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Trade Proposal Thread 8.0 "NHL 12 reigns supreme!"

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Old
02-12-2012, 10:58 AM
  #251
Gardner McKay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Nash has scored more goals than Carter.

Nash:277, Carter 193...but if you go goals/82 games played (to factor in the fact that Nash has played more games) it comes out to this:

Nash: 35.16 G/82
Carter: 32.04 G/82


Fairly comparable. Then again, Nash hasn't played with the Talent that Carter has played with, so there is some question as whether Nash would be a 45ish guy here or not. You really dont know with either guy. They both have some question marks to them.

But Carter is cheaper...by a ton.
It was late and I was going off memory but my point is still the same. Carter is alot cheaper. Personally, Nash's extra 2.6 million is not worth the chance of IF he can score an extra 10 goals a year playing with better talent. Many of us thought Zherdev would put in 35-40 goals playing along side Scott Gomez.

Unless it is a cheap reclamation project you have to take these players for what they are, not what you hope they can be.

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02-12-2012, 11:00 AM
  #252
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Originally Posted by azrok22 View Post
I really don't think Gill has enough foot speed to be considered by us as a viable rental option. Maybe a rental of Kostitsyn? Not exactly enamored him either, tbh.
WW for Kostitsyn is a redundant move.

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02-12-2012, 11:00 AM
  #253
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Originally Posted by NvincentYvalentineR View Post
It was late and I was going off memory but my point is still the same. Carter is alot cheaper. Personally, Nash's extra 2.6 million is not worth the chance of IF he can score an extra 10 goals a year playing with better talent. Many of us thought Zherdev would put in 35-40 goals playing along side Scott Gomez.

Unless it is a cheap reclamation project you have to take these players for what they are, not what you hope they can be.
After they've established themselves in the NHL: yes.

At the draft: obviously not.

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02-12-2012, 11:04 AM
  #254
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeRangers View Post
Pacioretty for Wolski. Get it done Slats
Wojtek Wolski, Mats Zuccarello, Ryan Bourque & Sam Klasen for Max Pacioretty, Chris Campoli, Nathan Beaulieu & Alexei Emelin
(Reminds me of the Gomez trade)
Heck - we can even throw in Redden & Avery for free! if they want
I dare someone to post that on the main boards :-P
Just dare them too....

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02-12-2012, 11:05 AM
  #255
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If we are trading Dubinsky in a big package, it better be for Ryan.

Dubinsky + Anisimov + Sauer + 1st + Thomas

Should not give up that package for a 7+ mil cap hit.

Ryan is the ideal player. In every aspect. Cap hit, age, position, skill set, style of play.

Forget Carter and Nash. Go after Ryan.

And on dealing Kreider, I wouldn't do it. But if there was one player id consider it for, it would be Ryan. For the same reasons above. It would be a tough pill to swallow. Everyone knows im high on Kreider. But when you're getting a perennial 30+ goal scoring 24 year old who is under contract and a VERY manageable cap hit. And is the best player in the deal...that's when you consider that deal.

NO to dealing Stepan, McDonagh, Staal, Girardi, Del Zotto under ANY circumstances.

Dubinsky + Sauer + Kreider + 1st

For Ryan?

Would have to strongly consider that one.

Ryan is a HECK of a player. Would fit here like a glove, too.

Hagelin. Stepan. Gaborik
Ryan. Richards. Callahan
Anisimov
Rupp. Boyle. Prust

Fill in the third line with guys like Thomas, Fasth, Miller, St. Croix...


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02-12-2012, 11:11 AM
  #256
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Originally Posted by Ailurophile View Post
WW for Kostitsyn is a redundant move.
Not even close. I would love Kostitsyn at the deadline to our team. He would instantly have one of the hardest and most accurate shots on our team, which would add to the offensive production that we need. I am not saying he is miles ahead of Wolski, but he is clearly ahead of wolski in terms of production.

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02-12-2012, 11:21 AM
  #257
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Originally Posted by SauceCheese91 View Post
Not even close. I would love Kostitsyn at the deadline to our team. He would instantly have one of the hardest and most accurate shots on our team, which would add to the offensive production that we need. I am not saying he is miles ahead of Wolski, but he is clearly ahead of wolski in terms of production.
Perhaps on the Habs team, in a Habs system, but with Torts? I don't think he would be. Have to imagine he'd be on the 4th line with Rupp and Prust before the end of the first period of his first game.

