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Kaberle playing time

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Old
01-14-2012, 09:45 AM
  #101
PricePkPatch
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Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
His passes go to Subban to die. He is great on a powerplay but he gets no help. I think he is a fine 2nd pairing guy but not on a team that has it's best dman (gorges) babysitting Subban. Kaberle wasn't brough in to be tough, he is offensive dman with a good pass and that is why he only cost garbage.
That's a good point, sadly. If Subban regained his early 2010 shot precision, Kaberle would be on pace for a much better season.

Cammy and Subban having horrible shot precision all year long is sure one of the reason our PP sucked. At least PK still contributed a lot elsewhere, but it would impact badly Kaberle's stats

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01-14-2012, 09:48 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Commandant View Post
Kaberle is averaging over 18 minutes a night on the season... hardly the 5 or 6 that the poster is talking about.

Even dressing 7 D, he's been averaging over 13 minutes.


A 50 pt dman who plays 16-18 minutes for 4.25 million is a bargain.

If he was a 25+ minute man getting 50 pts, he'd be worth 7 million.
But that's what I don't understand. The Habs are losing and have this offensive wiz in Kaberle and he only gets 13 - 16 minutes. I don't care if there are 7 D. Are the Habs playing to lose? I would just think that when you're having trouble scoring you'd have your offensive weapons on the ice. He's being paid IMO to play at least 20 minutes whether there are 7 D or not. I mean supposedly he's the best offensive d-man the Habs have. But he just is not that good defensively.

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01-14-2012, 10:10 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
That's a good point, sadly. If Subban regained his early 2010 shot precision, Kaberle would be on pace for a much better season.

Cammy and Subban having horrible shot precision all year long is sure one of the reason our PP sucked. At least PK still contributed a lot elsewhere, but it would impact badly Kaberle's stats
I have been saying that all year. Recently they have changed things up and put Weber in his place.Hopefully somebody steps up to score a few from the halfboards(Plekanec?).

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01-14-2012, 11:55 AM
  #104
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Originally Posted by danyhabsfan View Post
He's not in shape.

He has trouble in the defensive zone and our PP isnt better with him.

He has couple secondary assist thought...
Our PP is better with him.

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Old
01-14-2012, 06:37 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Stop watching hockeydb.com, and start watching hockey games... he's not good enough defensively anymore to get earn enough minutes to put up that many points. That's about all I can help you with there, except to add/reiterate that "on pace" means nothing. No one gets credit for games they miss due to injury or suspension as they are realities of the game, and no one gets credit for games they haven't even played yet because anything (including prolonged slumps/illness/injury) can happen. I mean, we can't refer to Crosby as a 130 pt player, even though he was "on pace" last year, because he has never actually gotten above 120.

Thomas Kaberle was a 50 point defenseman. Now he's an offense defenseman who is a soft, defensive liability. If the talent is still there, maybe he can recapture some of his past glory, but the same thing was also said about Scott Gomez (who is in a comparable situation to Kaberle, albeit the forward version).
Quit looking at stats, and start watching games is the biggest cop out of an argument made on this forum, and its made every day. As if the people who spend time to write posts about a hockey team don't watch the games too. Its such a faulty assumption, its ridiculous to start by attacking me on this point.

The point is you've claimed he's declined, that he's no longer a 50 pt defenceman, and I don't know how else you'd define what is or isn't a 50 pt defenceman without looking at the numbers. Both the numbers and repeatedly viewing him since he became a hab doesn't support the assertion that he's no longer a 50 pt D.

He was never a defensive D of the quality that you want him against top lines. His defense was always a liability. Leaf fans never believed it, but he never was Markov who was capable of matching against top lines.

He is what he is... a guy who can put up points, and can play decent defence if you give him a physical partner and managed his matchups.

A 50 pt d who ideally plays 16-18 minutes per game and not against top opposition... thats what he was and what he continues to be.

If he was playing against the other team's best line and producing like that, he'd be 7 million dollar player, but he's not... nor is he paid out of line with what his contributions are.

Pts cost money. You pay for production under the cap.


Last edited by Beakermania*: 01-14-2012 at 06:59 PM.
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Old
01-14-2012, 07:56 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
Our PP is better with him.
Statistically its gotten worse.

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Old
01-14-2012, 10:02 PM
  #107
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Tonight, vs the Sens, Kaberle really puts the Ho in Horrible.

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01-14-2012, 10:07 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by raz123 View Post
Tonight, vs the Sens, Kaberle really puts the Ho in Horrible.
Cadbury is quickly leading Montreal to the worst PP in the league.

I actually miss the days of Diaz, Weber, Subban manning the point on the PP. Least they ran at a 26th ranked clip not a 30th ranked one.

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01-14-2012, 10:07 PM
  #109
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Not only should he has less playing time during the game. But less playing during the shootout would be nice too....

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01-14-2012, 10:08 PM
  #110
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Trade this useless soft bum back to the Leafs, unfortunately their GM isn't as stupid as ours!

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01-14-2012, 10:13 PM
  #111
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0-5 PP

looks like the PP fix Gauthier found us isn't really working... good thing we have another 2 1/2 years for him to start making a positive impact

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01-14-2012, 10:19 PM
  #112
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Souray
Streit
Schneider
Wiz
Bergeron

Still what the powerplay needed IMO instead of a PP quarterback (another one).


