hagelin. Dubinsky. Fedotenko
Rupp. Boyle. Prust
I'm not sure I understand the point of bringing a player like Ruutu. In the case of this year's team, you either shoot high or don't do it at all IMO.

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01-06-2012, 02:37 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by xxxZENxxx View Post
I'm not sure I understand the point of bringing a player like Ruutu. In the case of this year's team, you either shoot high or don't do it at all IMO.
While I tend to agree, if the prime targets simply cost too much, then Ruutu, Whitney, Prospal would be adequate insurance policies and would only cost perhaps a 2nd round pick and a low level prospect.

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01-06-2012, 03:01 PM
  #80
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The one alarming thing this team needs is another top line winger. Dubi is a hit or miss.

Come playoff time does everyone feel comfortable that he'll be able to produce points and goals and make that 2nd line as dangerous as our 1st?

I certainly don't. What if he suddenly reverts back to how he was for the majority of the season? Additionally, I don't think he has very good chemistry on ice with Callahan and Richards. I'm not saying they don't have good chemistry in the locker room, but I just don't think they mesh well when they play together. Dubinsky's playing style disrupts the rhythm of that line.

Therefore we need another, more consistent (points producing), player to put on that 2nd line.

I'd love to get Bobby Ryan, however, his price seems too high. The strength of our club lies within our grit, and trading both Dubinsky and Sauer will hurt us in that department. Losing Dubi may not make that big of a difference because of our surplus of that type of player on offense, however, losing Sauer in addition will likely make us a weaker team, even if we are getting more talented offensively.

So then the trick becomes how to trade for a player, without losing a major component of our team. We all want the Rangers to make a run this season. Otherwise, losing both Dubi and Sauer for Ryan is a no brainer as we have replacements for both down the line, but don't have a player with the talent that Ryan brings.

If Anaheim decides to accept a trade, such as, Dubi, Thomas, Yogan, and a 1st... well that would be awesome. But that's wishful thinking and very unlikely. If you look at the trades for Richards and Carter this offseason you'll be able to gage what type of return the Ducks will seek, and it's a steep one.

In addition, no matter what happens with Ryan, the Rangers will certainly add a veteran - to try and mentor/guide/aid our players throughout the playoffs. Our team is very young, the more veterans we have, the better.

Therefore, it is conceivable that our 2nd line addition, will also come in the form of a veteran. Doan, Whitney, Iginla, maybe even Selanne (if he becomes available) would all be possibilities in my opinion (although some clearly more attainable than others).

To be real, as much as I've wanted Ryan, I don't think we're willing to give up the pieces to get him. As for Iginla, if we were to ever trade for him, it would come at the next trade deadline as he'll be a rental, won't cripple our cap for longer than half of a season, and will come cheaper than he would at this trade deadline. Shane Doan is having a down year, maybe even a sign that he's declining as a player. Seemingly every time we trade with Phoenix we get the worse end of the deal. He's not playoff hardened, he's not very gritty, he's aging and his play is declining. He's not a perfect candidate either. Whitney is a lot more playoff tested, seems to have more in the tank than Doan (despite being 4 years older), and would likely be cheaper to obtain than Doan in assets. And Selanne is not available as of this moment. He's the most appealing and could likely be had for just a draft pick.

Either way, I don't think we lose key pieces no matter the return. I'm not in favor for trading Dubi for the sake of trading him as I think he's a high end 3rd liner and brings grit thats integral to that line specifically. I'm not in favor for trading Sauer because he completes our defense going into the playoffs. High end pieces like Ryan don't always become available but for what the Ducks is it worth it? If we can get Ryan on the cheap then Sather is a trading God, however i'm fine with adding a veteran 2nd liner with talent instead, and keeping the players we have now going into the playoffs.

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01-06-2012, 03:02 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by xxxZENxxx View Post
I'm not sure I understand the point of bringing a player like Ruutu. In the case of this year's team, you either shoot high or don't do it at all IMO.
Disagree.

