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System or players?

View Poll Results: Are our offensive woes caused by the system or players limited ability?
System sucks, too D focussed 21 42.00%
Players suck, couldn't hit the side of a barn 18 36.00%
Other 11 22.00%
Voters: 50. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
02-05-2012, 12:22 AM
  #1
DontgoZiggy
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System or players?

Do you think the Kings offensive woes are the result of a faulty system or the players lack of ability? We are one of the best defensive teams in the league but can't bury the puck. I had a quick look through the Sharks record during Lombardi's tenure as their GM and noticed that they had a decent offense, scoring roughly 2.5 goals per game, peaking to just over 3 per game in the 01-02 season. Admittedly the game has changed a bit since the 02 season but can we solely place the blame on the team system?

On paper we have a very good team, unfortunately with Gagne injured and Penner not living up to his previous goal scoring ability, we seem very thin on the wing (ie having stoll playing 2nd line wing isn't a great look)

Personally I love our defensive side, great D, stellar goalie tandem but feel the offense is a bit limited. I think if we could pick up a winger of Parise or Kovalchuks ability we would be set, someone to pot Kopitars set ups. Perhaps pick up Carter and nudge him to Kopitars wing?

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Old
02-05-2012, 12:47 AM
  #2
ScoreZeGoals
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It's probably 75% system and 25% players. It's obvious to anyone with eyes that the system is an antiquated joke that needs to go. With that said we are still icing too many sub par players and guys who flat out don't belong in the NHL anymore. Either way, it all comes down on Lombardi's head and the time has come for him to go

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Old
02-05-2012, 12:59 AM
  #3
TwoForRoughing
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The problem with the system starts as soon as the Kings gain puck possession. The system is focused on getting pucks deep and crashing the net. To me, this kind of system is mainly for young, inexperienced teams, because the game is about simplifying. However, all elite teams have some fluidity in their game; the Kings don't have that. All elite teams make stick-to-stick passes and gain zone entry seamlessly. The Kings are tentative in that department because their system doesn't encourage it. You can play a very defensive system and still score. Just look at the Blues and Bruins.

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02-05-2012, 01:07 AM
  #4
drugold
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Players. Its not the systems fault the Kings cant finish

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Old
02-05-2012, 01:18 AM
  #5
cheap77
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I think it's a combination of both. Some players can't finish and some players don't do well in the system.

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Old
02-05-2012, 01:25 AM
  #6
KingKopitar11*
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the team is just crap overall. our system is pretty pathetic too. its both.

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Old
02-05-2012, 01:28 AM
  #7
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its both, but more fault lies on the systme.

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Old
02-05-2012, 02:57 AM
  #8
Telos
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As it's been said. It is both, but more system than players. Our systems are pre-lockout and are highly exploitable.

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02-05-2012, 05:26 AM
  #9
MynameisKing
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Both.

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Old
02-05-2012, 05:40 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoKingsGoo View Post
The problem with the system starts as soon as the Kings gain puck possession. The system is focused on getting pucks deep and crashing the net. To me, this kind of system is mainly for young, inexperienced teams, because the game is about simplifying. However, all elite teams have some fluidity in their game; the Kings don't have that. All elite teams make stick-to-stick passes and gain zone entry seamlessly. The Kings are tentative in that department because their system doesn't encourage it. You can play a very defensive system and still score. Just look at the Blues and Bruins.
If you watched the Blues feed, all their announcers were saying, was that the Blues had to get back to what they did best, dump and chase with speed....

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Old
02-05-2012, 05:42 AM
  #11
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Curious,

In the last two games, Halak made 3 game changing saves, if the Kings finish those..how many blame the system?

In the last game, Ward was the difference, if Kopitar puts in that rebound, or the other guys bury the chances they had.....how many blame the system?


The system isn't at fault here, it's the finish. If they weren't getting ANY chances, then yea, ok, you have a point, they are getting chances, they are getting solid shots off from where you need to be getting those, they just aren't finishing them....that's the problem.

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Old
02-05-2012, 08:04 AM
  #12
RAZZIE King
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Another vote for both...

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Old
02-05-2012, 08:04 AM
  #13
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The system is really the only thing that hasn't been changed.

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02-05-2012, 09:01 AM
  #14
RAZZIE King
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Is it too late to blame the new jerseys to boot??? I still say they're bad luck...

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02-05-2012, 09:24 AM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjmay View Post
Curious,

In the last two games, Halak made 3 game changing saves, if the Kings finish those..how many blame the system?

