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2011-12 All Purpose Kings Trade Rumors and Proposals Thread III

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01-26-2012, 02:16 PM
  #276
Duc620
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Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
The same could be said about any UFA coming here. They will cost more as well. Right now Gagne's 3m is looking pretty bad. But the Kings will deal with it.
Well, sure. But Gagne is (what?) one more year and he could still play some more (no matter how unlikely that may seem right now) for us. All he'd have to do is come back in the playoffs and drop a game winner or two.

Carter's a whole different scenario.... like nine years worth. I don't think Lombardi goes there. It just doesn't feel right.

I think he makes a play for Parise if he comes available before Feb 27 and if the deal makes sense. If no Parise, then he goes to plan b or c for the playoffs. That's probably a Ray Whitney Ruutu kind of thing.

I think Lombardi and Sutter really want to get the guys we have now into a playoff season with a healthy Kopitar just to determine what they really have. To measure this core in the playoffs and to provide them a second bite at it is important. I think the Kings do that before they start trading guys like Brown and JJ and Stoll. Loyalty is a two way street and disrespecting players loyalty - as it exists in the form of favorable contracts like JJ's - probably has a bigger effect on UFA's than we know.

He takes another shot at Parise in the summer.


Last edited by Duc620: 01-26-2012 at 03:44 PM.
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01-26-2012, 02:34 PM
  #277
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Lyle Richardson reported this morning that the rumored asking price for Ales Hemsky was a 1st rounder + top prospect. He reported that the Oilers asked for Nashville's 1st + Jon Blum from the Preds, which was obviously rejected. It sounds like asking prices are very high right now with the limited amount of definite sellers.

it's spector....so take it for what it is.
It seems like there are more definite sellers at this point than usual, no? That's a hefty price.

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01-26-2012, 02:38 PM
  #278
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If that's the case no wonder no deals are getting done.

It's probably gonna come down right to the deadline.

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01-26-2012, 02:41 PM
  #279
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Jeff Carter is not the answer. Zero character. Look at how he's sulked since being traded. Where's his competitive fire? That's not the guy you hitch your wagon to for the next 10 years.

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01-26-2012, 02:41 PM
  #280
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Would love to see the Oilers screw themselves out of a deal and lose Hemsky for nothing.

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01-26-2012, 02:47 PM
  #281
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Jeff Carter is not the answer. Zero character. Look at how he's sulked since being traded. Where's his competitive fire? That's not the guy you hitch your wagon to for the next 10 years.
We can't have everyone be a character, stand up guy. Eventually we might have to bring in a couple knobs who can score us some goals.

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01-26-2012, 02:51 PM
  #282
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Originally Posted by Ollie Weeks View Post
We can't have everyone be a character, stand up guy. Eventually we might have to bring in a couple knobs who can score us some goals.
His 10 year contract is the deal killer, for me. I don't mind a guy with questionable character but not when they are signed to retirement deals in their late 20s. Where's the motivation to improve his game?

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01-26-2012, 02:54 PM
  #283
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrice View Post
His 10 year contract is the deal killer, for me. I don't mind a guy with questionable character but not when they are signed to retirement deals in their late 20s. Where's the motivation to improve his game?
Would you have no taken Richards either?

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01-26-2012, 02:56 PM
  #284
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Originally Posted by Thrice View Post
His 10 year contract is the deal killer, for me. I don't mind a guy with questionable character but not when they are signed to retirement deals in their late 20s. Where's the motivation to improve his game?
So you want players that play for a paycheck? What good is it to sign a guy to a five year deal if they take off the first four years? You have to trust that they play for more then just money.

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01-26-2012, 02:56 PM
  #285
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Would you have no taken Richards either?
If you don't see a clear and distinct difference between the player Richards is and the player that Carter is, I can't help you.

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01-26-2012, 02:58 PM
  #286
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Would love to see the Oilers screw themselves out of a deal and lose Hemsky for nothing.
Yeah, it's the same lunacy when the asking price from the Kings was Schenn and a 1st round pick.

For Hemsky? They're nuts!

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01-26-2012, 02:58 PM
  #287
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So you want players that play for a paycheck? What good is it to sign a guy to a five year deal if they take off the first four years? You have to trust that they play for more then just money.
news flash: players DO play for a paycheck. Ask any Blue Jackets fan if they're happy having Carter locked up for the next 10 years.

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01-26-2012, 03:00 PM
  #288
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If the Kings don't want to trade for a player like Carter assuming the price is reasonable, they are never going to get a player of that skill level. I feel like you guys are waiting for the perfect player to arise every year and magically sign with the Kings. News flash! The Kings have eyed that player for the last 3 or 4 summers and not once landed the player. The really have NEVER done it unless you count Pavel Demitra.

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01-26-2012, 03:03 PM
  #289
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Originally Posted by Thrice View Post
news flash: players DO play for a paycheck. Ask any Blue Jackets fan if they're happy having Carter locked up for the next 10 years.
Ask any Blue Jackets fan if they are happy with anything about the team.

