You don't just plug in a player and add the points to determine the impact they have on the team. Adding a player like Nash changes things. Even if it's just replacing Dubinsky. Will he fit? Is he a given to click with Gaborik?
This year we are 15th in total goals scored.
Last year we were 16th.
A one jump difference so far adding a Richards and pretty much another, since Gaborik returned to being his usual self. And with also our other players improving.
This is a TEAM game. This is not the NBA. Unless you're add a talent like a Malkin or Crosby or even an offensive juggernaut in Stamkos, you aren't just suddenly going to go from a borderline top 10 offensive team to suddenly one of the best in the game. Sorry, im not buying that.
Last year we also had a miraculous performance by Brian Boyle that was not going to be repeated, as well as having Dubinsky bring something to the game other than 6 goals and some nice board work.
having Gaborik and Richards lead you in scoring is what SHOULD happen. this is the team we SHOULD have. Boyle is performing where he should, and by and large most other players are...nobody outside of maybe MDZ are performing well above where we expected them to, and a few guys are underperforming.
i agree its not a 1:1 mathetmatical equation, i even wrote that in my post if im not mistaken. but the premise is the same. Add more goals scored to yoru team youre going to be better offensively.
There is some parisitism that will dampen the numbers a little (ie, nash scoring goals that Callahan usually would be scoring), but it shouldnt be that much.
Just curious if anyone's had the courage wade over to the Trade Rumors to see what kind of mess the Brooks' article today has made of things.
i didnt even know there was a trade rumors part of this board.
i almost never leave this page. too many canadian fans lurking out there....they scare me with their stupidity. (no offense to the sane rational canadian hockey fan)
Just curious if anyone's had the courage wade over to the Trade Rumors to see what kind of mess the Brooks' article today has made of things.
I was surprised to see that not too much had come of it. Most Jackets fans just ignored it or claimed it was bogus and went back to explaining how Howson could just not trade Nash and he has all the power.
i didnt even know there was a trade rumors part of this board.
i almost never leave this page. too many canadian fans lurking out there....they scare me with their stupidity. (no offense to the sane rational canadian hockey fan)
It is a place not ventured by the light-hearted, where roving hordes of Devil and Islander fans gang up on unsuspecting Ranger fans. Only the bravest among, such as Jonathan, will venture there with any regularity. I, myself, prefer the modest comforts provided here.
You don't just plug in a player and add the points to determine the impact they have on the team. Adding a player like Nash changes things. Even if it's just replacing Dubinsky. Will he fit? Is he a given to click with Gaborik?
This year we are 15th in total goals scored.
Last year we were 16th.
A one jump difference so far adding a Richards and pretty much another, since Gaborik returned to being his usual self. And with also our other players improving.
This is a TEAM game. This is not the NBA. Unless you're add a talent like a Malkin or Crosby or even an offensive juggernaut in Stamkos, you aren't just suddenly going to go from a borderline top 10 offensive team to suddenly one of the best in the game. Sorry, im not buying that.
Really the only person who has improved has been Callahan. Besides that compared to last year the numbers as of right now:
Dubi - 19G to 6G this year
Boyle - 15G to 5G this year
Stepan - 16G to 12G this year
i feel really bad for Carter. Guy is a damn good hockey player that's had his name dragged through the mud for no reason at all. nothing but unsubstantiated BS.
Guy signed a discount contract to stay with the Flyers, then they trade him to Siberia right before his NTC kicks in. Of course he wants to GTFO...who wouldn't. Now nobody wants him because he's got a long term deal (but a good cap hit) and some mythical character problems that never were mentioned 1 iota before the Flyers tried to justify reshaping their entire team to get Mr. Universe on their club.
It is a place not ventured by the light-hearted, where roving hordes of Devil and Islander fans gang up on unsuspecting Ranger fans. Only the bravest among, such as Jonathan, will venture there with any regularity. I, myself, prefer the modest comforts provided here.
I was surprised to see that not too much had come of it. Most Jackets fans just ignored it or claimed it was bogus and went back to explaining how Howson could just not trade Nash and he has all the power.
