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Jacques Martin will be at l'Antichambre tomorrow

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01-18-2012, 01:01 PM
  #151
Jigger77
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Originally Posted by Humpty Dumpty View Post
Oh I'm sure PK is birght enough to get it....

I would just imagine he has other ideas. I mean everybody (even minor hockey players) has an opinion of how the team should play.

Sure these guys are pros but coaches loose guys all the time. I don't think that's a testament to PK's stupiddity but moreso to JM's rigidity and stuborness.

You need to find a way to use the guys you got JM... if you did maybe you'd still be coaching.
Actually, he was asked if PK's tendencies is something that bothers or annoyed him as a coach and he answered not really as a coach, but probably annoyed the players.

He handled PK extremely well and proof is the way he went from a loose canon all over the ice to one of their best defensemen last year after being benched.

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01-18-2012, 01:04 PM
  #152
Poulet Kostopoulos
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Originally Posted by Flyersfan182018 View Post
Montreal will never be successful until they start bringing more stability to their management and players...man its freaking crazy that there are only 3-4 players still with Montreal that were there when they had their big season in '08. Changing the coach every 2 years, and clearing the roster every 4 years will not help.
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This. I agree with you 100%. I thought they were finally on the right track too. They need to stick with a coach (one with proven experience) and stay with him through the highs and the lows, unless there is clearly a problem. They are in dire need of stability. The average lifespan of a coach here is 2 years. Two coaches they fired in the last decade have faced each other in the SCFs a few years later. Now this mess. I don't know why they don't learn that changing the coach that often is a guaranteed failing formula. It does not work. It resets the clock at zero every time.

They need to stop listening to fans and the media completely and work at building their reputation back as a team that has long-term stability and that will not fold and panic at the first signs of adversity. The fans have a big responsibility in this too. There needs to be a complete overhaul of how fans watch and absorb their Habs. The sense of entitlement, which leads to impatience, booing, knee-jerk reactions has to go. People need to be patient and understand that we're not in 1970 anymore and that ALL the teams are very, very good. Fans need to trust management and coaching a lot more, understand they will make great deals and lose on others but trust them to make the decision they believe is best for the team.

By listening to fans and folding under fan and media pressure the Habs lose a lot of credibility around the league and more importantly in their own dressing room. They panic, make perpetual changes and never get anywhere.
100% agree.

I so wish we had more fans (including the Media) thinking like this, especially the owner and manager. Patience is seriously lacking in this city with regards to Habs. We are changing coaches as if we are spinning "The Price is Right" wheel. Change and change and change, hoping that one day, by miracle, we have that one coach who will take the whole team in a spectacular and relentless ascension to the Cup... within 3 years max. Problem is, it rarely works that way.

Keep changing like that and chances are Habs will remain a mediocre team at best. It just shows lack of seriousness and rigour. Others in the league have already been laughing at this once respected organization.

I begin to wonder if all these changes, rather than the hockey itself, is actually THE business of this franchise: changes create news, drama, controversies and thus provoke media coverage and interests.

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01-18-2012, 02:45 PM
  #153
Chris Cutter
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Jacques Martin had an interview with Tony Marinaro on Team990 this morning, it was pretty interesting although Tony clearly has an agenda.
Here's the link if you're interested: http://watch.tsn.ca/featured/#clip603019

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Old
01-18-2012, 03:06 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Capitaine Gionta View Post
I was in the "Fire Martin" camp but I have to say, I learned what the saying "Be careful with what you wish for" means the hard way.
same here

looking at ut now i would have rather kept him and ride him till the end of the season
then re look

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01-18-2012, 05:12 PM
  #155
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Pretty much what I expected.

Jacques Martin is a nice guy.

He was not the right coach for this team. I wish him success wherever he ends up if he gets into coaching again.

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01-18-2012, 05:50 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Pretty much what I expected.

Jacques Martin is a nice guy.

He was not the right coach for this team. I wish him success wherever he ends up if he gets into coaching again.
exactly my thoughts

i dont think he's a bad coach, but just was not the right coach for montreal
he was not given the right pieces to work with nor did we have the right pieces to work with his style before he came here

I think carbo would of done better with this team and martin done better with the 08-09 team

it worked for him in ottawa cause he had offensive stars that can produce on their own so all he had to do was make sure they are defensively sound and he almost let them run their own offence

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01-18-2012, 07:29 PM
  #157
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I'll ask again:

Who was humiliating who ?

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01-18-2012, 07:32 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
We are playing better under RC? What in God's name are you talking about? More entertaining =/= better.
We played two decent games, this past weekend, that is it.
I cannot count the number of times we lost games under Martin where we said we should have won.
I look at he 6 road games as a write off. RC had no real chance to change anything. Since the new year however. We easily could and should be 5-1. The Bruins got a lucky bounce, but we played them pretty evenly, and could have won that. The SO loss should have been ours, their goalie stood on his head. St. Louis.... oh well we lost.

