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Sportsnet Magazine: Inside The Long Pathetic Fall Of The Once Great Canadiens Empire

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Old
01-13-2012, 07:16 PM
  #76
toshiro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsfan18 View Post
http://www.sportsnet.ca/magazine/201...en_age_of_qbs/

http://www.sportsnet.ca/magazine/201..._empire_joyce/

Just a heads up. The latest issue of Sportsnet magazine has a cover story on our Habs.

Unfortunately it's not under ideal circumstances.
Gordie Howe was up there with the Rocket.

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Old
01-13-2012, 07:17 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
Over the last 17 years, the Leafs have had more success than the Habs. They're also currently on the upswing. I mean, how can you laugh at them given how poor his franchise has been since 93?
Over the last 50 years, the Habs have had more success than the Leafs. I mean, how can you laugh at them (habs) given how poor your franchise has been since since 1967 ?

Our last cup is more recent than your's. Leafs haven't had ANY SUCCESS, the only success that counts is the Stanley Cup, anything short of that is a complete failure.

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01-13-2012, 07:19 PM
  #78
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If they say that about us...what about Toronto? LOL

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01-13-2012, 07:29 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Talks to Goalposts View Post
80 through 93 Montreal was consistently one of the top 5-6 teams in the league. Those 2 cups were entirely deserved. Any other franchise that's a golden age. In Montreal it gets dumped on because it wasn't the 70's or 50's. The talent they dealt away for nothing 95 on was what killed the franchise.
Sure they were deserved. But we weren't the best team in the league in either season by a long shot. Tell me you weren't shocked when we won.

We got lucky both seasons. Edmonton and Pittsburgh both fell out and we had a relatively easy road. Yes, we had some good teams but in those two seasons it was shocking that we won. The '89 team was actually the best of the lot. Too bad it was one of Richer's alternating bad seasons.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Born in 1909 View Post
If the kids here think the Cammy trade was bad... HA!

You should have lived through the Houle era and his bone-head Patrick Roy trade.
The things we've done this season remind me of the Houle era. It's happening again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by habsrule22 View Post
could be worse, you could be a Leaf Fan.
That's true.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
Over the last 17 years, the Leafs have had more success than the Habs. They're also currently on the upswing. I mean, how can you laugh at them given how poor his franchise has been since 93?
That's also true. But over the last six or seven years we've been better at grabbing the last playoff spot than they have. So uh, we win right?

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01-13-2012, 07:30 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by ReneBourque27 View Post
Over the last 50 years, the Habs have had more success than the Leafs. I mean, how can you laugh at them (habs) given how poor your franchise has been since since 1967 ?

Our last cup is more recent than your's. Leafs haven't had ANY SUCCESS, the only success that counts is the Stanley Cup, anything short of that is a complete failure.
50? This is the problem with Habs fans. Talking about the past. You know who talks about the past? Teams who haven't won jack in 20 years. You sound like a 49er and Cowboy fans.

I don't quite understand the arrogance. We are Columbus, Winnipeg, etc. Only diff is we have a rich and storied history that we can't seem to let go of. Lets make some new memories instead of looking back 20-30-40 years ago.

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01-13-2012, 07:31 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
Coming out of the lockout the Leafs had 16 players aged 32 or older and their GM was told by management he was not allowed to rebuild. That's what has taken them so long. Not until Burke took the reins and was given free reign were they allowed to rebuild. In 3 years he has completely retooled the roster and stocked the farm and you are now seeing the results. If he stays for a while, I'd get used to them being competitive.
Call me when they win something.

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Old
01-13-2012, 07:40 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by habsrule22 View Post
Call me when they win something.
Only if you call me when the Habs win something.

If you'd like it in a perspective that doesn't put you in a Leaf defensive stance, here you go:

Teams with fewer playoff rounds won than Montreal in the past 18 years

Nashville Predators
Florida Panthers
Los Angeles Kings
Minnesota Wild
Phoenix Coyotes
Calgary Flames
Atlanta Thrashers
New York Islanders
Edmonton Oilers
Columbus Blue Jackets

That's the kind of company you are talking about.

