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Trade Proposal Thread 8.0 "NHL 12 reigns supreme!"

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Old
02-10-2012, 09:13 PM
  #76
Rust Heisenberg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RussianRangersFan View Post
The issue isn't in two years, it's next year when we have a lot of RFA due raises. If you sign Parise, it's extremely likely you lose someone from our current core.
Wolski 4 mill off
Fedotenko 1.4 mill off
Eminger .8 mill off
Mitchell .65 mill off
Woywitka .65 mill off

We have roughly 7.7 mill coming of the books. We additionally had like something like 3 mill available too. So we have about 10.5-11 mill available for next year. Del Zotto is the only notable RFA next year, and he will not be in line for some sort of massive increase in salary. Likely 1.2 mill increase.

Kreider 1.1
Del Zotto 1.2 (more)
Prust and Biron resigned for same cap hit
Resign Stralman 1.2-1.4 mill

That leaves like 7-8 mill available while comfortably signing Del Zotto. Del Zotto likely gets a 2 year deal. The year after Anisimov is an RFA, he probably signs a 1 year deal for cap purposes and gets a better extension the following year after Gaborik and Redden are off the cap. Stepan is also the year after and he probably only warrants a 1.2 mill increase as well. Hagelin probably doesn't warrant more than a .3 mill cap increase when he's an RFA. And creativity will have to be used with McDonough and Sauer.

Don't say its not possible cause it is.

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02-10-2012, 10:14 PM
  #77
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Erikkson is going to cost a lot.

It would probably cost a Stepan or McDonagh as the main piece. Dubinsky alone as the main piece would not get it done.

This is a 26 year old 70+ pt winger on a gift contract.

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Old
02-10-2012, 10:32 PM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
Wolski 4 mill off
Fedotenko 1.4 mill off
Eminger .8 mill off
Mitchell .65 mill off
Woywitka .65 mill off

We have roughly 7.7 mill coming of the books. We additionally had like something like 3 mill available too. So we have about 10.5-11 mill available for next year. Del Zotto is the only notable RFA next year, and he will not be in line for some sort of massive increase in salary. Likely 1.2 mill increase.

Kreider 1.1
Del Zotto 1.2 (more)
Prust and Biron resigned for same cap hit
Resign Stralman 1.2-1.4 mill

That leaves like 7-8 mill available while comfortably signing Del Zotto. Del Zotto likely gets a 2 year deal. The year after Anisimov is an RFA, he probably signs a 1 year deal for cap purposes and gets a better extension the following year after Gaborik and Redden are off the cap. Stepan is also the year after and he probably only warrants a 1.2 mill increase as well. Hagelin probably doesn't warrant more than a .3 mill cap increase when he's an RFA. And creativity will have to be used with McDonough and Sauer.

Don't say its not possible cause it is.
And worst case, if the 5 UFAs all get a lot more than would be expected (because they take longer deals perhaps) you can simply move Dubinsky and everything is fine. I'm not simply discarding Dubi, but at the end of the day if you have to move him as a last resort in order to balance the cap a year later...well you do that every time to sign Zach Parise. I really don't get what people are so worried about.

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02-10-2012, 10:39 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
If no Hall/Weber, then yes to Eriksson

Dubinsky + Sauer + 1st '12 for Eriksson is ok

Dubinsky + Fasth + 1st '12 + Bickel for Eriksson. Heck - they can even have Avery back as a "throwin" since they are paying him anyway
is not Fasth is a keeper + can still do deal with first option

As to:
"NY would have to add significantly...
Dubi, Hagelin 1st at the very least..."

big time NO at that price. Hagelin here to stay.
Huh? If you're talking about Taylor Hall I'm pretty confused. I know EDM needs D, but trading Hall?

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02-10-2012, 11:48 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by KingWantsCup View Post
Huh? If you're talking about Taylor Hall I'm pretty confused. I know EDM needs D, but trading Hall?
Don't ask for logic out of Bernmeister. He's the king of ludicrous trade proposals. Also, please don't quote him.

