I think this slump is purely on the OFFENSIVE side of the puck. Reading through this thread and reading words like 'awful' to describe AA's play made me cringe a little. It even inspired me to look up some stats. AA has 6 giveaways on the season (http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...tssPlayerStats) which averages to .12 GvA/game which leads the team by a pretty considerable margin (next closest are guys getting 5 minute TOI like Rupp and Bickel). If he were having a 'mental breakdown' I would expect this number to be higher.
It's an offensive slump, hopefully he can get out of it and stay out. He's still very young and if he can minimize these slumps and eventually eliminate them from his game he will be one heck of a player.
I think this slump is purely on the OFFENSIVE side of the puck. Reading through this thread and reading words like 'awful' to describe AA's play made me cringe a little. It even inspired me to look up some stats. AA has 6 giveaways on the season (http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...tssPlayerStats) which averages to .12 GvA/game which leads the team by a pretty considerable margin (next closest are guys getting 5 minute TOI like Rupp and Bickel). If he were having a 'mental breakdown' I would expect this number to be higher.
It's an offensive slump, hopefully he can get out of it and stay out. He's still very young and if he can minimize these slumps and eventually eliminate them from his game he will be one heck of a player.
As has Dubi, I was hoping both would have a consistent season, but having neither one on their complete games right now reflects the goal scoring drought the team is facing.
Great game for AA last night. Stop trading the kid.
Leave Dubi alone too, pleeaase. Both are responsive to so-called Torts coaching and both, unlike myself, love being under Torts. They are here to stay.
Torts would trade Staal before those two. As for me, I'd rather trade anyone from moving "Notices" line above should we need help by the trade dead line.
I think this slump is purely on the OFFENSIVE side of the puck. Reading through this thread and reading words like 'awful' to describe AA's play made me cringe a little. It even inspired me to look up some stats. AA has 6 giveaways on the season (http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...tssPlayerStats) which averages to .12 GvA/game which leads the team by a pretty considerable margin (next closest are guys getting 5 minute TOI like Rupp and Bickel). If he were having a 'mental breakdown' I would expect this number to be higher.
It's an offensive slump, hopefully he can get out of it and stay out. He's still very young and if he can minimize these slumps and eventually eliminate them from his game he will be one heck of a player.
Great game for AA last night. Stop trading the kid.
Leave Dubi alone too, pleeaase. Both are responsive to so-called Torts coaching and both, unlike myself, love being under Torts. They are here to stay.
Torts would trade Staal before those two. As for me, I'd rather trade anyone from moving "Notices" line above should we need help by the trade dead line.
The main reason we should not trade these two now is that there would not be a high return. Both are good players to have on a team, neither a difference maker.
Two years ago, either one might have been centerpiece to a package for a legitimate player when there was still hope they might grow.
They both ARE what they are. AA is a 40 point player, good defnder, Dubi is the same + 10 points and a bit more consistent. These players are fairly easy to come by around the league.
I am not dumping on them by any means, just hoping that the "AA, Sauer, WW for Bobby ryan" insanity will stop. Anaheim hangs up on Sather if that is his package.
That's why you try to compare Callahan and Dubinsky solely on the basis of offensive production, when the biggest differences between the two are in their play away from the puck. I implore you, seek out someone who you think is credible when it comes to this sport. Ask anyone intimately involved with this sport who watches Rangers hockey, "Callahan or Dubinsky?" You won't like the answer you get. In practically every aspect of the game, Callahan is a much better player than Dubinsky.
First, I'm not, nor have I ever, compared Callahan and Dubinsky based solely on offensive production. You compare the two based on that this season (because it suits you) and dismiss it in previous seasons (because it doesn't suit you). That was the whole point of this stupid argument between us. I asked for consistency from you, and you pitched a tantrum.
Further, if you asked these people "intimately involved with this sport" about Dubinsky and Callahan, you'd likely have the same response (ie--one you wouldn't like--my guess is that the response would be fairly mixed). We've seen at least two teams demanding Dubinsky as the key part of big trades, only to be rebuffed by NYR brass. Before this season, Dubinsky was classified as a solid 2nd liner, while Callahan was seen as more of a borderline 2nd/3rd (something that I argued against on the main forum--even two years ago, I argued that both players were 2nd liners).
Your argument is basically "I'm right because other (unnamed) experts agree with me." The only thing I can say for that argument is that it's at least marginally better than "Anisimov is better defensively (in the face of all evidence to the contrary) because I keep saying so."
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Originally Posted by NYR Sting
*No wonder you don't see the problem; you think just like he does.
*I don't see how anyone can think Dubinsky is better than Callahan, unless they can't see the difference because they don't know what to look for. Nothing personal; that's just my honest opinion.
*That's another one of those nuances that you seem to miss when you watch the games, and it's those missed nuances that can lead to warped conclusions.
*Generally speaking, the word intangible is what people who don't know what they're talking about use to describe nuances of the game that they aren't informed enough about to put into words.
*This isn't what I meant by philosophy. I was referring, as I did above, to a strategic philosophy. A coaching philosophy. The belief that Dubinsky is a better player than Callahan signals that yours is founded on some pretty wild and unorthodox opinions about this sport.
* Therein lies the problem. To be objective, one must consider things from every perspective and within all contexts. I believe you intend to do that, but you are unable to because you lack the background to do so.
Just wanted to highlight some of your more...interesting statements. For someone who claims that he doesn't try to come off as a pretentious know-it-all, you sure do revert to pretentious rhetoric quite often. If this is how you engage with people who disagree with you in the real world, I imagine that you get punched a lot.
