HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > NHL Draft - Prospects
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

NHL Draft - Prospects Discuss hockey prospects from all over the world and the NHL Draft.

Thomas Hickey, a bust?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-27-2012, 01:21 AM
  #76
Asheru
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 646
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
He acted like he didnt want to be out there.
Quote:
Yes hes a AHL allstar. But as anyone who follows the AHL game knows the AHL AS game is more political with who goes to the game.
Mindreading plus a conspiracy theory. Nice.

Asheru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 03:10 AM
  #77
HTFN
Registered User
 
HTFN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,374
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan View Post
Obviously the part you quoted for me was a typo. I meant AHL all-star, not NHL all-star. I don't live in a weird twisted reality.

Also, I would at this moment in time take Scuderi and Mitchell over McDonagh, Alzner and Shattenkirk. In two years, no, but for what the Kings have and are doing, yes. We are a team trying to make the playoffs and go forward from there. You rely on veteran workhorses, not always emerging young guns. Subban is obviously a little different.

We know our team, we aren't just homers. We are the third best defense in the NHl right now for a reason. Scuderi and Mitchell are a big, big part of that and are our key shutdown guys and the glue to a defense that features a lot of youth in Johnson, Doughty, Voynov and Martinez. Today, I'll gladly take Mitchell and Scuderi over Alzner, Shattenkirk and McDonagh. Not two years from now, but today, yes.

And today is when Hickey is competing with those players, not two years from now.
Alzner is already doing what Scuderi does, but better (admittedly less tough).

HTFN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 03:51 AM
  #78
oilsands
shut 'em down.
 
oilsands's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Halland
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,935
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OccupySheen View Post
Kings drafting is pretty overrated....

They've had numerous high picks over the years.

Kopitar is their best pick.
Doughty has underachieved the last two years.
Quick is obviously the best "steal" they've found.

Beyond that, all we heard for years is how much talent they have coming, the Hickey pick, was a typical egotistical Lombardi "i'm going to show everyone how smart I am" move, and unfortunately for him, it has backfired
Doughty just turned 22. He has 148 points in 284 NHL games, which is over 0.5PPG, and he entered the NHL right after his draft year. He has an Olympic medal and Norris considerations in the past.

You don't have a point.

oilsands is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 03:54 AM
  #79
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
 
Frolov 6'3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: The Netherlands
Country: Netherlands
Posts: 9,526
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HTFN View Post
Alzner is already doing what Scuderi does, but better (admittedly less tough).
In every Hickey thread, Caps fans always feel the need to tell everyone how great Alzner is and how bad Hickey is. Well okay...but this takes the cake.

The Kings' defense is (fill in the blanks) x better than the Caps' defense.

Scuderi (probably one of the most underrated defensive defenseman) is part of that and is doing a hell of a job.

Quote:
Originally Posted by oilsands View Post
Doughty just turned 22. He has 148 points in 284 NHL games, which is over 0.5PPG, and he entered the NHL right after his draft year. He has an Olympic medal and Norris considerations in the past.

You don't have a point.
Just read his other posts about the Kings or any other team, than you will understand his point.

Its a song from Metallica, its called "troll & annoy".


Last edited by Frolov 6'3: 01-27-2012 at 03:59 AM.
Frolov 6'3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 04:31 AM
  #80
KEEROLE Vatanen
Based
 
KEEROLE Vatanen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 32,242
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by oilsands View Post
Doughty just turned 22. He has 148 points in 284 NHL games, which is over 0.5PPG, and he entered the NHL right after his draft year. He has an Olympic medal and Norris considerations in the past.

You don't have a point.
Really? even the Kings board has many people that have ripped into him the last 2 years

KEEROLE Vatanen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 05:30 AM
  #81
TopT
Registered User
 
TopT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Georgetown, KY
Country: Cayman Islands
Posts: 1,328
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OccupySheen View Post
Really? even the Kings board has many people that have ripped into him the last 2 years
bashing on the Kings board is a national sport; reading it makes you think Kopi is the worst player in the league

TopT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 05:46 AM
  #82
I am the Liquor
Wrong Way Eberle
 
I am the Liquor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Sunnyvale
Country: Canada
Posts: 36,955
vCash: 1400
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
How many missed a full season and a half due to injury and are only in their 2nd AHL season?
Well, since they are all in the nhl, many right out of their draft years, most others the year after that, they didnt even spend one year in the ahl nevermind two. Missing out on development years due to injuries is unfortunate, but all of the aforementioned group of d are younger than Hickey, and many made it to the nhl straight out of the draft.