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Old
02-11-2012, 12:19 AM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RL605 View Post
Erikkson is going to cost a lot.

It would probably cost a Stepan or McDonagh as the main piece. Dubinsky alone as the main piece would not get it done.

This is a 26 year old 70+ pt winger on a gift contract.
Given position, age and contract status, I don't think I'd give up Step for Erikson. Maybe...

But I know that I flat out wouldn't trade McD straight up for Erikson right now. He is a legit first pairing D on the best team in the league already. With years of RFA status ahead of him. You only move him for one of the top ten players in the league - period.

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02-11-2012, 12:43 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Given position, age and contract status, I don't think I'd give up Step for Erikson. Maybe...

But I know that I flat out wouldn't trade McD straight up for Erikson right now. He is a legit first pairing D on the best team in the league already. With years of RFA status ahead of him. You only move him for one of the top ten players in the league - period.
Don't get me wrong...I'm a big McDonagh fan, and think he'll be an all star in a season or two. But I think that's a bit much to say you would only trade him for a top 10 player in the league.

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02-11-2012, 06:37 AM
  #83
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Let us assume the following:
We are looking for UFA Rentals Only this year
We do not deal any of our current 12 roster fwds, top 6 defenders (plus Sauer) or goalies

Our Deadline Day cap space number (prorated) is at $6,959,621 according to Cap geek
Wolski will most likely be waived/traded - minus another $3,800,000 on the cap (annual)
One of Bickel ($600.000) or Woywitka ($650.00) will be waived/traded before the deadline.Both these numbers will be gone if we acquire another defender.

This gives us a total of $12,009,000 in possible "add-ons" to our cap space at the deadline. In addition - assuming Sauer is done for the year - we can add his LTIR number (around $820.000 that can Be used as cap overage) on top of this = $12,828,621 is the annual cap hit we could in theory be taking on...

We can therefore (at most) add one Rental defender & 2 Rental fwds by using our other non-roster assets (As in aforementioned players = Wolski + Woywitka + ev Bickel, The CT Whale roster, NYR prospects, future NYR draft picks).
Here below is basically what is theoretically available. All of these players will not make it tothe market. And all of these teams will NOT be sellers. Just saying so I do not need to hear this later.
You can do the math...
We might have to deal roster players to acquire some of the proposed rentals - but I think management is reluctant to do this regarding chemistry. We also might deal for other players that are not UFAs - but this is not the way Sather usually operates. This time might very wellbe different though... Time will tell....
Hope this little table can be helpful to all here on the Board...

OVERVIEW UFA RENTAL TRADE MARKET 2011/2012

PROBABLE SELLERS

Columbus
Påhlsson – Center - $2,650,000
Huselius (??? injured - out indef) - $4,750,000
Not in demand: Mackenzie, Martinek, Lebda, Johnson

Edmonton
Smyth – Left Wing - $6,250,000 NMC
Hemsky – Right Wing - $4,100,000
Sutton – Defense - $2,125,000
Not in demand: Petrell, Hordichuk

Anaheim
Selänne – Right Wing - $4,000,000 NMC
Koivu – Center - $2,500,000 NMC
Not in demand: Blake, Hagman, Parros, Pelley, Brookbank

Carolina
Ruutu – Left Wing - $3,800,000
Allen – Defense - $2,900,000
Not in demand: Spacek

Islanders (We don´t do business here)
Rolston, Pandolfo, PAP, Wallace, Eaton, Staios, Jurcina, Mottau, Reese

Montreal
Kostitsyn – Right Wing - $3,250,000
Moen – Left Wing - $1,500,000
Gil – Defense - $2,250,000
Not in demand: Darch, Campoli

Tampa Bay
Kubina – Defense - $3,850,000 Limited NTC
Not in demand: Moore (After the cheap hit on Feds?), Shannon, Hall, Clark, Gilroy, Gervais


