HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

2012 NHL Entry Draft Talk 2.0

View Poll Results: Which would you draft this upcoming summer?
Mikhail Grigorenko 53 42.40%
Nail Yakupov 54 43.20%
Other 18 14.40%
Voters: 125. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-12-2012, 12:32 PM
  #51
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
Galchenyuk makes me nervous. Missing a season might mean nothing, but it might have seriously warped his development. We don't know.

He should still be high up on the boards, but I'd put him behind Forsberg because of that. Still a top 5 guy for us considering we need to come out of this draft with forwards.
If you take a guy like him it has to be a high risk high reward, like if we have the 15th pick ot something...unless he comes back and looks strong at playoff time.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 12:53 PM
  #52
Roulin
Registered User
 
Roulin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Montreal
Posts: 4,235
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jabba11 View Post
Mikhail Grigorenko is still the prospect we should target the most in this draft. He is everything we need. But if he's not available, Alex Galchenyuk is definitely the player we should draft. Brett Connolly did only play 16 games and it didn't stop him from being pick 6th overall. And also, Galchenyuk is a much better prospect than Connolly.
The three players who were taken 7-9 are Skinner, Burmistrov and Granlund. IMO, the Connolly pick doesn't look great in hindsight.

Roulin is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 12:57 PM
  #53
NotProkofievian
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,715
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
The three players who were taken 7-9 are Skinner, Burmistrov and Granlund. IMO, the Connolly pick doesn't look great in hindsight.
Who's skinner, burmistrov, and granlund this year?

NotProkofievian is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 01:01 PM
  #54
Shutdown
Registered User
 
Shutdown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 863
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
If you take a guy like him it has to be a high risk high reward, like if we have the 15th pick ot something...unless he comes back and looks strong at playoff time.
Galchenyuk will be a top 5-6 pick regardless of his injury situation. Highly unlikely anyone has a shot at him outside the top 10.

Shutdown is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 01:02 PM
  #55
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shutdown View Post
Galchenyuk will be a top 5-6 pick regardless of his injury situation. Highly unlikely anyone has a shot at him outside the top 10.
I only see him going that high if he gets back on skates and shows he is "back".

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 01:15 PM
  #56
Roulin
Registered User
 
Roulin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Montreal
Posts: 4,235
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotProkofievian View Post
Who's skinner, burmistrov, and granlund this year?
Ha, that's the game! I wish I knew. Maybe they are dmen?

I just have some trepidation about long term injuries. IMO healthy players are less likely to have bumps in the road in their progression going forward. I remember Cody Hodgson being considered a can't-miss star before he got hurt.

Roulin is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 01:18 PM
  #57
NotProkofievian
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,715
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
Ha, that's the game! I wish I knew. Maybe they are dmen?
They are, and that's kind of the problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
I just have some trepidation about long term injuries. IMO healthy players are less likely to have bumps in the road in their progression going forward. I remember Cody Hodgson being considered a can't-miss star before he got hurt.
Cody Hodgson is no joke, either. IMO, having a prospect like him would be very good.

If Galchenyuk comes back and sucks the big one in the playoffs, then I agree, don't pick him.

...I just don't see that happening. If he comes back and plays like a 16 year old...well he's still better than almost all the 18 year olds this year.

NotProkofievian is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 01:20 PM
  #58
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotProkofievian View Post
They are, and that's kind of the problem.



Cody Hodgson is no joke, either. IMO, having a prospect like him would be very good.

If Galchenyuk comes back and sucks the big one in the playoffs, then I agree, don't pick him.

...I just don't see that happening. If he comes back and plays like a 16 year old...well he's still better than almost all the 18 year olds this year.
I would love to pro Hodgson away from vancouver for a couple veterans...that would be a good place and value for Cammalleri instead of trading him just for no good reason.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 01:20 PM
  #59
Jabba11
Hockey Lobby
 
Jabba11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,435
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
The three players who were taken 7-9 are Skinner, Burmistrov and Granlund. IMO, the Connolly pick doesn't look great in hindsight.
I'm talking about the fact that Connolly was taken that high even though he didn't play that much games during his draft year. AK46 too..taken 10th overall. So, it really depends on the team's projection of that player. Glachenyuk is much more skilled than Burmistrov and Connolly. And in this year's draft class, there aren't a lot of high end forwards.

Jabba11 is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 01:48 PM
  #60
Roulin
Registered User
 
Roulin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Montreal
Posts: 4,235
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotProkofievian View Post
They are, and that's kind of the problem.
Is it? It would be convenient to add a top forward prospect. But, if we can draft a future top pairing dman, who is better than Beaulieu and Tinordi, is that a problem? Trading a surplus of young, NHL ready dmen for team needs, should it get to that point, is not so difficult. We saw an example recently, with the Turris/Rundblad trade.

Roulin is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 02:27 PM
  #61
NotProkofievian
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,715
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
Is it? It would be convenient to add a top forward prospect. But, if we can draft a future top pairing dman, who is better than Beaulieu and Tinordi, is that a problem? Trading a surplus of young, NHL ready dmen for team needs, should it get to that point, is not so difficult. We saw an example recently, with the Turris/Rundblad trade.
It is necessary to add a top forward prospect. If we pick up a second first round pick, then absolutely, pick up someone like Koekkoek, or Ceci would be fine.

This is our year to get a top offensive forward in our system. Maybe a couple if Gauthier's got the sack to do it.

