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Coyotes Need A Center; Surplus Defensmen. Make Your Offers

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Old
01-21-2012, 07:56 PM
  #101
thestonedkoala
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Koivu or Brodziak interest you?

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01-21-2012, 10:11 PM
  #102
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What about Lars Eller for Gormley

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01-21-2012, 11:35 PM
  #103
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what would it take for new jersey to get yandle?

would futures work, or would it take someone who can make an impact immediately?

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01-22-2012, 12:05 AM
  #104
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Originally Posted by dredeye View Post
That probably is fair but I really wouldn't want to move him for Aucoin. He's a winger though and not a centre so it doesn't seem to address your teams needs.
I know, but I was thinking he could take Pyatt's spot on the bottom 6 next year and work his way up from there. If that's pretty fair, then that's a deal I would approach Aucoin with.

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01-22-2012, 01:09 AM
  #105
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The Coyotes would like a centre in exchange for on of their spare defenseman. I'm assuming Coyote fans are seeking a top six centre for a third pairing or less defenseman - that's not going to happen at least not from a contender team.

The Canucks have a spare and still young at age 26 ligitimate top six forward in Mason Raymond. Mason currently is used as a third line winger, but is capable playing all three forward postions and the Canucks are not hesitant to use him on their second line. Mason is a solid two way forward, good both offensively and defensively, can play on the PK and is considered one of the fastest, if not the fastest player in the NHL. Raymond was seriously injured in the Cup finals, but has shown this season that he is fully mended and able to play at 100%.

At present the Canucks have no need to trade Mason. He not only provides 2nd line insurance should Booth, Kesler or Higgins get injured, Mason, Cody Hodgson and Janek Hanson together make a very formitable offensive third line. The Canucks have other players who could fill Mason's spot on the third line, but none are as skilled or versitile as Raymond. The only reason the Canucks would consider trading Mason is if the player(s) they got in return over compensated for the loss of what Mason currently brings to the Canucks.

The Canucks are a Cup contender team and have not glaring holes in their roster that HAVE to be fixed, but their is always room for improvement on any team. Picks and prospects are not attractors in any trade to a contender like the Canucks. Any changes to the Canuck roster has to return players who can play and help the team this season though picks and prospects can be added for balance. Gillis also has a policy not to trade picks for rentals.

From the current Canuck roster there are likely only four players Gillis likely would consider trading. Raymond, Ballard, Alberts or Maholtra. Cory Schnieder might be considered a 5th player, but it is highly unlikely Gillis will consider trading him prior to the end of this season and the playoffs. Raymond is by far the best of this group and would be included only to attract quality in return. Ballard is the next most skilled and is the least likely Gillis would trade of the group as though his style of play doesn't fit well in AV's defense system, he is still a ligitimate NHL top 4 defenseman and the best insurance the Canucks have should Hamhuis, Bieksa, Salo or Edler get injured. The main reason Ballard would be included in a trade would be because the need of the Canucks to dump salary for cap balance due to a large salary coming back to the team due to the trade. Though good support players, the Canucks can replace Alberts and Malhotra from the farm.

The areas that the Canucks would like to strengthen their team would be in order, a top 4 right hand shot defenseman, a top six power forward with grit, and a fourth line enforcer with speed and skill. These are not critiacal areas that need repair, but areas that could be exploited at times by various playoff teams.

Mason's overall trade value would be similar to that of Ekman-Larsson or Yandle, but neither of these two Coyote defensemen are what the Canucks would want in exchange for Raymond. Both are left hand shot defensemen and neither are an improvement over Hamhuis or Edler. Runblad (plus) would be of interest, but Runblad himself is no where ready to replace this season what Mason brings to the Canucks this season. The trouble is is that the Phoenix players that would interest the Canucks are nearing the end of their NHL career and basically could be considered rentals. In order for the Canucks to give up a very talented player in Raymond who will be in the league for a number of years to come, the talent level being transferred to the Canucks would have to be very loopsided in the Canucks favour for the short time they Canucks would have use of those players.

As such, either:

To Vancouver: Derek Morris, Shane Doan
To Phoenix: (subject to Vancouver first trading Keith Ballard) Mason Raymond, Manny Malhotra plus a conditional 2013 first round pick if Doan re-signs with Vancouver.

or

To Vancouver: Derek Morris, David Runblad, Paul Bissonnette
To Phoenix: Mason Raymond, Victor Oreskovich, 2012 4th round pick.


Last edited by Hi-wayman: 01-22-2012 at 01:15 AM.
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Old
01-22-2012, 01:12 AM
  #106
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Regin + 3rd for Boedker.

