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Tim Thomas Cheated?

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Old
01-24-2012, 04:02 PM
  #101
pelts35.com
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
exactly, i never said TT's stunt had an impact.

i'm saying, just like when a goalie piles up snow, that it COULD have an impact - as for Sunday, we will never be sure.

as for the penalty that should be assessed, that's up to the league
Yes, it is up to the league and there is no way that they would force the team to forfeit. At worst maybe take away a shooter.

Just out of curiosity, anyone know what the penalty would be if a shooter used an illegal stick in a shootout?

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01-24-2012, 04:05 PM
  #102
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Every smart goal tender does this and I mean everyone. After the zamboni
Scraps the ice it takes a couple min to freeze by the time the shoot out start its almost frozen but still soft, a goaltender will come out and rough up the surface to get a better push off when going left to right. They will then take the snow that they pulled up and push it up against the posts and build it up a inch or two. This will slow or sometimes prevent the puck that is going slow to trickle in. When you are finished you squirt water in the area you cut too deep because it can have the opposite effect and skate will stick in the cut. Not illegal at all very smart

Also remember the zamboni scrape is for the players for the shots, the clean ice does not help the goaltender it hurts them. I heard that they give the goaltender some leeway to even things up


Last edited by RaybCamn: 01-24-2012 at 04:10 PM.
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01-24-2012, 04:17 PM
  #103
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i follow rick tocchet on twitter and he's always goodly enough to get back to me.

i asked him about thomas spraying water in the crease area just before the shootout and asked him his opinion on the impact it would have and or if it gives the goalie an advantage on the shooter(especially the first shooter)

Rick Tocchet @RealRocket22 if that's the case , there should repercussions if he indeed did that ...water in front of the net helps the goalie for sure

i cut and pasted this striaght from twitter so this quote is not at all a misrepresentation of tocchets response nor have i altered it in anyway


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01-24-2012, 04:35 PM
  #104
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I think it was pretty crafty of Thomas to do it. Good move for him.

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01-24-2012, 06:44 PM
  #105
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I really like Timmy.

In my opinion he is paid to win hockey games and titles. He had done exactly that.

The water thing is a good hockey move, because it helps his team winning and it isnīt against the rules although we donīt know exactly if it hurts Read really, it helps Thomas on a mental side of things.

The thing with the white house isnīt important. He is a sport player so he donīt need do go to the white house... Is his personal choice. I really like the explanation by Cicarelli. It shows their respect for each other. We are like a familie!! We need more of that insight the flyers!

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01-24-2012, 07:38 PM
  #106
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In the end, I think it's safe to say that if people are arguing whether or not a squirt of water messed up Read's shootout attempt, Read didn't try hard enough. A squirt of water shouldn't make or break your shootout attempt.

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01-24-2012, 09:14 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLHockeyKnight View Post
In the end, I think it's safe to say that if people are arguing whether or not a squirt of water messed up Read's shootout attempt, Read didn't try hard enough. A squirt of water shouldn't make or break your shootout attempt.
+1 enough with the conspiracy theories if THAT really made the difference to a bunch of professional hockey players than wow, just wow is all I have to say.

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01-24-2012, 11:20 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by MillerTime2181 View Post
+1 enough with the conspiracy theories if THAT really made the difference to a bunch of professional hockey players than wow, just wow is all I have to say.
He squirted the water. Changing the composition of the ice in front of you does make a difference. Why do you think they have Zambonis?

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01-24-2012, 11:24 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by JABEE View Post
He squirted the water. Changing the composition of the ice in front of you does make a difference. Why do you think they have Zambonis?
Hey if you really think it makes that much of a difference then maybe Bryzgalov can take a page out of Tims book and learn a thing or two.

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01-25-2012, 12:59 AM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironmanrulez View Post
I really like Timmy.

In my opinion he is paid to win hockey games and titles. He had done exactly that.

