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Old
02-06-2012, 08:56 AM
  #51
dats81
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Originally Posted by nitroglycerin View Post
If (major if) we trade at the dead line, we trade everyone. Danny too. Danny as good as he was is getting old. This is his worse season in the last 10 years. It will get worse very quickly.

With Gleason and possibly Suter off the table, price for Carle and Timonen will be sky high. I will repeat myself but I think we can get 1st and very good NHL ready prospect for each. We trade our D to teams like Hawks (have a lot of NHL ready prospects and rumored on the market for a d-men) or Van or some other team West and we can rebuild in one year. As soon as next year Flyers are a serious threat for a very long time.
I can't see the Flyers immediately becoming a serious threat with Coburn and Meszaros as our #1/#2 defensemen.

And any prospect picked in the first round will need at least 2 years of development until he becomes a serious contributor on an NHL team let alone a real cornerstone of the franchise, which won't happen until the player is at least in his mid twenties and there is no guarantee it will ever happen at all.

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Old
02-06-2012, 08:58 AM
  #52
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I would love to have Weber over Suter personally I like his size and style of play better, that's just me, BUT the Flyers need to get D men who are responsible in their own end do the simple thing very well and have snarl and balls to clear people out of the crease and make opposing forwards think twice about crashing our net, but I'm in the stand pat group for now but I believe Homer has an itchy trigger finger

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02-06-2012, 09:00 AM
  #53
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bryz to columbus
carter to nashville
weber to philly


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Old
02-06-2012, 09:02 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by dats81 View Post
I can't see the Flyers immediately becoming a serious threat with Coburn and Meszaros as our #1/#2 defensemen.

And any prospect picked in the first round will need at least 2 years of development until he becomes a serious contributor on an NHL team let alone a real cornerstone of the franchise, which won't happen until the player is at least in his mid twenties and there is no guarantee it will ever happen at all.
We'd have about 20M in cap space. We can sign or trade for anyone in the NHL. How do you know who will or won't be available at teh draft or UFA.

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02-06-2012, 09:07 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by SilkyMitts View Post
bryz to columbus
carter to nashville
weber to philly

I like these moves!

BUT

Columbus already have their own head case of a goalie.
Nashville needs a real goal scorer and Carter does not score right now.
Weber is worth more than twice as much as Jeff Carter.

So you just invented the most unlikely 3-way trade in history...

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Old
02-06-2012, 09:16 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by nitroglycerin View Post
We'd have about 20M in cap space. We can sign or trade for anyone in the NHL. How do you know who will or won't be available at teh draft or UFA.
So you trade away our two best defensemen (assuming that Carle is #2 based on his minutes for now) plus Briere for some high picks (which I like as much as you do).

To close the gaping holes we sign multiple UFAs like Hal Gill and the likes at the draft and hope that we don't overpay AND then we trade away additional players to fixed our real needs.

Sounds a bit complicated and way too risky for my personal taste

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Old
02-06-2012, 09:19 AM
  #57
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How about Carle for Zanon and a 2nd.
And then a 2nd for Gill.

For Minny...gives them more offense from their D which they lack. In essense...they get a better d-man and sacrafice some D for some O.

For Philly...they Trade Carle for Gill and Zanon. Trade away even strength O for 2 defensive D-men.

Timonen Coburn
Mez Gill
Zanon Gus

Certaily makes us more defensive minded in the D and we trade 0 assets. Then in the off season, we can persue Suter. And if that fails, we can trade a young F for a young D.

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Old
02-06-2012, 09:21 AM
  #58
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Take Lilja out behind the wood shed with a shotgun. Then give Nashville whatever they want for weber excluding Giroux. Besides G I'm not sure if there's anyone on the team I wouldnt be willing to part with now. Maybe thats just my frustration talking after that HORRENDUS weekend.

ps. am I the only one that thinks the defense is just as at fault as Bryz. How can a guy gain any confidence with Matt Carle throwing the puck away right in front of him and guys like Lilja out of position on almost every play?

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Old
02-06-2012, 09:29 AM
  #59
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and how about Bryz for Mason and Pahlsson??

Mason becomes the back up and maybe...just maybe...he can rebound. If not, we can let him go after next year.
Works for salary too this year

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Old
02-06-2012, 09:41 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by dats81 View Post
So you trade away our two best defensemen (assuming that Carle is #2 based on his minutes for now) plus Briere for some high picks (which I like as much as you do).
Not just some picks, combination of picks and young NHL ready players. Timonen, Carle are worth a lot since Suter is off the market and Gleason was re-signed.
Freaking Tomas Kaberle brought Joe Colborne,1st and a conditional pick. Imagine what Timonen can bring. He is twice the man Kaberle is and Kimmo is having one hell of a year ANNNNND he has one more year on his contract. Value of this vet is huge lets face it Kimmo is in teh end of his career.

Same goes for Carle, despite occasional turnover (like yesterday) he is having a career year and that’s without Pronger.

Let’s look at Jagr. Do you think a team like Preds would unload one of their young d-men for him?