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Old
01-13-2012, 07:40 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Phil Parent View Post
It's scintilating enough for me.

Nobody *****ed when he made his **** so pompous.

I'm so tired of people puking on the team. This ******* makes us look like a meaningless franchise. Here's the truth: We are tops of the league in revenues, tops in tv ratings, tops in ad revenue, tops in ticket sold, salaries paid (Meaning mainly that we're not on the NHL's welfare program, but rather are paying thru the nose for ***** like Phoenix to live on), we have won more cups than everyone else, have more people in the hall of fame than anyone, we are one of the top franchises in the NHL, and the most storied franchise in sports.

Now, we are not so hot today. But, that doesn't change the above facts. The day this verbose ******* makes a similar article about how Ballard letting his employees touch children in Maple Leaf Gardens led to a 45 years Stanley Cup drought for the Leafs is the day I accept that the closing of the Forum and the language issue has ANYTHING to do with the team's current misfortunes. Which it doesn't.

Amateur hour in the office, sure. But not those ****ing reasons. And it doesn't date back this far. Gainey was able to recover the team from the Houle Administration and make it somewhat respectable. It dates back to when Gauthier, as the head of pro scouting and incumbent GM, advised we should get rid of all the crowd favourites and that we hire 3 smurfs as the core of the franchise. Period. Once your core averages 5'10" in 2010's NHL, you are ****ED!
And now Gauthier say "we realised we were too little" when he got Bourque and people forgive him for it, when he was the guy that put us in this mess.

We are the laughing stock of this league. And I hope they do more articles like this because management deserve all the crap they get.

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Old
01-13-2012, 07:43 PM
  #84
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While unnecessarily verbose, the article was somewhat catching once you skimmed through the initial portion. Unfortunately, it completely died the instant language because a topic. Afterward is amounts to one tired cliche after another. Once again the media just "doesn't get it."

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01-13-2012, 07:46 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Some good things, some ridiculous.
There is no empire in Mtl, this has been the case since Corey and Houle screwed everything up. Since then, mediocrity at best.
However, things are overblown because of the bad season.
It's been a while since the Habs have been champ but once upon a time they were the most respectable organization, they were the best at scouting, at analysing and developping players. They smelled passion, competition, leadership. The Habs were the best at running a magor league hockey operation.

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01-13-2012, 07:49 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
Only if you call me when the Habs win something.

If you'd like it in a perspective that doesn't put you in a Leaf defensive stance, here you go:

Teams with fewer playoff rounds won than Montreal in the past 18 years

Nashville Predators
Florida Panthers
Los Angeles Kings
Minnesota Wild
Phoenix Coyotes
Calgary Flames
Atlanta Thrashers
New York Islanders
Edmonton Oilers
Columbus Blue Jackets

That's the kind of company you are talking about.
There was a stretch before the salary cap that Toronto was spending over 20m a year more on salaries than Montreal. Toronto was among the top 3 or 4 spending teams before the saloary cap. Like I said before Toronto still couldn t get it right. Since the salary cap. well its not even close.

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01-13-2012, 07:49 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
Only if you call me when the Habs win something.

If you'd like it in a perspective that doesn't put you in a Leaf defensive stance, here you go:

Teams with fewer playoff rounds won than Montreal in the past 18 years

Nashville Predators
Florida Panthers
Los Angeles Kings
Minnesota Wild
Phoenix Coyotes
Calgary Flames
Atlanta Thrashers
New York Islanders
Edmonton Oilers
Columbus Blue Jackets

That's the kind of company you are talking about.
Made worse when you consider Nashville has at least been competitive and Florida, Los Angeles and Edmonton all look to be turning their luck around in the not too distant future. Even Winnpeg seems close to playoff success, although I am hesitant to predict it yet. Unless we fix our state of affairs quickly, Montreal is posed to emulate Toronto not Detroit, as everyone loves to claim the benchmark.

