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Thomas Hickey, a bust?

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01-31-2012, 05:58 PM
  #201
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Went by Mckenzie stating 3 teams, 1 including the Kings had him in their top 5. Reading is good...
You have a link to any of this or are we supposed to take your word for it? Not that it matters much, since you already said you go by McKenzie, accept when it doesnt suit your argument apparently.

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01-31-2012, 06:01 PM
  #202
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Draft position is the only reason many label him a bust. Had he been taking 13th, he'd still be a legit prospect. 22 years old is still very young for a defenseman who missed time due to injury and is only in his 2nd pro season.

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01-31-2012, 06:04 PM
  #203
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
You have a link to any of this or are we supposed to take your word for it? Not that it matters much, since you already said you go by McKenzie, accept when it doesnt suit your argument apparently.
He said it at the draft and it's been talked about for years. BOS, LA and 1 other team felt he was a top 5 pick. It was probably STL because Jarmo Kekalainen loved the Hickey pick, commenting about it during the Blues 07 behind the scenes draft special...

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01-31-2012, 06:07 PM
  #204
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I believe he has to clear waivers if LA tries to send him to the AHL next season so he's probably going to replace Martinez or be traded.

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01-31-2012, 06:31 PM
  #205
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Because players from the 07 draft are just scratching the surface and we have yet to see who will have the best career? I could care less about the pick. They felt he was the BPA and filled a need and it hasn't set them back at all. They still have a ton of depth on defense and if Hickey develops into a 2nd pairing guy it will be icing on the cake.
With the way he has developed, I don't know how anyone can be too optimistic about his development. I don't care that he has been injured and that the Kings have a lot of depth, he hasn't really developed at all since he was drafted.

I don't see how the pick can be rationalized now. It was a very questionable pick at the time (and given where McKenzie had Hickey ranked, I would gladly bet that most NHL teams didn't think of him as a top 5 pick), and at this point, and the guy who most expected the Kings to pick at the time (Alzner) has turned out to be a much better player.

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01-31-2012, 06:48 PM
  #206
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Draft position is the only reason many label him a bust. Had he been taking 13th, he'd still be a legit prospect. 22 years old is still very young for a defenseman who missed time due to injury and is only in his 2nd pro season.
Alex Plante was taken 15th. Is he still a legit prospect?

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01-31-2012, 06:58 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by ocarina View Post
With the way he has developed, I don't know how anyone can be too optimistic about his development. I don't care that he has been injured and that the Kings have a lot of depth, he hasn't really developed at all since he was drafted.

I don't see how the pick can be rationalized now. It was a very questionable pick at the time (and given where McKenzie had Hickey ranked, I would gladly bet that most NHL teams didn't think of him as a top 5 pick), and at this point, and the guy who most expected the Kings to pick at the time (Alzner) has turned out to be a much better player.
He has developed (Hickey just played in the AHL all-star game) just not at the pace that was hoped. There are a number of organizations with which Hickey would be playing in the NHL, just like Voynov could have played in the NHL last season.

Development is good, I don't see the point in rushing defensemen or goalies especially. The more time you can give them, the better.

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01-31-2012, 07:01 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by ocarina View Post
With the way he has developed, I don't know how anyone can be too optimistic about his development. I don't care that he has been injured and that the Kings have a lot of depth, he hasn't really developed at all since he was drafted.

I don't see how the pick can be rationalized now. It was a very questionable pick at the time (and given where McKenzie had Hickey ranked, I would gladly bet that most NHL teams didn't think of him as a top 5 pick), and at this point, and the guy who most expected the Kings to pick at the time (Alzner) has turned out to be a much better player.
He's improved every season. He was a PPG in his first 7 AHL games, all of which were playoff games. Hextall said this about him after his 2nd injury...

Hickey was hurt for a long stretch this year, and he had a bit of a rough start to the year. He got hurt for quite a long period of time, but he started playing in Game 3 and he played extremely well. He had a real presence with the puck. He ran our power play and, quite frankly, after he had only played four or five games in 4 1/2 months, he shocked me with the type of poise and confidence that he came in with. In Game 6, he was outstanding. He wanted the puck the whole night against Hershey. He ran our power play and did a real good job.

Then last year he struggled a bit but this year he's been much better and put up solid offensive numbers considering Manchester's brutal offensive ability. He'd likely be a 40+ pt. defenseman on a halfway decent offensive team. Doubtful Lombardi and staff have given up on the kid and I bet they have turned down offers for him.

