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I think one of the problems with the NHL is it's hard to market players
No. Having a personality doesnt equal having a big ego. Not in the slightest.
Just because someone isn't publically outspoken, an extrovert, doesn't mean they don't have a personality. Basically, you seem to be saying that athletes should be entertainers as well as being skilled at the sport they play. Yes, I think it certainly helps, but marketing a sport shouldn't have to depend on that. You should market the skill-level of the players, teams as a group, and the dynamics of the sport itself. Beyond that, special personalities are just gravy.
The problem isn't with the nature of the game, as mentioned before hockey players play a lot more than your average MLB pitcher plays, and their success rate at scoring is far more frequent than MLB where if you hit 30% of the time you're an All-Star.
This line of argument just doesn't work. Sure, pitchers only play every few games... but when they are in the game, you're guaranteed to see them do something of note. I have bought day-of-game MLB tickets on a whim because I knew that a star pitcher would be on the mound. That alone is a selling point to a lot of people, even if it's not happening every single game.
Also, a good hitter might only average a little over .300, but he's going to get a whole lot more than 1 hit per game. Again, by buying a ticket you're almost guaranteed to see a good hitter do something of note. Even if that means striking out.
You are not guaranteed to see a top NHL player do something interesting in every game. That's a huge marketing problem.
Just because someone isn't publically outspoken, an extrovert, doesn't mean they don't have a personality.
which is exactly why I said they need to do more to showcase the players and humanize them through things like 24/7 and 36 Hours.
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Basically, you seem to be saying that athletes should be entertainers as well as being skilled at the sport they play. Yes, I think it certainly helps, but marketing a sport shouldn't have to depend on that. You should market the skill-level of the players, teams as a group, and the dynamics of the sport itself. Beyond that, special personalities are just gravy.
Didn't insinuate anything of the sort about them being entertainers. Where are you getting that?
Just said the NHL needs to get the players out of the cliche sports interviews box and showcase them as human beings. The other 3 leagues do a good job of this, the NHL not so much.
This line of argument just doesn't work. Sure, pitchers only play every few games... but when they are in the game, you're guaranteed to see them do something of note. I have bought day-of-game MLB tickets on a whim because I knew that a star pitcher would be on the mound. That alone is a selling point to a lot of people, even if it's not happening every single game.
Also, a good hitter might only average a little over .300, but he's going to get a whole lot more than 1 hit per game. Again, by buying a ticket you're almost guaranteed to see a good hitter do something of note. Even if that means striking out.
So let me get this straight, when an MLB star comes up to the plate and strikes out looking it's exciting. But when an NHL star gets a shot on goal that's stopped by the goalie it's not?
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You are not guaranteed to see a top NHL player do something interesting in every game. That's a huge marketing problem.
I guess if your definition of "interesting" is broad to other sports and extremely narrow to hockey, then I guess not.
Just said the NHL needs to get the players out of the cliche sports interviews box and showcase them as human beings. The other 3 leagues do a good job of this, the NHL not so much.
This, this and this again. The 24/7 show is basically the best thing that happened in the NHL in a long time. I would love something similar done each year for each team. Sure, it would mean 15 producers and directors but let's face it... a 24/7 for Calgary and Edmonton would be sweet. A 24/7 for Montreal, specially this year, would have been golden.
which is exactly why I said they need to do more to showcase the players and humanize them through things like 24/7 and 36 Hours.
Didn't insinuate anything of the sort about them being entertainers. Where are you getting that?
Just said the NHL needs to get the players out of the cliche sports interviews box and showcase them as human beings. The other 3 leagues do a good job of this, the NHL not so much.
IMO, its more of a sports/ethnic culture issue than a marketing one.
Hockey is filled with middle class white kids who have been had team-first pushed down on them since mites. Its not exactly a climate that will produce players who are outwardly entertaining.
Look at baseball, there are plenty of personalities, but most of them are the Latino players African Americans in football and basketball tend to be more outgoing, but again its a culture thing.
Sometimes I wish the European stars in this league did have a better grasp for the English language because they are far more outwardly entertaining than North American players. But again, the culture of North American hockey is very much the other way. Look at the issues that Ovechkins or Anisimov's celebrations caused.
The "problem" is that it's easier to notice stars in other sports during one game easier than you can in a hockey game. In hockey, a star could score zero points and someone who doesn't watch hockey would think he had a bad game, when it's very possible he had a good game but just didn't score. The stars in basketball all score a whole lot in every game, so it's easier to cheer for them if you are into basketball.
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which is exactly why I said they need to do more to showcase the players and humanize them through things like 24/7 and 36 Hours.