The water thing is a good hockey move, because it helps his team winning and it isnīt against the rules although we donīt know exactly if it hurts Read really, it helps Thomas on a mental side of things.

The thing with the white house isnīt important. He is a sport player so he donīt need do go to the white house... Is his personal choice. I really like the explanation by Cicarelli. It shows their respect for each other. We are like a familie!! We need more of that insight the flyers!
I'm undecided on whether or not it was appropriate for him to do, but the one thing that annoys me about the whole mess is that people say it took attention away from the team and put it on him, but the thing is fans and the media are actively giving it attention. I wonder if he would've released a statement if no one had commented on it? It isn't like he did something outrageous got in a clown suit, rode around on a unicycle, and beheaded some puppies, he chose not to go to the White House and meet with the President, let it be. Though I suppose to some people having so little respect for the position of the Presidency is somewhat outrageous, and I can understand that. On the other hand it is his right

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01-25-2012, 07:00 AM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JABEE View Post
He squirted the water. Changing the composition of the ice in front of you does make a difference. Why do you think they have Zambonis?
It's the same with a referee/lineman getting in the way when you try to clear the puck and then the other team scores cause it stayed in. The ref is part of the play, and it's on the player to get it around him. Same with this. I don't care if Thomas is standing in a 3 foot pond of water in the shape of the crease, they should still be able to score. Especially when there is ZERO DEFENSE in front of you.

And considering that other goalies have said that they do this, this shouldn't be a new occurrence to Read. Should have been something he's been aware of for years if he's made it to the NHL level.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MillerTime2181 View Post
Hey if you really think it makes that much of a difference then maybe Bryzgalov can take a page out of Tims book and learn a thing or two.
If it's really that big of an effect as people say, this times 100. It should be a requirement that he squirts a ring of water around him at every stoppage of play.

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01-25-2012, 08:42 AM
  #112
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Reading some of the responses in this thread it is very apparent that people have never played hockey before.

Yes, going from worn ice/ice which has no puddles, to a very slick and wet surface is very tough to control the puck, particularly when stick handling the way you would in a shootout attempt.

Next time you go play hockey, if you do at all, as soon as you get on that fresh sheet, grab a puck and try to stick handle along the ice and through a puddle.

Your opinion won't be the same I can assure you that.

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01-25-2012, 12:55 PM
  #113
Bernie Parent 1974
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RaybCamn View Post
Every smart goal tender does this and I mean everyone. After the zamboni
Scraps the ice it takes a couple min to freeze by the time the shoot out start its almost frozen but still soft, a goaltender will come out and rough up the surface to get a better push off when going left to right.

the pre- shootout zamboni is dry scrape = no water that needs to freeze [if zamboni was properly used]


Quote:
Originally Posted by RaybCamn View Post
After the zamboni
Scraps the ice it takes a couple min to freeze by the time the shoot out start its almost frozen but still soft, a goaltender will come out and rough up the surface to get a better push off when going left to right.
after a normal zamboni = you are correct about that


Quote:
Originally Posted by RaybCamn View Post
They will then take the snow that they pulled up and push it up against the posts and build it up a inch or two. This will slow or sometimes prevent the puck that is going slow to trickle in. up
illegal. the ref will ask the goalie to remove the snow.
rule 67.3 http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=26478

"A goalkeeper shall be assessed a minor penalty when he deliberately piles up snow or obstacles at or near his net that, in the opinion of the Referee, would tend to prevent the scoring of a goal."




Quote:
Originally Posted by RaybCamn View Post
Also remember the zamboni scrape is for the players for the shots, the clean ice does not help the goaltender it hurts them. I heard that they give the goaltender some leeway to even things up

never heard that regarding the NHL

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01-25-2012, 12:58 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by JLHockeyKnight View Post
It's the same with a referee/lineman getting in the way when you try to clear the puck and then the other team scores cause it stayed in. The ref is part of the play, and it's on the player to get it around him. Same with this.
WHAT ???? the refs HAVE TO be there ... TT did not HAVE squirt the crease .... in fact there are rules AGAINST goalies altering the ice

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01-25-2012, 12:59 PM
  #115
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That water was frozen before the first shot was missed....

