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Mike Richter or Henrik Lundqvist

View Poll Results: Who ya got?
Mike Richter 83 30.97%
Henrik Lundqvist 185 69.03%
Voters: 268. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
02-11-2012, 11:16 AM
  #251
JoeRangers
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Originally Posted by msv957 View Post
Not sure I agree.. Hank has had some quality teams the past 5-6 years where he could have pulled a Halak in the playoffs and carried some Ranger teams deep in the playoffs. Last year's Ranger team had top 5 best goal differential in the NHL, had top 5 lowest GAA in the NHL and had a top 15 in Goals scored. That was a good enough team to make some serious noise in the playoffs last year.
And when they got to the playoffs last year they scored 8 goals in 5 games and only 5 goals in their 4 loses. Hard for Lundqvist to carry a team when they cant score. Cant expect him to have 3 shutouts in one series.

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02-11-2012, 11:17 AM
  #252
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Originally Posted by JoeRangers View Post
And when they got to the playoffs last year they scored 8 goals in 5 games and only 5 goals in their 4 loses. Hard for Lundqvist to carry a team when they cant score. Cant expect him to have 3 shutouts in one series.
Yep. Those are pretty pathetic numbers.

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02-11-2012, 11:56 AM
  #253
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
I hope you aren't seriously comparing this team to the 94 team, which had 6 Hall of Fame caliber players on it.
50 wins is 50 wins. Whose to say that some of the current 2012 Rangers wont be Hall of Famers one day?

Lots of teams in 1994 had Hall of Famers. Only one team won the Cup.

The Rangers' back-up goalie this season is 10-2.

In other words, the 2012 Rangers are an elite team. Just because they don't have 35-plus guys with pre-Ranger HOF resumes, doesnt detract from their overall accomplishment.

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02-11-2012, 11:59 AM
  #254
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Originally Posted by Henriks Broadway Hat View Post
Cally going down was really bad.
Yes, the Cally injury did hurt but many teams go through injuries. Last year's team was more than good enough to go through a few rounds of the playoffs if Hank pulled a Halak and carried the team. I hope this doesn't sound like a knock against Hank as the odds are he will eventually get in that beast mode that some goalies get into during the playoffs and carry teams real far into the playoffs. Hank is a rock during the regular season and I like his chances come playoff time

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02-11-2012, 12:02 PM
  #255
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Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
50 wins is 50 wins. Whose to say that some of the current 2012 Rangers wont be Hall of Famers one day?

Lots of teams in 1994 had Hall of Famers. Only one team won the Cup.

The Rangers' back-up goalie this season is 10-2.

In other words, the 2012 Rangers are an elite team. Just because they don't have 35-plus guys with pre-Ranger HOF resumes, doesnt detract from their overall accomplishment.
Not disagreeing with you but I wonder how many more wins that team would have had with the shootout

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02-11-2012, 12:05 PM
  #256
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Quote:
Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
50 wins is 50 wins. Whose to say that some of the current 2012 Rangers wont be Hall of Famers one day?

Lots of teams in 1994 had Hall of Famers. Only one team won the Cup.

The Rangers' back-up goalie this season is 10-2.

In other words, the 2012 Rangers are an elite team. Just because they don't have 35-plus guys with pre-Ranger HOF resumes, doesnt detract from their overall accomplishment.
I don't doubt that there's at least one potential HoFer on this roster, but look... that team was incredibly good. There wasn't a single real weakness on that roster. Also, the difference between the 1 seed and the 8 seed was much greater then than it is now.

I'm just saying, that team was significantly better than almost the whole league.

This team is in first place, and other teams are considered better favorites than us.

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02-11-2012, 12:09 PM
  #257
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Originally Posted by msv957 View Post
Yes, the Cally injury did hurt but many teams go through injuries. Last year's team was more than good enough to go through a few rounds of the playoffs if Hank pulled a Halak and carried the team. I hope this doesn't sound like a knock against Hank as the odds are he will eventually get in that beast mode that some goalies get into during the playoffs and carry teams real far into the playoffs. Hank is a rock during the regular season and I like his chances come playoff time
Take a look at my reply to your last post. Not sure anyone could have carried that team through the 1st round. He would have needed to shutout out the Caps 3 times to get the Rangers through that 1st round. Thats beyond getting hot

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02-11-2012, 12:19 PM
  #258
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I don't know. Regular season, Hank by far. Richter's won though. Hard decision.

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02-11-2012, 12:31 PM
  #259
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
I don't doubt that there's at least one potential HoFer on this roster, but look... that team was incredibly good. There wasn't a single real weakness on that roster. Also, the difference between the 1 seed and the 8 seed was much greater then than it is now.

I'm just saying, that team was significantly better than almost the whole league.

This team is in first place, and other teams are considered better favorites than us.
Me neither.

And his name is Henrik Lundqvist.

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02-11-2012, 02:41 PM
  #260
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Ok, so let's make a deal...


If Lundqvist's the reason why the Rangers are an elite team, than it'll be solely on his shoulders if they dont advance in the playoffs.