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01-22-2012, 01:15 AM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi-wayman View Post
To Vancouver: Derek Morris, Shane Doan
To Phoenix: (subject to Vancouver first trading Keith Ballard) Mason Raymond, Manny Malhotra plus a conditional 2013 first round pick if Doan re-signs with Vancouver.

or

To Vancouver: Derek Morris, David Runblad, Paul Bissonnette
To Phoenix: Mason Raymond, Victor Oreskovich, 20124th round pick.
I'm not really interested in Mason Raymond, especially if that's the cost. I'd be interested in either Morris for Ballard or Aucoin for Ballard though. Then I'd look to flip Ballard. You interested in either of those?

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01-22-2012, 01:41 AM
  #108
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I know, but I was thinking he could take Pyatt's spot on the bottom 6 next year and work his way up from there. If that's pretty fair, then that's a deal I would approach Aucoin with.
I think for Caron I'd prefer to get a prospect with upside than Aucoin on the short term. Maybe a Hamill and Caron for Aucoin and prospect? Don't know who you'd be willing to move though. We need d prospects

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01-22-2012, 01:42 AM
  #109
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01-22-2012, 01:45 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Kaibur View Post
I'm not really interested in Mason Raymond, especially if that's the cost. I'd be interested in either Morris for Ballard or Aucoin for Ballard though. Then I'd look to flip Ballard. You interested in either of those?
He has ridiculously overrated Raymond. The fact that he thinks he's equal value to Yandle is hilarious. But it's nice he took all that time to let everyone know the canucks are a cup contender.

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01-22-2012, 01:50 AM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi-wayman View Post
To Vancouver: Derek Morris, Shane Doan
To Phoenix: (subject to Vancouver first trading Keith Ballard) Mason Raymond, Manny Malhotra plus a conditional 2013 first round pick if Doan re-signs with Vancouver.

or

To Vancouver: Derek Morris, David Runblad, Paul Bissonnette
To Phoenix: Mason Raymond, Victor Oreskovich, 2012 4th round pick.
Value wise, the first trade is close. I'm not familiar with Oreskovich so I won't comment on the second. Problem is, both of these trades don't make us better. We need talented, top six forwards. We're stacked on defense and with bottom six forwards. I think we're better off waiting until the offseason where we'll have a ton of cap room. If we get an owner, we can go after some top six talent then. If not, none of this matters. Maybe we need to move Yandle for a top line center but without an owner, we won't be able to improve enough to matter.

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01-22-2012, 01:52 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by dredeye View Post
He has ridiculously overrated Raymond. The fact that he thinks he's equal value to Yandle is hilarious. But it's nice he took all that time to let everyone know the canucks are a cup contender.
Yandle brings a top line forward if he's moved. Moving him for anything less would be stupid. Now if we started with Yandle for Kessler, that's a conversation worth having.

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01-22-2012, 02:04 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Kaibur View Post
I'm not really interested in Mason Raymond, especially if that's the cost. I'd be interested in either Morris for Ballard or Aucoin for Ballard though. Then I'd look to flip Ballard. You interested in either of those?
Probably not. I doubt Aucoin's skating would fit the Canucks. I also think Gillis will want to hang on to Ballard. It's AV that doesn't like Ballard always wanting to carry the puck out of our end rather than pass. Ballard is still a solid top 4 defenseman except on a team coached by AV.

What I would go for is Morris and Bissonnette for Malhotra (a 3rd line centre & very strong on faceoffs) and a 4th round pick. Then I would pair Morris up with Ballard as our 3rd pairing and trade off Alberts.

Hamhuis - Bieksa
Edler - Salo
Ballard - Morris
Rome - Tanev (spares)


Last edited by Hi-wayman: 01-22-2012 at 02:09 AM.
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01-22-2012, 02:10 AM
  #114
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Probably not. I doubt Aucoin's skating would fit the Canucks. I also think Gillis will want to hang on to Ballard. It's AV that doesn't like Ballard always wanting to carry the puck our rather than pass. Ballard is still a solid top 4 defenseman except on a team coached by AV.

What I would go for is Morris and Bissonnette for Malhotra (a 3rd line centre & very strong on faceoffs) and a 4th roung pick. Then I would pair Morris up with Ballard as our 3rd pairing and trade off Alberts.

Hamhuis - Bieksa
Edler - Salo
Ballard - Morris
Rome - Tanev (spares)
Not even a PHX fan but PHX does not want a 3rd line center. Malhotra really is no fit at all. PHX need top 6 scoring not a bottom 6 center.

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01-22-2012, 02:21 AM
  #115
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They send O'Reilly to Portland and the next day Langkow gets hurt. Peverley would be a great fit unfortunately, Bruins like him too much. Yandle won't get moved for the rest of the season. If the Coyotes trade him it will be in the off-season and for a #1 center (Carter, Stastny?). Gormley isn't likely to be traded. Gomez most likely will be bought out after the season. Don't see too many '12 UFA centers that may be available, an unproductive Boyes, Jokinen has burned that bridge, the Kings won't trade Stoll to the Coyotes when they are trying to make the playoffs too...

