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Claude Giroux

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Old
02-20-2012, 01:03 PM
  #1
FlyingHigh13
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Claude Giroux

Giroux, for all the praise he gets for being a solid two way forward with top end scoring ability he is -4 for the season. Thoughts? I know he plays on the pk and all but still think he should'nt be a minus player.

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02-20-2012, 01:04 PM
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Machinehead
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So? +/- is toilet paper. That came to pass the day Nick Lidstrom was a minus player.

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02-20-2012, 01:05 PM
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Canadian Chris
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingHigh13 View Post
Giroux, for all the praise he gets for being a solid two way forward with top end scoring ability he is -4 for the season. Thoughts? I know he plays on the pk and all but still think he should'nt be a minus player.
I'm sure you're not specifically stating it, but playing on the PK has no bearing on +/-

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02-20-2012, 01:06 PM
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Clearly +/- is the best way to determine a player's defensive competence and we obviously know it's Giroux's fault that Bryzgalov and Bobrovsky have combined for an 0.899 SV% behind him at even strength. Quality thread.

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02-20-2012, 01:09 PM
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ArGarBarGar
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+/- isn't really an accurate indicator of much by itself.

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02-20-2012, 01:11 PM
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Big McLargehuge
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+/- is a worthless stat.

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02-20-2012, 01:14 PM
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SaxMan
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Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
Clearly +/- is the best way to determine a player's defensive competence and we obviously know it's Giroux's fault that Bryzgalov and Bobrovsky have combined for an 0.899 SV% behind him at even strength. Quality thread.
Bobrovsky has a 920 SV% at ES. Bryzgalov has a 908 SV%. At least put the correct numbers.

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02-20-2012, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by SaxMan View Post
Bobrovsky has a 920 SV% at ES. Bryzgalov has a 908 SV%. At least put the correct numbers.
At least read the actual post. Why would their overall save percentages be pertinent? The goalies for Philly have stopped 89.9% of pucks at even strength when Giroux has been on the ice. I was under the impression that +/- measured a player's performance only when he's actually playing but please correct me if I'm wrong.

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02-20-2012, 01:16 PM
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Not his fault his goaltenders suck.

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02-20-2012, 01:17 PM
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As a pens fan Im having trouble finding a reason to hate Claude Giroux. That said hes a good not great defensive forward but definetly a great offensive one.

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02-20-2012, 01:18 PM
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He is not solid d-sive player.
He is solid PKer.

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02-20-2012, 01:19 PM
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SaxMan
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Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
At least read the actual post. Why would their overall save percentages be pertinent? The goalies for Philly have stopped 89.9% of pucks at even strength when Giroux has been on the ice. I was under the impression that +/- measured a player's performance only when he's actually playing but please correct me if I'm wrong.
Does that mean when he's on the ice the other team gets better scoring chances? Both their goalies SV % drops when he's on the ice. You would think a great defensive forward would limit great scoring chances.

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02-20-2012, 01:20 PM
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He is not solid d-sive player.
He is solid PKer.
Thought-provoking analysis. You should inform Laviolette immediately since he must be a complete moron to be matching Giroux against the opposition's top line every night and sending him out for more defensive zone faceoffs than any other player on the team.

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02-20-2012, 01:21 PM
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Left Circle OneTimer
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Originally Posted by SaxMan View Post
Does that mean when he's on the ice the other team gets better scoring chances? Both their goalies SV % drops when he's on the ice. You would think a great defensive forward would limit great scoring chances.
Most of his starts in the defensive end. Is that his fault? I dont know.

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02-20-2012, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by SaxMan View Post
Does that mean when he's on the ice the other team gets better scoring chances? Both their goalies SV % drops when he's on the ice. You would think a great defensive forward would limit great scoring chances.
He has one of the best scoring chance ratios on the Flyers but even ignoring that, there's no evidence that forwards are capable of suppressing opposing shooting percentage.

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02-20-2012, 01:23 PM
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Most of his starts in the defensive end. Is that his fault? I dont know.
It's always just easier to blame Philly's goaltending.

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02-20-2012, 02:26 PM
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He's an average defensive forward who gives it his all most of the time, but doesn't have the best defensive instincts, is small, and uses a small stick.

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02-20-2012, 02:27 PM
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+/- is a worthless stat, unless you are Erik Karlsson. (and only if he's a -)

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02-20-2012, 02:29 PM
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+/- Depends alot on factors outside an individuals control.

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02-20-2012, 02:32 PM
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Some Philly fans undervalue his defensive abilities and some overvalue them. I don't think he's anything special defensively, but he's not horrendous (like the Briere comparisons).

He's unreal in most other aspects though.

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02-20-2012, 02:32 PM
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Fred Taylor
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I read not too long ago on these boards that he faces some of the best qualcomp. in the league among top 30 scorers and also has one of the lowest offensive zone starts. Jagr is a +, and no way is he close to Giroux's level offensively or defensively.

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02-20-2012, 02:33 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
Thought-provoking analysis. You should inform Laviolette immediately since he must be a complete moron to be matching Giroux against the opposition's top line every night and sending him out for more defensive zone faceoffs than any other player on the team.
Must be ironic. Laviolette knows it. What is he going to do put Briere there? Giroux has miles to go before he can reach Richards level. That's who I call solid.

Coututrier is good but so young. Cannot do it all.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
He has one of the best scoring chance ratios on the Flyers but even ignoring that, there's no evidence that forwards are capable of suppressing opposing shooting percentage.
Great, it's the Fenwick guy again. The thread is over.

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02-20-2012, 02:46 PM
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PhillyPhaithful
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+\- means nothing really. Being on the PK and getting scored on doesn't count towards it... And he has a large amount of starts in the defensive zone against quality opposition. Not saying Claude is a great defensive player and nor do we really need him to be, but he is by no means a bad defensive player. I'd say a little above average defensively and a above average PKer.

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02-20-2012, 02:56 PM
  #25
GKJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wynan View Post
Thought-provoking analysis. You should inform Laviolette immediately since he must be a complete moron to be matching Giroux against the opposition's top line every night and sending him out for more defensive zone faceoffs than any other player on the team.
Is it listed somewhere as a stat for defensive zone starts? BTN only has offensive zone starts, and Couturier and Talbot are both have less offensive zone start percentages than Giroux.

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