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01-31-2012, 07:53 PM
  #209
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Alex Plante was taken 15th. Is he still a legit prospect?
Crickets.
And did Hickey make the AHL all star team?
Plante did.

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01-31-2012, 08:00 PM
  #210
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Originally Posted by Alybaba View Post
Crickets.
And did Hickey make the AHL all star team?
Plante did.
Yep.

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01-31-2012, 08:03 PM
  #211
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Originally Posted by Alybaba View Post
Crickets.
And did Hickey make the AHL all star team?
Plante did.
Yup he did

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01-31-2012, 08:21 PM
  #212
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Yup he did
Thats awesome.
I guess hes on about the same footing then.
But maybe not. Plante has actually got in a few NHL games.

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01-31-2012, 08:37 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by Alybaba View Post
Thats awesome.
I guess hes on about the same footing then.
But maybe not. Plante has actually got in a few NHL games.
Their situations arent comparible at all. Edmontons D is among the worst while LA has one of the best. Teubert made his NHL debut with the Oil while he was about 7th on LAs prospect defense chart a year ago and LA considered him a long ways away from being NHL ready

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01-31-2012, 09:18 PM
  #214
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Their situations arent comparible at all. Edmontons D is among the worst while LA has one of the best. Teubert made his NHL debut with the Oil while he was about 7th on LAs prospect defense chart a year ago and LA considered him a long ways away from being NHL ready
Come on now. Your trying to tell me that with such luninaries as Drew Drewiske, Peter Harrold, Jake Muzzin & Alec Martinez playing a combined 98 games over the last 1 1/2 seasons, if Hickey was anything but an abject flop he wouldn have got in?
Yeah sure. Its not like GM's, if there is any possibe way to get a highh pick into the lineup, they wont move heaven & earth to get them in , so they dont look like a donkey, which Lombrdi certainly does on this.

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01-31-2012, 09:34 PM
  #215
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Originally Posted by Alybaba View Post
Come on now. Your trying to tell me that with such luninaries as Drew Drewiske, Peter Harrold, Jake Muzzin & Alec Martinez playing a combined 98 games over the last 1 1/2 seasons, if Hickey was anything but an abject flop he wouldn have got in?
Yeah sure. Its not like GM's, if there is any possibe way to get a highh pick into the lineup, they wont move heaven & earth to get them in , so they dont look like a donkey, which Lombrdi certainly does on this.
Its called development, wow. Young players are better off logging big minutes in the minors rather than play limited minutes in the NHL. Those mentioned are older and or more physically mature or did their due dilligence in the AHL

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01-31-2012, 11:43 PM
  #216
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Originally Posted by Alybaba View Post
Come on now. Your trying to tell me that with such luninaries as Drew Drewiske, Peter Harrold, Jake Muzzin & Alec Martinez playing a combined 98 games over the last 1 1/2 seasons, if Hickey was anything but an abject flop he wouldn have got in?
Yeah sure. Its not like GM's, if there is any possibe way to get a highh pick into the lineup, they wont move heaven & earth to get them in , so they dont look like a donkey, which Lombrdi certainly does on this.
Drewiske, Harrold and Martinez are sitting as healthy scratches and get into about one in every ten games typically (Martinez ws a regular until Voynov came up when Doughty was hurt and kept the spot, forcing Martinez to the bench).

Why would the Kings recall Hickey to sit as a scratch like these guys? It's better he play 20+ minutes in the AHL than eat popcorn in the press box in the NHL.

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02-01-2012, 11:31 AM
  #217
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Its called development, wow. Young players are better off logging big minutes in the minors rather than play limited minutes in the NHL. Those mentioned are older and or more physically mature or did their due dilligence in the AHL
Insiders will quietly tell you that any player who plays more than 1 season in the AHL isn't going to be anything special. There's plenty of exceptions to this rule but rarely do they come in the form of top 5 draft picks as those guys are ahead in their development. Hickey's had five years to develop. The fact that people blame a 4 month injury for why he's not in the NHL speaks volumes about the excuses some make. LA isn't the greatest defensive core assembled, if Hickey could help the team win he would be up and playing on the third pair. He's just not that good.