I'd say it's the opposite. If we continue this play up to the deadline you don't want to start breaking up the core for a Ryan. A guy like Whitney or Prospal will not cost a lot at all and could be a sufficient rental. If it's any rental i'd prefer Prospal back.

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01-06-2012, 03:06 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
The one alarming thing this team needs is another top line winger. Dubi is a hit or miss.

Come playoff time does everyone feel comfortable that he'll be able to produce points and goals and make that 2nd line as dangerous as our 1st?

I certainly don't. What if he suddenly reverts back to how he was for the majority of the season? Additionally, I don't think he has very good chemistry on ice with Callahan and Richards. I'm not saying they don't have good chemistry in the locker room, but I just don't think they mesh well when they play together. Dubinsky's playing style disrupts the rhythm of that line.

Therefore we need another, more consistent (points producing), player to put on that 2nd line.

I'd love to get Bobby Ryan, however, his price seems too high. The strength of our club lies within our grit, and trading both Dubinsky and Sauer will hurt us in that department. Losing Dubi may not make that big of a difference because of our surplus of that type of player on offense, however, losing Sauer in addition will likely make us a weaker team, even if we are getting more talented offensively.

So then the trick becomes how to trade for a player, without losing a major component of our team. We all want the Rangers to make a run this season. Otherwise, losing both Dubi and Sauer for Ryan is a no brainer as we have replacements for both down the line, but don't have a player with the talent that Ryan brings.

If Anaheim decides to accept a trade, such as, Dubi, Thomas, Yogan, and a 1st... well that would be awesome. But that's wishful thinking and very unlikely. If you look at the trades for Richards and Carter this offseason you'll be able to gage what type of return the Ducks will seek, and it's a steep one.

In addition, no matter what happens with Ryan, the Rangers will certainly add a veteran - to try and mentor/guide/aid our players throughout the playoffs. Our team is very young, the more veterans we have, the better.

Therefore, it is conceivable that our 2nd line addition, will also come in the form of a veteran. Doan, Whitney, Iginla, maybe even Selanne (if he becomes available) would all be possibilities in my opinion (although some clearly more attainable than others).

To be real, as much as I've wanted Ryan, I don't think we're willing to give up the pieces to get him. As for Iginla, if we were to ever trade for him, it would come at the next trade deadline as he'll be a rental, won't cripple our cap for longer than half of a season, and will come cheaper than he would at this trade deadline. Shane Doan is having a down year, maybe even a sign that he's declining as a player. Seemingly every time we trade with Phoenix we get the worse end of the deal. He's not playoff hardened, he's not very gritty, he's aging and his play is declining. He's not a perfect candidate either. Whitney is a lot more playoff tested, seems to have more in the tank than Doan (despite being 4 years older), and would likely be cheaper to obtain than Doan in assets. And Selanne is not available as of this moment. He's the most appealing and could likely be had for just a draft pick.

Either way, I don't think we lose key pieces no matter the return. I'm not in favor for trading Dubi for the sake of trading him as I think he's a high end 3rd liner and brings grit thats integral to that line specifically. I'm not in favor for trading Sauer because he completes our defense going into the playoffs. High end pieces like Ryan don't always become available but for what the Ducks is it worth it? If we can get Ryan on the cheap then Sather is a trading God, however i'm fine with adding a veteran 2nd liner with talent instead, and keeping the players we have now going into the playoffs.
For the last time, Dubinsky is not going anywhere in a deal for Ryan. Their salaries are almost the same. There's no way Anaheim would do that. If we get Ryan it will have to be some combination of Anisimov/Sauer/pick/prospect hopefully not Kreider but I wouldn't rule it out. They'd want CHEAP young players who can step in right away and make a difference.

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01-06-2012, 03:57 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by xxxZENxxx View Post
I'm not sure I understand the point of bringing a player like Ruutu. In the case of this year's team, you either shoot high or don't do it at all IMO.
Ruutu has 14 goals on a crap Carolina team.