Moving Briere could be tricky the whole 3 kids, NTC and salary cap hit could turn a lot of GMs away. Still the whole PPG in playoffs is very attractive and I think we paid off a very good chunk of his contract, maybe Caps will bite. Caps have Carlson, Green, Orlov (looks promising), Wideman, Alzner and finally Green. Maybe we can make a deal. They need 2ndary scoring. They are trying to make playoffs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dats81 View Post
To close the gaping holes we sign multiple UFAs like Hal Gill and the likes at the draft and hope that we don't overpay AND then we trade away additional players to fixed our real needs.
If we get a young d-men back, we do not need multiply UFAs to fill available spots. And yes, we may miss playoffs, maybe not. we will have to beat Senators or Leafs for 7th or 8th spots.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dats81 View Post
Sounds a bit complicated and way too risky for my personal taste
Look, Howard Holmgren has done this before. Main difference, at the time we were not a playoff team.
As a fan I would be willing to wait and sacrifice one season where we developing 6-7 solid NHLers.
I doubt we will win the cup this year so it makes sense to take one step back to make 3 steps forward as soon as next season.

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Old
02-06-2012, 09:45 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
Is LAs management still soured on Drew Doughty? Do you think there'd be any way they'd let him go? It would probably need to be a massive overpayment. Maybe Jack Johnson is a more realistic possibility. LA may be able to lose defense to upgrade the offense, if they hope to make a run at the playoffs.

I'd say if homer makes serious offers for Ryan Suter or Shea Weber and it turns out that they definitely aren't available, then I would turn my attention to a guy like jack Johnson. If he turns out to be unavailable as well, then I'd look at a guy like Bryan Allen or Hal Gill.

But number 1 on the priority list should be doing whatever possible, (and rational) to get suter or weber.
Neither. They didn't give Doughty a long contract to trade him, and JMFJ may have been available, but he's one of their better offensive players even being a defenseman.


People are really getting their hopes up in regards to Weber/Suter. Same with trading Bryz. Not happening.

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02-06-2012, 09:48 AM
  #62
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Same with trading Bryz. Not happening.
Buy out. The only way around it. Getting it done during off season when new CBA is signed.

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02-06-2012, 09:49 AM
  #63
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#1 priority would be a #1 goalie. Just saying.

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Old
02-06-2012, 10:07 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by nitroglycerin View Post
Buy out. The only way around it. Getting it done during off season when new CBA is signed.
I think it's beyond a buyout. You need to hope for an amnesty clause a la the NBA where their hand are left clean and all they have to do is pay him, or for him to decide this is not worth it and skip off to Russia. Buy out leaves a couple years with over $5M cap hits in penalties during years where they'll have money tied up in Giroux, Schenn, Couturier, JVR, two $5M+ defensemen. And I'm only making assumptions here, and didn't even get to whoever our actual #1 goaltender is, or any wingers.

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02-06-2012, 10:11 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
I think it's beyond a buyout. You need to hope for an amnesty clause a la the NBA where their hand are left clean and all they have to do is pay him, or for him to decide this is not worth it and skip off to Russia. Buy out leaves a couple years with over $5M cap hits in penalties during years where they'll have money tied up in Giroux, Schenn, Couturier, JVR, two $5M+ defensemen. And I'm only making assumptions here, and didn't even get to whoever our actual #1 goaltender is, or any wingers.
whatever we did with LeClair/Brashear. It did not leave any cap hit but we bought them out. If that is amnesty. Fine.

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Old
02-06-2012, 10:14 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by PAZUZU View Post
people wanting suter or weber in orange and black are dreaming, preds have the cap space to keep both. a 3rd pairing dman is not going to fix this teams defensive zone issues, so i'm with the stand pat group. let the young guys get experience and hope bryz gets hot down the stretch.

homer is not usually in the stand pat group, so most likely there will be a deal done.
Having the cap space to sign them is irrelevant. The issue is that it's been widely reported that the ownership doesn't have the money to sign both of them, especially after the contract they gave Rinne. I know preds fans will tell you "Nuh uh, da owner gave Poille da ok to spend all da money dey need!" but I, and numerous media outlets and analysts seem to think otherwise.

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02-06-2012, 11:15 AM
  #67
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Do people really think Bryz is moveable? I don't understand any scenario that involves him not on the team. Even if they buy him out he would be a significant cap hit for like 15 years (I think as high as 6+ mill against the cap for a couple of them).

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02-06-2012, 11:36 AM
  #68
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I'll take a big, mid to late 20's Dman who is defensively responsible, physical, and capable of playing top 4 minutes. Preferably someone who lacks offense, so that the price to acquire him won't be too high. Also, he needs to be signed for another year or so, or at least easy to resign.

Then, in the offseason you move Carle/trade his rights/let him walk, and send a pick and/or prospect to Nashville for Suter's rights if it looks like Pronger really is done.

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Old
02-06-2012, 11:48 AM
  #69
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I just had a crazy idea and I am reasonably certain that it would work.

Flyers trade Ilya Bryzgalov to the New York Islanders for Rick DiPietro.