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01-25-2012, 02:15 PM
  #116
Bernie Parent 1974
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Originally Posted by AnchoRager View Post
That water was frozen before the first shot was missed....
and you know this how?

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01-25-2012, 03:35 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RaybCamn View Post
Every smart goal tender does this and I mean everyone. After the zamboni
Scraps the ice it takes a couple min to freeze by the time the shoot out start its almost frozen but still soft, a goaltender will come out and rough up the surface to get a better push off when going left to right. They will then take the snow that they pulled up and push it up against the posts and build it up a inch or two. This will slow or sometimes prevent the puck that is going slow to trickle in. When you are finished you squirt water in the area you cut too deep because it can have the opposite effect and skate will stick in the cut. Not illegal at all very smart

Also remember the zamboni scrape is for the players for the shots, the clean ice does not help the goaltender it hurts them. I heard that they give the goaltender some leeway to even things up
This is quite possibly the least informed post in the thread.

The goalie doesnt scrape the ice to allow them to "push side to side", they do it to prevent themselves from pushing all the way into the corner when the ice is slick after a flood.

Also, goalies clear the crease of extra snow as the period wears on as to not impede there side to side motion, and pile it at the sides. There is a rule preventing them from "piling it up to slow or prevent" a goal. Kerry Frasor touches base on this in his column on TSN.ca, and about how he approaches goalies about it. Either you move it, or I will, your choice.

The Zamboni scrape is to repair the ice and make it playable. This may constitute the "shot" idea in your post, but a players shot isnt the sole reason. Too much snow accumulates, the ice gets choppy, ruts appear making it more dangerous to turn, stop etc, the ice accumulation slows the puck etc.

There is no leeway for anyone in terms of ice surface, it is what it is.

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01-25-2012, 04:01 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by ORYX View Post
Reading some of the responses in this thread it is very apparent that people have never played hockey before.

Yes, going from worn ice/ice which has no puddles, to a very slick and wet surface is very tough to control the puck, particularly when stick handling the way you would in a shootout attempt.

Next time you go play hockey, if you do at all, as soon as you get on that fresh sheet, grab a puck and try to stick handle along the ice and through a puddle.

Your opinion won't be the same I can assure you that.
so rick tocchet never played hockey?

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01-25-2012, 04:28 PM
  #119
JLHockeyKnight
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
WHAT ???? the refs HAVE TO be there ... TT did not HAVE squirt the crease .... in fact there are rules AGAINST goalies altering the ice
My point is that it's part of the game. Tough ****. No point in whining over this. Boston fans probably are reading this thread and laughing their ***** off. And I don't blame them.

They're playing on a frozen lake of water....and he added more water. That's considered altering? If squirting water is considered altering the ice then any goalie that scrapes up the crease when they first hit the ice for the start of the period should be ejected from the game, cause they're clearly altering the effects the puck will experience once it reaches the crease.

Also any player that spits on the ice from the bench should ejected too for breaking the rules of altering the ice.

Also Nathan Horton should be thrown out of the league for altering the ice to win a Stanley Cup last year.

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01-25-2012, 04:37 PM
  #120
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Notice where Reader blew his tires.. Unless Tim Thomas has terminator hands, he didn't squirt the water that far.

I can't believe people are actually debating this.

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01-25-2012, 04:56 PM
  #121
Bernie Parent 1974
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Originally Posted by JLHockeyKnight View Post
My point is that it's part of the game. Tough ****.
you're joking, right ?
squirting extra water on the ice is absolutely NOT a mandatory part of the game like having refs on the ice.

if that were the case, the NHL would not have rule 67.3 about altering the ice

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