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01-26-2012, 03:07 PM
  #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrice View Post
If you don't see a clear and distinct difference between the player Richards is and the player that Carter is, I can't help you.
Then your previous statement is false. You said the only hangup was his contract. That is obviously a lie if you turn around and say that contract doesn't matter and it is the player 10 seconds later.... Who is the one that needs help?

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01-26-2012, 03:07 PM
  #291
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If the quality of Carter's play massively declines in the last two years of his contract, he'll be buried. I'd take him, and last season we all would have. I don't see what's changed. His quality of play was just fine when he had his buddy around, and ultimately, quality of play is what gets the job done, not character when you have to play for a bad team you didn't sign up for.

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01-26-2012, 03:19 PM
  #292
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Funny thing is...I think Edmonton, in a manner of speaking, has been flashing their sidearm on Hemsky for at least 2 offseasons now and haven't got ANY takers. I honestly think the guy is just going to

A) walk out of Edmonton for free
B) Remain in Edmonton til retirement and become one of those simply hated players for the fanbase. Oft injured, inconsistent, and yes, soft. Think about what Shawn Horcoff has become. Nobody bit on him in 09 when his contract was up and Edmonton was well out, so they inked him to, IMO a ridiculously stupid contract of 5.5 mil for 6 seasons with a NMC. That's a lot to pay a guy who will be in his mid 30's and averaging 20-30 points...


Hemsky will follow suit.

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01-26-2012, 03:35 PM
  #293
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Originally Posted by Buddy The Elf View Post
If the Kings don't want to trade for a player like Carter assuming the price is reasonable, they are never going to get a player of that skill level. I feel like you guys are waiting for the perfect player to arise every year and magically sign with the Kings. News flash! The Kings have eyed that player for the last 3 or 4 summers and not once landed the player. The really have NEVER done it unless you count Pavel Demitra.
Yuppers.

Parise is a pipe dream; even if you trade for him. He is an East coast guy(Pretty much all Hockey players are).

Parise is not signing with the Kings unless it's big money Think 7.5 to 8m (And term) Rather have Carter at his cap hit.

You would basically have to offer Parise money he could not turn down.

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01-26-2012, 03:37 PM
  #294
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They really badly need two things. A center, and a defensemen.

If you get past Roy and Gaustad (and even he has been bad this year) they really have very little depth or quality at center.

Adam is good but he is inconsistent, since he is a rookie. Lieno they are trying to convert to wing, and he's just been a train wreck at both positions anyways. Hecht is done for the season. That's only 3 centers. Szcezechura is capable, i personally like him but he is honestly their Scott Parse.

if you ask me Stoll would almost be perfect for them if they could get him to resign. a reliable 3rd line center. Who can kill penalties and is good on the draw. Cause right now they have Gaustad and Matt Ellis in the bottom 6, and Ellis isn't even a natural center.

Defense wise, They seem pretty set on having their puck movers be Ehrhoff, Myers, and Gragnani for a long time. The defensive group is a little shaky though with a mix of Leopold, Sekera, Weber, McNabb, Regher...Any trade likely guarantees that Leopold is out of town. Sekera has too good of a contract for what he brings (2.75 over the next 3 years), and Regher just got there. Weber still needs time to learn, so does McNabb and Brennan.

Basically one of Mitchell/Scuds/Greene would be a huge upgrade to what they already have.

All things considered the deal for Stafford probably starts here:

Stoll/Loktionov/Lewis
Greene/Scuds/Mitchell


for

Stafford
If we could deal Lewis and Greene for Stafford, I'd likely have a knee-wobbling orgasm.

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Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
Bummer

It's pretty much not worth it for the Kings to swap roster players. Unless those players are Stoll/Penner/Richardson/Lewis/Westy.

The Kings can't fill the Huge gap SCuds/Mitchell/ Greene would leave. Unless they were trading for some one similiar.
Frankly I'd be happy if the Kings did a deal for Stafford and then turned around and gave Montreal a 2nd for Hal Gill. I think Gill is more clutch in the playoffs than Greene was last year anyways and can log bigger minutes. Plus Gill versus Thornton in the playoffs would be nice to see. You add a guy like Stafford to your 3rd line and Gill to the backend, you are a better team. Much better IMO.

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It is ironic that Kings fans are running around spewing this cancerous talk after so feverishly defending Richards. Suddenly the tabloids were right about Carter, but Richards is a saint.

Bottom line, people need to play some moneyball here. Carter is on a discount contract for the rest of his career and is a 35-40 goal scoring forward for a reasonable price. I don't care about what rumor you want to perpetuate and make up about his character, he ideally addresses this team's greatest need in the most effective manner. I don't see how people can complain when we are getting the Flyers' offense mixed with the Kings' defense and goaltending for a reasonable cost long term. That is a pretty powerful combination to say the least.
Agree Telos. LA needs to pay up. I'm opposed to Nash due to his cap hit, something you and me discussed a lot already, but Carter is on a much better cap hit. Does anyone honestly think for $5.3 million we're going to get anyone better than Carter in UFA? Gagne got $3.5 million coming off two injury plagued sub-20 goal seasons at age 31. If Carter was a UFA this off-season, even with the year he's having now he'd still fetch an easy $5.5 million in UFA, and likely $6.5ish to come out here.