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Old
01-22-2012, 02:41 AM
  #116
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Not sure if Phoenix would have any interest but Mikhail Grabovski + Keith Aulie or Cody Franson for Schlemko would be great for the Leafs.

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01-22-2012, 02:42 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by HooliganX2 View Post
Not even a PHX fan but PHX does not want a 3rd line center. Malhotra really is no fit at all. PHX need top 6 scoring not a bottom 6 center.
Have you bothered to read this post from the beginning? The thread is about Phoenix looking for centres in exchange for defensemen. The fact that Phoenix may also be looking for top 6 scoring in addition to centres is irrelivent in this thread.

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01-22-2012, 02:50 AM
  #118
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Have you bothered to read this post from the beginning? The thread is about Phoenix looking for centres in exchange for defensemen. The fact that Phoenix may also be looking for top 6 scoring in addition to centres is irrelivent in this thread.
I read the thread title but I also know a little about Phoenix. I don't think Malhotra adds anything they don't already have. He really doesn't upgrade over Hanzel, Langkow or Gordon.

Malhorta is slightly better at face offs then Gordon. They hit about the same, Gordon blocks more shots points are close with Gordon having 3 more. Give away take aways are close also. Gordon is a +8 Malhorta is a -6.


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01-22-2012, 02:57 AM
  #119
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They send O'Reilly to Portland and the next day Langkow gets hurt. Peverley would be a great fit unfortunately, Bruins like him too much. Yandle won't get moved for the rest of the season. If the Coyotes trade him it will be in the off-season and for a #1 center (Carter, Stastny?). Gormley isn't likely to be traded. Gomez most likely will be bought out after the season. Don't see too many '12 UFA centers that may be available, an unproductive Boyes, Jokinen has burned that bridge, the Kings won't trade Stoll to the Coyotes when they are trying to make the playoffs too...
I think it's pretty close to not happening with the new extension but I'd be willing to move Peverley for the right piece. Not sure what you had in mind. That wouldn't happen until the off season though

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01-22-2012, 09:48 AM
  #120
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I think for Caron I'd prefer to get a prospect with upside than Aucoin on the short term. Maybe a Hamill and Caron for Aucoin and prospect? Don't know who you'd be willing to move though. We need d prospects
Ross, Brodeur, Goncharov, Stone. I tend to think we'd throw in Ross or Brodeur pretty easily. Goncharov and Stone might require a little more, as they're both RHD and we don't have as many of those. Goncharov's up with the big club for the third time this year, although he hasn't gotten an NHL game yet. They might showcase him for a trade in the next couple though. Stone is an interesting prospect who has steadily been improving and might start getting cups of coffee soon. Don't know if you'd be willing to add Knight instead of Hamill? Doesn't help with our center depth, but we're probably looking elsewhere for that top 6 center anyways. Hamill may not be any better than Miele.

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01-22-2012, 10:05 AM
  #121
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... a top six centre for a third pairing or less defenseman - that's not going to happen at least not from a contender team ...
I don't see how a non-contender can afford to give up a 1C or 2C for a third pairing D.

The price for a 1C was set by the Flyers. The price for a 2C was set by the Coyotes. The problem is the ownership needs to clear up before the team can take on the salary implications of a 1/2C long term, which is 4.5 to 8M a year.

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01-22-2012, 10:48 AM
  #122
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Montreal might be willibng to move one of Desharnais or Plekanec. But would be looking for youth/picks in return.

I would assume that Ekman-Larsson is pretty untouchable. So I can only see Boedker being a target for trade.

So I'll take a shot:

To Phoenix:
C Tomas Plekanec
F Travis Moen


To Montreal:
F Mikkel Boedker
one of Gormley/Runblad/Shlemko/Summers

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01-22-2012, 10:58 AM
  #123
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The Coyotes would like a centre in exchange for on of their spare defenseman. I'm assuming Coyote fans are seeking a top six centre for a third pairing or less defenseman - that's not going to happen at least not from a contender team.

The Canucks have a spare and still young at age 26 ligitimate top six forward in Mason Raymond. Mason currently is used as a third line winger, but is capable playing all three forward postions and the Canucks are not hesitant to use him on their second line. Mason is a solid two way forward, good both offensively and defensively, can play on the PK and is considered one of the fastest, if not the fastest player in the NHL. Raymond was seriously injured in the Cup finals, but has shown this season that he is fully mended and able to play at 100%.

