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Your face when you realize David Desharnais has more assists than...

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Old
02-19-2012, 04:01 PM
  #276
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danisonfire View Post
To your points:

1) Laughable, you are correct.

2) I honestly think 2-3rd line is more realistic, but with his history of growing his game 1st is a long shot, but who knows.

3) HOCKEY IQ, Passing, and to be honest many other areas about his game are slowly increasing (Might have to do with him being told his whole life to give up and him working through it). The first part, IQ is what I feel is making him able to adjust and grow in each league. When you look at him on paper you are correct, nothing really jumps out as Gamebreaking, but his awareness mixed with passing makes him effective.

DD just needs to keep growing his game and working hard, thats all anyone can ask from him.
yeah, I think this is a fair comment. As I stated before, he is an asset for our team, no doubt about it. However, I do believe he would be better as #2 or #3 with a real #1 center on our team (I know, its hard to qualify what REAL #1 means but by example, I said a Getzlaf would be good) and yet we can still have DD, Eller and Plek....if we want to....

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Old
02-19-2012, 04:15 PM
  #277
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If the worst anyone can say about DD is that he's not a true #1, he's doing pretty well. Whatever you want to call him, he's blossomed more than anyone on our team except Pacioretty. Not coincidentally, they're playing on the same line.

Whereas Patches has become what we all saw coming -- a productive power forward -- Desharnais snuck under all our legs and became the most patient, intelligent forward on the team. He's a mini-pitbull with the puck and he's a chessmaster with playmaking. I was ready to dismiss the guy for the obvious reason of his size -- holy cow was I wrong! Anyone believing DD's success is due to his linemates is just plain wrong. Every successful forward has strong linemates; this doesn't detract one bit from their ability. Pacioretty has repeated that Desharnais is the best center he's played with. Don't sell the guy... short.

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Old
02-19-2012, 04:18 PM
  #278
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I'm always getting a kick out of those who are insistent at how horrible DD is defensively. Believe what you want, but here are some fairly compelling stats.

Since Christmas (23 games)

Basic Stats: 23GP....6G+16A=22 PTS. +10

On Ice Goals For all situations: 33
On Ice Goals Against all situations: 14

On Ice ES For: 24
On Ice ES Against: 8

On Ice when on PP : 9
On Ice for SH Against: 2

On Ice ENG for: 0
On Ice ENG Against: 4

In this stretch (which approximates the beginning of his second full year in the NHL), DD is ES +16. Of the 14 goals against, he may have played a significant role in 3 or 4 of them. From what many on here seem to believe, it would be impossible for Cole, Patches, any defenseman, or Price to have had any shared responsibility for these 3 or 4 Or, God forbid, the other NHLers actually made real good plays to score.

He is a tireless worker whose positioning in the defensive zone has improved significantly during this stretch.

If only the rest of the Habs forwards could be killing the team on defense as bad as DD

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Old
02-19-2012, 04:26 PM
  #279
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sargent Pepper View Post
Show me where I made anything up? Oh please, do that, I would be happy to show the path to ridiculousness....
Okay, show me.

Where did I say that Desharnais is a #1 centre in the post you quoted?

I don't expect to hear back from you for hours since you'll never find it.

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Old
02-19-2012, 04:28 PM
  #280
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Desharnais for Nash?

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Old
02-19-2012, 04:29 PM
  #281
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beaker View Post
Desharnais for Nash?
Plekanec for Nash

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Old
02-19-2012, 04:29 PM
  #282
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Originally Posted by Beaker View Post
Desharnais for Nash?
The GM of the Blue Jackets is so bad, you may be able to throw in Gomez as part of the deal.

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Old
02-19-2012, 04:30 PM
  #283
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beaker View Post
Desharnais for Nash?
No chance. They'll have to throw in a pick or a prospect.

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Old
02-19-2012, 04:52 PM
  #284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
Okay, show me.

Where did I say that Desharnais is a #1 centre in the post you quoted?

I don't expect to hear back from you for hours since you'll never find it.
I never said that you had said that, Look at the question mark. Is that used for statements or questions? As I said, re-read before making nasty ridiculous comments....

Quote:
Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
Okay, show me.

Where did I say that Desharnais is a #1 centre in the post you quoted?

I don't expect to hear back from you for hours since you'll never find it.
The least you can do now is apologize! no?

Quote:
Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
Okay, show me.

Where did I say that Desharnais is a #1 centre in the post you quoted?

I don't expect to hear back from you for hours since you'll never find it.
Alas, you are the one who did not come back to apologize. You were quite willing to rip me in public but once proven wrong, you disappeared (yet your name was on the list of on-line moderator all and all night). I expected more from you man!


Last edited by One Man Rock Band: 02-20-2012 at 12:43 AM.
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Old
02-20-2012, 12:47 AM
  #285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sargent Pepper View Post
I never said that you had said that, Look at the question mark. Is that used for statements or questions? As I said, re-read before making nasty ridiculous comments....



The least you can do now is apologize! no?



Alas, you are the one who did not come back to apologize. You were quite willing to rip me in public but once proven wrong, you disappeared (yet your name was on the list of on-line moderator all and all night). I expected more from you man!
First of all, you need to stop double and triple posting, man. That's why there is an edit button.

