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01-10-2012, 01:32 PM
  #51
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Bickel adds that "jam" Torts is always talking about. He can be serviceable in limited action, especially against more physical teams.

Still not sure hes a full-time NHL'er - sample size has been too small.

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01-10-2012, 01:48 PM
  #52
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Not sure that Sauer is a top 4 guy with us anymore. Probably on most every other NHL team but MDZ has certainly moved up so in my mind our top 4 are Staal, Girardi, McDonagh and Del Zotto.

Considering Erixon is close and McIlrath probably a couple years away--the Rangers could easily do a trade. Kind of wondering what kind of return we could get for Mike Sauer. Tuomu Ruuttu came up the other day. I'm not sure what Ruuttu's contract situation is but he's got good size and a scoring touch, can play a gritty and nasty game.
Sauer IS a top four guy, even with the Rangers.

People are forgetting how near flawless he is in the defensive zone.

Stralman has played well, but going down the stretch and into the playoffs, Del Zotto should NOT be getting top four minutes with a player like Stralman. I don't know if I trust Stralman in a playoff situation in that spot.

McDonagh. Girardi
Del Zotto. Sauer
Staal. Stralman/Bickel/Eminger

If Staal is ready for the minutes, then:

Staal. Girardi
McDonagh. Sauer
Del Zotto. Bickel/Stralman/Eminger

Back to what's worked in the past. Those are our best four defenders to put against top offensive players to shut them down. Del Zotto pairing against lesser players where he can exploit them with his offensive skills.

And if Sauer were to be traded, it better be for an elite player, not Ruutu. That's when you trade for Ryan.

But, it would be unwise to trade Sauer.

Sauer is incredible defensively. We have been spoiled, and we have forgotten how good he is.

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01-10-2012, 01:58 PM
  #53
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Nice to have depth. Really nice, actually.

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01-10-2012, 02:16 PM
  #54
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I do not think it is so cut and dry. The one who is playing the best gets to be the #6defenseman. Bickel has not only not done a thing that warrants a seat on the bench, he has actually managed to open an eye or two.

Not sure that I agree that eminger was that much better than either Stralman or Bickel. Or if he was, it was not noticiably so. Right now, when Sauer comes back, one of Stralman or Bickel is going to sit. When Eminger comes back, he needs for whomever is in teh lineup, to play his way out. Much like Wolski is waiting on Mitchell to do.
Yeah I agree, but that doesn't mean he doesn't get sent down. By that logic we'd be playing with 9 forwards and 9 defenseman. Torts likes Eminger, he's established as well, and before he was injured was playing way better then Stu is playing now, which is good.

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01-10-2012, 02:22 PM
  #55
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Seems like Woywitka is the odd man out, but that assumes Eminger and Sauer eventually get healthy, no one else gets hurt and you don't make any acquisitions. A lot could change in a very short time.



Still not sure why Stralman get's so little respect around here. 1-5-6 in 16 games with almost no time on the PP. +11 and on the ice for only 2 goals against as a Ranger. Upwards of 22 minutes on most nights, a # Sauer hasn't topped all season. This is the guy that people want to rotate in and out of the lineup?
I know, it baffles me too.. I think it's because he's not a one-dimensional brute like Eminger (Joking! Even though it's not far from the truth)

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01-10-2012, 02:26 PM
  #56
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The Rangers have an almost unnecessary amount of defensive depth and it only showed because of an unlikely number of injuries. The depth guys that were picked up late, Woywitka and Stralman, aren't really tradeable, but the team could safely trade one of the top five guys and still have solid defense. They're all pretty much fan favorites, but with Erixon and McIlrath looking to crack the roster in a year or two, it would be smart to move one of the guys for a strong two-way forward. It's unrealistic to expect a superstar like Ryan, but another second liner would really solidify their ability to roll four lines, which can help beat the Bruins (their #1 challenge in the long run) who can dominate by doing the same thing.

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01-10-2012, 02:33 PM
  #57
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Right now, I'd much rather see Stralman in the lineup than either Eminger or Bickel. Stralman has been better than any of us could have hoped for. He adds a dimension to the team's play that they sorely needed: another guy with vision handling the puck. Eminger and Bickel are fine, but their contributions aren't as necessary given the makeup of the team.

Staal, Girardi, McDonagh, Sauer, Del Zott, Stralman is the best six the Rangers can put out on the ice right now. Hold on to Eminger and Bickel, to be sure, but I want #32 lacing them up most nights, as long as he keeps playing the way he has been.

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01-10-2012, 02:41 PM
  #58
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Right now the multitude of capable players on the defense is a good problem to have.

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01-10-2012, 02:53 PM
  #59
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LB has really been on his game recently. But I didn't understand it when he said Bickel has to go through waivers to get sent down because he played ten games? Can anyone clarify that?