The fact Hickey has been surpassed by Voynov on the depth chart speaks volumes.

I am the Liquor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 06:04 AM
  #83
Minor Boarding
Registered User
 
Minor Boarding's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Corleone
Posts: 1,976
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Well, since they are all in the nhl, many right out of their draft years, most others the year after that, they didnt even spend one year in the ahl nevermind two. Missing out on development years due to injuries is unfortunate, but all of the aforementioned group of d are younger than Hickey, and many made it to the nhl straight out of the draft.

The fact Hickey has been surpassed by Voynov on the depth chart speaks volumes.
And yet, you Oilers have players worse than Hickey in your defensive lineup.

Minor Boarding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 06:08 AM
  #84
I am the Liquor
Wrong Way Eberle
 
I am the Liquor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Sunnyvale
Country: Canada
Posts: 36,955
vCash: 1400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minor Boarding View Post
And yet, you Oilers have players worse than Hickey in your defensive lineup.
Which has absolutely nothing to do with anything. The Oilers management are morons. Looks like we agree. Hickey has to be a major disappointment for Kings fans. How could he not be?

I am the Liquor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 06:37 AM
  #85
Bjindaho
Registered User
 
Bjindaho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,850
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
How many missed a full season and a half due to injury and are only in their 2nd AHL season?
He's in his 3rd (as has been pointed out 3 times so far in this thread).

And who cares how many missed time? A lot of those kids are YOUNGER!

You shrug off when people provide you examples that counter your argument because you are trying to use a convenient truth to make this a statement rather than an argument, but Yann Sauve missed most of last year at 20 and still played NHL games (whereas Hickey has had 2 years to recover and still hasn't made it to the NHL).

The long list above are guys who were drafted in LATER years, meaning that they only entered into their team's systems at least a year after Hickey entered into LA's (which would offset the year Hickey missed).

The bigger problem here for most fans is that most of the guys on the list are better than Hickey right now (actually have a viable NHL role that they can play), despite the fact that he was the 4th overall pick in his year.

Bjindaho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 08:22 AM
  #86
Rangers1135
Registered User
 
Rangers1135's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 1,624
vCash: 500
at Mitchell and Scuderi being better than McDonagh, Shattenkirk and Alzner.

Rangers1135 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 08:41 AM
  #87
SFKingshomer
Registered User
 
SFKingshomer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Sioux Falls
Posts: 5,628
vCash: 500
2nd full season, not 3rd. Alzner is not as smart or good as Mitchell or Scuderi yet, neither are Shattenkirk and Mcdonagh

SFKingshomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 09:03 AM
  #88
kingsfan
Yes my liege!
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,558
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HTFN View Post
Alzner is already doing what Scuderi does, but better (admittedly less tough).
As a Caps fan, I'll let you be biased, just as you can assume as a Kings fan I'm biased towards Scuderi. It's a no win argument for both of us, so I'll leave it be. You believe what you want and I'll believe what I want.


Last edited by kingsfan: 01-27-2012 at 10:33 AM.
kingsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 09:04 AM
  #89
SFKingshomer
Registered User
 
SFKingshomer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Sioux Falls
Posts: 5,628
vCash: 500
He's had a strong camp and preseason two years in a row. Only reason he isn't a King is because they don't want him sitting behind 3 very good puck movers and they believe in seniority. Martinez spent 2.5 seasons, the younger Voynov 3, while Hickey is only in his 2nd FULL season due to injury.

SFKingshomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 02:18 PM
  #90
damacles1156
Registered User
 
damacles1156's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,151
vCash: 500
Thomas Hickey is 22 not 26; most Defensemen take a little longer to develop.

He has improved his game every year in Manchester, he was one of the last camp invites to leave the big club.

It is not Thomas hickey's fault Dean Lombardi took him 4th overall. Had Dean took him 10 to 15 (like he should have went). This thread would not have been made.

