Edit: I was going to add that I quoted a line-up for next season and asked where Mitchell was. If he is moved or scratched, the same applies for this year.
Where is Mitchell? If he goes or is scratched, I am okay with it because Wingels is showing a lot. He seems to have the tweener upside and is gaining more confidence as the games go on.
Nash would be awesome, but only if Havlat goes the other way. If LA goes out and Nash makes it clear he wants to come to SJ, the GM's hands may be tied and a move forced. I have nothing against Havlat or Demers, but they seem to be the most expendable at the time.
I'd rather not move Demers, though, as I like his game and enjoy the physicality he brings. Him and Braun are much different but can be equally important to the future.
Havlat is easy because we haven't seen much of him and Nash over Havlat is an easy move. It's just a matter of what it takes to upgrade.
On the other side, Havlat is almost like getting a late add at this point if he stays.
Next year, Mitchell's in the KHL ;-). (We'd have enough space to add Nash for those players so my only concern was how Nash would fit the next 2 seasons and Havlat is key to getting enough space.)
Agree on Demers but for Nash, there'd have to be some value. If DW wants him, he'd be wise to tell Howson he'll sit out until LA and NYR play their hands since they have better assets.
Agree on Havlat as a quasi trade. He better have the strongest hammies now.
Are you sure you're not confusing him with Mitchell? Desjardins is just fine - perfect 4th liner.
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd
Desjardins is fine if he's got Winchester on his wing. That's who he has the most chemistry with. He also helps kill penalties so he's providing value there as well.
Mitchell also fit that role for a while too. What I'm saying is that while some want a top 6 guy, I really want a guy that is better than DeJordan in all those aspects. Not a ton, just that much better to make DeJordan expendable. That's depth to me personally.
Just seems more reasonable and more useful. It's not a shot against Desi.
Mitchell also fit that role for a while too. What I'm saying is that while some want a top 6 guy, I really want a guy that is better than DeJordan in all those aspects. Not a ton, just that much better to make DeJordan expendable. That's depth to me personally.
Just seems more reasonable and more useful. It's not a shot against Desi.
I'm still confused why you're targeting Desi if we do get more bottom 6th depth. Mitchell is the one on thin ice (no pun intended). He got demoted pretty quickly for causing the 2nd Sharks penalty. He also had the lowest TOI of any forward.
I don't have any names in particular but I wouldn't mind an additional 4th liner on this team. We are relying on homegrown talent a little too much for the bottom 6 and they are for the most part young and soft.
Mitchell also fit that role for a while too. What I'm saying is that while some want a top 6 guy, I really want a guy that is better than DeJordan in all those aspects. Not a ton, just that much better to make DeJordan expendable. That's depth to me personally.
Just seems more reasonable and more useful. It's not a shot against Desi.
It actually is a shot against Desi when you're talking about replacing him or making it like he isn't good enough. We'd all love to have an improvement on every player if possible. However, it is not reasonable to go out and replace a guy that has proven his worth and made quality contributions in his role. He's a 4th liner. You don't need to spend assets to improve that. It barely will get used anyway in the playoffs.
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Originally Posted by OnTheFence
I always thought Nash was fairly quick? And I doubt they'd be losing creativity. Nash has amazing moves.
FWIW, I think Nash is a much better fit than Havlat. (Yes, I know Havlat has played like 5 games for us so far.)
Nash is creative individually. He's not much of a setup man and Havlat is still quicker than Nash. Havlat is much better at making his teammates better and that's really the overall point.
I'm still confused why you're targeting Desi if we do get more bottom 6th depth. Mitchell is the one on thin ice (no pun intended). He got demoted pretty quickly for causing the 2nd Sharks penalty. He also had the lowest TOI of any forward.
What KM said is what I'm getting at. Maybe a better illustration...
I don't have any names in particular but I wouldn't mind an additional 4th liner on this team. We are relying on homegrown talent a little too much for the bottom 6 and they are for the most part young and soft.
It actually is a shot against Desi when you're talking about replacing him or making it like he isn't good enough. We'd all love to have an improvement on every player if possible. However, it is not reasonable to go out and replace a guy that has proven his worth and made quality contributions in his role. He's a 4th liner. You don't need to spend assets to improve that. It barely will get used anyway in the playoffs.
Nash is creative individually. He's not much of a setup man and Havlat is still quicker than Nash. Havlat is much better at making his teammates better and that's really the overall point.
Do we need more set up men, though? Thornton on the first line, Clowe on the second line.
Marleau - Thornton - Nash // Finisher - Set up man - Creativity
Clowe - Couture - Pavelski // Set up man - Creativity - Finisher
Clowe-Couture-Pavelski would be the slowest line in humanity. I still can't even comprehend that a Clowe-Couture-Heatley line was able to function, though.
It actually is a shot against Desi when you're talking about replacing him or making it like he isn't good enough. We'd all love to have an improvement on every player if possible. However, it is not reasonable to go out and replace a guy that has proven his worth and made quality contributions in his role. He's a 4th liner. You don't need to spend assets to improve that. It barely will get used anyway in the playoffs.
Depth was still an issue with Vancouver last post season, as it was with Chicago the year before.
Think 3rd - 5th round picks. How bad will you want those back?
Clowe-Couture-Pavelski would be the slowest line in humanity. I still can't even comprehend that a Clowe-Couture-Heatley line was able to function, though.
Their hockey IQ would more than make-up for their lack of speed.
Depth was still an issue with Vancouver last post season, as it was with Chicago the year before.
Think 3rd - 5th round picks. How bad will you want those back?
And in the Vancouver series, Desi wasn't the problem. The Sharks have very little in way of futures as it is. Replacing someone who is doing well for his role through trade like that is simply poor asset management. And this kind of upgrade isn't going to tip the scales in the Sharks favor for the Cup.
And in the Vancouver series, Desi wasn't the problem. The Sharks have very little in way of futures as it is. Replacing someone who is doing well for his role through trade like that is simply poor asset management. And this kind of upgrade isn't going to tip the scales in the Sharks favor for the Cup.
Wasn't the problem vs. Was the solution = What I'm looking for in this discussion. That's all.
The more the opponent is hemmed down in the offensive zone, the better the Sharks are. That's just the style instilled by the coaching staff. If those 4th line minutes can actually creep up to relevance, then it's great for the whole team.
But in return argument, what do you think should be done? I'm always game for listening…
Havlat for Nash reduces team speed and overall creativity. The last thing the Sharks need to do is get slower in the top six.
havlats got really adding to team speed this year. the time in which he goes from press box to room helps coaches relay messages.
havlat+murray+doherty+stalock+1st should be an enticing enough packagethat columbus will take it if they cant get LA to bite on jj+bernier.
havlat while he may add speed, decreases grit and toughness up front. when he plays anyway. nash has a good amount of grit and toughness, and isnt a poor poor skater like heatley, hes like jumbo, slighly above average-good.
havlats got really adding to team speed this year. the time in which he goes from press box to room helps coaches relay messages.
havlat+murray+doherty+stalock+1st should be an enticing enough packagethat columbus will take it if they cant get LA to bite on jj+bernier.
havlat while he may add speed, decreases grit and toughness up front. when he plays anyway. nash has a good amount of grit and toughness, and isnt a poor poor skater like heatley, hes like jumbo, slighly above average-good.
Sorry man the Jackets would be more likely to demand either Pavelski or Couture along with either Demers or Braun and a pick
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