Didn't insinuate anything of the sort about them being entertainers. Where are you getting that?
Just said the NHL needs to get the players out of the cliche sports interviews box and showcase them as human beings. The other 3 leagues do a good job of this, the NHL not so much.
Sorry, didn't mean to imply something that you didn't intend.
So let me get this straight, when an MLB star comes up to the plate and strikes out looking it's exciting. But when an NHL star gets a shot on goal that's stopped by the goalie it's not?
It's a showcase moment for that star player. The crowd gets loud, and there's a couple of minutes where only 2 guys on the field matter -- the superstar batter, and the pitcher. Obviously it's possible for that scenario to fall flat (pop fly to 2nd or something) but there's at least a distinct moment when you say "here comes the superstar".
In the NHL, it's pretty common for star players to be quiet throughout a game and maybe have only one or two noteworthy plays. That adds up to what, 10 or 15 seconds a game? That's just not enough to showcase his talent. The defenses are just too good for a star player to have his limelight moment with great regularity.
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I guess if your definition of "interesting" is broad to other sports and extremely narrow to hockey, then I guess not.
It's not narrower to hockey than to other sports. This is a game where the star players sit on the bench 2/3rds of the game and has only 2-3 prime scoring chances on a good night. I appreciate more versatile players as much as the next guy, but points are what define superstars.
I agree with the personality angle. Sidney Crosby always comes off as interesting as masking tape whenever he's on camera. Those Sport-Chek/Reebok SC87 commercials they air, he looks part bemused, part concussed and they give the other actors all the speaking lines. Now, it's not the NHL's fault their most talented player is no actor, (I'm sure that's part of why he's so good at hockey) but the NHL seems to punish individuality. Anisimov seemed pretty chastised after his sniper celebration in interviews, someone just crushed his individuality. And while I understand why the Dallas Stars were upset with Sean Avery's sloppy seconds comment, I don't understand why the league was. That kind of thing would be great to build upon, especially in early season games. Everybody is aware of hockey's violent edge, and I'm sure a lot of fans wanted to see him get his. Let alone the fact that he's tied himself to general celebrity culture.
Patrick Kane's superman goal over the all-star weekend was great. Get this guy in ads. Ryan Kesler is known for his interview bombing of teammates, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdesgp_xEVw and Ilya Bryzgalov was the funniest thing about both 24/7s. He had a great quote in the papers after Jets fans taunted him the other night:
"I like it. It was a great atmosphere," Bryzgalov said after the Flyers beat the Jets. "I wish every building was as supportive as that. It's nice to hear cheering, 'Ilya, Ilya... ' I never heard it before, anywhere. When 15,000 people support you, it's very impressive. "Here, they cheer me. In Philly, they boo me," he laughed.
The NHL should be using these guys as well. I think if they can bring out a personality rather than repress it, it would make the players more relatable to the general public, and in turn, more marketable. And if you're using the whole roster, rather than the top 25 scorers, it kind of shows off the 'team' aspect, then it doesn't matter if the stars only get 2 or 3 chances a game to really show off.
It's kind of working in reverse. Get people interested in the players, then they might be curious to see what the fuss is about surrounding the game. Generic ads talking about rivalries or the intensity of the game don't really work if you aren't already somewhat interested in the first place.
You could replace the word "hockey" with "NASCAR".
Yet NASCAR is a marketing juggernaut compared to the NHL.
Maybe in North Carolina it is but not in Canada. I have known one guy in my life that watches NASCAR. I am 40 and I know a ton of sports fans and of everybody, one single guy watches NASCAR. Every sports fan I know watches hockey regularly.
NASCAR like the NHL both have strong a regional following and always will. Marketing will never change that.
As for the live versus tv debate, anything is better live than on TV. In fact, I think it's easier for some people to follow the game on TV than live.
NFL? Can't see that. (You can't see the replays in the stands, and that seems to be 90% of the action )
Cycling, road racing (think Tour of California, Tour de France) -- you can stand on the side of the road half a day to see 15 seconds of the peleton flashing by, or you can sit and home and watch the race unfold for hours, often getting close up shots of the riders as they pedal along.
Guess it depends on the sport (and where you sit).
Maybe in North Carolina it is but not in Canada. I have known one guy in my life that watches NASCAR. I am 40 and I know a ton of sports fans and of everybody, one single guy watches NASCAR. Every sports fan I know watches hockey regularly.
NASCAR like the NHL both have strong a regional following and always will. Marketing will never change that.
To the best of my knowledge, NASCAR doesn't attempt to market itself in Canada. It doesn't surprise me that nobody there watches it, any more than it would surprise me that nobody in Mexico watches the NHL.
