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Buy or Sell @ the Deadline: What would you do

View Poll Results: Two part question: Buy or Sell @ the Deadline? Which moves would you make?
We should be SELLERS @ the deadline. 10 11.49%
We should be BUYERS @ the deadline. 37 42.53%
I would trade Jagr @ the deadline for the right return. 7 8.05%
I would trade Briere @ the deadline for the right return. 11 12.64%
I would trade picks for Gleason @ the deadline. 33 37.93%
I would trade JVR+ for Suter @ the deadline. 20 22.99%
I would trade mid round picks for Suter's rights in the offseason 26 29.89%
I would trade picks for Beauchemin @ the deadline. 26 29.89%
I would trade JVR for Luke Schenn @ the deadline. 6 6.90%
I would stand pat @ the deadline. 12 13.79%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 87. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
01-15-2012, 02:27 PM
  #1
WeekendAtBernies
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Buy or Sell @ the Deadline: What would you do

I've seen a lot of people proposing things like acquiring Gleason for pick(s) at the deadline or making a run @ Suter w/ JVR+, etc. And for awhile, I was right there with everyone. I thought we should buy! buy! buy! @ the deadline.

But I have really started to doubt that we can win it all this year or even come close. I honestly don't think there's any way we can get past the Rangers. Let alone the Boston Bruins this year. There's just too many things going against us:

1. Pronger is likely done for the season (miniscule chance of some type of miracle recovery and him being ready for the playoffs)

2. Our #1 goalie has a .890 save percentage and our backup is a 23 year old who has never shown the ability to carry a team for a long stretch of time.

3. Our starting lineup has 5 or 6 rookies (Couturier, Schenn, Read, Zolnierczyk / Rinaldo, Gustafsson / Bourdon (sometimes only 1 of those 2, but usually both))

4. Our #1 scoring line relies heavily on a 39 year old legend who has lost a step and seems to have consistent groin problems and a scrappy winger having a career year

5. One of the only reasons we made it out of the first round last year, JVR, who was a playoff beast, is injured and he has been ineffective playing w/ said injury and it seems as if the current plan of the Flyers' brass is to have him continue playing injured until the offseason.

6. We have been consistently dominated by the Bruins and the Rangers... and we'd likely have to go through one or both of them in a physical 7 game series in order to make it to the Cup Finals.

7. Our defense is horrendous.

Is this seriously the makeup of a championship team? Is this seriously the makeup of a team that can even get out of the 1st round?

And when you answer the first question w/ an emphatic "NO!!" and you realize the second question is difficult to answer, don't you kind of have to reevaluate the direction of the team?

I mean look, I know making the playoffs is really exciting and all, and maybe I'm spoiled, but I'm sick of just making it and "seeing what happens". This team isn't winning anything this year. It's blatantly obvious.

So why not look to the future? Why not see if guys like Jagr and Briere would be willing to go elsewhere for a legitimate chance @ a cup if trading them would improve our team? The hot start was fun, but it was always unsustainable. This team is exactly what we thought it was when the year began... a fringe playoff team. Why not move some of our older assets for some younger pieces / picks / prospects and in the process, improve our draft slot?

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Old
01-15-2012, 02:55 PM
  #2
RIPRichardsCarter
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We need a defenseman in a trade where we don't get ripped off. It's that simple. Why do we have like 13 threads on this?

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01-15-2012, 02:58 PM
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nobody will trade for jagr or briere

they won't want jagr because he honestly has looked pretty slow and they probably assume his success is the result of giroux

briere because his contract is huge, even if he was having a career season it would hard to move him

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01-15-2012, 02:59 PM
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WeekendAtBernies
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RIPRichardsCarter View Post
We need a defenseman in a trade where we don't get ripped off. It's that simple. Why do we have like 13 threads on this?
This thread is a farcry from the ones about acquiring a defenseman.

I'm actually advocating trading some of our older assets away and tanking. This team is not a stanley cup winner.

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01-15-2012, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryzgalovsky View Post
nobody will trade for jagr or briere

they won't want jagr because he honestly has looked pretty slow and they probably assume his success is the result of giroux

briere because his contract is huge, even if he was having a career season it would hard to move him
I disagree with both of these.

Fans of other teams on here have talked about offering a late 1st for Jagr.

Seriously... you don't think Jagr would look good on a Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Jagr line? Or on a Ovie-Backstrom-Jagr line? Come on now...