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01-13-2012, 07:50 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by HabsByTheBay View Post
The fact that Gainey was less than a qualified success tells me the organization's problems run deeper than just having a good GM, because Gainey was a top GM in Dallas. We need a whole organization re-evaluation and cleanout.
That has me still scratching my head. The guy has always been a model of leadership, of intelligence, of wisom of credibility. He has won everything he went, at every job he did whether it was with the Habs, the Northstar and the Dallas. He comes to the Habs as GM and all he did was basically fill the holes to prevent the rain from coming in.

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Old
01-13-2012, 07:58 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
Made worse when you consider Nashville has at least been competitive and Florida, Los Angeles and Edmonton all look to be turning their luck around in the not too distant future. Even Winnpeg seems close to playoff success, although I am hesitant to predict it yet. Unless we fix our state of affairs quickly, Montreal is posed to emulate Toronto not Detroit, as everyone loves to claim the benchmark.
As far as original 6 teams go, a lot of people on this forum want us to emulate Chicago, and be a league joke for a decade so we can have a lot of draft picks.

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01-13-2012, 07:59 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by habsrule22 View Post
There was a stretch before the salary cap that Toronto was spending over 20m a year more on salaries than Montreal. Toronto was among the top 3 or 4 spending teams before the saloary cap. Like I said before Toronto still couldn t get it right. Since the salary cap. well its not even close.
You responded to a post that had nothing to do with Toronto by talking about Toronto. It seems rather obvious that you aren't concerned with asking why the Habs are with the dregs of the NHL, rather you'd prefer to engage in a "measurement" contest and avoid the issue.

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01-13-2012, 08:10 PM
  #91
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It was March 11, 1996, the last game at the Forum, the last act of a masterpiece and the last time the Canadiens mattered.
Great, so the Habs should keep all their revenues to themselves then. I wonder how much they would matter then.

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Old
01-13-2012, 08:22 PM
  #92
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I think it's time for...

THE FINAL WORD

Saying that 1996 was the last time the Habs "mattered" is pure sensational garbage. Want proof that the Habs still matter and in a big way?

They are close to dead last and everyone is talking about them.

No team in all of pro sports save perhaps the Yankees are such a focal point of a sport, a league, and of other fans. Look at the Bruins -- they've dominated us for about five years and they just won a Cup and they STILL can't purge us from their system. Everything we do is cause for alarm with their fans -- every trade, every win, every loss. Why?

Because it's the Montreal Canadiens. We're the biggest thing in the sport, and always will be. That means jealousy when we do well, schadenfreude when we do poorly, but it always means that people care -- care deeply in fact -- about what the Canadiens are doing.

Is the club bad right now? Hell yeah. We're one of the worst. Our team is in disarray, we have bad contracts, and the ship needs to be righted in a big way. But even now in the bottom of the barrel with our hated rivals atop the leaderboard and with a Stanley Cup ring on their finger, they're still second fiddle to the Habs. And so is the rest of the league.

So call the Habs a crappy team, call the management incompetent, call Gauthier a jerk and Molson clueless. But don't ever try pretending that the Habs are irrelevant. Because that's just patently absurd.

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01-13-2012, 08:24 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
People keep saying this but if you looked at it, it would probably depress you more than the author's article.

It's been 18 years since Montreal's last championship.....almost 2 decades, which is longer than a player's career and longer than many people on this site have been alive.

Since then Toronto has missed the playoffs 8 times and only made it 9 times. Despite that, they have appeared in 21 playoff series and won 11 rounds while losing 9 for a success rate of .550.

Montreal has made the playoffs 11 times and appeared in 17 playoff series yet have only won 6 rounds while losing 11 for a success rate of .353.

Despite only making it 9 times, Toronto has won nearly twice as many rounds. When one thinks how badly Toronto has sucked and then looks at Montreal's "success", it truly puts into perspective how far they have fallen.