Regular season -- "Rangers are great because of Lundqvist"

Postseason -- "Rangers are losers because Lundqvist didnt get any help"

We'll see.

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02-11-2012, 02:50 PM
  #261
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Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
Ok, so let's make a deal...


If Lundqvist's the reason why the Rangers are an elite team, than it'll be solely on his shoulders if they dont advance in the playoffs.

Regular season -- "Rangers are great because of Lundqvist"

Postseason -- "Rangers are losers because Lundqvist didnt get any help"

We'll see.
This is the first year the Rangers can be considered an Elite team and it isnt all Lundqvist. The whole team is playing great.

In past seasons the reason why they barely got into the playoffs was mostly due to his goaltending

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02-11-2012, 02:57 PM
  #262
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This debate is just absurd. Richter wasn't even a superstar goalie. I'm not saying winning the Stanley Cup is overrated, but there were many elite players who never got a chance to win it.

So, do I take Cam Ward or Bill Ranford over Lundqvist as well?

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02-11-2012, 03:08 PM
  #263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
I don't doubt that there's at least one potential HoFer on this roster, but look... that team was incredibly good. There wasn't a single real weakness on that roster. Also, the difference between the 1 seed and the 8 seed was much greater then than it is now.

I'm just saying, that team was significantly better than almost the whole league.

This team is in first place, and other teams are considered better favorites than us.

OK, so what's the point of even having this discussion. It's obvious that Richter will never get the credit he deserves from the fans here who were in elementary school or younger when he was in goal for the 1994 season.

The majority who actually saw Richter play and were old enough to understand the game back then will always credit Richter for doing his job during the 1994 run and not try to diminish it by saying garbage like "his teammates won the Cup" and "he only played well in a few games"

And I'm sorry, Henrik has yet to perform under the kind of pressure Richter did in 1994, where literally one goal would have completely derailed the entire season where it was Cup or bust from Day One.

One last thing....People make it sound like it was Richter's fault on Zelepuklin's tying goal, ignoring the fact that a) Graves and Leetch blew the assignment and left him wide open b) Richter made stretch pad save on the one-timer and the goal was scored because Zelepukin was allowed to take a 2nd whack at it completely untouched.

The 1994 team looked old and weak in the Devils series. Keenan benched Messier and Leetch. The only reason why they were in a position to advance was Mike Richter.

Jesus people....The entire 1994 postseason is on Gamecenter Vault and DVD...friggin watch them please.

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02-11-2012, 03:11 PM
  #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
This debate is just absurd. Richter wasn't even a superstar goalie. I'm not saying winning the Stanley Cup is overrated, but there were many elite players who never got a chance to win it.

So, do I take Cam Ward or Bill Ranford over Lundqvist as well?
Why wasnt he a superstar?

I'm starting to think you never saw any of the goalies in his era play at all.

Lundqvist is a regular-season superstar. That is the sole reason why this is even being debated. Richter was a very good regular season goalie but had two excellent postseasons that added to his legacy.

Lundqvist has yet to do that, for whatever reason.

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02-11-2012, 03:22 PM
  #265
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Lundqvist >>>> Richter and I love Richter.

Winning is not on the goalie, its on the team. Lundqvist could have 1.50GAA and .935% and still lose a series if the team isn't scoring. Bottom line it takes a team to win a championship, not one man.

For those who want to point at Richter or Giguere or Brodeur or Roy.... look at those teams. Did those guys do their part? Hell yeah but they didn't do it alone.

Richter had a huge playoffs in '94 but he certainly didn't win the team all 16 games alone so don't act like he did.

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02-11-2012, 03:30 PM
  #266
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterUnspoken View Post
Lundqvist >>>> Richter and I love Richter.

Winning is not on the goalie, its on the team. Lundqvist could have 1.50GAA and .935% and still lose a series if the team isn't scoring. Bottom line it takes a team to win a championship, not one man.

For those who want to point at Richter or Giguere or Brodeur or Roy.... look at those teams. Did those guys do their part? Hell yeah but they didn't do it alone.

Richter had a huge playoffs in '94 but he certainly didn't win the team all 16 games alone so don't act like he did.
He won the ones that mattered, which is why I'm sticking with Richter. Lundqvist has yet to do that.

Richter actually lead the NHL in SVPCT in the postseason twice in his career (1991 and 1997).


Lundqvist has never had a postseason in which he had a 1.50 GAA and .935 SVPCT. In fact, both his GAA and SVPCT increase from regular season to postseason.

2007 was the only postseason in which Henrik's SVPCT was lower in the playoffs than it was for that regular season. He's been to the playoffs 5 times. So while it is true that he hasn't played for elite teams in the playoffs, we see a drop in performance (which is usually rare for elite goalies since defenses tighten up for the playoffs)



In 1997, he lead the NHL in SVPCT the same postseason Roy, Hasek and Brodeur played in.


Last edited by DM23BK30: 02-11-2012 at 03:38 PM.
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02-11-2012, 03:31 PM
  #267
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Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
OK, so what's the point of even having this discussion. It's obvious that Richter will never get the credit he deserves from the fans here who were in elementary school or younger when he was in goal for the 1994 season.