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02-12-2012, 11:32 AM
  #258
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Originally Posted by Ailurophile View Post
Perhaps on the Habs team, in a Habs system, but with Torts? I don't think he would be. Have to imagine he'd be on the 4th line with Rupp and Prust before the end of the first period of his first game.
only players that i like from the Habs: Cole, Eller, Palushaj, Pacioretty, or Gorges..maybe Moen if dealt for Wolski..

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02-12-2012, 11:35 AM
  #259
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If the Rangers do trade for Nash...

That's Nash ($7.8) + Gaborik ($7.5) + Richards ($6.667) + Hank ($6.875) + Staal ($3.975) + Girardi ($3.325)

= $36.142 million on the books in 2013-2014 from just those guys.

The off-season before that season (not this, but next) the Rangers will have to re-sign Stepan, Hagelin, McDonagh, and Sauer.

By all accounts the Salary cap is taking a dip this off-season...even if it's (a generous guess of) $60 million in the 2013 off-season, that's still only $24 million to re-sign those important RFA's, the number doesn't include guys like Prust, Del Zotto, Callahan and others who will also be on the team.

Is it fair to assume that some of the aforementioned players will go to CBJ in the deal? Of course, but even so, it's going to be hard to fill out a roster with the limitations.

I absolutely LOVE Rick Nash, he's my favorite in the NHL. But Sather is a smart businessman, he shed a **** load of salary the last time the NHL was going to limit a teams budget...I see no reason that he thinks he can add Nash this time around and not handcuff the team in the future.

Though, crazier things have happened.

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02-12-2012, 11:37 AM
  #260
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Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
I am now completely convinced - Ranger Boy is Glen Sather
He always does have the answer's--Ranger Boy just come out of that Edmonton closet and tell us that you really are ?????.

Just kidding but as always thanks for the information.

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02-12-2012, 11:44 AM
  #261
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
If the Rangers do trade for Nash...

That's Nash ($7.8) + Gaborik ($7.5) + Richards ($6.667) + Hank ($6.875) + Staal ($3.975) + Girardi ($3.325)

= $36.142 million on the books in 2013-2014 from just those guys.

The off-season before that season (not this, but next) the Rangers will have to re-sign Stepan, Hagelin, McDonagh, and Sauer.

By all accounts the Salary cap is taking a dip this off-season...even if it's (a generous guess of) $60 million in the 2013 off-season, that's still only $24 million to re-sign those important RFA's, the number doesn't include guys like Prust, Del Zotto, Callahan and others who will also be on the team.

Is it fair to assume that some of the aforementioned players will go to CBJ in the deal? Of course, but even so, it's going to be hard to fill out a roster with the limitations.

I absolutely LOVE Rick Nash, he's my favorite in the NHL. But Sather is a smart businessman, he shed a **** load of salary the last time the NHL was going to limit a teams budget...I see no reason that he thinks he can add Nash this time around and not handcuff the team in the future.

Though, crazier things have happened.
I don't think they will trade for Nash but lets say they do.....may Sather is banking on a new CBA resetting/adjusting some of the cap hits or even adding a franchise rule clause etc? I guess what I am saying is that using the rules of today doesn't make much sense after September 15th.

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02-12-2012, 11:49 AM
  #262
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[QUOTE=silverfish;44009233]If the Rangers do trade for Nash...

That's Nash ($7.8) + Gaborik ($7.5) + Richards ($6.667) + Hank ($6.875) + Staal ($3.975) + Girardi ($3.325)

= $36.142 million on the books in 2013-2014 from just those guys.

The off-season before that season (not this, but next) the Rangers will have to re-sign Stepan, Hagelin, McDonagh, and Sauer.

By all accounts the Salary cap is taking a dip this off-season...even if it's (a generous guess of) $60 million in the 2013 off-season, that's still only $24 million to re-sign those important RFA's, the number doesn't include guys like Prust, Del Zotto, Callahan and others who will also be on the team.

Is it fair to assume that some of the aforementioned players will go to CBJ in the deal? Of course, but even so, it's going to be hard to fill out a roster with the limitations.

I absolutely LOVE Rick Nash, he's my favorite in the NHL. But Sather is a smart businessman, he shed a **** load of salary the last time the NHL was going to limit a teams budget...I see no reason that he thinks he can add Nash this time around and not handcuff the team in the future.

I got to agree with you while everyone is killing the deal because of Kreider I don't see him as a deal breaker.

