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2012 NHL Entry Draft Talk 3.0

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Old
02-24-2012, 12:28 PM
  #351
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Originally Posted by NotProkofievian View Post
I'm still waiting for someone to produce consistent reports that he has compete level issues from before his injury. I mean, don't you find it the least bit odd that Patrick Roy would say nothing if Grigs had issues to that extent?

Just look at the Grigorenko thread in the prospects sub-forum: not a single negative word about him until the infamous -6 game. Then all of a sudden the odd comment comes out "oh, he only plays when he wants to." Even when that scout talks, he only mentions like...the 4 or 5 most recent games.

Now he's supposed to fall off the map and end up with Lecavalier type compete level issues?

I dunno, I think this might be taking things a little far.

What do we know about Grigorenko? Well, that simply he is so far ahead of his peers in terms of play reading, and making as to be properly qualified as a genius in that regard; he probably has the most absurd hands in this draft; his shot is an absolute laser; and he has a killer instinct for the net.

I dunno, I find it funny that so many on this board wanted Carter for so long, a guy with legitimate, documented compete issues, and are now scared to death of one of the top 2 most talented prospects available in the draft...who we may have an opportunity to pick.
Agreed 100%.

Its funny how people start to question his compete level and his heart when he's basically playing on one leg.

I'd take him in a heartbeat. No questions of that in my mind.

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02-24-2012, 12:29 PM
  #352
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
Forsberg has been up and down for the past year, but pretty much everything out of Sweden is saying he has the most talent of any Swedish forward since Backstrom, and while I'm not sure what his compete level is exactly, the effort is there and his attitude has been praised. Still not sure how close to being ready he is, he has a little bit of everything, not overtly physical but willing and very aggressive. He has risks himself - he's nowhere near as polished as Yakupov and Grigorenko (though he's also playing against physically developed men, and not children), but there is a lot to work with.
Another positive to Forsberg though, is that he can come to NA and play in the AHL as an 18 year old. If he were able to bust loose in the 2nd half he'd be a callup, and I think he's physically ready, and has the most pro experience of the top guys as well. I think outside of Yakupov, he is certainly the best shot to come in and have an impact at some point in his age 18 season.

I still like Galchenyuk though.

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02-24-2012, 12:41 PM
  #353
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Another positive to Forsberg though, is that he can come to NA and play in the AHL as an 18 year old. If he were able to bust loose in the 2nd half he'd be a callup, and I think he's physically ready, and has the most pro experience of the top guys as well. I think outside of Yakupov, he is certainly the best shot to come in and have an impact at some point in his age 18 season.
Interesting point. I was thinking about something like it this morning - given that so many good players have been coming right out of Sweden, would the smart thing be to leave Forsberg (or whoever) to develop there for a year or two, and save years on his ELC? Or would it be more advantageous to bring him to the AHL to learn the culture and the language? I can see both points.

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02-24-2012, 12:46 PM
  #354
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Interesting point. I was thinking about something like it this morning - given that so many good players have been coming right out of Sweden, would the smart thing be to leave Forsberg (or whoever) to develop there for a year or two, and save years on his ELC? Or would it be more advantageous to bring him to the AHL to learn the culture and the language? I can see both points.
In Sweden or in the AHL, you'd still have the ELC slide as long as the player is under the age of 20. See Robert Mayer and Alex Avtsin who had their ELCs slide for us.

The only way a year is taken off the ELC is if the player is over the age of 20, or if he plays 10 NHL games.

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02-24-2012, 12:47 PM
  #355
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I wouldn't want to see Forsberg play another year in the Allsvenskan, however I can see why a year in the Elitserien would help his development. However I think the AHL might be the best bet for him, help him figure out what he needs to do physically to prepare for North American hockey. He still needs to fill out after all, right now that's the biggest thing holding him back.

Plus the AHL means he can be called up if he thrives.

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02-24-2012, 01:29 PM
  #356
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Hearing Grant Mckagg talk about Grigorenko, gotta say I'd be beyond shocked if we pick Grigorenko at this point especially when you consider his relationship with Timmins.

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02-24-2012, 01:39 PM
  #357
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Red Line has Forsberg at #2, Grigorenko at #3.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/hocke...=1ui0e0edrghg8

IF Forsberg had been born a month and 3 days later, he'd be a 2013 pick. Very young player, almost a full year younger than Yakupov...I wouldn't put him in the AHL next year because of that.

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02-24-2012, 01:44 PM
  #358
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
I wouldn't want to see Forsberg play another year in the Allsvenskan, however I can see why a year in the Elitserien would help his development. However I think the AHL might be the best bet for him, help him figure out what he needs to do physically to prepare for North American hockey. He still needs to fill out after all, right now that's the biggest thing holding him back.

Plus the AHL means he can be called up if he thrives.
It's better if he plays in the SEL. If we draft him, we should hope Leksand qualifies for SEL.

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02-24-2012, 01:45 PM
  #359
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Watching Forsberg at the WJC, what struck me was his skating. I don't remember reading much about his skating, but it looked great to me.

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02-24-2012, 01:46 PM
  #360
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Originally Posted by Zeroknowledge View Post
Hearing Grant Mckagg talk about Grigorenko, gotta say I'd be beyond shocked if we pick Grigorenko at this point especially when you consider his relationship with Timmins.
It's one thing to not want to take a risk with a player that high, it's quite another to miss out on a franchise center that was within your grasp at that pick.