POSSIBLE SELLERS

Winnipeg
Oduya – Defense - $3,500,000
Not in demand: Slater, Glass, Wellwood, Stapleton, Jones, Flood

Buffalo
Gaustad – Center - $2,300,000
Boyes ? naw? – Right Wing - $4,000,000
Not in demand: Hecht

Ottawa
Kuba? – Defense - $3,700,000
Not in demand: Winchester, Konopka, Carkner

Calgary
Sarich – Defense - $3,600,000 Full NMC
Stempniak – Right Wing - $1,900,000
Not in demand: Jokinen (lol - what if ???), Moss, Kostopoulos, Jackman, Hannon

Phoenix
Doan – Right Wing - $4,550,000 NMC
Langkow – Center - $4,500,000 NMC
Whitney – Left Wing - $3,000,000 NMC/NTC
Aucoin - Defense - $2,000,000 Modified NTC
Not in good grace: Rozsival (we want a refund – take back Wolski??) - Defense - $5,000,000

Minnesota
Zanon ? – Defense - $1,933,333
Not in Demand: Brodziak, Christensen (lol), Staubitz, Peters, Lundin, Stoner

Colorado
Hejduk – Right Wing - $3,000,000 NMC (will not waive?)
Not in Demand: Jones, McClement, McLoed, Winnik, Van der Gulik, Hunwick

Dallas
Souray – Defense - $1,650,000
Grossman (possible Sauer replacement?) – Defense - $1,625,000
Not in demand: Dvorak, Burish, Peterson, Dowell

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Old
02-11-2012, 07:05 AM
  #84
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I'm on the Paul Gaustad bandwagon. So do we think it takes something like a 2nd rounder? Or a mid level prospect like McColgan? Lindberg?

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02-11-2012, 07:29 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by NYR21 View Post
I'm on the Paul Gaustad bandwagon. So do we think it takes something like a 2nd rounder? Or a mid level prospect like McColgan? Lindberg?
I've been pushing hard for Gaustad for the last month or so. He is great at faceoffs, plays the PK, and would be an upgrade over Boyle on the 3rd line.

I think the addition of him and Smyth (or Selanne, if made available) could really push this team over the top without breaking the bank. Two players that would fit nicely into this system and address major areas of need.

They need someone who can provide secondary scoring snd help out the PP (Smyth) and bottom 6 depth that can take PK minutes away from the top players as well as win that key defensive zone faceoff (Which I'm telling you now could kill this team in the playoffs if it's not addressed), in Gaustad.

If Feds is healthy, run lines of:

Anisimov - Stepan - Gaborik
Smyth - Richards - Callahan
Dubinsky - Gaustad - Hagelin
Feds/Rupp - Boyle - Prust

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02-11-2012, 07:32 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
Let us assume the following:
We are looking for UFA Rentals Only this year
We do not deal any of our current 12 roster fwds, top 6 defenders (plus Sauer) or goalies

Our Deadline Day cap space number (prorated) is at $6,959,621 according to Cap geek
Wolski will most likely be waived/traded - minus another $3,800,000 on the cap (annual)
One of Bickel ($600.000) or Woywitka ($650.00) will be waived/traded before the deadline.Both these numbers will be gone if we acquire another defender.

This gives us a total of $12,009,000 in possible "add-ons" to our cap space at the deadline. In addition - assuming Sauer is done for the year - we can add his LTIR number (around $820.000 that can Be used as cap overage) on top of this = $12,828,621 is the annual cap hit we could in theory be taking on...

We can therefore (at most) add one Rental defender & 2 Rental fwds by using our other non-roster assets (As in aforementioned players = Wolski + Woywitka + ev Bickel, The CT Whale roster, NYR prospects, future NYR draft picks).
Here below is basically what is theoretically available. All of these players will not make it tothe market. And all of these teams will NOT be sellers. Just saying so I do not need to hear this later.
You can do the math...
We might have to deal roster players to acquire some of the proposed rentals - but I think management is reluctant to do this regarding chemistry. We also might deal for other players that are not UFAs - but this is not the way Sather usually operates. This time might very wellbe different though... Time will tell....
Hope this little table can be helpful to all here on the Board...