Blame Dean Lombardi, Not Hickey.

Cause so far Thomas is holding up his end just fine.

damacles1156 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 06:50 PM
  #91
WarriorofTime
HFBoards Sponsor
 
WarriorofTime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 15,140
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
How many missed a full season and a half due to injury and are only in their 2nd AHL season?
Most don't need 2 full years in the AHL. It's technically his 4th overall season in the AHL technically too. 2007 is a long time ago to have not made the NHL yet. Hickey had 2 years to develop in the WHL after getting drafted too.

If he's not a bust I don't know what is. Some people seem to think a player has to hit 30 before they can be evaluated.

WarriorofTime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 07:21 PM
  #92
WarriorofTime
HFBoards Sponsor
 
WarriorofTime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 15,140
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
Thomas Hickey is 22 not 26; most Defensemen take a little longer to develop.

He has improved his game every year in Manchester, he was one of the last camp invites to leave the big club.

It is not Thomas hickey's fault Dean Lombardi took him 4th overall. Had Dean took him 10 to 15 (like he should have went). This thread would not have been made.

Blame Dean Lombardi, Not Hickey.

Cause so far Thomas is holding up his end just fine.
I disagree. Alex Plante is also a bust. He was drafted 15th by the Oilers that same year. He has played in 10 games (3 this year, 3 last year, 4 the year before) for the Oilers. He is also a Defenseman who played in the WHL. He is in his third year in the AHL.

At this point players should be showing something to prove they are full time NHL players. Hickey plays in the AHL and has not even earned a callup in his career. A lot of guys younger than him have played in the NHL and are regulars on their team in big roles. As great as Rob Scuderi is if you have a really good defenseman beneath him you move him for that young player. Ditto with a guy like Alec Martinez, a 4th round pick from the same draft as Hickey. He's not even a top defensive prospect for the Kings with Voynov (drafted 2nd year a year after Hickey) ahead of him.

If he's not a bust you're awfully generous with what you consider a bust.

WarriorofTime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 07:33 PM
  #93
Kershaw
 
Kershaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Country:
Posts: 25,511
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
2nd full season, not 3rd. Alzner is not as smart or good as Mitchell or Scuderi yet, neither are Shattenkirk and Mcdonagh
Lay down the pipe. McDonagh is playing 25 mins per game on the best defensive team in the league. Mitchell and Scuderi are good, but I doubt they'd crack the Rangers top 4, let alone being noted as being better than McDonagh.

Kershaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 07:41 PM
  #94
Holden Caulfield
Moderator
The Eternal Skeptic
 
Holden Caulfield's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,900
vCash: 500
I think Thomas Hickey is going to be an NHL player in the mold of a Greg Zanon or Mike Weaver type. Not very big, but real solid defensively, shot blocker, character bottom pairing guy. Zanon became an NHL regular at 26, Weaver at 27.

For sure not what you are looking for at #4 in the draft, but he will play in the NHL, IMO.

Holden Caulfield is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 07:50 PM
  #95
WarriorofTime
HFBoards Sponsor
 
WarriorofTime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 15,140
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holden Caulfield View Post
I think Thomas Hickey is going to be an NHL player in the mold of a Greg Zanon or Mike Weaver type. Not very big, but real solid defensively, shot blocker, character bottom pairing guy. Zanon became an NHL regular at 26, Weaver at 27.

For sure not what you are looking for at #4 in the draft, but he will play in the NHL, IMO.
Assuming he spends the next four years working really hard in the AHL and developing into a character guy. Greg Zanon was a 5th round pick as a 20 year old after playing one season in the NCAA. He played 3 more seasons after getting drafted. At 22 he was in his senior year at the University of Nebraska-Omaha. He wasn't playing CHL hockey at 16 and a top 4 pick who was in the AHL for 3 seasons already. He didn't enter the AHL until 23. Mike Weaver was undrafted and signed by the Atlanta Thrashers after a four year NCAA career at Michigan State at the age of 22. They're not comparable situations.