Its quality of depth. Everyone talks up Boston like they're the greatest thing since sliced bread. Was Horton REALLY necessary when they already had Lucic and Krejci?

Ruutu fits this team's identity to a 'T'.

He brings an intimidating physical game. Intimidating because he hits as hard as anyone in the league with reckless abandon. And he hurts people. He's a tough as nails player with skill. Our team would be that much harder to play against. Our physical game can wear down an opponent.

And he can score.

It gives Torts more options.

And I see Ruutu as more then a rental. He's 28. We could/should resign him.

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01-06-2012, 04:42 PM
  #84
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DEADLINE DEALS
  • Prospal for a 2nd & one of Bickel/Parlett
  • Sarich for Zuccarello, one of Eminger/Strålman/Woywitka/Valentenko & a 4th (2013 3rd?)
  • Kotitsyn for Wolski & Yogan (we can add Christ?) or some other throw in
  • Otherwise - A 6th/7th/future considerations to NYR for christ (or he gets waived)

Prospal - Stepan - Gabby
Dubinsky - Richards - Cally
Hagelin - AA - Kotitsyn
Feds/Rupp - Boyle - Prust

Mitchell

alt

AA - Stepan - Gabby
Prospal/Dubinsky - Richards - Cally
Hagelin - Dubinsky/Prospal - Kotitsyn
Feds/Rupp - Boyle - Prust

Mitchell

Staal - Girardi
McD - Sauer
MDZ - Sarich

Eminger/Strålman

This then leaves all the "core guys" still with the team
And this also does not deplete the farm too much imo - iow We keep our best prospects
If this above proposal is enough to get these guys at the deadline - is however an entirely different question...

If and only if something like Dubinsky/AA, Sauer/Erixon, Thomas & a 1st are enough to get Ryan - it might be worth considering
Emphasize on the words "If" & "MIGHT"
Otherwise I would stay away from Bobby Ryan.
Burke is going to overpay to get him.

And I also think often mentioned names like Doan, Selänne, Iginla, Parise, Getzlaf, Perry, Suter, Nash & Whitney are not going to wind up in NYC - all for differing reasons.
At least not this year...
Hemsky, Gleason & Carter I want no part of
Ruutu, Moen, Gil & Påhlsson might be other secondary options (if reasonable) worth considering looking into as a Plan B

But I also think Glen might surprise the BeJesus out of us all...
I also unfortunately think that they might trade Hagelin as an important piece (not the main piece) in part of a bigger deal
His value is gaining momentum very rapidly...
Do not like this & do not ask me why - just got a feeling here...
Time will tell


Last edited by BBKers: 01-06-2012 at 04:47 PM.
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Old
01-06-2012, 04:45 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
For the last time, Dubinsky is not going anywhere in a deal for Ryan. Their salaries are almost the same. There's no way Anaheim would do that. If we get Ryan it will have to be some combination of Anisimov/Sauer/pick/prospect hopefully not Kreider but I wouldn't rule it out. They'd want CHEAP young players who can step in right away and make a difference.
You're not making much sense.

This is not a salary dump. Dubinsky would have to be included BECAUSE the salaries match up, not excluded. Anaheim has more cap flexibility than we do. To make it easier, without sending players down for us, we would send Dubi the other way. Anaheim is not strapped for cash so I see no substance to your claim that they wouldn't accept Dubinsky because of his salary.

Additionally, 4.2 mill for 1 more season is not expensive. It's moderate. He's certainly not cheap, but he's young, he's useful, can step in right away, and has a lower contract than Ryan.

And I don't care what the Ducks want. They might an entire team in exchange for Ryan, it doesn't mean they will get it. A realistic and fair trade, as i've stated before, would be Dubinsky, Sauer, prospect (whether that be Kreider, Thomas, Fasth, Zucarello, Mcilrath, or Erixon), and a 2nd or 3rd. If they want more they won't get it from us. If no other team offers them as much as the deal i've stated above the Rangers will have more leverage and thus possibly be able to negotiate Ryan's price down. You don't know what the market is for him, you don't know how desperate Anaheim's GM is to shake up their roster, you don't know how much they value our players.

