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What are some interesting players to target?

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Old
02-01-2012, 10:59 AM
  #76
Monctonscout
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Originally Posted by gillyguzzler View Post
Just like Carter, Plekanec is going through a rough stretch. But the Plekanec that we saw yesterday is a pale shade of the Plekanec from last year and from the first 25 games this year. There's something OFF with him now but he's a better player than what he's showing us. GMs know that.

That being said, I'd do a Plek, Weber and 2nd for Carter.
What I really hate about taht deal is...

1-For Carter's better numbers Plekanec is a much better all around player, Carter is not on his level as a playmaker, PK guy or defensively.

2-you trade a quality guy who has excelled here for a guy that weas moved from Phille because he enjoyed the nightlife a bit too much(see Higgins).

3-you have a group of big wingers that are more shooters than playmakers and you get a shoot first center

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02-01-2012, 11:03 AM
  #77
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Go get Getzlaf whether it be veterans like Plekanec or young players like Eller or Kristo,yes he only has 1 year left on contract if he doesn't want to re-sign he would bring way more back than Plekanec you could flip him to florida for Jonathan Huberdeau or go after Eakin and Koznetsov with the caps,impact player star players don't settle for mediocrity.

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02-01-2012, 11:05 AM
  #78
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For my money the whole point of acquiring Carter would be to have Plekanec share the tough minutes so you could let Carter loose against second toughs (or vice-versa). That'd give you a credible alternative to Gomez and let you use DD and Eller against the bottom of opposing lineups, where they'd wreck face.

If you have to trade Plekanec to get Carter, it's just not worth it. You're not really strengthening your center line much at all.

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02-01-2012, 11:13 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
For my money the whole point of acquiring Carter would be to have Plekanec share the tough minutes so you could let Carter loose against second toughs (or vice-versa). That'd give you a credible alternative to Gomez and let you use DD and Eller against the bottom of opposing lineups, where they'd wreck face.

If you have to trade Plekanec to get Carter, it's just not worth it. You're not really strengthening your center line much at all.
You're also tying yourself to a ten year deal. I don't think trading Pleks for Carter makes sense either. And Carter's struggling. It would be another case of taking somebody else's problems off their hands.

It would be one thing to gamble on him returning to form, it's a whole other ball of wax to give up a guy like Pleks in order to take that gamble. No way should we be paying a premium on a guy who's struggling with a huge contract. We've seen that movie before and it didn't end well.

I'd prefer we just stay away from Carter altogether right now. Big contract, low numbers, got dealt from Philly and rumours of him having a bad attitude. We've had enough of that for a while now.

Once again, we're better off going the draft route.

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02-01-2012, 11:20 AM
  #80
Em Ancien
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I'm amazed people want to acquire those 9-10 year deals when you see guys like Richards (both actually), Carter, Ehrhoff, Bryzgalov, Lecavalier and probably quite a few more greatly underachieve when you're just at the start of that contract.

I hope people realize Gomez has only done 3 years. You'd have 6-7 more of that.

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02-01-2012, 11:23 AM
  #81
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Carter Available. Is He The Center We've Been Looking For?

And what would you offer if you were Habs management, if anything?

http://spectorshockey.net/wordpress/2012/02/01/nhl-trade-rumors-february-1-2012/

Aaron Portzline and Dreger confirm Carter is on the trade block.

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Old
02-01-2012, 11:26 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
And what would you offer if you were Habs management, if anything?

http://spectorshockey.net/wordpress/...bruary-1-2012/

Aaron Portzline and Dreger confirm Carter is on the trade block.
Well, okay.

But they have to agree to taking Max and Beaulieu on the return.

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Old
02-01-2012, 11:28 AM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
And what would you offer if you were Habs management, if anything?

http://spectorshockey.net/wordpress/...bruary-1-2012/

Aaron Portzline and Dreger confirm Carter is on the trade block.
That's like confirming Gomez is on the trading block. Terrible contracts will always be available.

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02-01-2012, 11:30 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by halloffame44 View Post
Go get Getzlaf whether it be veterans like Plekanec or young players like Eller or Kristo,yes he only has 1 year left on contract if he doesn't want to re-sign he would bring way more back than Plekanec you could flip him to florida for Jonathan Huberdeau or go after Eakin and Koznetsov with the caps,impact player star players don't settle for mediocrity.
I don't get what you're trying to say?