OVERVIEW UFA RENTAL TRADE MARKET 2011/2012

PROBABLE SELLERS

Columbus
Påhlsson – Center - $2,650,000
Huselius (??? injured - out indef) - $4,750,000
Not in demand: Mackenzie, Martinek, Lebda, Johnson

Edmonton
Smyth – Left Wing - $6,250,000 NMC
Hemsky – Right Wing - $4,100,000
Sutton – Defense - $2,125,000
Not in demand: Petrell, Hordichuk

Anaheim
Selänne – Right Wing - $4,000,000 NMC
Koivu – Center - $2,500,000 NMC
Not in demand: Blake, Hagman, Parros, Pelley, Brookbank

Carolina
Ruutu – Left Wing - $3,800,000
Allen – Defense - $2,900,000
Not in demand: Spacek

Islanders (We don´t do business here)
Rolston, Pandolfo, PAP, Wallace, Eaton, Staios, Jurcina, Mottau, Reese

Montreal
Kostitsyn – Right Wing - $3,250,000
Moen – Left Wing - $1,500,000
Gil – Defense - $2,250,000
Not in demand: Darch, Campoli

Tampa Bay
Kubina – Defense - $3,850,000 Limited NTC
Not in demand: Moore (After the cheap hit on Feds?), Shannon, Hall, Clark, Gilroy, Gervais


POSSIBLE SELLERS

Winnipeg
Oduya – Defense - $3,500,000
Not in demand: Slater, Glass, Wellwood, Stapleton, Jones, Flood

Buffalo
Gaustad – Center - $2,300,000
Boyes ? naw? – Right Wing - $4,000,000
Not in demand: Hecht

Ottawa
Kuba? – Defense - $3,700,000
Not in demand: Winchester, Konopka, Carkner

Calgary
Sarich – Defense - $3,600,000 Full NMC
Stempniak – Right Wing - $1,900,000
Not in demand: Jokinen (lol - what if ???), Moss, Kostopoulos, Jackman, Hannon

Phoenix
Doan – Right Wing - $4,550,000 NMC
Langkow – Center - $4,500,000 NMC
Whitney – Left Wing - $3,000,000 NMC/NTC
Aucoin - Defense - $2,000,000 Modified NTC
Not in good grace: Rozsival (we want a refund – take back Wolski??) - Defense - $5,000,000

Minnesota
Zanon ? – Defense - $1,933,333
Not in Demand: Brodziak, Christensen (lol), Staubitz, Peters, Lundin, Stoner

Colorado
Hejduk – Right Wing - $3,000,000 NMC (will not waive?)
Not in Demand: Jones, McClement, McLoed, Winnik, Van der Gulik, Hunwick

Dallas
Souray – Defense - $1,650,000
Grossman (possible Sauer replacement?) – Defense - $1,625,000
Not in demand: Dvorak, Burish, Peterson, Dowell
I don't see how that's accurate. How do we have 6.9 million in cap space right now? Answer: we don't.

And I think there's some discrepancy between saying "we do not move any of our 12 roster forwards or 6 defensemen" and them suggesting we add 1-2 forwards and a d-man. Where do they play if nobody's losing their spot?

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Old
02-11-2012, 07:46 AM
  #87
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Rangers Oilers Deadline Trade Proposal

Rangers get Theo Peckam
Oilers get Wojtek Wolski


Rangers get some toughness on defense since Sauer might be done for the year....Oilers get another skilled forward who seems to have confidence issues...