What's been said before is that their GM values non-Russian players. That much can be proven, through his moves in the past. For whatever the reason he doesn't like to trade for them or sign them. So you can stop packaging Anisimov in every deal instead of Dubinsky. Your favoritism for Dubinsky won't keep him out of a deal if we're getting a better package in return. What's also evident is that our GM has a knack of coming out on top in trades. If there is mutual interest then a deal will get done and I doubt we get hosed. More likely the GM's can't meet eye to eye and Anaheim either deals him away to another bidder or keeps him in hopes that he can find the same success he's had in the past.

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01-06-2012, 04:50 PM
  #86
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there is no need to add to much. One rental LWer is enough

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01-06-2012, 06:40 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
The one alarming thing this team needs is another top line winger. Dubi is a hit or miss.

Come playoff time does everyone feel comfortable that he'll be able to produce points and goals and make that 2nd line as dangerous as our 1st?

I certainly don't. What if he suddenly reverts back to how he was for the majority of the season? Additionally, I don't think he has very good chemistry on ice with Callahan and Richards. I'm not saying they don't have good chemistry in the locker room, but I just don't think they mesh well when they play together. Dubinsky's playing style disrupts the rhythm of that line.

Therefore we need another, more consistent (points producing), player to put on that 2nd line.
Have we been watching the same games? Dubi disrupting the rhythm of that line? If anything, Dubi has made that line better and woke Richards up. Did you watch last night's game against FLA? and all the games since he was moved back on that line.

I don't disagree that we could use another scoring LW, but I just disagree with your assessment of Dubi.

Honestly, I don't want to disrupt the chemistry we have currently have. For so many years we've just thrown together and bought pieces praying that they would develop chemistry. Outside of the Straka-Nylander-Jagr line we never had the kind of chemistry we have now throughout the team.

I'm in agreement with the posters that suggest all we need is a rental (Whitney, Ruutu, etc) we can get with just prospects and picks.

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01-06-2012, 06:52 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by xxxZENxxx View Post
I'm not sure I understand the point of bringing a player like Ruutu. In the case of this year's team, you either shoot high or don't do it at all IMO.
my theory is this. Team is doing great so why F up the chemistry by moving a guy like Dubinsky for example

just keep this crew together and bring in a rental that wont cost a ton...........if you look at options Rutuu is one of the best options.........its not easy to get a Bobby Ryan

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01-06-2012, 07:13 PM
  #89
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You're not making much sense.

This is not a salary dump. Dubinsky would have to be included BECAUSE the salaries match up, not excluded. Anaheim has more cap flexibility than we do. To make it easier, without sending players down for us, we would send Dubi the other way. Anaheim is not strapped for cash so I see no substance to your claim that they wouldn't accept Dubinsky because of his salary.

Additionally, 4.2 mill for 1 more season is not expensive. It's moderate. He's certainly not cheap, but he's young, he's useful, can step in right away, and has a lower contract than Ryan.

And I don't care what the Ducks want. They might an entire team in exchange for Ryan, it doesn't mean they will get it. A realistic and fair trade, as i've stated before, would be Dubinsky, Sauer, prospect (whether that be Kreider, Thomas, Fasth, Zucarello, Mcilrath, or Erixon), and a 2nd or 3rd. If they want more they won't get it from us. If no other team offers them as much as the deal i've stated above the Rangers will have more leverage and thus possibly be able to negotiate Ryan's price down. You don't know what the market is for him, you don't know how desperate Anaheim's GM is to shake up their roster, you don't know how much they value our players.