First Getzlaf will cost more than Plekanec straight up, they'd want Subban or a 1st plus a prospect.

Two, what's the point of trading a pile of assets for Getzlaf only to flip him elswhere next year.

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02-01-2012, 11:34 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by PATCHESx67 View Post
Trade

Travis Moen For 2012 2nd Round Pick
Hall Gill For 2012 3rd Round Pick
Chris Campoli For 2012 4th Round Pick
Andrei Kostitsyn Only If You Get A First + Prospect ( If Not Re-Sign Him )
MTL 2012 1st Round Pick ( Top 10 ) + 2013 CGY 2nd Round Pick + 2012 3rd Round Pick For 2012 2nd Overall ( Draft Mikhael Grigorenko )
Thomas Plekanec + Andrei Kostitsyn For Bobby Ryan + 3rd Round Pick

RFA

Carey Price
PK Subban
Lars Eller
Ryan White
Mike Blunden
Raphael Diaz
Alexei Emelin


UFA

Ryan Suter
Tuomo Ruutu
Paul Gaustad

Minors

Gomez To Hamilton



2012-2013 Montreal Canadiens

Patches - DD - Cole
B Ryan - Grigorenko - Gionta
Ruutu - Eller - Bourque
Darche - Gaustad - White

Suter - Markov
Gorges - Subban
Emelin - Diaz

Price
Sorry but why does any team give up the 2nd overall for that?

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Old
02-01-2012, 11:35 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
That's like confirming Gomez is on the trading block. Terrible contracts will always be available.
I'm not a big Carter fan(I find him overrated) but his contract is not bad at all, not in the same stratosphere as Gomez or Lecavalier for sure. His cap hit is excellent(5.27/yaer) if he is putting up 35-40 goals. Term is a bit long but the last 3 years he only makes 7 mil total and he'll be 35, 36 and 37 and probably still productive.

What makes him a poor fit for us is they'll want big return after having given Phillie Voracek and Couturier to get him. Plus he is a shoot first guy and our wingers are the same.

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02-01-2012, 11:37 AM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I'm not a big Carter fan(I find him overrated) but his contract is not bad at all, not in the same stratosphere as Gomez or Lecavalier for sure. His cap hit is excellent(5.27/yaer) if he is putting up 35-40 goals. Term is a bit long but the last 3 years he only makes 7 mil total and he'll be 35, 36 and 37 and probably still productive.

What makes him a poor fit for us is they'll want big return after having given Phillie Voracek and Couturier to get him. Plus he is a shoot first guy and our wingers are the same.
How can you say Carter is overrated but Plekanec is not?

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02-01-2012, 11:52 AM
  #88
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IMO, and as much as I love the guy, we have to move Gionta. An average player, an average captain. We need better players in our top 6.

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02-01-2012, 11:54 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
How can you say Carter is overrated but Plekanec is not?
Pleks is a strong 2nd line center and that's probably what Carter is. The difference is in the contracts.

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02-01-2012, 12:28 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I'm not a big Carter fan(I find him overrated) but his contract is not bad at all, not in the same stratosphere as Gomez or Lecavalier for sure. His cap hit is excellent(5.27/yaer) if he is putting up 35-40 goals. Term is a bit long but the last 3 years he only makes 7 mil total and he'll be 35, 36 and 37 and probably still productive.
From an article about the Belanger signing:

Between 2005-06 and 2007-08, 62 33 year old forwards played 3949 NHL games. Between 2008-09 and 2010-11, 36 year old forwards played 1975 NHL games. So about a 50% decline in games played. Slice it another way. 35 33 year olds played 70+ games in the period in question. 15 of those guys didnít last to play an age 36 season. So a 57% survival rate of guys who managed 70+ games in a season.
http://www.mc79hockey.com/?p=4163

So there's a good chance Carter won't even be good/healthy enough to be an NHL'er in the last two years of his deal. If that happens, he may or may not choose to retire - the team would be at his mercy.

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02-01-2012, 12:58 PM
  #91
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IMO, and as much as I love the guy, we have to move Gionta. An average player, an average captain. We need better players in our top 6.
I agree to an extent but with his sub-par season and the injury that ended it, he'll have very little value and we still need NHL caliber players for next year ; I think AK and Moen are goners so I say keep Gio unless a surprisingly good offer comes along.

