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Nash-ty Rumors Part IV: The Longest Week

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02-22-2012, 11:33 AM
  #926
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Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
and the need to create room for a goalie which is hysterical cause they still need a goalie.
I agree... it is hysterical. Their never ending need for a goalie.

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02-22-2012, 11:34 AM
  #927
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Originally Posted by nyrfan1026 View Post
Its hilarious to see Toronto fans on the Trade-talk board saying they refuse to part with Jake Gardiner, then lambast NY fans when we laugh off proposals that include McD.

The Maple Leafs are one of the few teams I don't follow around the league, anyone know anything about the kid? Even close to comparable to McD or is it just another case of TML over-rating the **** out of their players.

Anyway, last night sure served as a strong argument point for the Nash proponents.

I'm slightly warming up to the idea of trading for him if it can be done without losing any of the core (Mactruck, Dstep, MDZ, etc) and Kreider and Erixon.

McIlrath, AA, CT, Miller, Dubinsky, 1st round pick, MZA (lol) should all be in play.

GM Howson is probably asking the moon for Nasher, I don't see anyone ponying up mid-season.

A package of the above combo shouldn't really piss of the Nash opposers.

If Howson refuses to deal without McDonagh coming back the other way, you say thanks, but no thanks. Same goes for MDZ and Stepan obviously.

THE PP IS A DISASTER.
Of course it's Toronto overvaluing their prospects. That's all that fanbase knows how to do.

Anyway, I agree. Set your limits for Nash and stick to it. If it's Dubi, McIlrath, Miller and a 1st, pull the trigger. If he wants a roster d-man, either don't do it or send Bickel or Emi away .

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02-22-2012, 11:34 AM
  #928
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Originally Posted by UAGoalieGuy View Post
I think if the Rangers added Carter there are enough guys on this team to keep him in line. Also people do tend to mature as they get older. He wouldn't be the primary focus here. More attention would be paid to Lundqvist, Gaborik, Richards, and probably Callahan.

He could move to the LW and play on a line with Richards and Callahan. That contract us just killer though, but his cap hit is pretty good.
Why though? Why take a chance on a guy that needs to be kept in line? They don't need bad attitudes, whether it's one or four. This is a young team, good players will become available again, and this team will still be good.

Parise will possibly make it to July 1st, he's a great character, player, and he will not cost any assets. If he doesn't sign with the Rangers, there are still options down the road.

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02-22-2012, 11:39 AM
  #929
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The reason he was traded was because of Pronger.
You and your silly facts. 9 months ago people would have been over the moon if we had picked up Carter. Now, people are acting as if he's a cancer that has been run out of town by half a dozen teams. I find it just a little difficult to believe that the guy was with an organization for 8 years, signed 3 different contracts with them over that period, but was a malcontent the entire time.

Frankly, if the guy can slack off and score 30+ goals per year, I couldn't care less what he does in his free time.

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02-22-2012, 11:40 AM
  #930
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Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
The reason he was traded was because of locker room problems. Bad influence on the young guys coming up.
You don't know that. That's what the rumors are, and granted that is the only thing we have to go on. You can also say that he was traded (along with Richards who somehow gets a bye on all the lockerroom and party rumors) because his focus was questioned. That is something that strikes me as a maturity issue, which is also something that can be fixed with.... age and perspective. It's a gamble, sure, but if the price is Dubinsky and a minor prospect in the way of Valentenko/MZA, I'm not sure how you pass. We need scoring, he scores. He's scored in the playoffs, with injuries to boot.

I'm not thrilled that the hypothesized cure for Carter is a change of scenery to a winning team, but he'll score at Dubinsky's projected rate on a bad year, and at a 40+ goal rate when he's on. A great crack at the cup for that gamble is certainly worth it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jersey Girl View Post
Let's stay away from guys who need people to make excuses why they're playing bad or have a bad attitude.
Savard and Jagr come to mind immediately. I wished we had more patience on the one, and am glad that the other did need excuses, cause it worked out well.

Another name is Zherdev, and it didn't work out well. But I'm not exactly crying that he cost us a 2nd pair defenseman making over $4m and not on our team.





OK, I think I have been a pretty patient fan... didn't want to trade for Gaborik or Richards, wanted no part of Kovalchuk, was happy that we didn't cave into the demanded price for Heatley. So I'm not exactly impulsive. But when the main names on the table are Carter/Nash for a package centering on Dubinsky, I find it very ironic that people invoke the rumors and excuses card. I get not wanting to part with Kreider, the core youth on the team, Erixon/Miller even. But when people want to keep Carter away when the return is Dubinsky... it's a bit shocking.

Dubinsky has nothing but excuses to show for this season. He's gotten a chance at every line combo, special attention from the coach, coddling, tough love, the "intangibles" medal. I love his game, he has an edge and heart, but he's streaky. We need a part that usually costs so much the trade doesn't get consummated. He's always been streaky but it seems to me that the streaks become longer and longer. I'd hate to miss turning Dubinsky into a top flight scorer, just like we supposedly missed on Prucha for Seabrook, when our blueline was Roszival, Malik, Kasparitis, Poti....