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Old
02-11-2012, 07:51 AM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
I don't see how that's accurate. How do we have 6.9 million in cap space right now? Answer: we don't. We do actually. Well kinda. If you read what I said - I said this is the capspace available AT THE DEADLINE when we would make these moves.Our annual cap space right now is $1.504.784. But that also means that we can in theory take on an additional cap hit as per today´s date (with our 24 man roster with Sauer on LTIR) of $4.971.158 in prorated annual salary.This number grows to be $6,959,621 at the deadline. See the numbers at capgeek.com if you do not believe me where it is clear as daylight about us having the $6,9 M number at the deadline. Plus - any salary from roster players we send the other way in deadline deals are a wash and can be added on top of this amount (for example Wolski, Woywitka & Bickel). On top of this we can add Sauers LTIR money retroactively since December 5 (assuming he is out for the season) when he was concussed. That means another $820.000. Numbers are right.

And I think there's some discrepancy between saying "we do not move any of our 12 roster forwards or 6 defensemen" and them suggesting we add 1-2 forwards and a d-man. Where do they play if nobody's losing their spot? DEPTH. For 4 rounds of playoff hockey you need lots of Depth. Mitchell is an optimal #13/14 depth guy. Hagelin is a rookie. Eminger/Strålman might be great options as 7th defenders, not regulars through 4 consecutive grinding playoff series. There will - unfortunately - be injuries. Rupp/Prust might get banged up and sit a game or two (depending on who we play...)
See bolded above


Last edited by BBKers: 02-11-2012 at 08:01 AM.
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02-11-2012, 08:07 AM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 View Post
Rangers Oilers Deadline Trade Proposal

Rangers get Theo Peckam
Oilers get Wojtek Wolski


Rangers get some toughness on defense since Sauer might be done for the year....Oilers get another skilled forward who seems to have confidence issues...
I miss Jed Ortmeyer

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Old
02-11-2012, 08:20 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
Wolski 4 mill off
Fedotenko 1.4 mill off
Eminger .8 mill off
Mitchell .65 mill off
Woywitka .65 mill off

We have roughly 7.7 mill coming of the books. We additionally had like something like 3 mill available too. So we have about 10.5-11 mill available for next year. Del Zotto is the only notable RFA next year, and he will not be in line for some sort of massive increase in salary. Likely 1.2 mill increase.

Kreider 1.1
Del Zotto 1.2 (more)
Prust and Biron resigned for same cap hit
Resign Stralman 1.2-1.4 mill

That leaves like 7-8 mill available while comfortably signing Del Zotto. Del Zotto likely gets a 2 year deal. The year after Anisimov is an RFA, he probably signs a 1 year deal for cap purposes and gets a better extension the following year after Gaborik and Redden are off the cap. Stepan is also the year after and he probably only warrants a 1.2 mill increase as well. Hagelin probably doesn't warrant more than a .3 mill cap increase when he's an RFA. And creativity will have to be used with McDonough and Sauer.

Don't say its not possible cause it is.
Most of these numbers are ballpark, but I am strongly opposed to jettisoning Mitchell and his hard work/production for only .65 savings.

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02-11-2012, 08:30 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by NYR21 View Post
I'm on the Paul Gaustad bandwagon. So do we think it takes something like a 2nd rounder? Or a mid level prospect like McColgan? Lindberg?
McColgan yes.
Prefer to keep Lindberg.

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02-11-2012, 08:56 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Henriks Broadway Hat View Post
I went to Anaheim's board. They all agrees that if he's not scoring, he's not noticeable.
Sorry to come out of lurker mode; promise I'll go back.

That's not actually the conclusion we drew. I also think some people on our board may be fixating on the scoring portion of the ledger a little too much.

One key piece of information that many weren't taking into account are penalties drawn per 60, and penalties taken per 60.

From our top line:
Getzlaf:
PD/60 - 0.7
PT/60 - 0.9

Perry:
PD/60 - 1.2
PT/60 - 1.0

Ryan:
PD/60 - 1.1
PT/60 - 0.6

He's also 2nd among them in hits, 1st in takeaways, and 2nd worst in giveaways.

Good luck against the Flyers, today.

