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Eastern Conference drafting in the past decade (NYR Management Appreciation)

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Old
02-13-2012, 07:49 PM
  #26
TheRedressor
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I will never forget the pure hatred for the Derek Stepan pick over Jared Staal lol........People were even making fun of Steps for being a tap dancer LOL.

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02-13-2012, 08:05 PM
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I will never forget the pure hatred for the Derek Stepan pick over Jared Staal lol........People were even making fun of Steps for being a tap dancer LOL.
Any video that exists?

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02-13-2012, 08:13 PM
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Any video that exists?
It was on these very boards.

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02-13-2012, 08:16 PM
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It was on these very boards.
I only joined a short while ago

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02-13-2012, 11:49 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I still think their drafting in the first round has been mediocre.
Agree.

And the thing about not having a top five pick, it was because management refused to pack it in year after year around the deadline. Never, ever did management take the approach to be sellers, and opted instead on acquiring players mid-season to try and make a run and qualify. All this did was place us 9-12 in the East and leave us with a mid-round pick. It was a flawed approach for years and screwed the club. Additionally, they made poor first round choices. The year Hugh Jessiman was picked, my God, take a look at the first round. Throw a dart and it would have been tough not to select a star.

Everything changed in March of 2004 when they finally smartened up. Drafting after that has been above average in my opinion, so I'll give credit where it's due. But it was multiple years of awful decisions that will forever leave me with a sour taste in my mouth when it comes to Glen Sather.

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02-14-2012, 12:08 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by nyrmessier011 View Post
Agree.

And the thing about not having a top five pick, it was because management refused to pack it in year after year around the deadline. Never, ever did management take the approach to be sellers, and opted instead on acquiring players mid-season to try and make a run and qualify. All this did was place us 9-12 in the East and leave us with a mid-round pick. It was a flawed approach for years and screwed the club. Additionally, they made poor first round choices. The year Hugh Jessiman was picked, my God, take a look at the first round. Throw a dart and it would have been tough not to select a star.

Everything changed in March of 2004 when they finally smartened up. Drafting after that has been above average in my opinion, so I'll give credit where it's due. But it was multiple years of awful decisions that will forever leave me with a sour taste in my mouth when it comes to Glen Sather.
I also wonder if the salary cap forced the Rangers to be smarter. This year, the average age of the team is under 27. The blue line for many years was a liability; now it's a strength.

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02-14-2012, 04:10 AM
  #32
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nyrmessier and aemoreira - both excellent points. Along the thoughts with nyrmessier, the Rangers would be a few points out of a playoff spot and make deadline deals that acquired aging talent. The perceived results were the Rangers weren't good enough to make the playoffs yet, not bad enough to secure a premium pick in the first round. However, I always thought that if the Rangers "sold" in one of those years, that they would actually perform better (hungry kids / minor leaguers). In 2004, that theory was not to come to fruition as the Thomas Pock, Josef Balej led Rangers had a hard time winning. Sather is ultimately responsible for any success or failure in the draft but in my humble opinion, this team's recent success of player development and better drafting coincides with Gordie Clark's involvement.

aemoreira - the salary cap certainly appears to have contributed to the Rangers to keep the free agent contracts at a minimum. I hope that the temptation to throw crippling contract terms to disappointing players (see Redden, Wade; Gomez, Scott; Drury, Chris) are limited going forward.

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02-14-2012, 07:55 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by aemoreira1981 View Post
I also wonder if the salary cap forced the Rangers to be smarter. This year, the average age of the team is under 27. The blue line for many years was a liability; now it's a strength.
The cap was not the reason for the Jessiman pick. And, yes, the drafting has picked up, but there has also been more of a safety approach. Everything is a crap shoot, but the mantra seems to have been, let's take a kid who may not be a top line player, but will probaby be a second or a definite third liner. Same with the blue liners. There has not been a swing for the fences pick in quite a while.

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02-14-2012, 08:14 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by aemoreira1981 View Post
I also wonder if the salary cap forced the Rangers to be smarter. This year, the average age of the team is under 27. The blue line for many years was a liability; now it's a strength.
I thought it might in 2004 into 2005, but it really didnt. At the first inkling of success Sather blew through $100M+ on silly acquisitions. During that time, however, a strong core was being built. I refuse to believe Sather fully trusted it at the time when you look at the Drury/Gomez/Redden signings.

He seems to have learned now. Only took 12 years and 3 major phases of his leadership.

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02-14-2012, 08:22 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by aemoreira1981 View Post
I also wonder if the salary cap forced the Rangers to be smarter. This year, the average age of the team is under 27. The blue line for many years was a liability; now it's a strength.
Forced them to be smarter or handcuffed Sather and made it harder to rebuild through Lil Jimmy's checkbook?