Silly and delusional they are, apparently.
Nash: I'll accept a trade to the Rangers, Bruins, Leafs, Wings or Flyers.
The trade boards aren't nearly as bad as the CBJ board.
Someone posted this:
Quote:
Hey guys. I am not here to troll just have an honest question. I am not asking if you would do this deal, but if this deal were to go through would you all be extremely upset or could you deal with it?
Dubinsky, Tim Erixon, JT Miller, Mats Zuccarello, and the Rangers First Round Pick for Nash.
Just wanted to know what your opinion on this would be. Thanks.
This was the response:
Quote:
Not close whatsoever. Quantity does not equal quality. Dubinsky is the only legitimate NHLer in this proposal and he's struggling. If I were GM, I don't have to trade Nash and I would stick to my "needs." I think the only way the Rangers are going to get Nash is if the deal is Dubinsky, McDonagh/Del Zotto, Kreider and your first round pick at a minimum. If the Rangers don't want to part with those pieces, then there will be no deal. I really think that Nash (if he's traded) is probably headed to LA.
I think the Rangers may turn their attention to Jeff Carter by Monday. They might be able to get a player that can add some offense and the price tag will probably be much cheaper. A deal like Dubinsky, Dylan McIlrath and a first/second might do the trick to get Carter.
what it is, is SPECTACULAR defensively, SPECTACULAR between the pipes, and borderline AWFUL in the offensive zone. the top 10 in goals scored is really more of a reflection of how good we are defensively and how well we pressure the puck...also our shooting percentage has got to be abnormally high...i can't seem to find the stats, but considering how low we are in shots per game and how high we are in goals per game, that S% must be very high compared to most other teams. which means we've either got a very skilled team, which anyone who has watched this team knows we don't, or we have a very lucky team. i think it's more that that anything else.
The teams with the best chances to win the cup usually have all 3 things going for them. High G/G, Low GA/G and a high SV%
Rangers need some more offense.
Also, getting Nash helps this team become far more balanced than ppl give them credit for. if you wanted you could put a superstar on each of our top 3 lines and just dare the opposition to shut them down, OR you could stack the hell out of one line and play them for 30 mins a night. Gives you so many options. When the other team puts their 4th line out for a defensive zone draw, you put Nash-Richards-Gaborik and watch them poop their pants.
When the other team loads up on a shut down line to stop your stars, you split them up and force them to try to shut down 3 strong lines.
Seriously, look at this roster, hypothetically, next year:
First line: Rick Nash - Brad Richards - Ryan Callahan
First line: Artem Anisimov - Derek Stepan - Marian Gaborik
Second line: Chris Kreider - JT Miller - Carl Hagelin
Third/Fourth Line: Rupp - Boyle - Prust
There is no team in the league that can put out that combination of size, speed, skill, defensive awareness, etc on a night in and night out basis. Could we lose? Of course. But, it becomes a lot harder.
Whats wrong with turning a Great team, to an even Greater team? I don't get the problem.
Great post...some interesting numbers.
Rangers have improved GA/G from last year by almost a 1/2 goal per game
10/11 2.38 #5
11/12 1.92 #2
On offense they have regressed slightly though I would say last seasons GF/G were inflated by a few blowouts.
10/11 2.73 #16
11/12 2.72 #12
They also have a winning % of .567 when being outshot (17-8-5) and are .769 when outshooting their opponent (20-6-0)the .769 is #1 in the NHL.
Adding Nash vastly improves this team's offense--- and personally, I wouldn't stop there. I want to add a bottom-6 faceoff guy and a vet dman, too. Look at what the 94 team did trade wise. They were the best team in the league, and they could still improve; who woulda thunk it?
Personally, Nash/Ott/Allen would be a perfect deadline.
Sorry squirt, but you've made a rare misstep here.
There is plenty of room for improvement, but this isn't about complacency. It's about patience and opportunity.