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01-10-2012, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
LB has really been on his game recently. But I didn't understand it when he said Bickel has to go through waivers to get sent down because he played ten games? Can anyone clarify that?
I believe it's because he's over 25.

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01-10-2012, 03:27 PM
  #61
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I think you've got to hold onto all 8 of them (sans Woywitka I guess) for the playoffs. You never know when you're gonna need depth on the backend and at this point they've all proven they can play pretty well.

I didn't realize Bickel would need waivers, so I was originally thinking the best thing to do would be to stash him in the minors once everyone was healthy and hold onto Woywitka, but we still need Eminger and Sauer to come back so there is time for this to work out.

I also don't want to start taking ice-time from Del Zotto now that he's playing like a legitimate top-4 d-man and putting up points 5 on 5. If you put him and Stralman on the 3rd pair once Staal and Sauer are back to 100%, I'd really hope Torts rolls all 3 pairs much more evenly then we're seeing now.

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01-10-2012, 03:35 PM
  #62
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I believe it's because he's over 25.
It is because he will cross over the games threshold.

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01-10-2012, 03:36 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by NYR Sting View Post
He adds a dimension to the team's play that they sorely needed: another guy with vision handling the puck. Eminger and Bickel are fine, but their contributions aren't as necessary given the makeup of the team.
See, and I think it is the other way around. Bickel adds the dimension that makes the team better and harder to play against. Stralman does have vision, but Girardi, MDZ, McDonagh and Staal are all capable of moving the puck to one degree or another. Bickel adds something that others do not. Plus, and I am in no way touting his offensive prowers, he seems to know how to get his shot (for what it is worth) on goal>

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01-10-2012, 03:37 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by NYR Sting View Post
Right now, I'd much rather see Stralman in the lineup than either Eminger or Bickel. Stralman has been better than any of us could have hoped for. He adds a dimension to the team's play that they sorely needed: another guy with vision handling the puck. Eminger and Bickel are fine, but their contributions aren't as necessary given the makeup of the team.

Staal, Girardi, McDonagh, Sauer, Del Zott, Stralman is the best six the Rangers can put out on the ice right now. Hold on to Eminger and Bickel, to be sure, but I want #32 lacing them up most nights, as long as he keeps playing the way he has been.
Agreed, Stralman has earned his spot.

But a big part of the 6 you give is Sauer's ability to return this season. Heard he's having light workouts, which is a good sign, but the guy took one hell of a shot.

If Stralman's play does come back down to earth, I could see him being swapped with Eminger/Bickel depending on the opponent.

But right now? Yea, he should be playing against anybody (even if the backline was 100% healthy)

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01-10-2012, 03:40 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Agreed, Stralman has earned his spot.

But a big part of the 6 you give is Sauer's ability to return this season. Heard he's having light workouts, which is a good sign, but the guy took one hell of a shot.

If Stralman's play does come back down to earth, I could see him being swapped with Eminger/Bickel depending on the opponent.

But right now? Yea, he should be playing against anybody (even if the backline was 100% healthy)
Rather see Bickel in the line-up come the post season than Stralman... Not overly impressed with Stralman's play in his own zone... I think he will get flustered/overwhelmed when the post season intensity ramps up.

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01-10-2012, 03:44 PM
  #66
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It is because he will cross over the games threshold.
The games threshold is different for different aged players.

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01-10-2012, 03:49 PM
  #67
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but with Erixon and McIlrath looking to crack the roster in a year or two
That maybe rather optimistic. I like them both, but McIlrath is more than a year or two away. And Erixon, whom I like as well, looked rather timid and a bit lost. Before we start to move young defensemen, how are still improving and also proving themselves (always a needed commodity), there had better be players that are ready to step into their role on the team. I am in absolutely no hurry to trade any of the defensemen.

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01-10-2012, 03:58 PM
  #68
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Rather see Bickel in the line-up come the post season than Stralman... Not overly impressed with Stralman's play in his own zone... I think he will get flustered/overwhelmed when the post season intensity ramps up.
I agree.

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01-10-2012, 05:00 PM
  #69
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Bickel gives us a dimension that no one else on our D really does. We've got guys who are strong and physical--Girardi, Sauer etc. but Bickel has an orneriness the others really don't match.

OTOH not as much has been asked of him yet and I'm not sure he is a guy who is ready to step up to top 4 minutes--something both Stralman has done very well and Eminger pretty well. In one of the 24/7 episodes Torts calls out Stralman--tells the team that there is a reason that Eminger had become a regular in the lineup and it wasn't because he looked pretty out there.--basically it was because he competed.