There have also been fans of other teams quite interested in acquiring Briere.

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01-15-2012, 03:02 PM
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oh yeah tanking, that's a good idea

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01-15-2012, 03:03 PM
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I honestly would do absolutely nothing at all. The CBA is going to change, possibly pulling the cap down some. Pronger may or may not be healthy next season. Timonen will be done after next season. Most of your offense is young.

I would just stand pat, and see where we are when the new CBA is signed. Maybe there will be a free buyout period where the Flyers will be able to just buyout Pronger's deal, so it's not an albatross. Then they can use that to sign a new D to replace Pronger/Timonen.

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01-15-2012, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryzgalovsky View Post
nobody will trade for jagr or briere

they won't want jagr because he honestly has looked pretty slow and they probably assume his success is the result of giroux

briere because his contract is huge, even if he was having a career season it would hard to move him
I disagree Briere is only payed 6.5 for one more year, then it's 3 million followed by 2 million though his cap hit is 6.5. He was a all-star last year, and is a proven playoff performer. If there's a team with cap space that's looking to make some noise the playoffs he could be someone they're interested in adding. IMO The biggest question is would he wave his NMC to go anywhere.

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01-15-2012, 03:06 PM
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If Danny B could be moved I might move him due to his salary and apparent lack of production regardless of who he has played with this year. No matter how much of a beast he could be in the playoffs, if we don't make it I would rather see get some value for him and clear out space. Won't happen though. We're going to get ripped off for a D who either won't stay with us long-term, will sign a stupidly expensive contract/extension, or will only be a marginal upgrade at best.

It makes one wonder if this team with the pieces it has can win or if we get another D could win and the longer the season rolls without seeing any adjustments it looks doubtful. So if we're going to go youth to build on next season we should be sellers to finish revamping the team after we redid the forwards/goalies we need to redo the defense.

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01-15-2012, 03:10 PM
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WeekendAtBernies
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoDu View Post
oh yeah tanking, that's a good idea
I love when people use .gifs in place of sound reasoning.

Why is tanking a bad idea? Please... any logic whatsoever you have, I'm all ears.

Is this team a Stanley Cup winner with a goalie w/ a .890 save percentage, their clear #1 defenseman gone for the season, their best postseason player last year hampered by a season-long injury, the Rangers and Bruins stronger than ever, etc?

I know it's not fun to hear that your team has no chance and would be best served tanking, but I think that's the truth here. You made a bunch of moves in the offseason to get younger, severely hampering your chances to win now. You have a few pieces (Briere, Jagr) that are only gonna be good for a couple more playoff runs @ best. You have a massive need for a #1 defenseman and this draft is stocked w/ some amazing ones if you can get into the top 15. Why not tank?

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01-15-2012, 03:12 PM
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We aren't the Penguins. The Flyers do not tank. Too much respect for the team and the league.

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01-15-2012, 03:15 PM
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Originally Posted by MountainHawk View Post
We aren't the Penguins. The Flyers do not tank. Too much respect for the team and the league.
When I say "tank" I don't mean deliberately losing games. I mean that out of respect for Danny, you trade him and give him a legit chance to win a cup. Same w/ Jagr if that's something he's open to.

In the process, we pick up some nice pieces for the future. It's the same as a team that is out of the playoffs trading off some of their assets. The fundamental belief is the same: Carolina doesn't believe they can win a cup this year so they trade Gleason. The Flyers don't believe they can win a cup this year so they trade Briere and Jagr.

No difference.

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01-15-2012, 03:16 PM
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I know JVR had a good postseason last year, but I highly doubt he would be a huge reason why this team wouldnt make it far in playoffs. Now if you said Giroux or Briere I would agree, but not JVR.

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01-15-2012, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by sandlansd View Post
When I say "tank" I don't mean deliberately losing games. I mean that out of respect for Danny, you trade him and give him a legit chance to win a cup. Same w/ Jagr if that's something he's open to.

In the process, we pick up some nice pieces for the future. It's the same as a team that is out of the playoffs trading off some of their assets. The fundamental belief is the same: Carolina doesn't believe they can win a cup this year so they trade Gleason. The Flyers don't believe they can win a cup this year so they trade Briere and Jagr.

No difference.
You aren't getting into the top 15 if you trade them to cup contenders, though.

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01-15-2012, 03:22 PM
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The Flyers had the worst team in franchise history in 2006-07, and they were still buying. They're not selling.