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02-14-2012, 08:38 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I thought it might in 2004 into 2005, but it really didnt. At the first inkling of success Sather blew through $100M+ on silly acquisitions. During that time, however, a strong core was being built. I refuse to believe Sather fully trusted it at the time when you look at the Drury/Gomez/Redden signings.

He seems to have learned now. Only took 12 years and 3 major phases of his leadership.
BRB - I agree with you that Sather was given a lot...and I mean A LOT of time to get the team to this point. However, Sather's era has to be split where you look at the pre-lock out and post lock out NHL. Now I don't have any sources so this purely speculative on my part but I always thought it was interesting timing on when the Rangers decided on the purge of Spring 2004. As fans, a lockout seemed likely but never did I think an entire NHL season was to be lost. Sather is part of the old boys club it seems. He may have known that the NHL landscape was about to change. Thus, prior to the lockout, when there wasn't a cap, Sather brought in the available talent (albeit damaged goods). His Jagr trade was curious. Anson Carter straight up? The Rangers basically had a bargain on their hands as Jagr should have been the MVP in 2005-06. Shanahan signs and the emergence of Henrik. Sean Avery part 1 was a success. I think Sather thought he could get a cup run by bringing in Drury and Gomez. (Although I liked Nylander and Cullen). If some of you have better memories, Jagr had a clause in his contract that appeared to be an easy incentive to reach but he never did. Prior to 2008-09, he left for the KHL and Avery signed with Dallas. This is where Sather set back a bit. Besides the existing, long term deals to Gomez and Drury, he spent a boatload for Redden.

I am re-reading my post...I don't think I have a point???


Last edited by drewcon40: 02-14-2012 at 08:51 AM.
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02-14-2012, 08:45 AM
  #37
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After 05-06, it was quite obvious that Sather thought that the team could make a run for the Cup with Jagr. 06-07 made that dream seem even more real. I think most Rangers fans felt the same. That's why Shanny, Gomez, Drury, & Redden were brought in. Only Shanahan was a good signing.

The bright side was that in spite of all that, Sather never traded away any promising young players. Name me one player that he's traded away that ended up being a star elsewhere. Tyutin's far from a star, so don't say him. I guess Kim Johnsson was pretty good, but no star. I know some people will never forgive him for trading Leetch and especially since that first rounder that was gotten for him ended up being Korpikoski. At least Sauer came from that.


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Old
02-14-2012, 09:03 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by drewcon40 View Post
BRB - I agree with you that Sather was given a lot...and I mean A LOT of time to get the team to this point. However, Sather's era has to be split where you look at the pre-lock out and post lock out NHL. Now I don't have any sources so this purely speculative on my part but I always thought it was interesting timing on when the Rangers decided on the purge of Spring 2004. As fans, a lockout seemed likely but never did I think an entire NHL season was to be lost. Sather is part of the old boys club it seems. He may have known that the NHL landscape was about to change. Thus, prior to the lockout, when there wasn't a cap, Sather brought in the available talent (albeit damaged goods). His Jagr trade was curious. Anson Carter straight up? The Rangers basically had a bargain on their hands as Jagr should have been the MVP in 2005-06. Shanahan signs and the emergence of Henrik. Sean Avery part 1 was a success. I think Sather thought he could get a cup run by bringing in Drury and Gomez. (Although I liked Nylander and Cullen). If some of you have better memories, Jagr had a clause in his contract that appeared to be an easy incentive to reach but he never did. Prior to 2008-09, he left for the KHL and Avery signed with Dallas. This is where Sather set back a bit. Besides the existing, long term deals to Gomez and Drury, he spent a boatload for Redden.

I am re-reading my post...I don't think I have a point???
No, I understand...and a lot of people do like to break it up between pre and post-lockout Sather...and label it bad vs. good. The bolded part is why the immediate years after the lockout were not much of a success. Those were terrible decisons, perhaps worse than any decision he made pre-lockout. Difference is, he had Lundqvist around to mask them a bit.

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02-14-2012, 09:16 AM
  #39
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A great big thanks to the OP for leaving Sather out of this thread and focusing on Management as a whole.

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02-14-2012, 09:41 AM
  #40
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Difference is, he had Lundqvist around to mask them a bit.
That, my friend, is the key!!

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02-14-2012, 10:09 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Forced them to be smarter or handcuffed Sather and made it harder to rebuild through Lil Jimmy's checkbook?
Never understood that argument. That would make sense if Sather had not spent the last 5 years throwing money at every serious free agent available.

The only real difference is the drafting (and development) is infinitely better. There is actually a team to add these players too.

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02-14-2012, 10:12 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by nyrmessier011 View Post
Agree.