I wouldn't mind adding any of the players you mentioned - if budgetary concerns weren't an issue. In fact, I think Nash, Ott, and to a lesser extent Allen, would all solve a bunch of this team's problems. But this is a cap league, and everything has to be about budget first. Nash and Ott simply make too much money. With the RFAs coming up over the next couple of summers, and the Rangers already overpaying 3 4th liners, this is just not wise financial management.
Dubinsky, McIlrath, Thomas and a 1st is most certainly a price that I would be willing to pay to get Nash if he was paid reasonably appropriately. I'm not going to lose it if this deal is made as I did when the Rangers signed Gomez or Redden. It wouldn't be a catastrophe of those proportions, but it wouldn't be the right move. This team has a long window. Not winning the Cup this season would not be the end of the world. The window has just opened.
You make moves when they are right for you. If the move isn't right for you, then you show some resolve and wait for a better opportunity. If you have reason to believe no other opportunity will present itself in the near future, then you make compromises. $7.8 million for the next six years is not right for this team. Not for a good but not elite player like Nash. There is evidence to believe other opportunities will present themselves. Better opportunities.
And I'm not so sure how much better the 94 team was after they made those trades. I always thought they could have won it all with the team they had before those deals were made (well, except Larmer... he was awesome). Glenn Anderson was monster in the playoffs, and is a very nice guy in person, but I think the team could have won with Gartner, too. Ditto for some of the other moves.
I just posted this on the Blue Jacket's board. I have no reason to lie and am hoping this is true.
Ok guys really not trying to start any false rumors and honestly have no reason at all to lie, but I have a buddy who works for the New York Daily news who has some ties with many of the New York organizations. He is saying that everyone will be shocked at how low the price tag for Nash will end up being. He said things could change but the feeling is the Rangers are going to get him for a deal centering around Dubinsky, Erixon, and the Rangers 1st. They will also include a second tier prospect like Christian Thomas or Michael St. Criox a long with a fill in player like John Mitchell, Wolski, or Mats Zuccarello. Like I said no reason to lie and he is not saying this is a done deal, but the sense is that is all the Rangers will offer and the other teams are out.
Something tells me Brandon Dubinsky will play his two best games of the season on Friday and Saturday!!!
He should have done that against Columbus. Make a statement. Pretty invisible in my opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by New York RKY
My guess is it's either a given that he's not in he deal or it simply slipped his mind.
I didn't see Lundqvist listed and I'm pretty sure he won't be traded. It's a given.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG the place to be
Your a good kid inferno but using this math system of yours can you explain how we have 157 goals and 421 total points on our roster if 1 point = 1 goal
17 goals for Dubinsky, 35 for Nash. Are you really splitting hairs when he straight up adds 18 goals?
Anyway...can this happen? I'm starting to have dreams about Nash in a Rangers jersey.
I do think it's more likely that it happens than not right now. I'd say 70/30 is where I'd place it. My theory is that Howson is actually being made the fall guy by making this deal. Then he gets fired, and the new GM comes in without the Nash situation hanging over his head. Once Columbus went to Nash and asked him for the teams he'll waive his NMC to go to, and started openly pursuing deals in the media, I think Columbus had to reach the point of resolution by dealing him. And, I don't know how many times it can be brought up, but, Columbus is in no way shape or form going to get the trade package for Nash that their fans are fantasizing about...not with 1) the NMC. 2) the $7.8 million cap hit, or 3) the remaining $47 million still owed him. And, again, teams do not get the value in trades that fans think they will. You can bring up countless deals, especially in the cap era, and the package offered by the Rangers is the going rate.
-Stepan is on pace for 50+ pts compared to 45 last year
-Callahan having his best season
-Addition of Richards, even though he's having a down year points wise, is an upgrade from last season
-Del Zotto better
-McDonagh better
-Gaborik a totally different player
Guys have improved offensively.
Goals win games. Your whole post was based on the fact that we haven't improved in goal scoring. Can you honestly say that Nash would not help that cause. It probably would, but I couldn't say what the overall effect it will play if we do land him.