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01-15-2012, 03:26 PM
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I'm not okay with tanking. We should trade Briere. I don't think it'll hurt us this year even in the playoffs, and will help us for the future. Get Gleason/Beauchemin for now, and try going after Suter in offseason. We can still compete, and get valuable playoff experience for young guys. I don't think tanking sets a good example for the organization or it's young players.

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01-15-2012, 03:26 PM
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The Flyers had the worst team in franchise history in 2006-07, and they were still buying. They're not selling.
I didn't say what WILL they do, I said what WOULD YOU do... there's a difference.

I feel confident that Homer will blow his load, make an idiotic trade where we give up too much for a rental defenseman, we will go out in the 2nd round to BOS or NYR in a sweep, we will land a pick just low enough that we miss out on the premier defensemen in the draft, and... yeah.

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01-15-2012, 03:27 PM
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lol @ the notion of this organization "selling" when this team is currently sitting 7th in the entire NHL in points while having a few games in hands on most teams above them.

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01-15-2012, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by cheesesteak View Post
I'm not okay with tanking. We should trade Briere. I don't think it'll hurt us this year even in the playoffs, and will help us for the future. Get Gleason/Beauchemin for now, and try going after Suter in offseason. We can still compete, and get valuable playoff experience for young guys. I don't think tanking sets a good example for the organization or it's young players.
I apologize... "Tanking" wasn't the best use of words.

What I meant was to simply sell some of our older assets (Jagr, Briere)... NOT TIMONEN. And in the process of getting rid of Jagr and Briere, I thought it would bring our team down to a higher draft position than we would get if we keep those 2.

I didn't mean to intentionally lose games or to trade guys away for nothing just to improve our draft slot.

I just meant that naturally, trading away guys like Briere + Jagr would likely leave us with a higher draft pick.

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01-15-2012, 03:31 PM
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Tanking the season? Are you kidding me?

Your logic is mind blowing.

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01-15-2012, 03:33 PM
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lol @ the notion of this organization "selling" when this team is currently sitting 7th in the entire NHL in points while having a few games in hands on most teams above them.
And we all learned last year that the absolute most important thing when evaluating the future of a team is where they sit in points @ the all star break... amiright?

I mean this team was 2nd in the NHL in points @ the half way mark last year. And that was clearly indicative of how we'd perform in the playoffs.

We've gotten way younger w/ a bunch of rookies, we're missing our biggest / baddest / best defensemen, our starting goalie is worse, we're even softer than we were last year... OBVIOUSLY we can beat the Rangers or Bruins in a physical 7 game series. Why would anyone doubt this?

We're 7th in the NHL in points everyone... THE CUP IS OURS!!!

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01-15-2012, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by RIPRichardsCarter View Post
Tanking the season? Are you kidding me?

Your logic is mind blowing.
Please... enlighten me with your case for keeping everyone, trading away valuable picks for a rental, etc.

Convince me that we are contenders this year and that we can beat the Boston Bruins or New York Rangers in a 7 game series.

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01-15-2012, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cheesesteak View Post
I'm not okay with tanking. We should trade Briere. I don't think it'll hurt us this year even in the playoffs, and will help us for the future. Get Gleason/Beauchemin for now, and try going after Suter in offseason. We can still compete, and get valuable playoff experience for young guys. I don't think tanking sets a good example for the organization or it's young players.
Oh, but you forget Briere turns on the beast mode come playoff time

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01-15-2012, 03:45 PM
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Please... enlighten me with your case for keeping everyone, trading away valuable picks for a rental, etc.

Convince me that we are contenders this year and that we can beat the Boston Bruins or New York Rangers in a 7 game series.
LOL.

You probably would have made this exact same thread back in 2010.

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01-15-2012, 03:56 PM
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WeekendAtBernies
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LOL.

You probably would have made this exact same thread back in 2010.
No, in 2010 we went into the season as the favorites to win the cup. We had some early problems, but we were greatly under-performing. The team had outstanding potential and everyone could see that. We had an impressive roster of players.

This season is the polar opposite. We went into the season w/ low expectations. We weren't supposed to do anything. Everyone played above their heads for the first 30 or so games and everyone's expectations went up. Now we're playing like the team we really are... sloppy, inconsistent, etc. We're also missing our best defensive player and probably the key to our team and he's done for the year. Our goaltending is terrible, Boston and NYR look unbeatable, etc.

But you're right... this season is oh so eerily similar to 2010.... Cup finals here we come!!!

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