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In Praise Of Wilson

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Old
02-05-2012, 11:24 AM
  #76
The Blue Devil
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
I hate this argument. If you lack skill, you adapt your strategies to compensate.
IMO, that's only true to a certain extent. It seems pretty apparent that when Burke came in he had a specific idea of how he wanted the team to play and he would weed out the players unfit or who were unwilling to make the system successful. After he takes care of that problem he then brings in a core of younger players who haven't exactly had to play a specific system and would be able to learn his/Wilson's system easier, he also brought in other players who were familiar with the style of play or who had the ability transition to their system.

Pretty much his first 1 1/2 season's were weeding the players out, his 3rd(last year) was getting the new players to learn the system and this is the year for the team to start implementing the system properly(not perfectly). As we have seen so far in the new year it looks as if the team has really started to show what the system is like when executed properly. IMO, next season is the year that we should start expecting bigger things.

This is how most successful teams operate, implement a system, get players who can work well in that system and get rid(for lack of a better term ATM) of the ones that don't fit.

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02-05-2012, 11:24 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by SteveV View Post
5 on 5 we're 7th in the league on goal ratio. What a terrible system we have!
Well couldn't that have something to do with Lupul and Kessel absolutely blowing up this season?

Last year they were 20th. The year before? 29th.

This season, the team is better, and the coaching is better. I'm not disagreeing. I actually think that Wilson has done a fair job this season. I DON'T think that the team is succeeding because of his coaching. I DON'T think that he should have been given the opportunity to turn things around considering how poorly everything went leading up to this year.

His coaching this year is merely passable, which is WAY better than previous years, but it's not something that we should be dancing in the streets about.

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02-05-2012, 11:24 AM
  #78
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I wasn't playing "memory lane". Wise money looks at what you had to work with, and people who are conveniently trying to turn those TEAMS OF BUMS into decent squads, it is just absolutely laughable, honestly and truly. You can hate the guy all you want, but we had no depth when he came here and we got rid of almost every single guy since Burke arrived. Again, I will bet money the haters were the same guys IMPLORING Burke to ship out all these guys and rebuild, we will take the pain of losing. Now all of sudden, Wilson is on the hook for that crap. AMAZING!
I'd buy this argument if guys like Jacques Lemaire didn't exist.

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02-05-2012, 11:24 AM
  #79
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the Wilson bashers arguments are just abysmal

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02-05-2012, 11:26 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
Look at how Minnesota did. Look at Nashville. Look at Phoenix. Many years they don't have a ton of talent but play a system that allows them to be competitive. That's called coaching.
I know, just look at all the cups they've won. BTW, you'd KILL for Nashville's D, just kill for it "ton of talent" alright.

Talent does matter, and we used to win when we had it. Gee, that Burnsey, what a system! Talent. That Quinn, what a tactician! Talent.

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02-05-2012, 11:28 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by GrizzLeaf View Post
Sorry then, there have been so many posters not willing to give Wilson any credit for anything, I saw your posts in that category. Glad I was wrong and that you do indeed think Wilson has done well these last few weeks.

As for focusing on the PK, the coach and by extension the team, have changed what they do to take less penalties and have changed the PK enough to be tops in the league the last 4 or 5 weeks. The PK % was so horrible up to that point, it will take a miracle to boost those numbers past bad, but if they stay the course, and keep killing penalties, how can anyone complain!?
The lack of penalties in general is more of a plus than the quality of PKing (although it's been much better), and I think the general sense of discipline was something that wasn't there before, and something I'll give full props to Wilson for. But I need to see it for longer than a month.

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02-05-2012, 11:28 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by diceman934 View Post
Wilson's record as a coach speaks for its self.....missed the playoffs 9 years out of 17 as a head coach thus far.

The PK is good right now, penalties are down that is coaching......however may I point out that he goal-tending has been great since the new year as well.....all good PK has great goal-tending.

Not a fan of Wilson.
One month of perfect PK is not going to change that one little bolded sentiment for me. Leaf fans often talk about Bi-polar. Well the very definition of bi-polar is a thread like this. I understand the OP because he is a Wilson supporter through and through but he is asking some of Wilsons critics to come to the dark side. No thanks.

This is akin to a goaltender who has a career .870 SV % and a 3.82 GAA having a great month where he posted a few shutouts and won some games....and then asking fans to forget about those horrible career numbers because he had a good month.

I don't expect the PK to remain perfect for the remainder of the season, obviously, but if it continues to impress and the Leafs as a team play as impressively defensively for the rest of the year and into the playoffs....I will then start to give praise where praise is due. Not until then.

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02-05-2012, 11:28 AM
  #83
eyeball11
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Originally Posted by SteveV View Post
I know, just look at all the cups they've won. BTW, you'd KILL for Nashville's D, just kill for it "ton of talent" alright.

Talent does matter, and we used to win when we had it. Gee, that Burnsey, what a system! Talent That Quinn, what a tactician! Talent
Sounds like the point is going clear over your head. Also funny you'd mention Burns, probably one of the best coaches there ever was at getting more out of his players than their individual ability. Compare the 93 Leaf roster to that of Pittsburgh. Get back to me.

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02-05-2012, 11:29 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
I'd buy this argument if guys like Jacques Lemaire didn't exist.
Lame. He had TWO hall of fame defenceman and a HALL OF FAME goalie. Thanks for proving my point.

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02-05-2012, 11:31 AM
  #85
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Lame. He had TWO hall of fame defenceman and a HALL OF FAME goalie. Thanks for proving my point.
In Minnesota?