The key to the GM game is knowing when to be patient and when to sell when value is high. Teams see Dubinsky as a lot of potential, maybe a guy needing a new team or venue. I don't see it that way, and if I'm right then other teams will see it too. Then you get your Prucha for Lisin type trade.

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02-22-2012, 11:43 AM
  #931
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Why would Columbus want dubbi? He has done nothing. They would rather take Haglin! I like how we try and pawn off guys who have little value to us.

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02-22-2012, 11:45 AM
  #932
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As long as CBJ doesn't expect anything close to the package they traded for Carter, from NYR, I could get on board.

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02-22-2012, 11:46 AM
  #933
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I'm getting impatient with this...
Can a trade just happen already?

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Old
02-22-2012, 11:47 AM
  #934
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
You and your silly facts. 9 months ago people would have been over the moon if we had picked up Carter. Now, people are acting as if he's a cancer that has been run out of town by half a dozen teams. I find it just a little difficult to believe that the guy was with an organization for 8 years, signed 3 different contracts with them over that period, but was a malcontent the entire time.

Frankly, if the guy can slack off and score 30+ goals per year, I couldn't care less what he does in his free time.
Yep. Everything changed once Pronger's massive ego took over. He wasn't a fan of Richards or Carter and the team gave in to what Pronger wanted. An idiotic move if I've ever seen one, really. Trading their two franchise players to satisfy the "needs" of some over the hill egomaniac.

And now people here actually believe Carter was a malcontent. Hilarious. The smear campaign really worked well.

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02-22-2012, 11:47 AM
  #935
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Originally Posted by Revelation View Post
As long as CBJ doesn't expect anything close to the package they traded for Carter, from NYR, I could get on board.
Dubi, Wolski and a 1st for Carter. Get it done, Sather.

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02-22-2012, 11:48 AM
  #936
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Can't wait for Monday, when this will all be over one way or another.

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02-22-2012, 11:49 AM
  #937
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Kyper said the Kings are the one team which would give Howson whatever he wants but Nash isn't crazy about LA. That's weird considering LA is on the list. That list isn't really the solid list. If a non-list team makes an offer,Columbus could ask Nash about going there.

Kyper and Doug MacLean were discussing Jeff Carter. They said Carter has a suitcase in his locker so he can leave Columbus immediately without having to go to his apartment for his stuff.

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02-22-2012, 11:51 AM
  #938
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Originally Posted by Section 409 View Post
Why though? Why take a chance on a guy that needs to be kept in line? They don't need bad attitudes, whether it's one or four. This is a young team, good players will become available again, and this team will still be good.

Parise will possibly make it to July 1st, he's a great character, player, and he will not cost any assets. If he doesn't sign with the Rangers, there are still options down the road.

At this point I'm looking at the hhere and now, and I'm sure Sather is too.

The Rangers have been building to the future for how many years now? When was the last time they were in this situation? How many more years will Lundqvist be able to play at the level he is at now? No one has crystal ball.

The Rangers have a good shot to win now, THIS season. If adding a piece like Nash, Ryan, Carter, etc can happen and it doesn't gut the system, you pull the trigger.

Im sick of people saying "wait for next season" or "X prospect COULD put up similar product in a couple of seasons.

Players like Nash, Ryan, Carter fit inti both short and long term future of this team. I'm not proposing trading MDZ, McD, Kreider, and Stepan because I'd be pissed if they did. If the right deal is there you do it now.
Sather is too.

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Old
02-22-2012, 11:52 AM
  #939
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Dubi, Wolski and a 1st for Carter. Get it done, Sather.
I would MUCH rather replace Dubi with Anisimov in that deal. Dubi is a more complete player, and Anisimov is more of a redundant piece while still having value.

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02-22-2012, 11:55 AM
  #940
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What's your point? Appreciate the poor attempt at humor... maybe next time, add something of value to the discussion?
Same point as your original post which I was replying to. None. You said a factual statement that brought nothing to this discussion, so I did the same. I didn't think I'd have to spell that out for you.

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02-22-2012, 11:56 AM
  #941
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Any one here wanna bet that if we miss out on Nash, Carter becomes a Ranger?

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02-22-2012, 11:56 AM
  #942
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Originally Posted by bubba5 View Post
Why would Columbus want dubbi? He has done nothing. They would rather take Haglin! I like how we try and pawn off guys who have little value to us.
Because while Dubi is having a down season, One year doesn't make the player.

Dubinsky, even while slumping offensively is a great pk'er, a solid physical player and regardless of this one particular season is good for 40+ points per season.

40+ points per season with an ability to post 55 points while playing a physical brand of solid defensive hockey is a valuable asset.

The mind-set that some have that because he has JUST 6 goals that he has no, to limited value is astonishing.

The reason Howson is asking for the sun, moon and stars is because Nash (the last 4 years) is an average 35 goal/70 point scoring forward. His stats this season may not bear that out, but that is who the player is.

And in the same breath, one can state that Dubinsky is also much better than his stats this year would indicate and such he HAS value.

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02-22-2012, 11:56 AM
  #943
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Originally Posted by UAGoalieGuy View Post
At this point I'm looking at the hhere and now, and I'm sure Sather is too.