The guy is just now entering his prime years and even on a weaker team in a season when he's actually been pretty banged up, he's scoring at a 27 goal clip. Only Mike Richards is scoring goals at the same clip in LA right now.

I'll take the risk on his contract, no problem. I didn't bat an eyelash on Richards, the same with Carter.

What may play into this is what management thinks of DL's long-term future in the organization. If they are planning on firing him if we don't make the playoffs, I doubt they'd let him go ahead and bring in a 10-year contract. Understandably as well (though I wouldn't fire DL this off-season no matter what happens, but that's a different argument for a different thread).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaygokings View Post
Lyle Richardson reported this morning that the rumored asking price for Ales Hemsky was a 1st rounder + top prospect. He reported that the Oilers asked for Nashville's 1st + Jon Blum from the Preds, which was obviously rejected. It sounds like asking prices are very high right now with the limited amount of definite sellers.

it's spector....so take it for what it is.
That is a crazy asking price, but perfectly understandable. Considering what Edmonton got by holding onto Penner until the bitter end, why would they deal Hemsky for less now, regardless of the season he's having. If Columbus doesn't deal Carter and Parise stays put, Hemsky arguably becomes the best talent available at the trade deadline. I still feel he gets at the very minimum a 2nd and a decent prospect (like a Tyler Toffoli).

The deadline is the worst time to go shopping. You want your picks to get you a lot in a tarde? Do deals in June at the draft, not in mid-February.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buddy The Elf View Post
If the Kings don't want to trade for a player like Carter assuming the price is reasonable, they are never going to get a player of that skill level. I feel like you guys are waiting for the perfect player to arise every year and magically sign with the Kings. News flash! The Kings have eyed that player for the last 3 or 4 summers and not once landed the player. The really have NEVER done it unless you count Pavel Demitra.
Bingo, thanks Elf. Eventually we are going to have to go for a risk, and it's possible this is a chance to buy low on Carter, assuming Dreger is right (which I doubt he is). If we can get Carter for a 1st and a guy like Forbort, I'd do it and hold my breathe Carter doesn't get hurt anymore.

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01-26-2012, 03:43 PM
  #295
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If we want to take a stab at Carter, I hope it could be a quantity over quality thing like offering Lewis, Martinez, Holloway, Zatkoff and a high pick or two. So we are left with basically the same squad.

Won't happen though, so I hope we pass.

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01-26-2012, 03:45 PM
  #296
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Yuppers.

Parise is a pipe dream; even if you trade for him. He is an East coast guy(Pretty much all Hockey players are).

Parise is not signing with the Kings unless it's big money Think 7.5 to 8m (And term) Rather have Carter at his cap hit.

You would basically have to offer Parise money he could not turn down.
I totally agree. People say that they would rather have Parise then Carter....no kidding. The problem is Parise is a UFA who more than likely want to stay out east and if he did sign here it would make Carter's deal look like a bargain.

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01-26-2012, 03:49 PM
  #297
Duc620
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We can't have everyone be a character, stand up guy. Eventually we might have to bring in a couple knobs who can score us some goals.
I have no problem with some jackalope who can score. I don't even have a problem with Carter or any other criminal warrior that might be out there. I'm confident that the core can deal with that in the room and off the ice.

Just don't want those kind of guys that are also locked into contracts over three years (or left on a deal) or so bent in dollars they can't get traded.

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01-26-2012, 03:52 PM
  #298
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I have no problem with some jackalope who can score. I don't even have a problem with Carter or any other criminal warrior that might be out there. I'm confident that the core can deal with that in the room and off the ice.

Just don't want those kind of guys that are also locked into contracts over three years (or left on a deal) or so bent in dollars they can't get traded.
Anyone can be traded or bought out sent down ETC; I don't know why anyone is worried about that.

There will always be a team that has to make salary in the cap era as well.(Florida)

10 years from now it will be some other team.

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01-26-2012, 04:27 PM
  #299
Buddy The Elf
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I totally agree. People say that they would rather have Parise then Carter....no kidding. The problem is Parise is a UFA who more than likely want to stay out east and if he did sign here it would make Carter's deal look like a bargain.

I made the joke about having Parise's brother/sister on the roster. We have the next best thing for Carter, his best friend.

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01-26-2012, 04:30 PM
  #300
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I made the joke about having Parise's brother/sister on the roster. We have the next best thing for Carter, his best friend.
Gagne (even though he is out) pretty much said he woudln't have signed here; the only reason was Williams/Richards.

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