A TO fan cherrypicking stats. Now that's something new. Why stop there, why not count it since TO won THEIR own last cup, when I wasn't even born, when my own father was still a teenager. 45 friggin years ago. Let's count how many rounds won since then... I mean, that's just a little more than half the average lifespan.

And why cherry pick since the Habs last cup?? Why not count it since the new CBA?

How many teams have made the playoffs less often than the Habs since 2005?

24 teams...

How many times did TO go to the playoffs in the same span?

ZERO, ZILCH, NADA


Thing is, as a Habs fan, I can at least say I saw a cup win in the modern era. Can you say the same for TO, the supposed supremacy of hockey? To witness a cup win at the same age I saw one for the Habs, a TO fan would need to be 60 years old...

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Old
01-13-2012, 08:28 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
You responded to a post that had nothing to do with Toronto by talking about Toronto. It seems rather obvious that you aren't concerned with asking why the Habs are with the dregs of the NHL, rather you'd prefer to engage in a "measurement" contest and avoid the issue.
I ve responded to every post you made. You started by stating that Toronto had more play off wins than Montreal in the last 18 years. If you go look at the salaries teams were paying before the lock out. Toronto was in the top 3 or 4 teams in the league, were as Montreal was average to below average spending team. There was a stretch were Toronto was spending 20m a year more than Montreal. With that kind of advantage, you better have more success. But again, they couldn t get it right because they didn t win it all. They never even made the Finals. Since the salary cap, its not close.

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01-13-2012, 08:30 PM
  #95
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The only team ever to make news by having a bad season,gotta love those haters.Haters have to hate!

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01-13-2012, 08:32 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post


A TO fan cherrypicking stats. Now that's something new. Why stop there, why not count it since TO won THEIR own last cup, when I wasn't even born, when my own father was still a teenager. 45 friggin years ago. Let's count how many rounds won since then... I mean, that's just a little more than half the average lifespan.

And why cherry pick since the Habs last cup?? Why not count it since the new CBA?

How many teams have made the playoffs less often than the Habs since 2005?

24 teams...

How many times did TO go to the playoffs in the same span?

ZERO, ZILCH, NADA


Thing is, as a Habs fan, I can at least say I saw a cup win in the modern era. Can you say the same for TO, the supposed supremacy of hockey? To witness a cup win at the same age I saw one for the Habs, a TO fan would need to be 60 years old...
And when we got to see the Habs win it, it was on a Color TV.

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01-13-2012, 08:33 PM
  #97
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what they don't talk about, and what molson needs to figure out quickly, is that winning would cure everything very quickly (and not even an actual cup, just a few back-to-back seasons of the 2008 regular season success or the 2010 PO success).


if the habs were to build a contender, who managed to be a top-4 in the conference team for 4-5 years in a row, with a few deeper playoff runs (2nd/3rd round), let alone a finals appearance and/or cup, we'd quickly be a "hot" destination for players both young and old.

when you hear players talk about montreal, many of them speak of it as "the" place to play, even cammalleri in leaving seemed pretty sincere about the incredible "experiences" he had with the whole city behind the team... and all he did was win 2 playoff series in 2 1/2 seasons.

The problem is that aside from the '08 regular season, we haven't had a top-4 conference finish in years, let alone stringing together a few.

likewise, we haven't had consecutive playoff successes in over a decade.

Bring in the right management team, build the roster into one that among the top 20% (top 6-8 in the league) for a few years in a row, and the city will be absolutely electric. The players in place will love playing here and every other player around the league that comes in and gets a taste of it will start thinking "hey, i need to experience this to"...

starts with the leadership, until we get that right, we'll continue to suffer and montreal will continue to be a place that players avoid because of the negative experience of not living up to the legacy fans expect.


of course, if we were a contender for 3-4-5 years and didn't reach a final or win a cup, there would be a fair share of second guessing and pressure, and that would have it's own negative affects, but it would hardly match the excitment and optimism that would be present outside of the few weeks following a playoff disapointment.

heck, when is the last time we actually experienced a real playoff disappointment... even 08' didn't have that bitter of a sting, since we were in such shock about the fluky regular season.


