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Chris Botta on Chris Kreider (All Kreider discussion)

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02-13-2012, 11:18 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by SlingshotVv View Post
We've gotten like 10 posts this passed year frmo people who actually have watched Kreider play say that the talent is there, but the guy floats a lot, and/or goes long stretches standing around or not involved in the game. We have seemingly hundreds of fans talk about him being a first year 30/30 all-star. There is a major disconnect going on with the fanbase over this guy.

Reminds me of Sanguinetti, where the equation was: The less you saw Sanguinetti play, and the more your knowledge of his game was from scouting reports and people online, the higher his ceiling and NHL readiness was. I really REALLY hope this isn't the case with Kreider.

If he truly is going to need Torts to whip him into shape, a late season call-up is going to do more harm than good.
Definitely dont see a late season call up. How many games can he actually play once BU's season is over. Dont think the Rangers wanna throw him into that kind of situation. Much rather him go to the Whale and play out the season there and see what his games like. Him making the team next year is certainly a real possibility.

BTW love the avatar

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02-13-2012, 11:18 AM
  #52
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hah please don't compare this team to the 1980 usa team.
It was a joke.

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02-13-2012, 11:22 AM
  #53
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Is the beanpot final on tv?
Nesn i believe

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02-13-2012, 11:35 AM
  #54
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i think its crazy to assume he'd really be able to step in and contribute right away, especially when the NHL competition is at its fiercest.

is a move like this even precidented?

I think its far more likely Zuc or WW gets put in the lineup if we lose a top 6 forward (god forbid)

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02-13-2012, 11:43 AM
  #55
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On 1050 ESPN Radio yesterday, Dave Maloney said, “This guy is a horse folks. He was a man amongst boys. Rangers management all going to the Beanpot tomorrow night to get a look at probably the next big young player to join the Rangers”
the rangers should take him to the bruins game tomorrow too. happy valentines day, chris.

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02-13-2012, 11:59 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mullichicken25 View Post
i think its crazy to assume he'd really be able to step in and contribute right away, especially when the NHL competition is at its fiercest.

is a move like this even precidented?

I think its far more likely Zuc or WW gets put in the lineup if we lose a top 6 forward (god forbid)
Doug Weight stepped from the college ranks straight into a playoff Series against the Capitals.

It's not often that it happens, very rare in fact, but it does happen

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02-13-2012, 12:17 PM
  #57
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Beanpot on NESN

does anyone know of an internet stream that will carry the Beanpot? I don't get NESN on my cable system.

Thanks!!!

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02-13-2012, 12:17 PM
  #58
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it wouldnt be the worst thing in the world to be honest.

This kid is either going to be a HUGE part of our future, or a HUGE piece to move to help the team. Either way, no need to coddle him. ive felt he's been NHL ready since last season, so who knows.

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02-13-2012, 12:29 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Ailurophile View Post
No more hype!

Christ if this kid doesn't pot at least 20 goals his first year with NYR people are going to be eating him alive.
Year? You new here?

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02-13-2012, 12:35 PM
  #60
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I'll be disappointed if Kreider doesn't score 20 goals a month.

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02-13-2012, 12:38 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
it wouldnt be the worst thing in the world to be honest.

This kid is either going to be a HUGE part of our future, or a HUGE piece to move to help the team. Either way, no need to coddle him. ive felt he's been NHL ready since last season, so who knows.
Yup...this kid already has experience against NHL players by playing in two WCs. While it's not the NHL playoffs, it is against a lot of quality NHL players. The kid is built physically right now to play against NHL players...6'3", 225, with that skating ability? Once again, Ranger brass felt he was ready to go pro last year. The question is more how will his inexperience be a factor. Besides, with Tortorella, it's all about trust. It's why Boyle and Prust got the minutes they do, and why the likes MZA and Avery never found a place in the lineup on a consistent basis.

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02-13-2012, 12:45 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by SlingshotVv View Post
We've gotten like 10 posts this passed year frmo people who actually have watched Kreider play say that the talent is there, but the guy floats a lot, and/or goes long stretches standing around or not involved in the game. We have seemingly hundreds of fans talk about him being a first year 30/30 all-star. There is a major disconnect going on with the fanbase over this guy.

Reminds me of Sanguinetti, where the equation was: The less you saw Sanguinetti play, and the more your knowledge of his game was from scouting reports and people online, the higher his ceiling and NHL readiness was. I really REALLY hope this isn't the case with Kreider.

If he truly is going to need Torts to whip him into shape, a late season call-up is going to do more harm than good.
There is so much wrong with this post.