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02-11-2012, 09:07 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by KingWantsCup View Post
Huh? If you're talking about Taylor Hall I'm pretty confused. I know EDM needs D, but trading Hall?
Yes. Hall of Edmonton, and even though Hall maybe a sacred cow to many Oiler fans as is Girardi to many Ranger brethren, I argue the extended deal(s) I've suggested are win-win, and assume that should be the bottom line.

Yes. Hall was first overall. He could be viewed as pre-elite. Certainly not uber-elite (Malkin, Stamkos) or elite (Stastny) but he is clearly a gifted sniper, and whether it be he or somebody else, there is no arguing we badly need a sniper. The fact he's young and could have extended connection = stability to team if signed long term is another plus, more so than adding guys who are older.

There are 2 basic ? for EO to answer if this is a decision made with mind and not heart.
1. Who would replace Hall (lost offensive production) if he goes?
2. Is the return outrageous enough to command accepting Ranger offer?

1. Oilers already have firepower with, at minimum, RNH + Eberle and now the emerging Gagner as serious weapons. hemskey was/is a useless bust, but the these guys are a solid. stud core. Additionally, MPS has physical skills and can do everything needed except score. If he can be taught to shoot, that's another in their current arsenal. But that issue aside, if the Martians kidnapped Hall tomorrow, they'd still have this terrific trio. Now add to that a projected top 2 pick. There has been buzz on these boards that EO are thinking about trading down to take a top D prospect, so desperate is their need for a guy NOW. That would be a mistake with the head + shoulders cut above the top 2 picks, both F scorers, show. Getting Girardi + keeps all that intact, keeps Oilers with best long term development.

2. Granted Oils are coughing up Hall, but my offer is not chopped liver:
Girardi -- All Star D, defensive specialist
Sauer -- shut down D (working on current assumption he is available soon)
choice of G prospect they need Talbot/Stacjer
a freebie in v-tank -- no downside, upside is may find game, pull another Potter
swap of 2 Ranger 1sts (2013 + 14) for 3 Edmonton 2nds (2012, 13 + 14)

In addition, though I'm not sure it could be juggled cap wise till after the season, I'm amendable to sending Dubi for prospect Tyler Pitlick

----

now there is always downside in that any D, by nature of the position, is more likely to get injured than the average F. And with shot blocking machine like Girardi, there is always a certain inherent risk there. But on the other hand, if you want great D, in addition to shadowing + other shutdown, you block shots. But that inherent risk aside, Oilers are getting real value.

Sniper ability v. Shut down excellence +

So yes, as to this being my suggestion, which I stand behind.

I CHALLENGE ANYONE TO EXPLAIN HOW THE ABOVE IS NOT VALUE FOR VALUE.

I understand how you don't trade Ted Williams, even for Joe DiMaggio.
But the fact is if Williams were traded for, say, Mantle and Ford, the Sox would have arguably gotten the better of it.

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Old
02-11-2012, 09:16 AM
  #94
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That's a crazy trade proposal that would set the Rangers back 5 years. They can keep Hall (which, btw, is complete fantasy if you think Edmonton is trading him) for what you're offering. 2 starting D's, 2 1st round picks, and 2 prospects for Hall and 2 2nd's? Who is he? Eric Lindros? Crazy deal that's ludicrously bad for the NYR. No thanks.

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Old
02-11-2012, 09:18 AM
  #95
Rangers Fail
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Enough with Taylor Hall. Seriously, just stop with the ludicrous trade proposals.

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Old
02-11-2012, 09:19 AM
  #96
azrok22
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For the umpteenth time, Hall is not moving. As a Oilers' first overall draft pick, he have intrinsic value as a promise of the future that sells tickets. No matter how many times you post the same thing, that isn't going to change. These proposals have been mocked, repeatedly, for a reason. It's not because other fans wouldn't love Hall; it's because there's some displacement from reality going on.