As far as as your post went - if you didn't mean it how you typed it, then you simply made a poor judgment in how to describe your feelings.

Here's your quote;
"Small Centre with no outstanding scoring skills, no skating skills, not D skills, no size or roughness in him.....and you want to pawn him as a legitimate #1 center? Really? that's your story?"

I never said a single word about him being an number one centre right now. But just to throw fuel into the fire --- he's going to be.

PS. Just because it says I'm online, doesn't mean I'm here. I was in the wrestling thread for awhile due to the PPV and watching The Walking Dead. I wasn't in the Montreal section since that post.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:05 AM
  #286
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Pretty funny that, only 2 years ago, we were having a debate on this same board about who was the better player between Trotter and Desharnais, and the Sargent Peppers of this world argued it was Trotter.

The single fact that we are now debating about who's better between DD and Plekanec (while Trotter is nowhere close to the NHL) shows how much the Sargent Peppers of this world were wrong at that time, and are still wrong today.

Looking back at archives, we can find a few gems. Like here :

Quote:
I don't understand the love for Desharnais?

He's a quebecois.. great -_- but other than that I don't give a ****.

He's very small, weak and is an ahler never drafted.. that's it.

I never understood why does this board listen so much to TV analysts who just love to overrate a quebecois.
- Thinkbig

Quote:
Ya, those analysts get a lot of fans hyped up over a player who will probably have little impact with us. It's not even that he's 5'7, there are a bunch of small players. Gionta is small but he is strong on the puck, Deshernais isn't.

He might get a few games with us, but let's not get excited over a player who probably has no long term future with us.
- xposbrad

Quote:
If Deharnais sees a game with us we're in trouble.

I kinda feel for the guy he is elite at the AHL level, almost like a clone of Locke.
- Next Best Thing*

Quote:
OVERRATED!!!

Desharnais is a good little player....great speed and skill....but if he can't handle the rough stuff....he's useless. Gomez is 10 times the player Desharnais will ever be....so personally, I'd gladly pay Gomez $10 million a year before I'd consider using Desharnais instead of him. At least with Gomez you get a complete player in every aspect of the game.

Desharnais might....MIGHT play 10 games with the Habs this season.....MAYBE!!!
- Pleky Roks

Quote:
I do not think he can make this team.

He does not have the speed to replace a smaller forward on the Habs, and does not bring enough of a crashing game to replace a bigger body on the top 2 lines.

That leaves a 3rd or 4th line role. I have not seen anything in his game ON THE ICE that tells me he could take that role away from someone else.

He is just one of those guys that cannot make it to the next level. He just does not have the toolset.
- Joe Cole

Funny gem here too :

Quote:
If Plekanec can get 70 points playing with Cammy then Trotter can get 50. A fire hydrate could get 50 playing with Cammy. lol

Do you see a future Gionta type in Trotter? Several in Hamilton are saying that because of size and determination, skill factor. They say he is a little quicker and better hands than a Plekanec. Another told me think Derek Roy. In that he will be a player someday but expect a couple 35-40 points season before he matures.
- GNick42


I bet DD comes read the Habs Board every night before going to bed. It must be a great motivation to have so many detractors and to make them all eat crows.

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:08 AM
  #287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EllertoKostitsynGoal View Post
The players on that list DD could be more comparable to are Richards and Krecji. Soft minutes one-way players who aren't especially strong defensively and better used in a sheltered and PP specialist role (Richards more so than Krejci). Not sure I'd trade for Richards contract, doesn't seem worth it for a player that needs sheltering and is on the decline.

DD brings a lot for his contract, yes it's annoying when people act like Pacioretty could barely score at the NHL level before playing with him (on pace for 30 + last season playing with Gomez, who everybody thinks is terrible and Gio who can't pass) or like he makes Plekanec expendable but that's not DD's problem.

I'd say a big part of the problem is the lack of real analysis on hockey shows and all. People don't hear about the distinction between PP prod and ES prod or between tough minutes and soft minutes, what we hear is how X player has 5 more points than Y player so he must be so much better... Players are more than their point totals and the l'Antichambre crew and all never mention that so it's pretty normal that most people won't magically get these things.

If player X limits a top line to 3 scoring chances in a game (but let's say 2 goes in, he finishes -2) and is on the ice for 10 scoring chances(and none goes in) and player Y is on the ice for only 3 scoring chances for (2 happens to go in, he gets 2 points) but 10 against playing lesser opposition, who had the better game? The stat sheet would say player Y...

But reading those names shows how much we can't rank players by production. Krecji outscored Bergeron last season and in the playoffs but he was in absolutely no way a better player than him. Bergeron is one of the best tough minutes center in the league and a puck possession beast, DD may be comparable in points totals but his overall impact in a game doesn't compare at all. Not a whole lot of players can impact a game in every single way like Bergeron does.

And Bolland, another top tough minutes center, can't be forgetten when talking Chigago's center depth.

