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Pens had most injuries of any team in the NHL this year

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02-07-2012, 06:38 PM
  #26
mrzeigler
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Originally Posted by Sidney the Kidney View Post
I'm not really sure what your response has to do with what I was getting at in my post. I was talking about how much impact these players make on their team, not on their cap hit.

The Isles losing DiPietro, if anything, HELPS their on-ice product because he's awful and allows them to use better goalies. What does his salary have to do with his actual impact as a player?

It has an impact on the value of the players who are on the ice for the team.

Oh, I agree that the quality of the injured plays a huge hole in terms of actual missing talent. But the amount of the contract limits the amount (measure in dollars) of potential talent that a team can to have on a roster any given year.

For example, if Dipietro's contract prevented the Islanders from signing free agent Superstar X, then an injured Dipietro not only robs the Islanders of Dipietro's contribution but also of the contribution of Superstar X who otherwise would be on the team.

It's an abstract point, I know, but I think one worth considering.


Oh, and by the way, I fully intend to copyright Superstar X.

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02-07-2012, 07:24 PM
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HuskerTornado
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Originally Posted by alcanalz View Post
32? Is that a joke?

Thirty ****ing two, to 244. Unbelievable.
And only 4 points separate the teams (Boston has 2 games in hand as well, though).

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02-07-2012, 07:52 PM
  #28
Sidney the Kidney
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Originally Posted by mrzeigler View Post
It has an impact on the value of the players who are on the ice for the team.

Oh, I agree that the quality of the injured plays a huge hole in terms of actual missing talent. But the amount of the contract limits the amount (measure in dollars) of potential talent that a team can to have on a roster any given year.

For example, if Dipietro's contract prevented the Islanders from signing free agent Superstar X, then an injured Dipietro not only robs the Islanders of Dipietro's contribution but also of the contribution of Superstar X who otherwise would be on the team.

It's an abstract point, I know, but I think one worth considering.


Oh, and by the way, I fully intend to copyright Superstar X.
That might have merit, if the Isles were right up to the cap ceiling and DiPietro's contract doesn't allow them to sign someone to improve them. But the Isles have so much cap space they could basically sign an entire 20-man roster with the cap space they have left.

So DiPietro taking up $4.5 million cap space has absolutely no impact on their ability to bring in that illusive "Superstar X" that you're talking about. The only thing that stops them from spending on Superstar X is Charles Wang being allergic to spending money.

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02-08-2012, 09:57 AM
  #29
mrzeigler
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Originally Posted by Sidney the Kidney View Post
That might have merit, if the Isles were right up to the cap ceiling and DiPietro's contract doesn't allow them to sign someone to improve them. But the Isles have so much cap space they could basically sign an entire 20-man roster with the cap space they have left.

So DiPietro taking up $4.5 million cap space has absolutely no impact on their ability to bring in that illusive "Superstar X" that you're talking about. The only thing that stops them from spending on Superstar X is Charles Wang being allergic to spending money.
Whether it's a salary cap imposed by the CBA or the owner's financial willingness, it's still a salary cap. Regardless of the owner's motive — be it greed, political maneuvering during an arena negotiation, or actual money limitations — it's still a limit.

Sorry for prolonging this digression, but it could be argued that when an owner sets a payroll limit lower than the CBA cap, the relative significance of the injury is amplified. Consider ...

If a player with an $8.7M/year cap hit were lost from a Dallas Stars payroll of $49.7M, it would be reasonable for people to assume that that team would have a tougher time of overcoming the player's absence than if he were on, say, a Penguin team with a $64.5M roster. Such a contract would eat up 17.5 percent of the Stars' resources; whereas with the Penguins, that deal accounts for 13.5 percent of the team's on-ice budget.

(Why did I switch from Isles to Stars? Cuz my initial point wasn't intended to apply only to the Isles. So I'm switching to a team that clearly has a team-imposed cap that's pretty low to illustrate.)

Anyway, to equate the relative impact to the Dallas franchise, you'd want to factor in the injury of a Pittsburgh player(s) who earn around $2.58M/year ($2.58M + $8.7M = $11.28M, which is 17.5 percent of the Penguins roster value). So the impact to the Dallas Stars of losing a Sidney Crosby or Evgeni Malkin would be relatively equivalent to the Penguins losing Malkin or Crosby PLUS losing Cooke ($1.8M) and Adams ($0.675M).

Of course, that's assuming the monetary value of every NHL contract is a fair representation of a player's on-ice value. We know that's not the case — rookie contracts tend to be much better deals for franchises, UFA deals often are in favor of the players and then there are just deals and steals. So this approach is most useful in a general evaluation of the issue ... but we also can use it to help determine if a team has mostly good (more value for the team) or bad (less value for the team) contracts. A team with good contracts will be more likely to overcome serious adversity than one with bad contracts. And so, to digress even further, I look at that list of games missed and the conference standings, and I can't help but conclude that no matter how much we ***** and moan about guys like Martin, Shero was pretty damn shrewd in assembling this team.

So when it comes to injuries, do the Pens have an advantage because they spend up to the cap? Yes and no.

Yes, because they have an NHL roster that even with Sidney Crosby injured still has more money invested in NHL talent than 10 NHL teams are spending on their entire rosters. So of course we expect this team to soldier on and remain competitive when he's hurt.

However, because we're up against the CBA salary cap, Shero doesn't have the luxury of being able to beg the ownership group for permission to increase the payroll so he could trade for a player or two to shore up the holes created by the injury. Of course, there's no guarantee that the owner of a team that is well-below the CBA cap would grant such a request, but it remains a possibility.

Hope I haven't bored you guys too much with this. It was one of those things I had a general idea about but the more I picked it apart, the more interested in it I became. Hence this long post.


Last edited by mrzeigler: 02-08-2012 at 10:10 AM.
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