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02-01-2012, 01:03 PM
  #92
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A very long deal IS a big risk element, but: what's the cap going to be in the last two years of the deal? It's not the dollars that are important, it's the percentage of total cap.

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02-01-2012, 01:07 PM
  #93
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A very long deal IS a big risk element, but: what's the cap going to be in the last two years of the deal? It's not the dollars that are important, it's the percentage of total cap.
And really... there's no way to predict what it will look like 10 years from now. I don't see getting Carter as being part of a strategic plan. I see it as what it really would be... a gamble. And I think the downside of that gamble outweighs the reward.

Kyle Turris on the other hand... that would've been a gamble that I think would be worth taking.

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02-01-2012, 01:07 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
And really... there's no way to predict what it will look like 10 years from now.
We can make educated guesses though, and the cap has gone up every year since it was introduced.

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02-01-2012, 01:10 PM
  #95
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We can make educated guesses though, and the cap has gone up every year since it was introduced.
That's true. But when I look at the economy, I see very dark clouds ahead. I realize that's outside the world of hockey but if the economy goes 'boom' then contracts like these will be a killer.

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02-01-2012, 01:25 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
That's true. But when I look at the economy, I see very dark clouds ahead. I realize that's outside the world of hockey but if the economy goes 'boom' then contracts like these will be a killer.
The economy already went boom, several times. Interest rates are still super-low in the States and so on about a bunch of other depressing things - all we gotta consider is if the Canadian economy is every going to burst and it doesn't look likely at all.

The cap will at the very very worst plateau, that's how it's designed.

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02-01-2012, 01:28 PM
  #97
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Considering the price of players right now we may very well have to concede to the fact we have to opt for a bad contract and various other risks of getting a player like Jeff Carter, not long after his drinking issues surfaced Jeff Carter was deemed untouchable now no one wants him, sounds like Gomez pre Sather contract days...

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02-01-2012, 01:32 PM
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
What I really hate about taht deal is...

1-For Carter's better numbers Plekanec is a much better all around player, Carter is not on his level as a playmaker, PK guy or defensively.

2-you trade a quality guy who has excelled here for a guy that weas moved from Phille because he enjoyed the nightlife a bit too much(see Higgins).

3-you have a group of big wingers that are more shooters than playmakers and you get a shoot first center
My God, have you seen Plekanec play during the last 2 or 3 months??? PK... yes, he's very good. Defensively? Worst +- on the team. Playmaker? You have to be kidding!

The Plekanec from last year was excellent. He is playing terrible terrible hockey right now (unless he is on the PK).

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02-01-2012, 01:47 PM
  #99
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The economy already went boom, several times. Interest rates are still super-low in the States and so on about a bunch of other depressing things - all we gotta consider is if the Canadian economy is every going to burst and it doesn't look likely at all.

The cap will at the very very worst plateau, that's how it's designed.
Maybe.

But right now the Devils are on life support via the NHL and there are a few other clubs out there having problems paying the bills. Not all of them can move to Quebec City. Sooner or later this could have an effect on things.

Ten years is a long, long time. Would we have known that there would have even been a salary cap ten years ago? No. But it's been here for five or six years now.

And even forgetting about the cap, Carter could get hurt and we could be stuck with a maimed player for the next decade. And buying out a contract like that would be murder. We'd be paying it out for the next century.

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02-01-2012, 01:56 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Maybe.

But right now the Devils are on life support via the NHL and there are a few other clubs out there having problems paying the bills. Not all of them can move to Quebec City. Sooner or later this could have an effect on things.

Ten years is a long, long time. Would we have known that there would have even been a salary cap ten years ago? No. But it's been here for five or six years now.

And even forgetting about the cap, Carter could get hurt and we could be stuck with a maimed player for the next decade. And buying out a contract like that would be murder. We'd be paying it out for the next century.
I'm all for reasonableness, which is why I don't think Carey Price is worth 7/49m , but being afraid of the future is a bad move. We've needed a 1st line centre for more than a decade now, Carter and Pleks (+DD/Eller) would be rather attractive, wouldn't it?

Philly commits to huge deals and manages to get out of them, Boston does it, Chicago, Pittsburgh and Detroit do it. We should do it too.

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