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Old
02-11-2012, 09:24 AM
  #97
bernmeister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zil View Post
Don't ask for logic out of Bernmeister. He's the king of ludicrous trade proposals. Also, please don't quote him.
For shame.
Et tu, Zil. Et tu?

I am guilty as charged as to my suggestions being outlandish, ones pushing the envelope thinking outside the proverbial box. And I have no problem with them being put under the microscope, that is why we post and what we are here for.

But they have a logic and a rationale.
You may disagree with the conclusions, and you may disagree as to preferences, which again, I acknowledge you are entitled to.

But there is a difference between saying:

On the one hand,
(YOUR OPINION) I prefer we keep our vaunted D intact at any and all costs or being one must give to get, I don't want to overpay for a sniper to once and for all provide us another block for the Rangers to have as a foundation and
(A DIFFERING OPINION) with an opposite view

and on the other hand
(again, your OPINION) someone disagrees with me.
They value the sniper more than the defenseman.
This valuation is inherently erroneous, wrong, error error does not compute (a posture based on logic/math, and not opinion).
Their disagreement MUST be faulty. Such is the only possible conclusion.

AND WAY, WAY EVEN MORE IMPORTANT THAN THAT, WAY BIG TIME IN THE FOR SHAME DEPT:

You proudly wear the avatar with the late great John Lennon, a champion of peace, and to a lesser extent, free speech.

And you want to suggest an automatic blacklisting of any and all my posts, unilaterally, because in your OPINION you disagree?

What would John Lennon do?

For shame, for shame....


wait.... what's that I hear in the distant background?
it's getting louder.....

now I recognize it!!!!!

YES IS THE ANSWER
AND YOU KNOW THAT, FOR SURE...

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Old
02-11-2012, 09:28 AM
  #98
haohmaru
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John Lennon wouldn't make that trade.

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Old
02-11-2012, 09:39 AM
  #99
bernmeister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
That's a crazy trade proposal that would set the Rangers back 5 years. They can keep Hall (which, btw, is complete fantasy if you think Edmonton is trading him) for what you're offering. 2 starting D's, 2 1st round picks, and 2 prospects for Hall and 2 2nd's? Who is he? Eric Lindros? Crazy deal that's ludicrously bad for the NYR. No thanks.
I'll get back to you later on this.
I think the short answer is he's worth it, and there is a real premium on snipers.

But I welcome the opportunity to intelligently analyze the pros and cons of this.

IN FACT, I'LL GO ONE BETTER.
Let's see if we can over the next 2 weeks at everyone's convenience, have an extended discussion on the topic, (mods may/may not prefer separate thread).

once and for all, let there be a definitive cost benefit analysis
Hall to Rangers along the above proposal I made, or any one slightly modified close enough thereto.

I'll consider with an open mind that acquiring Hall for the price quoted is not a good idea, IF my critics can demonstrate why, in their opinion which they have obligation to substantiate, preferably with fact, same is overall negative for us.

If that CAN be done objectively, and is NOT reduced to subjective opinion, I'll drop Hall for not less than 1 year.

But, if that can't be done objectively, and iis reduced to subjective opinion, then my critics must concede, in the name of intellectual honesty, the bernmeister theory of acquiring Hall as presented cannot be discredited.

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Old
02-11-2012, 09:44 AM
  #100
bernmeister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azrok22 View Post
For the umpteenth time, Hall is not moving. As a Oilers' first overall draft pick, he have intrinsic value as a promise of the future that sells tickets. No matter how many times you post the same thing, that isn't going to change. These proposals have been mocked, repeatedly, for a reason. It's not because other fans wouldn't love Hall; it's because there's some displacement from reality going on.
Please see my subsequent post.
if true, that intrinsic value has already been somewhat replaced (RNH) and can be so even further.

More importantly, I daresay unarguably, that pales in comparison to actually winning.
The O heavy Oilers would compete more quickly drafting an exceptional scoring F at #2 overall (your new ticket selling rock star), and moving Hall for the package.

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