And the thing about not having a top five pick, it was because management refused to pack it in year after year around the deadline. Never, ever did management take the approach to be sellers, and opted instead on acquiring players mid-season to try and make a run and qualify. All this did was place us 9-12 in the East and leave us with a mid-round pick. It was a flawed approach for years and screwed the club. Additionally, they made poor first round choices. The year Hugh Jessiman was picked, my God, take a look at the first round. Throw a dart and it would have been tough not to select a star.

Everything changed in March of 2004 when they finally smartened up. Drafting after that has been above average in my opinion, so I'll give credit where it's due. But it was multiple years of awful decisions that will forever leave me with a sour taste in my mouth when it comes to Glen Sather.
That has to one of the worst draft picks ever for this team. Its not even like you can say well he was supposed to be a great player but he just didnt pan out or he was picked where he should have been. I dont think that guy was on anyones radar. I remember guys who follow the draft and prospects saying the Rangers should draft a bunch of guys that were there when the Rangers were picking and they took Jessiman instead.

It really is sickening looking at the names taken after him. Just to make everyone throw up a little:
Dustin Brown, Brent Seabrook, Zach Parise, Ryan Getzlaf, Brent Burns, Ryan Kesler, Mike Richards, Brian Boyle and Corey Perry just in the 1st round

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02-14-2012, 10:21 AM
  #43
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Never understood that argument. That would make sense if Sather had not spent the last 5 years throwing money at every serious free agent available.

The only real difference is the drafting (and development) is infinitely better. There is actually a team to add these players too.
The impending lockout helped also. That was the season Sather gutted the team and clearly made the decision to start over. I think the prospect of a year without hockey made that decision easier for him.
They have actually done something that is hard to do. They have rebuilt while remaining compeitive (hence no high draft picks).
Having Lundqvist clearly helped in that regard.

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02-14-2012, 10:23 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by JoeRangers View Post
That has to one of the worst draft picks ever for this team. Its not even like you can say well he was supposed to be a great player but he just didnt pan out or he was picked where he should have been. I dont think that guy was on anyones radar. I remember guys who follow the draft and prospects saying the Rangers should draft a bunch of guys that were there when the Rangers were picking and they took Jessiman instead.

It really is sickening looking at the names taken after him. Just to make everyone throw up a little:
Dustin Brown, Brent Seabrook, Zach Parise, Ryan Getzlaf, Brent Burns, Ryan Kesler, Mike Richards, Brian Boyle and Corey Perry just in the 1st round
They key point of the Jessiman pick to me will always be our cupboard - it was bare as bare could be and Sather and Co take the biggest wildcard of the draft!?

Horrible management when you had so many players who at least had proven some things in their draft year. Personally I was a big Kesler fan(posters argued his offense was not there!!), liked Parise, Carter, Richards, Brown and many posters on here wanted Getzlaf.

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Old
02-14-2012, 10:58 AM
  #45
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That has to one of the worst draft picks ever for this team. Its not even like you can say well he was supposed to be a great player but he just didnt pan out or he was picked where he should have been. I dont think that guy was on anyones radar. I remember guys who follow the draft and prospects saying the Rangers should draft a bunch of guys that were there when the Rangers were picking and they took Jessiman instead.

It really is sickening looking at the names taken after him. Just to make everyone throw up a little:
Dustin Brown, Brent Seabrook, Zach Parise, Ryan Getzlaf, Brent Burns, Ryan Kesler, Mike Richards, Brian Boyle and Corey Perry just in the 1st round
One of these things is not like the other, one of these things doesn't belong.

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02-14-2012, 11:00 AM
  #46
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One of these things is not like the other, one of these things doesn't belong.
Lol I was wondering if someone would catch that

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02-14-2012, 11:00 AM
  #47
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What do you guys think happened to Bobby Sanguinetti? I thought he'd be every bit as good as MDZ. Why did one succeed and one bust?

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02-14-2012, 11:15 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
It was on these very boards.
You go back thru these boards and you will come up with some gems. It hysterically funny in spots and worth a look if you want some belly laughs.

The comments about Stepan and his tap dancing and that his favorite show was "glee". The face palms after we picked Kreider it goes on and on.

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02-14-2012, 12:31 PM
  #49
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mahon - Crosby and Ovechkin were both 1st picks overall. The Rangers never played bad enough for those picks. The Brendl pick was a trade with Tampa Bay that got us the 4th overall pick.

The pick for Bure wound up being a #10.
Lindros was acquired a package plus a 3rd rounder
The Rangers traded for Kovalev, which was a salary dump for Pittsburgh. I don't think picks were moved in that trade.
Crosby draft was a league wide lottery. How soon we forget.

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02-14-2012, 12:41 PM
  #50
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Crosby draft was a league wide lottery. How soon we forget.
Did I indicate otherwise?

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