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02-01-2012, 11:37 AM
  #218
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great. none of those 4 would be able to crack our top 4 right now anyway. im fine with letting Hickey develop more and more. I'm not a Hickey fan, but there's no reason he couldn't become a poor man's Brian Rafalski, who didn't even play an NHL game until he was 26.
McDonagh and Shattenkirk would crack the top 4? Doughty Johnson and what Greene? Granted I don't watch the west as much but from what I have seen and looking at the roster what other defenseman would be better than those two? Mcdonagh is our #2 defenseman right now playing ahead of Marc Staal.

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02-01-2012, 11:53 AM
  #219
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Originally Posted by WarriorofTime View Post
Insiders will quietly tell you that any player who plays more than 1 season in the AHL isn't going to be anything special. There's plenty of exceptions to this rule but rarely do they come in the form of top 5 draft picks as those guys are ahead in their development. Hickey's had five years to develop. The fact that people blame a 4 month injury for why he's not in the NHL speaks volumes about the excuses some make. LA isn't the greatest defensive core assembled, if Hickey could help the team win he would be up and playing on the third pair. He's just not that good.
He had a major shoulder and ankle injury and is only in his 2nd ahl season. 22 is plenty young for a defenseman. Reading is fun

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02-01-2012, 11:57 AM
  #220
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Agree to disagree with this premature thread. Plenty of others similar age not labled a bust because of their draft position. Disappointment thus far? Sure, but not close to a bust.

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02-01-2012, 12:28 PM
  #221
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Manchester is brutal offensively which is part of Hickey's problem. He's been better this year and made the AS team but injuries have set him back for sure. He's still young and should get his shot soon. If he's a bust then so is a guy like Eric Tangradi who is the same age and hasn't done jack in the NHL despite playing an easier position to learn.
So what. Look at the other players that made the team. Hell, Alex Plante(15th in 07) made the AS team and most Oiler fans just hope he becomes a 6/7th physical defenseman. He's a bust as well for a 1st round pick.

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02-01-2012, 12:42 PM
  #222
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Why are Kings fans defending the Hickey pick? They should be furious.

Wouldn't it have been wonderful to draft Voracek instead and used HIM to get Richards instead of Schenn? Or have drafted Couture and not even needed to acquire Richards?

Wasting a top 5 pick is an absolute tragedy. Terrible asset management by Lombardi and the fact that most Kings fans can't see that speaks volumes about them (and not in a good way).

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02-01-2012, 01:38 PM
  #223
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McDonagh and Shattenkirk would crack the top 4? Doughty Johnson and what Greene? Granted I don't watch the west as much but from what I have seen and looking at the roster what other defenseman would be better than those two? Mcdonagh is our #2 defenseman right now playing ahead of Marc Staal.
Matt Greene is a physical defensive defender (who ranks in top5 in hits for defensman) that is excelling in the defensive roles - ie. PK, boxing out the slot, cleaning away the rebounds. He has also a mean streak in him and plays very physical along the boards. He is also a great shot blocker who once blocked a shot with his face (also got once hit by a truck) and then went to congratulate Quick and after that proceeded to get treatment...

Pic says all:



As for the Kings drafting Hickey fail etc. In hindsight, Lombardi should've drafted Couture but Lombardi can't predict future to know that he's gonna get Doughty/Voynov in his next draft.

Also Hickey is a player, whose two biggest obstacles to the NHL were his tiny frame (he has heavily bulked up since his draft tho) and the fact that he tried to overdue things (end-to-end rushes, often jumping on play) which would not translate well to NHL.
However he is a hard worker and a great skater and while he won't be a top pairing defender, he should be a Beauchemin kind of defensman.

Here is a nice video of his skating abilities and he looks way more physical mature.



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02-01-2012, 02:05 PM
  #224
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Originally Posted by tomd View Post
Why are Kings fans defending the Hickey pick? They should be furious.

Wouldn't it have been wonderful to draft Voracek instead and used HIM to get Richards instead of Schenn? Or have drafted Couture and not even needed to acquire Richards?

Wasting a top 5 pick is an absolute tragedy. Terrible asset management by Lombardi and the fact that most Kings fans can't see that speaks volumes about them (and not in a good way).
You cant automatically assume we would have Schenn if we drafted Voracek

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02-01-2012, 02:33 PM
  #225
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
You cant automatically assume we would have Schenn if we drafted Voracek
God, you have an answer for everything!

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