What's been said before is that their GM values non-Russian players. That much can be proven, through his moves in the past. For whatever the reason he doesn't like to trade for them or sign them. So you can stop packaging Anisimov in every deal instead of Dubinsky. Your favoritism for Dubinsky won't keep him out of a deal if we're getting a better package in return. What's also evident is that our GM has a knack of coming out on top in trades. If there is mutual interest then a deal will get done and I doubt we get hosed. More likely the GM's can't meet eye to eye and Anaheim either deals him away to another bidder or keeps him in hopes that he can find the same success he's had in the past.
Sorry but it's just not realistic. Anisimov and Sauer collectively make 3 million. Trading Wolski for a 7th round pick to a desperate bubble team or sending him down creates more than enough room to add Ryan. Dubinsky isn't going anywhere.

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01-06-2012, 08:48 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
Sorry but it's just not realistic. Anisimov and Sauer collectively make 3 million. Trading Wolski for a 7th round pick to a desperate bubble team or sending him down creates more than enough room to add Ryan. Dubinsky isn't going anywhere.
I'm trying to say that the salary coming back to Anaheim is not necessarily a sticking point. It's not a salary dump.

Trading Wolski is no easy feat. That's not a given.

And again it's a tendency for the Anaheim GM to not take on Russian players. You can't neglect that for the hell of it. That's his own personal preference not to do this. I see no reason for him to break that so that we can keep Dubinsky.

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01-06-2012, 08:51 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
Sorry but it's just not realistic. Anisimov and Sauer collectively make 3 million. Trading Wolski for a 7th round pick to a desperate bubble team or sending him down creates more than enough room to add Ryan. Dubinsky isn't going anywhere.
And also, the point of a Ryan trade would be to have two complete offensive lines.

Removing Anisimov creates a hole. We'd still be incomplete, just on a different line.

He's not being dealt. We have a replacement for Dubinsky, not for Anisimov. You deal from your strengths, not your weaknesses.

What hurts us in the trade is losing Sauer, but it seems an inevitability if we're trying to get Ryan.

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01-06-2012, 08:59 PM
  #92
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so this Dubi character is starting to look good with Richards and Cally........Gaborik is scoring so they should keep Steps and AA with him

Still hope they get a top 6 winger but the current top 6 is looking good

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01-06-2012, 09:07 PM
  #93
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DEADLINE DEALS
  • Prospal for a 2nd & one of Bickel/Parlett
  • Sarich for Zuccarello, one of Eminger/Strålman/Woywitka/Valentenko & a 4th (2013 3rd?)
  • Kotitsyn for Wolski & Yogan (we can add Christ?) or some other throw in
  • Otherwise - A 6th/7th/future considerations to NYR for christ (or he gets waived)

Prospal - Stepan - Gabby
Dubinsky - Richards - Cally
Hagelin - AA - Kotitsyn
Feds/Rupp - Boyle - Prust

Mitchell

alt

AA - Stepan - Gabby
Prospal/Dubinsky - Richards - Cally
Hagelin - Dubinsky/Prospal - Kotitsyn
Feds/Rupp - Boyle - Prust

Mitchell

Staal - Girardi
McD - Sauer
MDZ - Sarich

Eminger/Strålman

This then leaves all the "core guys" still with the team
And this also does not deplete the farm too much imo - iow We keep our best prospects
If this above proposal is enough to get these guys at the deadline - is however an entirely different question...

If and only if something like Dubinsky/AA, Sauer/Erixon, Thomas & a 1st are enough to get Ryan - it might be worth considering
Emphasize on the words "If" & "MIGHT"
Otherwise I would stay away from Bobby Ryan.
Burke is going to overpay to get him.

And I also think often mentioned names like Doan, Selänne, Iginla, Parise, Getzlaf, Perry, Suter, Nash & Whitney are not going to wind up in NYC - all for differing reasons.
At least not this year...
Hemsky, Gleason & Carter I want no part of
Ruutu, Moen, Gil & Påhlsson might be other secondary options (if reasonable) worth considering looking into as a Plan B

But I also think Glen might surprise the BeJesus out of us all...
I also unfortunately think that they might trade Hagelin as an important piece (not the main piece) in part of a bigger deal
His value is gaining momentum very rapidly...
Do not like this & do not ask me why - just got a feeling here...
Time will tell
at this.