But the Habs keep shoving those players aside. Gauthier learned that perhaps should have some bigger bodies so maybe he'll figure out this PP thing too - sometime. Have no idea when.

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Old
01-14-2012, 10:30 PM
  #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
0-5 PP

looks like the PP fix Gauthier found us isn't really working... good thing we have another 2 1/2 years for him to start making a positive impact
Somewhere Jim Rutherford is pouring a glass of Scotch & saying, whew thank the Lord Pierre Gauthier is a fool.

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Old
01-14-2012, 10:35 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Habs23 View Post
Somewhere Jim Rutherford is pouring a glass of Scotch & saying, whew thank the Lord Pierre Gauthier is a fool.
and what's worse, it's probably one of these:

http://simplyscotches.blogspot.com/2...-in-world.html

his owner feeling generous given how much money he saved the team...


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01-14-2012, 10:40 PM
  #115
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Kab is useless and was not what we needed in the first place.

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Old
01-15-2012, 01:25 AM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirk Muller View Post
Cadbury is quickly leading Montreal to the worst PP in the league.

I actually miss the days of Diaz, Weber, Subban manning the point on the PP. Least they ran at a 26th ranked clip not a 30th ranked one.
Even Pleks scored a goal from the point.

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01-15-2012, 01:32 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
Our PP is better with him.
yet where are the PP goals the lst while? i doint even notice kaberle while he isnt making huge mistakes he isnt doing much to really help- thats why i didnt understand that trade he wasnt going to getr the team on a winning streak

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01-15-2012, 01:37 AM
  #118
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Used properly with the right partner and Kaberle becomes a solid contributor. My ideal defensive lineup.

Markov - Gorges
Kaberle - Defensive stalwart
Emelin - Subban
Diaz

Essentially, we need a Gorges clone and we'd have a cup contending D.

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Old
01-15-2012, 02:13 AM
  #119
larek
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
Used properly with the right partner and Kaberle becomes a solid contributor. My ideal defensive lineup.

Markov - Gorges
Kaberle - Defensive stalwart
Emelin - Subban
Diaz

Essentially, we need a Gorges clone and we'd have a cup contending D.
LOL!!!

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Old
01-15-2012, 02:28 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Commandant View Post
Quit looking at stats, and start watching games is the biggest cop out of an argument made on this forum, and its made every day. As if the people who spend time to write posts about a hockey team don't watch the games too. Its such a faulty assumption, its ridiculous to start by attacking me on this point.
You say this, but be honest, how many non-Habs related games do you watch per week? Sure, admittedly I've assumed that you're someone who possibly watches one (maybe two) non-Habs related game a week if he's lucky, so let me know if I've made a faulty assumption. It just sounds like your expectations/beliefs in Kaberle's abilities are stuck in '05/06 - which would be natural if you really haven't seen that much of him between then and now, and just notice that the points keep coming in.

And to answer your question, "50 points defenseman" is a label used either in hindsight referring to seasons where that was actually achieved, or with regard to a player who realistically could be expected to meet that mark without extraordinary circumstances. I simply say that Kaberle has been lucky to get the ice time that he has in the past couple of years (enabling him to get those points), and submit that he is the former not the latter. Having to compete with Kubina, Finger, and Van Ryn, etc for ice time (Schenn having a unique role among Maple Leaf defenders as a "true shutdown defender" - thus not competition for icetime) led to lots of opportunities to end up connected to scoring plays via 2nd assists, but he has looked pretty ineffective, to me, for a while.

Now that he plays in front of this fan base on the regular, I expect visions of immediately post-lockout Kaberle to disappear naturally, but understand that it may take some longer to admit/realize it than others; one way or the other.

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01-15-2012, 02:35 AM
  #121
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When PG talked to the media after the Kaberle trade. He looked like a kid in a candy store grinning from ear to ear like he stole an elite player. The rest of the GM's in the league must have thought PG is a complete jackass for taking Kaberle.

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01-15-2012, 02:42 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
Our PP is better with him.
Come on Natey, you don't actually believe that? Between your love of Breezy and now Kabs, I really wonder about you sometimes.

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Old
01-15-2012, 02:44 AM
  #123
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
Used properly with the right partner and Kaberle becomes a solid contributor. My ideal defensive lineup.

Markov - Gorges
Kaberle - Defensive stalwart
Emelin - Subban
Diaz

Essentially, we need a Gorges clone and we'd have a cup contending D.
Markov is not coming back people. Just face it.

Another stupid signing by PG!

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Old
01-15-2012, 02:45 AM
  #124
Maliki2
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Originally Posted by LastRide View Post
When PG talked to the media after the Kaberle trade. He looked like a kid in a candy store grinning from ear to ear like he stole an elite player. The rest of the GM's in the league must have thought PG is a complete jackass for taking Kaberle.
Most of the GM's in the league already knew that PG was a ****ing idiot. This just proves it.

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Old
01-15-2012, 03:36 AM
  #125
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Originally Posted by Maliki2 View Post
Most of the GM's in the league already knew that PG was a ****ing idiot. This just proves it.
There's an entire thread with people defending him. Some going so much as to say he's done a good job. Funny, huh?

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