So your point is... torpedoed.

RC has the habs playing more entertaining and better.

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01-18-2012, 07:37 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by habfaninvictoria View Post
I look at he 6 road games as a write off. RC had no real chance to change anything. Since the new year however. We easily could and should be 5-1. The Bruins got a lucky bounce, but we played them pretty evenly, and could have won that. The SO loss should have been ours, their goalie stood on his head. St. Louis.... oh well we lost.

So your point is... torpedoed.

RC has the habs playing more entertaining and better.
So, there's an excuse for pretty much every loss under RC.

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Old
01-18-2012, 07:56 PM
  #160
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Originally Posted by Jee View Post
I'll ask again:

Who was humiliating who ?
Martin did it to a player. A player that is now a key guy on the Habs, could go from Price to Gorges.

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01-18-2012, 08:05 PM
  #161
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Martin did it to a player. A player that is now a key guy on the Habs, could go from Price to Gorges.
I see. Not a fan of a coach humiliating a player. Thank God it worked out good, but it could've been a disaster.

I'd bet my left nut Guy Boucher would've never done that.

I also think it's Price.

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01-18-2012, 09:06 PM
  #162
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To those who think Habs are playing better under RC: Are you watching tonight's game? lol And there has been several games just like this one since RC became headcoach.

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01-18-2012, 09:57 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by Jee View Post
I see. Not a fan of a coach humiliating a player. Thank God it worked out good, but it could've been a disaster.

I'd bet my left nut Guy Boucher would've never done that.

I also think it's Price.
Martin didn't humiliate anybody, he blasted a player because he was slacking off (and if he did it in front of players, it must be because it had been a while). Nothing wrong with that, at all.


Quote:
Originally Posted by habfaninvictoria View Post
I look at he 6 road games as a write off. RC had no real chance to change anything. Since the new year however. We easily could and should be 5-1. The Bruins got a lucky bounce, but we played them pretty evenly, and could have won that. The SO loss should have been ours, their goalie stood on his head. St. Louis.... oh well we lost.

So your point is... torpedoed.

RC has the habs playing more entertaining and better.
Sure, write off every loss while you're at it. I'm pretty sure you did the same with Martin right?

We are not playing better, at all, and no we should not be 5-1, not even 3-3. We did not dominate any game under RC. We won the ones we deserved to win and lost our losses fair and square.
Our team is playing badly. I don't see how anybody that has actually paid attention during the games think we could be 5-1 in our last six.
We played well in Ottawa, but so did they. Just like in Boston. You cannot say that these teams deserved to lose more than us. It was even and we lost fairly.
The last game we got stolen from us was under Martin, not RC.

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01-18-2012, 10:40 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Poulet Kostopoulos View Post
To those who think Habs are playing better under RC: Are you watching tonight's game? lol And there has been several games just like this one since RC became headcoach.
not sure how the terrible play of Pleks, Kostitsyn and others is again a reflection of the coaching. Obviously the players have to take the blame as well.

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01-18-2012, 10:50 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Poulet Kostopoulos View Post
To those who think Habs are playing better under RC: Are you watching tonight's game? lol And there has been several games just like this one since RC became headcoach.
"Fire Martin" fans were living up to there emotional ( i.e reactionary ) nature... Habs should have kept him on until the off-season and started fresh. I see no benefit in firing Martin but unfortunately the "fans" wanted him gone mid-season expecting a miraculous turn-around.

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01-18-2012, 10:53 PM
  #166
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"Fire Martin" fans were living up to there emotional ( i.e reactionary ) nature... Habs should have kept him on until the off-season and started fresh. I see no benefit in firing Martin but unfortunately the "fans" wanted him gone mid-season expecting a miraculous turn-around.
Yeah, blame the fans for Jacques Martin's boring system and the Habs' terrible start of the season.

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01-18-2012, 11:02 PM
  #167
WhiskeySeven
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Yeah, blame the fans for Jacques Martin's boring system and the Habs' terrible start of the season.
How dare the fans want to be entertained. They're not true fans.

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01-18-2012, 11:04 PM
  #168
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Firing Martin essentially doomed the year instead of saving it given that Cunneyworth has a different system. Marc Crawford actually made this point a while back, when a coach comes in with a new system midseason it usually ends up being a bad year, although Hitchcock and Bylsma stand out as exceptions.

Should Martin have been fired? Probably not, he benched young players often but Cunneyworth is doing the same. More like fire Gauthier for poor construction of the team and in particular the Markov situation. Still, I think his boring system was tough to swallow without wins, otherwise looking at his performance he was actually quite successful with the conf run and the rather strong first round series against Boston.