I have seen Kreider at least 25 times since we drafted him, as have many many other posters here. From the WJC, to the WHC (I'll get to this later) to his frequently televised games, he's been viewed heavily from our fans, more so then any other prospect we have, a far cry from Bobby freaking Sanguinetti. This is the only prospect in our system where local people that frequently see these players don't have a superior opinion, we've all seen Kreider, and there's a reason we are so high on him. If he didn't have a flaw then there's no reason he wouldn't be the best prospect in hockey. What many people in this tread have mentioned, his "problem" is remedied very easy with a guy like Tortorella. For every person who is underwhelmed, there are twice as many fans that are incredibly impressed with how he plays.

Nobody has ever called Kreider a first year all-star. People have high expectations for his career, because his tools and skill set are through the roof, but nobody expects insane #'s his rookie year. Carl Hagelin and Derek Stepan both came in and put up good numbers as rookies (Hagelin likely would score 20 if he played an entire season), and Kreider is every bit as good of a prospect. There's no reason he can't be a 20 goal scorer his rookie year.

Brad Richards was amazed at his play before camp. The Rangers brass think he is going to be a go to player, and he was selected over every single american prospect at the age of 18 to play with men at the world hockey championships, where he has looked great. He was selected by a committee of NHL GM's and coaches for that tournament, the literal be-all-end-all to this argument. Last year he looked better then Craig Smith IMO, who is currently have an fantastic rookie season in the NHL and looks to be a dangerous top 6 player. And as an 18 year old he was getting bottom 6 minutes, surely he can't be a hard working, defensively responsible player if he's lazy and floats, and needs to be "whipped into shape".

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02-13-2012, 12:47 PM
  #63
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Anyone watch any Blues games the last two seasons?

David Backes, what a player, never scored more than 17 goals or 42 points in a single year playing at Mankato State. Look what he's done in St Lou the last few seasons, a real force even though he does not ooze natural talent in any one thing except PLAYING HOCKEY.

Kreider's next, with the possibility of being more dominant because of his speed.

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02-13-2012, 12:51 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by SherWood Lumber 76 View Post
Anyone watch any Blues games the last two seasons?

David Backes, what a player, never scored more than 17 goals or 42 points in a single year playing at Mankato State. Look what he's done in St Lou the last few seasons, a real force even though he does not ooze natural talent in any one thing except PLAYING HOCKEY.

Kreider's next, with the possibility of being more dominant because of his speed.
Kreider does ooze natural talent though...

But these type of expectations are very lofty.

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02-13-2012, 12:56 PM
  #65
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If he's added to the roster AFTER the deadline would he even be eligible to play in the playoffs? He's not under contract so I don't think he's on the Rangers reserve list...anyone have any confirmation on that? I'm going to start searching now...

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02-13-2012, 01:00 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by ColonialsHockey10 View Post
Kreider does ooze natural talent though...

But these type of expectations are very lofty.
Thats my point, thats why expectations are high. The kid does have natural gifts, the stat analysis is irrelevant unless he's just not scoring, which has not been the case.

I don't think its a sure thing but Kreider could be what Seguin was to the Bruins playoff run. You don't think Clark or Gorton think about it?

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02-13-2012, 01:07 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by ColonialsHockey10 View Post
There is so much wrong with this post.

I have seen Kreider at least 25 times since we drafted him, as have many many other posters here. From the WJC, to the WHC (I'll get to this later) to his frequently televised games, he's been viewed heavily from our fans, more so then any other prospect we have, a far cry from Bobby freaking Sanguinetti. This is the only prospect in our system where local people that frequently see these players don't have a superior opinion, we've all seen Kreider, and there's a reason we are so high on him. If he didn't have a flaw then there's no reason he wouldn't be the best prospect in hockey. What many people in this tread have mentioned, his "problem" is remedied very easy with a guy like Tortorella. For every person who is underwhelmed, there are twice as many fans that are incredibly impressed with how he plays.

Nobody has ever called Kreider a first year all-star. People have high expectations for his career, because his tools and skill set are through the roof, but nobody expects insane #'s his rookie year. Carl Hagelin and Derek Stepan both came in and put up good numbers as rookies (Hagelin likely would score 20 if he played an entire season), and Kreider is every bit as good of a prospect. There's no reason he can't be a 20 goal scorer his rookie year.

Brad Richards was amazed at his play before camp.
The Rangers brass think he is going to be a go to player, and he was selected over every single american prospect at the age of 18 to play with men at the world hockey championships, where he has looked great. He was selected by a committee of NHL GM's and coaches for that tournament, the literal be-all-end-all to this argument. Last year he looked better then Craig Smith IMO, who is currently have an fantastic rookie season in the NHL and looks to be a dangerous top 6 player. And as an 18 year old he was getting bottom 6 minutes, surely he can't be a hard working, defensively responsible player if he's lazy and floats, and needs to be "whipped into shape".