In the last game, Ward was the difference, if Kopitar puts in that rebound, or the other guys bury the chances they had.....how many blame the system?


The system isn't at fault here, it's the finish. If they weren't getting ANY chances, then yea, ok, you have a point, they are getting chances, they are getting solid shots off from where you need to be getting those, they just aren't finishing them....that's the problem.
Every system will get you chances, it's the number and quality of those chances that are different. The Kings had three quality goal scoring chances against the Blues? Three or four (including Kopi's goal) against Carolina? That's awful and your not going to get past the glass ceiling this team is up against generating so few chances. The reason we generate so few scoring chances is because the system requires the players to generate all offense from the blueline. How many times have we complained after games that an obscene number of our shots are blocked? That's because everyone in the NHL knows what were doing and we fail to adjust.

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Old
02-05-2012, 10:52 AM
  #16
Jason Lewis
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You mean scoring chances come in the slot? Wait.....what?


That isn't Kings hockey. Perimeter Perimeter Perimeter!

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Old
02-05-2012, 11:02 AM
  #17
ZJames
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Ive been supporting DL since day one, but this season he has lost all of my support. He has done a great job building a team that is tough to score on, but he kind of forgot about another important aspect of hockey: SCORING! This is the first time in all my days of Kings fandom that I have not enjoyed watching the team. Sick of this crap, and unfortunatly i am starting to lose hope that we will see a cup any time soon. DL has lost my support.

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Old
02-05-2012, 11:52 AM
  #18
King'sPawn
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Players.

The system is not too dissimilar from the one St. Louis uses, but the Blues execute it well and they are one of the most dangerous teams in the league.

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02-05-2012, 12:15 PM
  #19
Butch 19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZJames View Post
Ive been supporting DL since day one, but this season he has lost all of my support. He has done a great job building a team that is tough to score on, but he kind of forgot about another important aspect of hockey: SCORING! This is the first time in all my days of Kings fandom that I have not enjoyed watching the team. Sick of this crap, and unfortunatly i am starting to lose hope that we will see a cup any time soon. DL has lost my support.
This the the 4th poll option:

DL has failed at drafting and developing a single scorer in 6 years. Not one. (how is this even possible? You'd think you would back into 1 over the years?)

Well, I guess that would go in the players category.

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Old
02-05-2012, 12:31 PM
  #20
ScoreZeGoals
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch 19 View Post
This the the 4th poll option:

DL has failed at drafting and developing a single scorer in 6 years. Not one. (how is this even possible? You'd think you would back into 1 over the years?)

Well, I guess that would go in the players category.
I agree with what your trying to say, but Simmonds did go to Philly and has already matched his career high in goals. Part of that is player progression and opportunity, but part of it is also getting away from this system

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Old
02-05-2012, 12:35 PM
  #21
Jason Lewis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScoreZeGoals View Post
I agree with what your trying to say, but Simmonds did go to Philly and has already matched his career high in goals. Part of that is player progression and opportunity, but part of it is also getting away from this system
I'd say 90% of that is getting away from our system.

You do realize that if you took away his PP points and time in Philly he would currently have 20 points, and be on pace for 34?


Which is on average for what he did here with no PP time.

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Old
02-05-2012, 12:43 PM
  #22
ScoreZeGoals
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Originally Posted by Jaygokings View Post
I'd say 90% of that is getting away from our system.

You do realize that if you took away his PP points and time in Philly he would currently have 20 points, and be on pace for 34?


Which is on average for what he did here with no PP time.
We tried Simmonds both on the top line and on the PP in our system, it was a train wreck, yet he goes elsewhere and prospers? Hell, Old man Smythers already has 16 goals which matches Kopi who leads the Kings in goals. L.A. is where players offensive production goes to die.

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Old
02-05-2012, 12:57 PM
  #23
Butch 19
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If you look at Simmonds output you aslso have to look at Richards (lack of) output in L.A.

?? I don't know what the problem is here - maybe it is the system.

Richards was supposed to really let Kopitar really start scoring. Kopi is being paid #1 scoring/team leader money, but in many games he is invisible.

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Old
02-05-2012, 03:02 PM
  #24
DaAnimal
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Its not the system its the players. Plain and simple.

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Old
02-05-2012, 03:36 PM
  #25
ScoreZeGoals
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaAnimal View Post
Its not the system its the players. Plain and simple.
Who could possibly disagree with such a deep articulate argument?

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