While I do believe Krieder will be really good some have said they see him as a 60pts 30 goal scorer that's some big shoes to fill in a season or 2.

Remember the last player we thought was going to be this good never played an NHL game--RIP Cherepanov.

Nash is a stud and playing with a center that can get him the puck who know's how many he'll put in--so if the deal is what has been mentioned you have to think long and hard about it.

Dubi--personally I would rather it be AA(who just happened to score yesterday while the GM was there)
1st we'll be picking 25 or lower
Krieder--tough but you never know how he'll turn out.
WW for cap reasons.

Also after looking at capgeek I'm not so sure we won't have enough money to sign our RFA they claim that we'll have 24 or so million available(2013-2014) and unless I'm missing something even if you add Nash's salary(minus Dubi's)we'll still have 20or so million left(unless the cap goes down).

So I'm not so sure we can't live with Nash's cap hit and sign all of our RFA/UFa.

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02-12-2012, 11:49 AM
  #263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
I don't think they will trade for Nash but lets say they do.....may Sather is banking on a new CBA resetting/adjusting some of the cap hits or even adding a franchise rule clause etc? I guess what I am saying is that using the rules of today doesn't make much sense after September 15th.
That's a huge risk, and a big IF. He'd have to know something to do something based around that kind of gamble.

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02-12-2012, 11:50 AM
  #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
I don't think they will trade for Nash but lets say they do.....may Sather is banking on a new CBA resetting/adjusting some of the cap hits or even adding a franchise rule clause etc? I guess what I am saying is that using the rules of today doesn't make much sense after September 15th.
Valid points, we could be looking at a completely different CBA come next season...but there's no world I see that move working out well financially for the franchise.

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02-12-2012, 12:00 PM
  #265
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CLB has pahlsson too. Ufa face off specialist

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02-12-2012, 12:01 PM
  #266
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Im firmly on the side of the Rangers standing pat or going after cheap upcoming UFA's to bolster the roster at wing or on defense.

All this talk about trading roster assets and assuming contracts that, in some cases, run 10 more years is ridiculous. It shows an utter lack of understanding of how this squad was built, and how its come together. This team's success is far greater than the sum of its parts - thats a unique and fragile thing to have.

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02-12-2012, 12:08 PM
  #267
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Originally Posted by Ailurophile View Post
Perhaps on the Habs team, in a Habs system, but with Torts? I don't think he would be. Have to imagine he'd be on the 4th line with Rupp and Prust before the end of the first period of his first game.
There are a lot of misconceptions about Kostitsyn's game.

In reality, he is a big body who can hit like a truck and is a good goal scorer. Excellent 3rd line winger, solid 2nd liner. He is very, very well liked in the Montreal locker room, he's reportedly a great teammate. I'd love to add him for a 2nd rounder or a B-prospect. He'd fit the system well.

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02-12-2012, 12:18 PM
  #268
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Im firmly on the side of the Rangers standing pat or going after cheap upcoming UFA's to bolster the roster at wing or on defense.

All this talk about trading roster assets and assuming contracts that, in some cases, run 10 more years is ridiculous. It shows an utter lack of understanding of how this squad was built, and how its come together. This team's success is far greater than the sum of its parts - thats a unique and fragile thing to have.
The anti-prospect that refused to acknowledge how this team was being built, from within, presumes to tell others how THEY have no understanding?

The chances of a big deal happening are slim. That doesn't mean people can't discuss it.

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02-12-2012, 12:24 PM
  #269
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I'd move Del Zotto before I move Dubinsky. Hes having a down year. When he has confidence he's an extremely valuable playoff player.

A lot of DZs assists are secondary. He's having a great year, no doubt, but I think we've got guys who can move the puck just as well, and Erixon is going to be special. He just needs a couple more years.

I'd put DZ in a deal with Anisimov along with prospects and picks to get Ryan.

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02-12-2012, 12:25 PM
  #270
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Im firmly on the side of the Rangers standing pat or going after cheap upcoming UFA's to bolster the roster at wing or on defense.

All this talk about trading roster assets and assuming contracts that, in some cases, run 10 more years is ridiculous. It shows an
utter lack of understanding of how
this squad was built, and how its
come together. This team's
success is far greater than the sum
of its parts - thats a unique and
fragile thing to have.
I AGREE . however what will be said if we fall short and miss out and perhaps adding one more player would have been the differance

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02-12-2012, 12:28 PM
  #271
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Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
I'd move Del Zotto before I move Dubinsky. Hes having a down year. When he has confidence he's an extremely valuable playoff player.