Though I'll say we have a better 5o5 offence than the Rangers. I also think we might have the edge in center depth but that would be because we have the best tough minutes guy in the lot (+Eller who can't be forgotten when talking about our depth at center)


Those are the kind of comments that annoy people about DD.

Plekanec remains the better player, the main difference would be that playing Plekanec's role DD would at best, be pretty useless, at worst, be absolutely terrible. (but most players would be that playing the role Plek does)

Wich is the whole reason DD ended up with Cole and Patches. Eller (who's the better tough minutes player between him and DD ) had to take Plekanec's place on the tough minutes trio (wich was an amazing puck possession trio) of Subban-Plekanec-Gorges because Plekanec had to become "the second D pairing" while the injuries to tough minutes players meant we couldn't hide our lack of a second pair.

Acting like DD began "outperforming" Plek out of nowhere and stole the number one center spot is rewriting history.

Much like saying he was on pace for 40+ pts last year playing with Darche and Pyatt is (no mention of his PP pts or the guy who was our 4th ES pts leader) especially when Plekanec's linemates aren't taken into consideration when comparing his pts totals to DDs.

Plekanec is still our best center.

Edit: MSL isn't a good comparable to DD. Briere is, and Briere can get lots of points but there are things he can't do and he's better used in a role where he doesn't have to do these things. Briere scores more when used as a 3rd line center than he does used as a second line one.
i like you...

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Old
02-20-2012, 03:27 AM
  #288
One Man Rock Band
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Here's a question I have, EllertoKostitsyn... Eller gets harder competition (though that has become a lot closer lately) but how is their performance in those specific minutes? Take out all soft minutes from both players and what does it look like? Probably impossible to find out though.

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Old
02-20-2012, 05:44 AM
  #289
MasterDecoy
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sutter praising desharnais

http://lakingsinsider.com/2012/02/15...it/#more-20642

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Old
02-20-2012, 09:02 AM
  #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
DD for Kopitar

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Old
02-20-2012, 09:07 AM
  #291
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to answer the OP...


...then you realize he is rarely a threat to shoot.

That said, I was not one of the believers, but I am now.

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02-20-2012, 09:22 AM
  #292
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I'm not that surprised - I could tell in his first exhibition game with the Habs a couple years back that he was a fantastic passer with superb vision and anticipatory skills. I remember clearly emailing Trevor Timmins and telling him that Desharnais would play in the NHL some day despite his height.

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Old
02-20-2012, 09:36 AM
  #293
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Its too bad really, if he was 6`2 and 215 he would be a superstar. I like him and I love watching him on the Habs, but he is just too small to be a #1 C

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Old
02-20-2012, 10:43 AM
  #294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
to answer the OP...


...then you realize he is rarely a threat to shoot.

That said, I was not one of the believers, but I am now.
He's still on pace for 16-goals. With some experience, he could be a 20-goal guy.

Although I see him putting up Adam Oates type numbers (Capitals era).

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Old
02-20-2012, 10:50 AM
  #295
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Originally Posted by jefferiah View Post
No disrespect to Toews. I really like him. But the guy is also playing on a line with our two top scorers.
same thing?

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Old
02-20-2012, 11:05 AM
  #296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PATCHESx67 View Post
DD for Kopitar
LA needs to add

im still no convinced zombietar is actually alive

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Old
02-20-2012, 01:27 PM
  #297
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Stop under estimating or otherwise downplaying the potential contributions of Desharnais. He'll just prove you wrong.

He's a legitimate top two centre. There's no reason why he can't do everything Marty St. Louis has done. St. Louis had 40 points in his first full season at age 25. Desharnais, in his first full season at age 25, already has 44. Yeah, yeah...different players have different learning curves, etc. That's nice and all, but remember this post when Desharnais leads the team in scoring.

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Old
02-20-2012, 01:29 PM
  #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PinchedNerve View Post
Stop under estimating or otherwise downplaying the potential contributions of Desharnais. He'll just prove you wrong.

He's a legitimate top two centre. There's no reason why he can't do everything Marty St. Louis has done. St. Louis had 40 points in his first full season at age 25. Desharnais, in his first full season at age 25, already has 44. Yeah, yeah...different players have different learning curves, etc. That's nice and all, but remember this post when Desharnais leads the team in scoring.
If his name was Dave Harness, he would be God on this board...

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Old
02-20-2012, 02:26 PM
  #299
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Originally Posted by PinchedNerve View Post
There's no reason why he can't do everything Marty St. Louis has done.
I don't expect DD to win the Art Ross/Hart/Lindsay any time soon, and I doubt I'm alone there. I know you guys (I'd guess either French and/or short of stature yourself, but don't dwell on those assumptions please) probably just want to hope the best for the guy, but we're talking two completely different calibre of player here. Yes, St. Louis is (not just "was") just plain better in too many departments to allow any kind of similarities/comparison to be drawn from everything we've seen from both over their careers.

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Old
02-20-2012, 04:29 PM
  #300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
He's still on pace for 16-goals. With some experience, he could be a 20-goal guy.

Although I see him putting up Adam Oates type numbers (Capitals era).
Capitals-era Oates isn't that crazy a possibility if he keeps it up. Pre-Capitals Oates though, I don't think so.

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