At present the Canucks have no need to trade Mason. He not only provides 2nd line insurance should Booth, Kesler or Higgins get injured, Mason, Cody Hodgson and Janek Hanson together make a very formitable offensive third line. The Canucks have other players who could fill Mason's spot on the third line, but none are as skilled or versitile as Raymond. The only reason the Canucks would consider trading Mason is if the player(s) they got in return over compensated for the loss of what Mason currently brings to the Canucks.

The Canucks are a Cup contender team and have not glaring holes in their roster that HAVE to be fixed, but their is always room for improvement on any team. Picks and prospects are not attractors in any trade to a contender like the Canucks. Any changes to the Canuck roster has to return players who can play and help the team this season though picks and prospects can be added for balance. Gillis also has a policy not to trade picks for rentals.

From the current Canuck roster there are likely only four players Gillis likely would consider trading. Raymond, Ballard, Alberts or Maholtra. Cory Schnieder might be considered a 5th player, but it is highly unlikely Gillis will consider trading him prior to the end of this season and the playoffs. Raymond is by far the best of this group and would be included only to attract quality in return. Ballard is the next most skilled and is the least likely Gillis would trade of the group as though his style of play doesn't fit well in AV's defense system, he is still a ligitimate NHL top 4 defenseman and the best insurance the Canucks have should Hamhuis, Bieksa, Salo or Edler get injured. The main reason Ballard would be included in a trade would be because the need of the Canucks to dump salary for cap balance due to a large salary coming back to the team due to the trade. Though good support players, the Canucks can replace Alberts and Malhotra from the farm.

The areas that the Canucks would like to strengthen their team would be in order, a top 4 right hand shot defenseman, a top six power forward with grit, and a fourth line enforcer with speed and skill. These are not critiacal areas that need repair, but areas that could be exploited at times by various playoff teams.

Mason's overall trade value would be similar to that of Ekman-Larsson or Yandle, but neither of these two Coyote defensemen are what the Canucks would want in exchange for Raymond. Both are left hand shot defensemen and neither are an improvement over Hamhuis or Edler. Runblad (plus) would be of interest, but Runblad himself is no where ready to replace this season what Mason brings to the Canucks this season. The trouble is is that the Phoenix players that would interest the Canucks are nearing the end of their NHL career and basically could be considered rentals. In order for the Canucks to give up a very talented player in Raymond who will be in the league for a number of years to come, the talent level being transferred to the Canucks would have to be very loopsided in the Canucks favour for the short time they Canucks would have use of those players.

As such, either:

To Vancouver: Derek Morris, Shane Doan
To Phoenix: (subject to Vancouver first trading Keith Ballard) Mason Raymond, Manny Malhotra plus a conditional 2013 first round pick if Doan re-signs with Vancouver.

or

To Vancouver: Derek Morris, David Runblad, Paul Bissonnette
To Phoenix: Mason Raymond, Victor Oreskovich, 2012 4th round pick.
I suspect Mason Raymond has about 1/2 the trade value you seem to feel he does.

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Old
01-22-2012, 12:45 PM
  #124
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I suspect Mason Raymond has about 1/2 the trade value you seem to feel he does.
You are probably half right. Trade value is not a fixed value, but a scale. The value of a player, a prospect or a pick varies between teams and their needs. Obtaining a first round pick will have half the value to a team like the Canucks compared to that of a team on a major rebuild. Just because a player is a highly skilled player doesn't mean another club has a need for him and will pay what other clubs may pay.

Though I am a Canuck fan I made no attempt to take an unfair advantage of the Coyotes in my trade proposals. In fact, based on the theme of this thread, I tried to look at the needs of Phoenix and what they have to spare. My trade suggestion is definately based on a Canucks point of view as to the bennefit of gaining the Phoenix players verses the harm to the Canucks due to the loss of the Canuck assets, but from a Canucks point of view my suggestions are not unreasonable.

The Coyotes really don't have a lot that would interest the Canucks. They are deep in defencemen, weak everywhere else and of those defencemen, other than OEL, Klesla and Yandle, most of those defensemen would fall into the 3rd pairing/spare/prospect still developing catagory of a lot of NHL teams. In my trade suggestion I recognized that Phoenix can't afford to trade their three core defensemen. They need to build around those defensemen, but that really limited just what the Canucks could use in exchange for a Canuck centre.

In saying that I may be vastly over valuing Mason Raymond or in another post, Manny Malhotra, I will counter that by saying I think you are underestimating just how deep and strong the Canucks as a team are especially in goal and on the forward lines. The Canucks have a third line that is equal to most second lines. Both Malhotra (faceoffs) and Raymond (speed & PK) bring skills that are in the elite level for those skills. Both were very influencial that Vancouver made it to the Cup finals last season. Both would be asked by the Coyotes to play well above the level that they are asked to play on a stacked Canuck team.

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01-22-2012, 01:35 PM
  #125
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Any interest in Roy or Gaustad?

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