A lot of DZs assists are secondary. He's having a great year, no doubt, but I think we've got guys who can move the puck just as well, and Erixon is going to be special. He just needs a couple more years.

I'd put DZ in a deal with Anisimov along with prospects and picks to get Ryan.
Dubinsky has a career high of 54 points. He's a good player, but he's far from necessary.

Del Zotto fills a need for this team PPQB and puck moving defenseman. His defensive game has come along tremendously. He's logging 23/24 minutes a night in all situations, and he's still only 22. He has a LOT of developing to still do. Secondary assists? A lot of assists that defenseman get are secondary. Yesterday's pass to Callahan certainly wasn't secondary, however, and was brilliant. How do we know if Erixon will come even close to how Del Zotto has performed this year? When you're a contending team, you don't trade a top notch, proven player because you have a prospect that might become as good. That's like saying you'd move Girardi because McIlrath will be here soon.

Rangers won't move Del Zotto, not in a deal for Ryan, not in any realistic deal at all. Dubinsky is a good trade chip because the Rangers have players that can fill his role and he'd be wanted by a lot of teams. I don't want to trade him, but if I had to choose one semi-important player on this team that I'd trade, it'd be Dubinsky.

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02-12-2012, 12:29 PM
  #272
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
I'd move Del Zotto before I move Dubinsky. Hes having a down year. When he has confidence he's an extremely valuable playoff player.

A lot of DZs assists are secondary. He's having a great year, no doubt, but I think we've got guys who can move the puck just as well, and Erixon is going to be special. He just needs a couple more years.

I'd put DZ in a deal with Anisimov along with prospects and picks to get Ryan.
Wow seriously? I think Dubi is easily replaceable from a production standpoint, yet it would hurt the lock room if he is moved. DZ is having a superb year and is playing with a high level of confidence. Yeah some of his assists are secondary, but DZ starts the play with his vision, whereas some of these goals wouldn't be in the net without his recognition. He is one of the leaders in Plus/Minus and has been a rock on the defensive end. MDZ is one of the last guys I would move on this team outside of McD, Steps, Staal.

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02-12-2012, 12:30 PM
  #273
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
The anti-prospect that refused to acknowledge how this team was being built, from within, presumes to tell others how THEY have no understanding?

The chances of a big deal happening are slim. That doesn't mean people can't discuss it.
You are the most black and white person on this board, as seen by labeling me as "anti-prospect." Problem is, you're wrong most of the time.

Your problem is you think these prospects are/are going to be great players. We have very few great players on this team, but we do have a mindset and identity that defines the team. The coach deserves the most credit for that, not the prospects. These guys have bought into what Tortorella is selling and thats invaluable. They are better than their talent dictates.

To throw a monkey wrench into that is silly. For you, the biggest hypocrite of all, to even be talking about this is even more silly...because, lets face it, you wouldnt be willing to give anything of value up because of the inflated premium you place on prospects.

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02-12-2012, 12:31 PM
  #274
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
I'd move Del Zotto before I move Dubinsky. Hes having a down year. When he has confidence he's an extremely valuable playoff player.

A lot of DZs assists are secondary. He's having a great year, no doubt, but I think we've got guys who can move the puck just as well, and Erixon is going to be special. He just needs a couple more years.

I'd put DZ in a deal with Anisimov along with prospects and picks to get Ryan.
DZ will probably end up having 10+ goals 30+ assists this season. What other young D-man do we have that has the potential do that? Not to mention his defensive game has improved drastically since his rookie year. The Rangers would be stupid to trade him.

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02-12-2012, 12:37 PM
  #275
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
I'd move Del Zotto before I move Dubinsky. Hes having a down year. When he has confidence he's an extremely valuable playoff player.

A lot of DZs assists are secondary. He's having a great year, no doubt, but I think we've got guys who can move the puck just as well, and Erixon is going to be special. He just needs a couple more years.

I'd put DZ in a deal with Anisimov along with prospects and picks to get Ryan.
Ask yourself this, who's easier to replace? I grinding 3rd liner who can put up 20+ goals and 40-50 points or a puck moving dman who's 21 and will probably at the very least in his prime put up 10+ goals and the same amount of points? Alot easier to replace Duby than it is to replace Del Zotto. Erixon could very well be better than him in a few years but you dont know for sure. And I would love to hear who can move the puck just as well.

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