NotProkofievian is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 03:14 PM
  #62
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotProkofievian View Post
It is necessary to add a top forward prospect. If we pick up a second first round pick, then absolutely, pick up someone like Koekkoek, or Ceci would be fine.

This is our year to get a top offensive forward in our system. Maybe a couple if Gauthier's got the sack to do it.
If you start drafting for need you could end up with another Giroux-Fischer situation.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 03:24 PM
  #63
NotProkofievian
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,715
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
If you start drafting for need you could end up with another Giroux-Fischer situation.
Except there's no one with 106 points sitting behind him, and Galchenyuk isn't a flawed defenseman with a ****** attitude.

NotProkofievian is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 04:34 PM
  #64
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotProkofievian View Post
Except there's no one with 106 points sitting behind him, and Galchenyuk isn't a flawed defenseman with a ****** attitude.
What?

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 04:39 PM
  #65
NotProkofievian
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,715
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
What?
Sorry, 103 points.

Bringing up the Fischer-Giroux point is just a bad argument: multiple teams seemed to know what we didn't with Fischer. It wasn't a case of drafting for need. It was a case of making a really bad pick.

You might as well say "don't draft in a ****** way."

Galchenyuk isn't Fischer.

NotProkofievian is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 04:45 PM
  #66
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotProkofievian View Post
Sorry, 103 points.

Bringing up the Fischer-Giroux point is just a bad argument: multiple teams seemed to know what we didn't with Fischer. It wasn't a case of drafting for need. It was a case of making a really bad pick.

You might as well say "don't draft in a ****** way."

Galchenyuk isn't Fischer.
Not at all, it's a case of drafting for need and taking a player before he should be drafted.

In the first round you take the best player available, period. If you go looking for a specific position or type of player you end up gambling when you shouldn't. BPA is not guaranteed and there will still be busts, but at that point in the draft that's the best strategy.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 04:47 PM
  #67
NotProkofievian
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,715
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Not at all, it's a case of drafting for need and taking a player before he should be drafted.

In the first round you take the best player available, period. If you go looking for a specific position or type of player you end up gambling when you shouldn't. BPA is not guaranteed and there will still be busts, but at that point in the draft that's the best strategy.
Who is better than Galchenyuk at 7 right now?

NotProkofievian is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 04:54 PM
  #68
le_sean
Registered User
 
le_sean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Ottawa
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 15,060
vCash: 500
Problem with Fischer is he was the BPA to just one of our scouts. A lot of trust was put on that pick.

What the Habs need to do is pick the consensus BPA in the first round, then rely on scouting the get steals later. These first round players have been scouted by many people for years, it should often be a no brainer, especially in the Top 10.

i.e. It would be nice to get Galchenyuk, but Dumba has a higher ceiling, so you need to pick him. Deal with the surplus if it ever becomes an issue. At worst you might have 3 fantastic defencemen on your team with ELCs. Then you're laughing.

le_sean is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 04:58 PM
  #69
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotProkofievian View Post
Who is better than Galchenyuk at 7 right now?
Somebody who is healthy if he isn't.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 04:59 PM
  #70
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
Problem with Fischer is he was the BPA to just one of our scouts. A lot of trust was put on that pick.

What the Habs need to do is pick the consensus BPA in the first round, then rely on scouting the get steals later. These first round players have been scouted by many people for years, it should often be a no brainer, especially in the Top 10.

i.e. It would be nice to get Galchenyuk, but Dumba has a higher ceiling, so you need to pick him. Deal with the surplus if it ever becomes an issue. At worst you might have 3 fantastic defencemen on your team with ELCs. Then you're laughing.
For us to draft a player in round 1 I'm sure mutliple scouts plus the head scout would have seen him. For CHL players the GM would ahve probably seen him also.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 04:59 PM
  #71
NotProkofievian
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,715
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Somebody who is healthy if he isn't.
I didn't think you'd have an answer. I'm saying that, even if he was injured, I don't think there is a BetterPA.

NotProkofievian is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 05:15 PM
  #72
le_sean
Registered User
 
le_sean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Ottawa
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 15,060
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
For us to draft a player in round 1 I'm sure mutliple scouts plus the head scout would have seen him. For CHL players the GM would ahve probably seen him also.
You really think so? Maybe video clips, but I seem to recall something about lot of weight being put on that one scout in Minnesota. I'm sure several teams had watched him play, but how often do you think they make a trip to a High School game?

It just seems like one person probably really pushed for it, said it could be the steal of the draft and it ends up blowing up in our faces. I mean really, a Minnesota High School league? How can you honestly tell if they are a Top 30 17/18 year old in the entire world?

le_sean is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 05:16 PM
  #73
Shutdown
Registered User
 
Shutdown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 863
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Somebody who is healthy if he isn't.
You're letting his injury cloud your judgement way too much.

Shutdown is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 05:22 PM
  #74
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,404
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shutdown View Post
You're letting his injury cloud your judgement way too much.
Having a devastating injury at 17 if a pretty serious thing. You lose a year of important development.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
01-12-2012, 05:27 PM
  #75
Shutdown
Registered User
 
Shutdown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 863
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Having a devastating injury at 17 if a pretty serious thing. You lose a year of important development.
That's fine, but not every GM and head scout thinks the way you do. Someone will take a chance on him and it'll likely be in the top 5.

Shutdown is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:57 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.