Flyers do this to lower their cap hit. Islanders do this because the cap is not a problem for them and the money owed is relatively similar. The only difference is that Bryzgalov could return to form given the correct conditions on the Island, whereas DiPietro has pretty much proven with the injuries and everything that he is done.

It is pretty much all upside for both teams.


DiPietro OKs the trade because he gets a chance at a cup in Philly. Bryzgalov OKs the trade because his teammates are starting to hate him and he cannot handle the pressure of playing here.

The beauty of the trade though is that it creates a built in amnesty clause. Because NMCs and NTCs do not carry over Bryzgalov could be waived in New York if they ever become a team that spends right up to the cap and he does not improve. And the Flyers could waive DiPietro since he does not have any kind of NMC or NTC.

Assuming it happens after this season:

DiPietro is owed 40.5 million over the next 9 seasons.
Bryzgalov is owed 41 million over the next 8 seasons.

What does everyone think?

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Old
02-06-2012, 11:51 AM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by broadwaybro86 View Post
I just had a crazy idea and I am reasonably certain that it would work.

Flyers trade Ilya Bryzgalov to the New York Islanders for Rick DiPietro.

Flyers do this to lower their cap hit. Islanders do this because the cap is not a problem for them and the money owed is relatively similar. The only difference is that Bryzgalov could return to form given the correct conditions on the Island, whereas DiPietro has pretty much proven with the injuries and everything that he is done.

It is pretty much all upside for both teams.


DiPietro OKs the trade because he gets a chance at a cup in Philly. Bryzgalov OKs the trade because his teammates are starting to hate him and he cannot handle the pressure of playing here.

The beauty of the trade though is that it creates a built in amnesty clause. Because NMCs and NTCs do not carry over Bryzgalov could be waived in New York if they ever become a team that spends right up to the cap and he does not improve. And the Flyers could waive DiPietro since he does not have any kind of NMC or NTC.

Assuming it happens after this season:

DiPietro is owed 40.5 million over the next 9 seasons.
Bryzgalov is owed 41 million over the next 8 seasons.

What does everyone think?
ur crafty, i love it..

having Dipi on this team would be good for a laff.

prolly snap his back witihin the first minute on ice and be done forever.

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Old
02-06-2012, 12:09 PM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
Having the cap space to sign them is irrelevant. The issue is that it's been widely reported that the ownership doesn't have the money to sign both of them, especially after the contract they gave Rinne. I know preds fans will tell you "Nuh uh, da owner gave Poille da ok to spend all da money dey need!" but I, and numerous media outlets and analysts seem to think otherwise.
true, if ownership does not have the cash, then cap space is irrelevant. i know their ownership has had its' issues in the past, but i'm wondering if that's in the past now. this article about their current ownership caught my eye:

http://www.ontheforecheck.com/2011/1...redators-owner


Last season, the Predators averaged 16,143 fans per game, selling out 16 regular season games, more than the previous two seasons combined. Additionally, within the last two years, the team has added significant corporate partners such as Bridgestone, AT&T, Nissan and Fifth Third Bank.

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Old
02-06-2012, 01:16 PM
  #72
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If there are any serious changes to the cap this offseason, and even if there aren't, there is a very good chance that teams would be allowed atleast one amnesty buyout. If Bryzgalov continues to look like he does, why wouldn't Snyder dish out the money to kick his ass out of here? It might cost us 27 mil to do it, but if it sets us up better for the offseason and beyond, why not?


As for the deadline, I want Nicklas Grossman from Dallas, and I wouldn't mind if we resigned him.

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Old
02-06-2012, 01:18 PM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff VanRichards View Post
If there are any serious changes to the cap this offseason, and even if there aren't, there is a very good chance that teams would be allowed atleast one amnesty buyout. If Bryzgalov continues to look like he does, why wouldn't Snyder dish out the money to kick his ass out of here? It might cost us 27 mil to do it, but if it sets us up better for the offseason and beyond, why not?


As for the deadline, I want Nicklas Grossman from Dallas, and I wouldn't mind if we resigned him.
assuming his status doesnt change, the amnesty buy-out should be used on Pronger

actually now that I think about it, if Pronger isnt capable of playing, can the Flyers even buy him out?


Last edited by RJ8812: 02-06-2012 at 01:27 PM.
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Old
02-06-2012, 01:20 PM
  #74
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#1 priority to me is not spending anything remotely valuable, this team has defensive and goaltending issues that aren't going to be replaced at the deadline without gutting the team mid season.

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Old
02-06-2012, 01:22 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff VanRichards View Post
If there are any serious changes to the cap this offseason, and even if there aren't, there is a very good chance that teams would be allowed atleast one amnesty buyout. If Bryzgalov continues to look like he does, why wouldn't Snyder dish out the money to kick his ass out of here? It might cost us 27 mil to do it, but if it sets us up better for the offseason and beyond, why not?


As for the deadline, I want Nicklas Grossman from Dallas, and I wouldn't mind if we resigned him.
Because if they buy out Bryzgalov, they're still stuck with a cap hit...and would be until 2027-28. That's not exactly doable.

http://www.capgeek.com/buyout_calcul...06&buyout_d=15

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