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01-18-2012, 11:22 PM
  #169
Le CH
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Yeah, blame the fans for Jacques Martin's boring system and the Habs' terrible start of the season.
Are you more entertained with this version of the Habs? I hate to break this to you but putting together a winning team in the current version of the NHL is not only about coaching and is MUCH more difficult than most posters seem to think. Habs fanbase seem to have absolutely no patience and "forces" management into bad decisions because of this lack of patience.

Why didn't fans realise that this team wasn't going to make the play-offs or would barely make the them with the injuries + lack of top-shelf talent? Its always drama time in Montreal but the fans/media have only themselves to blame since they force management's hand yet they don't see themselves as part of the problem.

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01-18-2012, 11:34 PM
  #170
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Firing Martin essentially doomed the year instead of saving it given that Cunneyworth has a different system.
It's not so much the new system as the fumble-fingered handling of personnel.

Dude cannot honestly believe that Plekanec is his third-best center or that Eller can handle first-line matchups, can he? And what's with the D roulette?

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Should Martin have been fired? Probably not, he benched young players often but Cunneyworth is doing the same.
No, he really didn't do that very often.

The Habs were recovering under Martin. They were creeping up the standings -- not shooting up, because it doesn't usually happen that way, but well on their way to grabbing a playoff spot. Hiring Cunneyworth put them in a tailspin they have yet to recover for.

What's his record now, 4-9-1? I don't really find that entertaining.

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01-18-2012, 11:34 PM
  #171
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Originally Posted by smon View Post
Firing Martin essentially doomed the year instead of saving it given that Cunneyworth has a different system. Marc Crawford actually made this point a while back, when a coach comes in with a new system midseason it usually ends up being a bad year, although Hitchcock and Bylsma stand out as exceptions.

Should Martin have been fired? Probably not, he benched young players often but Cunneyworth is doing the same. More like fire Gauthier for poor construction of the team and in particular the Markov situation. Still, I think his boring system was tough to swallow without wins, otherwise looking at his performance he was actually quite successful with the conf run and the rather strong first round series against Boston.
Martin should have been fired and so should Gauthier. Keeping Martin around would have just prolonged the inevitable. He was not the right guy for this team.

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01-18-2012, 11:35 PM
  #172
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I never liked Martin's style, but he was an effective coach. He was fired too soon, but in a market where results are demanded, you can't hang on to a coach in that situation. Martin shouldn't have been fired during the season, he should have been retained even if the fans and media whined their way out of the bell center.

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01-19-2012, 01:45 AM
  #173
Poulet Kostopoulos
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How dare the fans want to be entertained. They're not true fans.
C'mon, stop being hypocrites: fans here don't want to be entertained, they want winning and RIGHT AWAY and ALL THE WAY. Please stop that entertaining/boring BS. I have never seen a fan here complain that Habs are playing a boring system when they are winning.

Fans here hates JM because he is not winning enough, not because of his "boring" system. PERIOD. That "boring system" argument is just another excuse, another ammo for these fans' hate.

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01-19-2012, 09:45 AM
  #174
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exactly my thoughts

i dont think he's a bad coach, but just was not the right coach for montreal
he was not given the right pieces to work with nor did we have the right pieces to work with his style before he came here

I think carbo would of done better with this team and martin done better with the 08-09 team

it worked for him in ottawa cause he had offensive stars that can produce on their own so all he had to do was make sure they are defensively sound and he almost let them run their own offence
I disagree. I think he was the ideal coach for this team. The reason is that his system can make a mediocre team be better and win games. If you look at the defense he had and the number of injuries to key players it's quite remarkable that he had that team 2 games above .500 and 2 points out of a playoff position.

It's too bad they screwed up because they were on their way back and I'm positive we'd be in the playoffs this year if they hadn't jumped the gun and folded under fan pressure. Then once you're in who knows. That group of players made it to the conference finals his first year and gave one hell of a scare to the Stanley Cup champs last year. I would have loved to see what they would have done this time around. Too bad.

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01-19-2012, 11:26 AM
  #175
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Originally Posted by Jigger77 View Post
I disagree. I think he was the ideal coach for this team. The reason is that his system can make a mediocre team be better and win games. If you look at the defense he had and the number of injuries to key players it's quite remarkable that he had that team 2 games above .500 and 2 points out of a playoff position.

It's too bad they screwed up because they were on their way back and I'm positive we'd be in the playoffs this year if they hadn't jumped the gun and folded under fan pressure. Then once you're in who knows. That group of players made it to the conference finals his first year and gave one hell of a scare to the Stanley Cup champs last year. I would have loved to see what they would have done this time around. Too bad.
Exactly! Martin had this Habs team overachieving since he arrived in Montreal. We're now seeing this team for what it truly is in terms of calibre. It's comical reading all the Martin haters pathetically spin doctor everything when they should be eating crow.

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