Decisions eventually are going to have to be made--whether this season or in the off season. All of Stralman, Bickel, Eminger and Woywitka are in contract years. Erixon may be ready to go next season. If I had to rank them at this point: 1. Stralman--he's been playing top 4 is putting up impressive +/- stats with Del Zotto--moves the puck the best of the whole bunch. Not all that physical but now and again throws a big hit--more importantly he's not avoiding hits and not many pucks have been going in the Rangers net when he's on the ice. 2. Bickel--size, toughness, slots in well as a physical no-nonsense inexpensive bottom pairing guy. 3. Eminger--a bit older but competitive, can step up to more responsibility and ice time if needed. Knows the system and his teammates--willing to accept whatever role he's given. 4. Woywitka--serviceable bottom pairing/spare. Not a disaster in his own end--but the most limited of the group.

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01-10-2012, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Sauer IS a top four guy, even with the Rangers.

People are forgetting how near flawless he is in the defensive zone.

Stralman has played well, but going down the stretch and into the playoffs, Del Zotto should NOT be getting top four minutes with a player like Stralman. I don't know if I trust Stralman in a playoff situation in that spot.

McDonagh. Girardi
Del Zotto. Sauer
Staal. Stralman/Bickel/Eminger

If Staal is ready for the minutes, then:

Staal. Girardi
McDonagh. Sauer
Del Zotto. Bickel/Stralman/Eminger

Back to what's worked in the past. Those are our best four defenders to put against top offensive players to shut them down. Del Zotto pairing against lesser players where he can exploit them with his offensive skills.

And if Sauer were to be traded, it better be for an elite player, not Ruutu. That's when you trade for Ryan.

But, it would be unwise to trade Sauer.

Sauer is incredible defensively. We have been spoiled, and we have forgotten how good he is.
Everything you say is accurate, but while Sauer is awesome defensively, I feel it's only a matter of time before his career is cut short. His two brothers, and father have all had pro sports careers ended prematurely due to chronic injuries. It was a big concern of mine before this season, and now he's had a concussion, and it looked like a severe one. Well see how long it takes for him to get back and if he can play at the same level, but if we can move him as a key piece in a deal for someone like Ryan, I'd jump on it and run.

Edit: I was wrong. He has THREE brothers who were forced into early retirement due to injury.

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01-10-2012, 05:38 PM
  #71
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The playoffs are a different beast then the regular season . I think we have to keep Bickel around for some very important games versus the more physical teams between now and year end . If we lose Woywitka along the way...so be it...it happens and he helped get us over a hurdle which was all he was intended for . Bickel was brought into this organization for a purpose...nastiness !!! Well , we want him for those games and also to ride shotgun for Staal while he gets his game back up to speed .

If worse came to worse we could dress an extra Dman for some games if we think we might need Bickel for a couple of bouts or whatever . I can't see why we can't sit out a Mitchell or Feds and give their icetime to a few more guys like Hagelin/Richards/Dubi/Boyle or others . I'm sure the forwards could live with the extra ice unless we get into a bunch of BB games .

It's just a thought to get ice for 7 guys on the Blueline and not rush Staal whatsoever ...what do you guys think ???

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01-10-2012, 06:12 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
LB has really been on his game recently. But I didn't understand it when he said Bickel has to go through waivers to get sent down because he played ten games? Can anyone clarify that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
I believe it's because he's over 25.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NvincentYvalentineR View Post
It is because he will cross over the games threshold.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
The games threshold is different for different aged players.
Honestly, in thinking about this a little more, I'm not sure why Brooks claimed that.

The Rangers had to waive Bickel at the beginning of the season, too, and he hadn't played a single game yet at that point. Maybe this has to do with the "emergency" nature of his call-up, which might be why he didn't have to clear to come up. Honestly, I'm too tired to dig into this right now.

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01-10-2012, 06:55 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Honestly, in thinking about this a little more, I'm not sure why Brooks claimed that.

The Rangers had to waive Bickel at the beginning of the season, too, and he hadn't played a single game yet at that point. Maybe this has to do with the "emergency" nature of his call-up, which might be why he didn't have to clear to come up. Honestly, I'm too tired to dig into this right now.
A player that has cleared waivers doesn't have to clear waivers again in the same season until he has played 10 NHL games or has spent 30 days on the NHL roster.
Bickel cleared waivers after training camp, he will now have to clear waivers again if he were to be sent down after playing his 10th game.
He didn't have to clear re-entry waivers when recalled because he is on a two-way contract and his AHL salary is below 105k.

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01-10-2012, 08:58 PM
  #74
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I agree when Sauer's back that Bickel and Stralman should alternate depending on the type of team were playing. For example, against a team like Boston, Bickel will come in handy as a physical take no crap dman, that is also a very steady dman in his own right.

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01-10-2012, 09:02 PM
  #75
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I agree when Sauer's back that Bickel and Stralman should alternate depending on the type of team were playing. For example, against a team like Boston, Bickel will come in handy as a physical take no crap dman, that is also a very steady dman in his own right.
did you see how Bickel barely played in the 3rd period?

You send him to the minors and play Stralman or Eminger when healthy as the 6th

Woywitka is down eventually too. Sauer should be a few weeks away if he is symptom free

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