The Rangers have been building to the future for how many years now? When was the last time they were in this situation? How many more years will Lundqvist be able to play at the level he is at now? No one has crystal ball.

The Rangers have a good shot to win now, THIS season. If adding a piece like Nash, Ryan, Carter, etc can happen and it doesn't gut the system, you pull the trigger.

Im sick of people saying "wait for next season" or "X prospect COULD put up similar product in a couple of seasons.

Players like Nash, Ryan, Carter fit inti both short and long term future of this team. I'm not proposing trading MDZ, McD, Kreider, and Stepan because I'd be pissed if they did. If the right deal is there you do it now.
Sather is too.
To be clear, my original reference was to Carter. I want Ryan, he's the best of the three considering his cap hit, IMO.

I can't get past Nash's contract, I just can't. He's an incredible player, but there is way too much uncertainty with the new CBA.

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02-22-2012, 11:57 AM
  #944
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Kyper and Doug MacLean were discussing Jeff Carter. They said Carter has a suitcase in his locker so he can leave Columbus immediately without having to go to his apartment for his stuff.
Oh man, Thats priceless!!

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02-22-2012, 11:57 AM
  #945
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Originally Posted by UAGoalieGuy View Post
I think if the Rangers added Carter there are enough guys on this team to keep him in line. Also people do tend to mature as they get older. He wouldn't be the primary focus here. More attention would be paid to Lundqvist, Gaborik, Richards, and probably Callahan.

He could move to the LW and play on a line with Richards and Callahan. That contract us just killer though, but his cap hit is pretty good.
Bad way to start thinking. Oh the locker room is so great we can get some *******s in there and still be fine. Soon you're the football jets.

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02-22-2012, 11:58 AM
  #946
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On another note, Pierre MacGuire mentioned on the radio yesterday, that he wouldn't discount the idea that both Parise and Suter would sign together with Detroit, when they hit the free agent market this summer. They're very good friends and MacGuire has some inside info about this scenario.
Regardless, let's stop with this crazy fantasy about Parise signing with us this off season. There is a .00001% chance he would sign with us.

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Old
02-22-2012, 12:00 PM
  #947
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if you dont think there is a difference in intensity as the regular season goes on and that it severely increases in the playoffs i dont know what to tell ya. if you do understand that then i guess i dont understand the post. the rangers have out worked and out willed other teams, but thats not enough in the playoffs.

I'm not saying that the playoffs aren't a more intense brand of hockey, I'm saying that every team plays as hard as possible during the regular season and every team kicks it up another notch in the playoffs - the style of the game changes noticeably every year in every round regardless of who is playing. That doesn't mean that during the regular season all teams are capable of playing playoff hockey and some do and others don't. Knowing its the post season, knowing that the team that you are playing against can send you home if you lose, knowing that winning brings you a huge step closer to your lifelong dream makes everyone play harder. I fully expect the Rangers to kick their intensity up even further in the playoffs, as every team does. You seem to be assuming that they're going to stay the same while everyone else gets better.

There is a big difference between the playoffs being more intense and the alternate reality you're presenting in other comments where everyone but the Rangers takes the regular season lightly and they will all improve come playoffs while the Rangers won't.

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02-22-2012, 12:01 PM
  #948
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Originally Posted by UAGoalieGuy View Post
At this point I'm looking at the hhere and now, and I'm sure Sather is too.

The Rangers have been building to the future for how many years now? When was the last time they were in this situation? How many more years will Lundqvist be able to play at the level he is at now? No one has crystal ball.

The Rangers have a good shot to win now, THIS season. If adding a piece like Nash, Ryan, Carter, etc can happen and it doesn't gut the system, you pull the trigger.

Im sick of people saying "wait for next season" or "X prospect COULD put up similar product in a couple of seasons.

Players like Nash, Ryan, Carter fit inti both short and long term future of this team. I'm not proposing trading MDZ, McD, Kreider, and Stepan because I'd be pissed if they did. If the right deal is there you do it now.
Sather is too.
I agree with this post but will go further and state that it's not even JUST about THIS season but next season as well.

You add a Nash to thsi team for arguments sake and you have two very real and veyr ligitimate shots at the cup.

As long as McD, MDZ, Kreider and Miller are not moved I'm good.

Dubinsky and any 2 other prospects and a 1st rounder (2nd rounder if it's both Erixon and McIlrath) for Nash and I am fine with that.

I'll deal with any potential Cap issue in 2013.

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Old
02-22-2012, 12:03 PM
  #949
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Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
Same point as your original post which I was replying to. None. You said a factual statement that brought nothing to this discussion, so I did the same. I didn't think I'd have to spell that out for you.
False. My point was that Carter scored 3 more goals than the entire Rangers team did last night. There is value to that fact.

This a very good collection of talent, but I don't care how good Lundqvist and the D are, they need to pick the scoring up to be a serious Cup threat... whether that's with current players or picking up players that can score.

kthxbai

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02-22-2012, 12:03 PM
  #950
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As long as McD, MDZ, Kreider and Miller are not moved I'm good.
I think at this point I feel the exact same way.

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