WarriorofTime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 08:00 PM
  #96
Holden Caulfield
Moderator
The Eternal Skeptic
 
Holden Caulfield's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,900
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WarriorofTime View Post
Assuming he spends the next four years working really hard in the AHL and developing into a character guy. Greg Zanon was a 5th round pick as a 20 year old after playing one season in the NCAA. He played 3 more seasons after getting drafted. At 22 he was in his senior year at the University of Nebraska-Omaha. He wasn't playing CHL hockey at 16 and a top 4 pick who was in the AHL for 3 seasons already. He didn't enter the AHL until 23. Mike Weaver was undrafted and signed by the Atlanta Thrashers after a four year NCAA career at Michigan State at the age of 22. They're not comparable situations.
I knew they were both NCAA guys, which does make their ages older since they come out of school later. Hickey is a great character guy right now, very good defensively, and probably could step in on the bottom pairing with several teams. Maybe I should have said that both Weaver and Zanon spent the bulk of 3 seasons in the minors before moving on to the NHL? I think Hickey will take the next step in the next year or two, and will be a similiar type of player to those two, after 3-4 AHL seasons. Only reason I included Zanon's and Weaver's ages was to show that Hickey still had plenty of time to establish himself as that type of D.

Again, yes he is a huge disappointment at #4, but I still think he will be an NHLer, albeit a bottom pairing smallish defensive defenseman.

Holden Caulfield is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 10:10 PM
  #97
HTFN
Registered User
 
HTFN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,374
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan View Post
As a Caps fan, I'll let you be biased, just as you can assume as a Kings fan I'm biased towards Scuderi. It's a no win argument for both of us, so I'll leave it be. You believe what you want and I'll believe what I want.
Fewer offensive zone starts, a higher quality of competition, very similar Corsi and he has a better goal differential as well. This wasn't just something I would say without some semblance of evidence.

HTFN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 10:16 PM
  #98
damacles1156
Registered User
 
damacles1156's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,151
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WarriorofTime View Post
I disagree. Alex Plante is also a bust. He was drafted 15th by the Oilers that same year. He has played in 10 games (3 this year, 3 last year, 4 the year before) for the Oilers. He is also a Defenseman who played in the WHL. He is in his third year in the AHL.

At this point players should be showing something to prove they are full time NHL players. Hickey plays in the AHL and has not even earned a callup in his career. A lot of guys younger than him have played in the NHL and are regulars on their team in big roles. As great as Rob Scuderi is if you have a really good defenseman beneath him you move him for that young player. Ditto with a guy like Alec Martinez, a 4th round pick from the same draft as Hickey. He's not even a top defensive prospect for the Kings with Voynov (drafted 2nd year a year after Hickey) ahead of him.

If he's not a bust you're awfully generous with what you consider a bust.
Plenty of NHL defensemen didn't even make the Show till mid 20's. If people consider a 22 year old a bust. Then more than half the AHL and NHL (Current players) are busts.

I consider a guy a bust when:
A: He is no longer able to play hockey (and never made the show).
B: Is a career AHL person past the age of 25
C: His skill set will never translate to the NHL.


Thomas Hickey doesn't meet any of that criteria

Once again if he was picked 10th to 15th or later. We wouldn't be having this discussion. First of all no one but Kings fans would even care, everyone would just assume he is like every AHL person trying to develop.

But since he was slelected in the top Five, Everyone can't wait to pile on the guy.


Last edited by damacles1156: 01-27-2012 at 10:22 PM.
damacles1156 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 10:25 PM
  #99
darko
Registered User
 
darko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Country: Australia
Posts: 52,746
vCash: 500
He's what, 22 years old. Too early to call him a bust.

darko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-27-2012, 10:42 PM
  #100
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hôlle
Posts: 28,449
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
Thomas Hickey is 22 not 26; most Defensemen take a little longer to develop.

He has improved his game every year in Manchester, he was one of the last camp invites to leave the big club.

It is not Thomas hickey's fault Dean Lombardi took him 4th overall. Had Dean took him 10 to 15 (like he should have went). This thread would not have been made.

Blame Dean Lombardi, Not Hickey.

Cause so far Thomas is holding up his end just fine.
I would have made the thread because Hickey would still be considered a bust on the Kings page on hockeysfuture.

MXD is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:57 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2016 All Rights Reserved.