Just win baby... winning cures everything.

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Old
01-13-2012, 08:39 PM
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingAvtsin View Post
I think it's time for...

THE FINAL WORD

Saying that 1996 was the last time the Habs "mattered" is pure sensational garbage. Want proof that the Habs still matter and in a big way?

They are close to dead last and everyone is talking about them.

No team in all of pro sports save perhaps the Yankees are such a focal point of a sport, a league, and of other fans. Look at the Bruins -- they've dominated us for about five years and they just won a Cup and they STILL can't purge us from their system. Everything we do is cause for alarm with their fans -- every trade, every win, every loss. Why?

Because it's the Montreal Canadiens. We're the biggest thing in the sport, and always will be. That means jealousy when we do well, schadenfreude when we do poorly, but it always means that people care -- care deeply in fact -- about what the Canadiens are doing.

Is the club bad right now? Hell yeah. We're one of the worst. Our team is in disarray, we have bad contracts, and the ship needs to be righted in a big way. But even now in the bottom of the barrel with our hated rivals atop the leaderboard and with a Stanley Cup ring on their finger, they're still second fiddle to the Habs. And so is the rest of the league.

So call the Habs a crappy team, call the management incompetent, call Gauthier a jerk and Molson clueless. But don't ever try pretending that the Habs are irrelevant. Because that's just patently absurd.
Exactly. I agree with everything here 100%

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Old
01-13-2012, 08:45 PM
  #99
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Lol @ people actually defending Toronto in this thread. Montreal never had that many years of straight futility EVER! Leafs have missed the playoffs 7 straight seasons and might miss it for an 8th time.

Even in the horrible late part of the century, the Habs never missed it so many times. Their longest stretch was 3 years not 7 rofl.

Also the Leafs haven't made te SCF in 44 years, their fondest memory since was 1993 when Montreal themselves won the Cup.

Leafs also missed the playoffs 4 straight years in the late 80's and 3 straight years in the late 90's.

Heck since 1996, the Leafs have made the playoffs only 6 times in 15 seasons (missed in 96, 97, 98, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 11. Made in 99, 00, 01, 02, 03, 04) That is absolutely brutal.

Don't ever defend the Leafs. They are known losers.

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01-13-2012, 08:49 PM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingAvtsin View Post
I think it's time for...

THE FINAL WORD

Saying that 1996 was the last time the Habs "mattered" is pure sensational garbage. Want proof that the Habs still matter and in a big way?

They are close to dead last and everyone is talking about them.

No team in all of pro sports save perhaps the Yankees are such a focal point of a sport, a league, and of other fans. Look at the Bruins -- they've dominated us for about five years and they just won a Cup and they STILL can't purge us from their system. Everything we do is cause for alarm with their fans -- every trade, every win, every loss. Why?

Because it's the Montreal Canadiens. We're the biggest thing in the sport, and always will be. That means jealousy when we do well, schadenfreude when we do poorly, but it always means that people care -- care deeply in fact -- about what the Canadiens are doing.

Is the club bad right now? Hell yeah. We're one of the worst. Our team is in disarray, we have bad contracts, and the ship needs to be righted in a big way. But even now in the bottom of the barrel with our hated rivals atop the leaderboard and with a Stanley Cup ring on their finger, they're still second fiddle to the Habs. And so is the rest of the league.

So call the Habs a crappy team, call the management incompetent, call Gauthier a jerk and Molson clueless. But don't ever try pretending that the Habs are irrelevant. Because that's just patently absurd.
Exactly! This guy is claiming the Habs are irrelevant, yet dedicates a long winded essay to bash us.

How many pieces like this do you see written about the Islanders, another once great team?

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