You can throw in Jim Cermy tweeting "Kreider is the best prospect here hands down" on one of the days Kreider was skating at Ranger camp beforee he headed off to BC. It isn't just Ranger fans that see big things for this kid. Dave Starman gushes about this kid every opportunity he gets. On the NBC broadcast on Friday, the were all over the kid. Pierre McGuire loves the kid.

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02-13-2012, 01:18 PM
  #68
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marian gaborik floats for the vast majority of his shifts as well.

Ryan Callahan is the exception rather than the rule...very few "Star" type players go at 100mph their entire shift. its about conserving the energy and ramping it up at 100mph for the few seconds where an opportunity presents itself.

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02-13-2012, 01:22 PM
  #69
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These comments about 'standing around' 'gliding' leave me wondering. Ever watch Gaborik? He's not racing around the ice at full speed all the time. There are times when he turns the jets on and there are times when he doesn't. It's all situational. The main thing is he can do things at high speed. The thing with Kreider is he has that extra gear, can reach it almost automatically and he has excellent size and strength to go along with all that.

Whether or not he scores a lot starting out--I expect he's going to be a better player than Hagelin in the long run and Hagelin is really good.

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02-13-2012, 01:23 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
marian gaborik floats for the vast majority of his shifts as well.

Ryan Callahan is the exception rather than the rule...very few "Star" type players go at 100mph their entire shift. its about conserving the energy and ramping it up at 100mph for the few seconds where an opportunity presents itself.
Exactly. Kreider's "floating" is actually very similar to Gaborik's now that you mention it. He picks his battles and accelerates at specific times. He certainly makes lazy plays and has bad shifts, as any player does. Even Cally had that horrible turnover against NJ, nobodies perfect.

He gets top PK minutes at BC, and throws a hit as good as anyone. And players don't need to dangle like Kuznetzov to have hands and pass like Granlund to have vision either, Kreider has both.

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02-13-2012, 01:34 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by mullichicken25 View Post
i think its crazy to assume he'd really be able to step in and contribute right away, especially when the NHL competition is at its fiercest.

is a move like this even precidented?

I think its far more likely Zuc or WW gets put in the lineup if we lose a top 6 forward (god forbid)
Brian Leetch joined the team right after the olympics and played all the way through. It was a little earlier in the year but it was March I believe.

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02-13-2012, 02:14 PM
  #72
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the rangers should take him to the bruins game tomorrow too. happy valentines day, chris.
If they did, he'd be whipping out the Bruins underwear and waving his Bruins flag

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02-13-2012, 02:58 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by SlingshotVv View Post
Reminds me of Sanguinetti
Going to Agree with Colonial. Your post suggests it's own significant level of disconnect.

I agree that Kreider may have some bad habits. It's about experience and the level he's playing at more than anything else. It's a problem that Tortorella has a very solid track record in fixing. Just look at the guys he'll be skating with in New York. Does anyone seriously think this bunch will tolerate a floater? Never.

I'm willing to bet that by mid point of his first season Kreider will be recognized as one the hardest workers on the squad.

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02-13-2012, 03:09 PM
  #74
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These comments about 'standing around' 'gliding' leave me wondering. Ever watch Gaborik? He's not racing around the ice at full speed all the time. There are times when he turns the jets on and there are times when he doesn't. It's all situational. The main thing is he can do things at high speed. The thing with Kreider is he has that extra gear, can reach it almost automatically and he has excellent size and strength to go along with all that.

Whether or not he scores a lot starting out--I expect he's going to be a better player than Hagelin in the long run and Hagelin is really good.
The proverbial nail on the head eco. That is an excellent comparison.

Puck pursuit has been a topic of "discussion" between Gabby and Tort's. We saw it on 24/7 and have been given indications that they talked about it more than once. Tort's does not tolerate repeating himself. I think it's safe to say that problem has been rectified.

Kreider will be fine.

A bigger, stronger, faster Carl Hagelin, with a harder, more accurate shot. People are going to be very excited as the Rangers bring him along.

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02-13-2012, 03:12 PM
  #75
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I'd be VERY surprised to see Kreider join the team after he graduates. He's been busting his ass for 3 years so he can begin his career this fall. Let the kid have a break for cryin out loud.

I'd liken his "floating" to the way Gaborik plays. One second he's gliding along, and the next he's flying down the ice at top speed backing off the defender. The real advantage is that while Gaborik doesn't have tremendous size, Kreider is like a refrigerator on skates. Not many defenders can handle a 6'3 225lb forward barreling down the wing.

Whether or not you agree on his upside, the prospect of what the kid could bring to the table is drool-worthy.

Edit: Sorry, didn't see so many others making the Gaborik comparison too, haha.

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