I think the best part of this is how much effort you put into this post, dressing it up all nice.

You do realize that the last 4 stanley cup champion teams have only made 1 deadline deal at the most. The Rangers are not going to make 4 trades come deadline day. And why the hell do we want Sarich? Please God explain that one to me. All the defensemen you're ready to deal for him are BETTER than he is and have been better all year. You're making trades for no reason. I dont see why MTL deals us Kostitsyn. Oh because we as fans like Yogan even though other teams may not see too much there. And MTL doesnt need Wolski. They arent gona just do us a favor and take an expiring contract so we can have Kostitsyn who has been better the last couple years.

The only move I agree with is the Christensen move. That's the only one that makes sense. Well Prospal as well as a plan D or E. He shouldnt be the first option or even 2nd, 3rd option. I also think a 2nd round pick and a player is too much for an aging prospal who has had knee problems.


Last edited by RGY: 01-06-2012 at 09:12 PM.
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01-06-2012, 09:13 PM
  #94
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so this Dubi character is starting to look good with Richards and Cally........Gaborik is scoring so they should keep Steps and AA with him

Still hope they get a top 6 winger but the current top 6 is looking good
Man, that Dubi guy really disrupts the rhythm of that line, horrible chemistry...

Glad we're not the GM or coaches of this team.

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01-06-2012, 09:19 PM
  #95
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Would love a Ruutu or Whitney at the deadline. Natural left wingers which we need and the former could easily be resigned after this year since he fits what we want.

Prospal wouldn't be a bad choice either at all though I can't see Sather trading for him knowing he'd admit he was wrong in letting him go in the offseason to begin with and having to give even some assets to get him back.

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01-06-2012, 09:23 PM
  #96
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Dubinksy is getting real hot. Bet his trade value is getting better by the day ... just sayin'

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01-06-2012, 09:25 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Rangerfan4life90 View Post
Would love a Ruutu or Whitney at the deadline. Natural left wingers which we need and the former could easily be resigned after this year since he fits what we want.

Prospal wouldn't be a bad choice either at all though I can't see Sather trading for him knowing he'd admit he was wrong in letting him go in the offseason to begin with and having to give even some assets to get him back.
Prospal is a safe bet just cause he knows the system, fits in the dressing room. Worse case he would be a nice rental. He could start on the 3rd line and play with Gabs if need be

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01-06-2012, 09:33 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Vitto79 View Post
Prospal is a safe bet just cause he knows the system, fits in the dressing room. Worse case he would be a nice rental. He could start on the 3rd line and play with Gabs if need be
I'm fine with this idea but no reason to rush into it. Let's see if his knee can hold up another two months and if they can get him for something like Zuc and a 3rd similar to the McCabe trade.

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01-06-2012, 09:45 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by White Plains Batman View Post
I'm fine with this idea but no reason to rush into it. Let's see if his knee can hold up another two months and if they can get him for something like Zuc and a 3rd similar to the McCabe trade.
agreed. I doubt he's the first choice. The FA rental list for wingers is not that great. Whitney may not even move if the Yotes are in the hunt and Rutuu will attract a ton of interest

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01-06-2012, 10:10 PM
  #100
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Prospal Stepan Gaborik
Ryan Richards Callahan
Hagelin Dubinsky Fedotenko
Rupp Boyle Prust
Mitchell

Staal Girardi
McDonagh Del Zotto
Bickel Stralman
Eminger
Erixon

Lundqvist
Biron



Anisimov, Sauer, 1st for Ryan
2nd for Prospal


I'd be very confident going to war with that lineup. I even like the idea of Erixon-Stralman as the bottom pair a year from now. And before someone makes a fuss about it, I really don't think it's that big of a deal having one defenseman (either McDonagh or DZ) playing their off-side at even strength.

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