Regardless of Grant's opinion, I very much doubt Timmins won't be making a few trips to Quebec to really make sure.

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02-24-2012, 01:50 PM
  #361
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Anyone could enlighten me on Gaunce skating ?

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02-24-2012, 01:51 PM
  #362
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
Red Line has Forsberg at #2, Grigorenko at #3.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/hocke...=1ui0e0edrghg8

IF Forsberg had been born a month and 3 days later, he'd be a 2013 pick. Very young player, almost a full year younger than Yakupov...I wouldn't put him in the AHL next year because of that.
And that's why I pick Forsberg out of anybody in this draft (Excluding the superstar.)

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02-24-2012, 01:54 PM
  #363
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Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
Regardless of Grant's opinion, I very much doubt Timmins won't be making a few trips to Quebec to really make sure.
He watched the Remparts twice last weekend when they were on the road for the games in Saint John and Moncton (the games the scout talks about in Grant's article). The Remparts beat reporter tweeted about his presence. Our Q scout Serge Boisvert was also there with him.

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Old
02-24-2012, 01:55 PM
  #364
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
He watched the Remparts twice last weekend when they are on the road for the games in Saint John and Moncton (the games the scout talks about in Grant's article). The Remparts beat reporter tweeted about his presence. Our Q scout Serge Boisvert was also there with him.
He's also still bothered by the ankle injury.

I assume TT will be going back once Grigs is 100%.

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02-24-2012, 02:06 PM
  #365
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There's not a lot of season left in the Q and the Remparts may not go very deep in the playoffs. He may not be 100% healthy again this season. Sprained ankles are a b*tch, they usually only heal with lots of rest.

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02-24-2012, 02:14 PM
  #366
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Originally Posted by Mrb1p View Post
And that's why I pick Forsberg out of anybody in this draft (Excluding the superstar.)
I think a lot of people are sleeping on Forsberg because of his age. His skillset is everything you'd want for a premier winger.

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02-24-2012, 02:17 PM
  #367
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I think a lot of people are sleeping on Forsberg because of his age. His skillset is everything you'd want for a premier winger.
No one's sleeping on Forsberg. His ceiling simply isn't perceived to be as high as the 2 big forwards and what's presumed to be Galchenyuk's.

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02-24-2012, 02:22 PM
  #368
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No one's sleeping on Forsberg. His ceiling simply isn't perceived to be as high as the 2 big forwards and what's presumed to be Galchenyuk's.
If you go to the Prospects board there's a lot of people looking at his stats and assuming he must have something wrong with him, you even see people who would rather take Collberg.

Not as much here, I think the general consensus is one of the 4 means a successful draft.

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02-24-2012, 02:39 PM
  #369
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Having seen forsberg live, I can attest to two things:

1.) he has a very high level of skill in all areas. Skating, stick handling, shooting, protecting the puck blah blah blah. He doesn't have an area of technical inferiority.

2.) he is very creative.

However, what I haven't seen him is plays where he just dominates the other team and finishes with authority. In other words, I haven't seen him drop it like it's hawtt.

But the reason for that is simple: there's no video of him.

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02-24-2012, 03:50 PM
  #370
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Interesting about Wilson's interview: Models game after Lucic and would love to play anywhere but "Montreal would be cool."

With our 2nd rounder, would you pick Wilson over Di Giuseppe, Thrower and others that are on the 2nd/1st round bubble?

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02-24-2012, 03:59 PM
  #371
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I think a lot of people are sleeping on Forsberg because of his age. His skillset is everything you'd want for a premier winger.
That is my one concern with him. His age makes him a bit more difficult to predict, imho. A little tougher to be confident he will be an impact player. His stats, this year, are a little light... I don't know his situation though and he looked very good at the WJHC, so that could be irrelevant as he is a talented and skilled player. Just one minor concern really, Forsberg could very well be a great pick.

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02-24-2012, 03:59 PM
  #372
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Originally Posted by Habsolument90 View Post
Interesting about Wilson's interview: Models game after Lucic and would love to play anywhere but "Montreal would be cool."

With our 2nd rounder, would you pick Wilson over Di Giuseppe, Thrower and others that are on the 2nd/1st round bubble?
You think Wilson lasts to 33rd or so overall? I wouldn't pick DiGiuseppe that high, he never seems to play well in all the Michigan games i've seen.

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02-24-2012, 04:05 PM
  #373
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You think Wilson lasts to 33rd or so overall? I wouldn't pick DiGiuseppe that high, he never seems to play well in all the Michigan games i've seen.
He may very well shoot up to a mid 1st, but I've read speculation about scouts not seeing much offense at the pro level as well as rankings that have him outside of the 1st.

About Giu, he looked great at the WJC camp and tbh I think he's doing well for a freshman.

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02-24-2012, 04:14 PM
  #374
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I'm glad folks are finally coming to their senses and realizing that Forsberg is a better pick than Grigorenko. I thought Forsberg looked much better than Grigorenko at the WJC....much more rounded game and played on top PP unit of by far the best and deepest team in the tourney.

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02-24-2012, 04:30 PM
  #375
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He may very well shoot up to a mid 1st, but I've read speculation about scouts not seeing much offense at the pro level as well as rankings that have him outside of the 1st.

About Giu, he looked great at the WJC camp and tbh I think he's doing well for a freshman.
DiGiuseppe is having a good year at Michigan, but I still won't take him that high, maybe in the '50's, just don't really care for him from the games ive seen (although i mostly focus on just watching Bennett and Pateryn)

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