Listen--I realize that you think you're something special. I don't know if it's the post count, the mod tag, or just bad parenting. You aren't any better than anybody else here, and this kind of nonsense (the posting equivalent of "you disagree with me, so you must be an idiot") isn't worth any more of my time. I've been watching this team for going on three decades now, and I couldn't care less whether or not some random kid on an internet forum thinks he's the hockey-analysis equivalent of Gretzky. I'll cede you the last word, though I won't bother responding anymore. As I said initially--I tend to stick up for players who get dogpiled on for slumps (which go against a history of production) or non-hockey reasons (like the holdout). Time will tell which of us is right about Dubinsky.
You compare the two based on that this season (because it suits you) and dismiss it in previous seasons (because it doesn't suit you).
Again, that's false. In fact, my arguments had hardly anything to do with scoring AT ALL. Here is one post from that thread, and here is another, both in direct response to you.
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That was the whole point of this stupid argument between us. I asked for consistency from you, and you pitched a tantrum.
The point is that everything you said in this paragraph is a lie, including this last comment. That 2nd post of mine that I linked above is also my final post in that thread, where I refuted some of the baseless comments you made not only about Callahan and Dubinsky, but about other posters on this board. Please feel free to show me (in a private message, preferably) where you "asked me for consistency," or where I threw a tantrum, for that matter.
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Just wanted to highlight some of your more...interesting statements. For someone who claims that he doesn't try to come off as a pretentious know-it-all, you sure do revert to pretentious rhetoric quite often. If this is how you engage with people who disagree with you in the real world, I imagine that you get punched a lot.
No, that's just how I engage with people who call my opinion a load of crap without providing any legitimate reasons as to why, and then make things up to get ahead in an argument.
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Listen--I realize that you think you're something special. I don't know if it's the post count, the mod tag, or just bad parenting. You aren't any better than anybody else here, and this kind of nonsense (the posting equivalent of "you disagree with me, so you must be an idiot") isn't worth any more of my time.
When you called my post a load of crap, was that worth my time? And my parents, BTW, taught me at least one valuable lesson in life. You don't see me posting very often in the NFL thread around here, or the MLB thread. I tend to not offer opinions on things I'm not well versed in. On the contrary, when I don't know something, I tend to seek out those who do and try to learn about the topic from them. And I don't see how you equate my belief that you don't understand how to analyze the game with me thinking I'm better than you or anyone else. Why would knowledge about a sport make one person better than another, and why do you assume that I would think that? I don't think I'm better than anyone here, including you - or at least I didn't, until I discovered that you're dishonest. How do you propose someone has a debate with you, when you dismiss fact, and commonly accepted principles simply because you don't accept them as such, and then present completely subjective half-truths as fact and scoff at any notion otherwise? That's what you did in that thread from December, and it's what you did now. We both obviously have TOTALLY different understandings of how the game of hockey is to be played. There is no middle ground here, either. One of us is right, the other is wrong. Not just about Anisimov vs Dubinsky, or Callahan vs Dubinsky, but about so much more where this sport is concerned, because if you think Dubinsky is a better hockey player than Callahan, you have a completely different understanding of how this game is to be played than I do.
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I've been watching this team for going on three decades now, and I couldn't care less whether or not some random kid on an internet forum thinks he's the hockey-analysis equivalent of Gretzky. I'll cede you the last word, though I won't bother responding anymore. As I said initially--I tend to stick up for players who get dogpiled on for slumps (which go against a history of production) or non-hockey reasons (like the holdout). Time will tell which of us is right about Dubinsky.
Time has already told us that you're wrong, because both players have been in the league for a while now, and one has clearly established himself as a far superior player. That's not an opinion; it's a fact. And if Dubinsky turns into the next Wayne Gretzky tomorrow, it still won't change that for the first 5 years of their careers, he was the inferior player. That you think people are dogpiling on Dubinsky because of a holdout and a slump only continues to show that you don't even understand the debate itself. 5 years of rampant inconsistency is not a slump. It's 5 years of rampant inconsistency. I don't think I'm the hockey-analysis equivalent of Gretzky. I'm a random kid on the internet, not someone who has spent nearly his entire life around hockey and people who make a living off of hockey in a variety of capacities, coaching and scouting in particular. What could I possibly know? There are other people here at HF, however, who deserve that kind of praise. All of them disagreed with you about this.
@NYR Sting: Since youre a Mod, cant you change the thread title to "Who is the better, Callahan vs Dubinsky" maybe even add a poll?
I brought up Dubinsky because I believe his play is one of the reasons that Anisimov has been shifted to LW this season, which has contributed to Anisimov not playing his game. I had no intention of moving the discussion away from Anisimov. Apologies to all that such an event occurred.
Anisimov was dominant tonight. I don't know what was going on for that brief period earlier this year, but this is the guy who was a PPG player and defensive demon as a 20 year old in the AHL. This is why I want to keep AA and trade Dubi (if you have to move one or them) for the eventual LW upgrade.
Anisimov was dominant tonight. I don't know what was going on for that brief period earlier this year, but this is the guy who was a PPG player and defensive demon as a 20 year old in the AHL. This is why I want to keep AA and trade Dubi (if you have to move one or them) for the eventual LW upgrade.
id rather keep both and trade one of the top prospects. Dubinsky does alot of little things and is very close with Callahan. remember chemistry is a part of winning and not skill