In the United States, NASCAR still obviously has its base in the southeastern region but it is popular nationwide. Drivers like Dale Earnhardt Jr., Jeff Gordon and Danica Patrick are at least as well recognized as Sidney Crosby and Alex Ovechkin. Its national TV contract is three times larger than the NHL's. Granted its popularity tanked with the recession, but it is still better than the NHL at marketing itself to a mass audience. I'd be interested to see a revenue comparison between the leagues if one exists -- I'd imagine that NASCAR's corporate cash flow puts the NHL to shame.
And it has the same handicaps as the NHL in regard to regionalism, niche appeal, and being much better in person than on TV.
For the NHL to market players they need to cultivate both heroes and antiheroes.People need not just to love some players, but to hate others. People have to think - this guy is great and I just hate that SOB on that team. In an era of political correctness, to get the population's collective emotions flowing we need a bit of outrage and a strong dynamic.
As an example, when baseball exploded in popularity, the Babe was loved across the country and the equally talented but very outspoken and nasty Ty Cobb was loathed.
As an example, when baseball exploded in popularity, the Babe was loved across the country and the equally talented but very outspoken and nasty Ty Cobb was loathed.
True enough, but where are the Hero's & Anti-Heros' in todays game?. Crosby's out, Ovechkins' lagging, and unless your a Caps/Pens fan that rivalry doesnt exactly get the crank going. Detroit, Boston, Chicago & Vancouver have some premier talent however they make headlines often for the wrong reasons (Thomas for eg.). The teams meet so infrequently that rivalries dont even get a chance to get going. Theres no Broadway Joe, Hull, Orr, a Derek Sanderson, Cement Head Semenko, Gretzky, Lemieux etc out there really, someone who transcends the game & captures the imagination.
There are a lot better villains than heroes at the moment.
Ovechkin, Subban, Lucic, Hartnell, Pronger... those are All Stars. Lower-level guys who are still easily hate-able: Marchand, Kaleta, Cooke, Armstrong, Avery. Good hockey players who agitate the bejeezus out of their opponents. Never mind the epic hate for guys like Crosby, Price, Kessel.
All of the players listed above are in the same conference. Rosters are chock-full of villains right now, not so much of heroes.
One problem in marketing on a local scale is "the foreign millionaire factor". It's kind of hard to get people to support a game between "our foreign millionaires", and "their foreign millionaires". Most NHL players are either Canadians or Europeans, i.e. "foreign millionaires" as far as Americans are concerned.
This isn't so much of a problem with Canadians as they're "foreign" in the most technical of sense, but it absolutely is an issue with Europeans. Even here in Detroit where we pride ourselves on the number of European players we have, it's always been the case that guys like Yzerman and even McCarty and Osgood developed these huge cultish fanbases whereas the likes of Fedorov and even Lidstrom until more recently couldn't really completely win over hearts and minds the way our Canadian grinders did. Even now that everyone fully appreciates Lidstrom, he's not even close to garnering the level of adulation Yzerman did... there are hundreds of thousands of people in Michigan whose loyalties were to Steve first and the Wings second.
Hockey simply isn't designed as a star oriented game. There's nothing you can do to change that fact and no amount of marketing is going to make it any easier for new fans to get into the game.
Hockey simply isn't designed as a star oriented game. There's nothing you can do to change that fact and no amount of marketing is going to make it any easier for new fans to get into the game.
Ya, good examples & points. Part of the problem is the Draft itself, whereby a guy like Kesler from Livonia (and who was a star in OHIO playing NCAA) wind up in far flung locations. Europeans have yet to be embraced & or revered as much as North Americans, despite the now nearly 40yr chain of some tremendous talents starting with Salming, through Kurri & Lidstrom et al. If there was some way to tilt the playing field whereby a kid born in say Nashville or Charlotte, wherever, wound up in a Predators' or Hurricanes jersey, a home-town-hero if you will, that would be helpful. However, due to the nature of the game itself, if said player doesnt "fit" within any given coaches system or what have you, you could be looking at a lot of busts & disappointments. I dont know what the answer is, as it seems at present the league doesnt really have a single leading light, that one or 2 in a generational player upon which to pin its marquee...
If there was some way to tilt the playing field whereby a kid born in say Nashville or Charlotte, wherever, wound up in a Predators' or Hurricanes jersey, a home-town-hero if you will, that would be helpful.
Already happened. Blake Geoffrion.
It was a neat story. However, Blake being more of a grinder forward prevented him from having tremendous value, since we have plenty of that style player. So, he was traded to Montreal.
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