The majority who actually saw Richter play and were old enough to understand the game back then will always credit Richter for doing his job during the 1994 run and not try to diminish it by saying garbage like "his teammates won the Cup" and "he only played well in a few games"

And I'm sorry, Henrik has yet to perform under the kind of pressure Richter did in 1994, where literally one goal would have completely derailed the entire season where it was Cup or bust from Day One.

One last thing....People make it sound like it was Richter's fault on Zelepuklin's tying goal, ignoring the fact that a) Graves and Leetch blew the assignment and left him wide open b) Richter made stretch pad save on the one-timer and the goal was scored because Zelepukin was allowed to take a 2nd whack at it completely untouched.

The 1994 team looked old and weak in the Devils series. Keenan benched Messier and Leetch. The only reason why they were in a position to advance was Mike Richter.

Jesus people....The entire 1994 postseason is on Gamecenter Vault and DVD...friggin watch them please.
Definitely not fair to say that Richter wasnt a HUGE part of the Rangers winning in 94. He definitely had more than a few good games. I also dont think its fair to say that because he won the Cup and Lundqvist didnt that he is better. Lundqvist has had no help in the playoffs

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02-11-2012, 04:10 PM
  #268
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Also, watch the 97 series against the Devils. Richter was the only reason we won that Series, just ask the Devils fans.

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02-11-2012, 04:21 PM
  #269
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I had season tickets through '93-94, so I can honestly say that I saw a lot of Richter. I can't say that the '93-94 team wouldn't have won with Lundqvist in net and the disparity between our post lockout roster(s) and the teams from '91-97 is pretty huge. I loved Richter, too, but I think Henrik is the better goalie and his career Rangers #'s will probably eclipse Richter's in every category when all is said and done. It remains to be seen if a roster can ever be assembled again like our Cup winning team.

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02-11-2012, 04:31 PM
  #270
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
I had season tickets through '93-94, so I can honestly say that I saw a lot of Richter. I can't say that the '93-94 team wouldn't have won with Lundqvist in net and the disparity between our post lockout roster(s) and the teams from '91-97 is pretty huge. I loved Richter, too, but I think Henrik is the better goalie and his career Rangers #'s will probably eclipse Richter's in every category when all is said and done. It remains to be seen if a roster can ever be assembled again like our Cup winning team.
See bolded.

When he does so, I'll agree.

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02-11-2012, 04:54 PM
  #271
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Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
This debate is just absurd. Richter wasn't even a superstar goalie. I'm not saying winning the Stanley Cup is overrated, but there were many elite players who never got a chance to win it.

So, do I take Cam Ward or Bill Ranford over Lundqvist as well?
Cam Ward is a great goalie. I don't think the Rangers miss a step at all if Ward was the #1 goalie on this team

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02-11-2012, 04:57 PM
  #272
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Originally Posted by msv957 View Post
Cam Ward is a great goalie. I don't think the Rangers miss a step at all if Ward was the #1 goalie on this team
I'm not going to respond to that.
Do you take Chris Osgood over Hank as well? Niemi?

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02-11-2012, 05:28 PM
  #273
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Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
Why wasnt he a superstar?
He didn't have the longevity and was never a consensus top 3 goalie in the league. Good player, but he wasn't a superstar. When I think of superstar goalies, I think of Belfour, Brodeur, Hasek, etc.

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02-11-2012, 05:30 PM
  #274
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Originally Posted by msv957 View Post
Cam Ward is a great goalie. I don't think the Rangers miss a step at all if Ward was the #1 goalie on this team
Ward is a good goalie no doubt, but he's never been better than Lundqvist. Even ask Hurricanes fans on who the better goalie is.

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02-11-2012, 06:11 PM
  #275
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Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
OK, so what's the point of even having this discussion. It's obvious that Richter will never get the credit he deserves from the fans here who were in elementary school or younger when he was in goal for the 1994 season.

The majority who actually saw Richter play and were old enough to understand the game back then will always credit Richter for doing his job during the 1994 run and not try to diminish it by saying garbage like "his teammates won the Cup" and "he only played well in a few games"

And I'm sorry, Henrik has yet to perform under the kind of pressure Richter did in 1994, where literally one goal would have completely derailed the entire season where it was Cup or bust from Day One.

One last thing....People make it sound like it was Richter's fault on Zelepuklin's tying goal, ignoring the fact that a) Graves and Leetch blew the assignment and left him wide open b) Richter made stretch pad save on the one-timer and the goal was scored because Zelepukin was allowed to take a 2nd whack at it completely untouched.

The 1994 team looked old and weak in the Devils series. Keenan benched Messier and Leetch. The only reason why they were in a position to advance was Mike Richter.

Jesus people....The entire 1994 postseason is on Gamecenter Vault and DVD...friggin watch them please.
You should read back in the thread where I said that Richter is one of the best big game goalies of the last 20 years. I never said Richter wasn't a big part of that team. I just said that the 1994 Rangers were a superior team to the 2012 Rangers.

That crap about assuming that people with differing opinions than you haven't seen what you have? Yeah, you can check that right now. No need to be a dick about it.

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