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02-05-2012, 11:31 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by SteveV View Post
I know, just look at all the cups they've won. BTW, you'd KILL for Nashville's D, just kill for it "ton of talent" alright.

Talent does matter, and we used to win when we had it. Gee, that Burnsey, what a system! Talent. That Quinn, what a tactician! Talent.
About as many as Wilson has won in his 17 years coaching in the NHL. With a freakishly talented San Jose team to boot.

Not saying anything...I'm just sayin

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02-05-2012, 11:31 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
Sounds like the point is going clear over your head. Also funny you'd mention Burns, probably one of the best coaches there ever was at getting more out of his players than their individual ability. Compare the 93 Leaf roster to that of Pittsburgh. Get back to me.
Burns was a great coach, but he also had a great team. Gilmour was MVP, we had an awesome goalie, Clark was perhaps the best grit/skill combo in the league and our defence was stacked with solid players. Hello in there, Burns does jack without players who could EXECUTE.

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02-05-2012, 11:32 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by SteveV View Post
I know, just look at all the cups they've won. BTW, you'd KILL for Nashville's D, just kill for it "ton of talent" alright.

Talent does matter, and we used to win when we had it. Gee, that Burnsey, what a system! Talent That Quinn, what a tactician! Talent
Agreed! Talent does matter.

A big piece of the talent puzzle that's been missing for years is between the pipes. It's not a coincidence that the Leafs downward spiral started when Raycroft became number one, followed by Toskala taking over. Then Guigere cam aboard and had a meh season. Reimer doesn't stand on his head for the second half of last season, and the Leafs finish near the bottom yet again.

Talent means a ton. Talent between the pipes mean everything.

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02-05-2012, 11:32 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by SteveV View Post
Burns was a great coach, but he also had a great team. Gilmour was MVP, we had an awesome goalie, Clark was perhaps the best grit/skill combo in the league and our defence was stacked with solid players. Hello in there, Burns does jack without players who could EXECUTE.
You clearly know nothing of Pat Burns history.

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02-05-2012, 11:33 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
In Minnesota?
how much playoff success did he have with the Wild?

having Stevens, Niedermeyer and arguably the best goalie of all time helps you be such a great coach. how is that not obvious.

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02-05-2012, 11:33 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
In Minnesota?
That's funny dude, what has MINNESOTA done? You're giving me bloody MINNESOTA to make the most tortured argument imaginable. AND, you're laughing at me! Man.

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02-05-2012, 11:34 AM
  #92
eyeball11
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Originally Posted by Darcy Tucker View Post
how much playoff success did he have with the Wild?

having Stevens, Niedermeyer and arguably the best goalie of all time helps you be such a great coach. how is that not obvious.
A) We aren't talking about NJ
B) The subject was being able to get something out of little and compensating for lack of talent.

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02-05-2012, 11:35 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by GrizzLeaf View Post
Agreed! Talent does matter.

A big piece of the talent puzzle that's been missing for years is between the pipes. It's not a coincidence that the Leafs downward spiral started when Raycroft became number one, followed by Toskala taking over. Then Guigere cam aboard and had a meh season. Reimer doesn't stand on his head for the second half of last season, and the Leafs finish near the bottom yet again.

Talent means a ton. Talent between the pipes mean everything.
No, no if Lemaire had Toskala and Stajan he would have won cups, CUPS I tell ya!

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02-05-2012, 11:35 AM
  #94
Darcy Tucker
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
A) We aren't talking about NJ
B) The subject was being able to get something out of little and compensating for lack of talent.
which Lemaire never did with the Wild so your point is invalid.

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02-05-2012, 11:36 AM
  #95
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Any time he's received legit nhl goaltending, wilson's leafs have looked pretty dang good.

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02-05-2012, 11:36 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
A) We aren't talking about NJ
B) The subject was being able to get something out of little and compensating for lack of talent.
No, you brought up Lemaire, and you didn't SPECIFY team. Try to keep up with your meandering attempt to save face

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02-05-2012, 11:37 AM
  #97
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No they shouldnt have and their play since leaving PROVES it. A bunch of bums! Stajan can barely stay in the league, ditto for Hagman, Poni is marginal, our goalies aren't even in the LEAGUE ANYMORE!

Give me a break, we had a bad, bad, bad team.
They had below average goaltending, I posted this on Friday. Andropov-Moore-Grabo-Stajan are not the worst combination of centers in the league, that experienced team was not as bad as some people want to make it out to be, their goaltending was.

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02-05-2012, 11:37 AM
  #98
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Originally Posted by SteveV View Post
That's funny dude, what has MINNESOTA done? You're giving me bloody MINNESOTA to make the most tortured argument imaginable. AND, you're laughing at me! Man.
You seem to be making big leaps in your logic here. Once again, nobody expected Wilson to come in and win a cup right away, they simply wanted to compete. You're saying it's all talent related, but we can all come up with examples of less or similarly talented teams doing much more than the Leafs under Wilson, even if it was just for a season or two.

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02-05-2012, 11:37 AM
  #99
Darcy Tucker
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Originally Posted by SteveV View Post
No, you brought up Lemaire, and you didn't SPECIFY team. Try to keep up with your meandering attempt to save face
also the Wild had Gaborik, Burns and Backstrom to build on.Stars at their positions. not exactly the 08 Leafs.

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02-05-2012, 11:37 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by zeke View Post
Any time he's received legit nhl goaltending, wilson's leafs have looked pretty dang good.
Thank you.

And please let us know ANY Leafs team that has succeeded WITHOUT that type of goaltending. Just one?

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