Trade Rumors and Free Agent TalkTrade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.
I don't see it as over valuing at all. In a vacume, I'd say it's about even.
Wilson, though, is Nashville's best top-6 and is young, and is only getting better. The Preds traded up in the draft to get him and he's been brought up through the system. His value to the team is too big.
Because it would take more than Colin Wilson to land Derek Roy.
Hate to break the news to you, but that is a fact.
That isn't a bash against your team. You guys have a very good team but you are over valuing Colin Wilson in a big way.
If Regier only landed Wilson for Roy I'd be extremely angry.
Wilson is 21, playing far better than Roy this year, is a beast physically, and has years ahead of him under team control. Roy is a struggling, undersized forward, on a lame duck team this year, signed for one more year, making 5.5 million bucks. Be real. There is no way that Roy equals Wilson this year.
Don't get me wrong, Roy has been a very good forward for several years now, but he is coming off an injury plagued 2010-2011 season while simultaneously putting in a pedestrian 2011-2012 season. 2 years ago, I would agree. Now, not so much. The Sabres as an organization are in a different place as well.
I peg Roy's value as roughly akin to Mike Fisher's last year. Fortunately for the Sabres, this is a seller's market. Instead of the first and conditional third/2nd. It will likely be a first, conditional third/second, and a top 3-6 prospect.
Wilson is 21, playing far better than Roy this year, is a beast physically, and has years ahead of him under team control. Roy is a struggling, undersized forward, on a lame duck team this year, signed for one more year, making 5.5 million bucks. Be real. There is no way that Roy equals Wilson this year.
Don't get me wrong, Roy has been a very good forward for several years now, but he is coming off an injury plagued 2010-2011 season while simultaneously putting in a pedestrian 2011-2012 season. 2 years ago, I would agree. Now, not so much. The Sabres as an organization are in a different place as well.
I peg Roy's value as roughly akin to Mike Fisher's last year. Fortunately for the Sabres, this is a seller's market. Instead of the first and conditional third/2nd. It will likely be a first, conditional third/second, and a top 3-6 prospect.
First, Wilson is 22, not 21.
Derek Roy played in the NHL while he was a youngster as well. If you compare their first three seasons against each other, Roy's were much better. Also, Roy has been playing some real good hockey the last few weeks. It is believed that the injury he suffered last year took some time to completely come back from.
Roy was a point a game player last season before the injury and his recent games look like he is completely back to form.
Also, Roy is only 28 and there is no reason to believe that he can't continue to be a 70 point a year player for quite some time.
I'm not taking anything away from Wilson but I believe his high draft status is a big reason he is being over valued. Can't say that I wouldn't feel the same if he played for my team but I am trying to be honest.
You have a an extremely solid team and I wish you well this spring.
Wilson is 21, playing far better than Roy this year, is a beast physically, and has years ahead of him under team control. Roy is a struggling, undersized forward, on a lame duck team this year, signed for one more year, making 5.5 million bucks. Be real. There is no way that Roy equals Wilson this year.
And yet Roy has more points than Wilson. Wilson is viewed as more valuable than Roy because Roy hasn't lived up to higher expectations this season, while Wilson has been a pleasant addition under largely tempered expectations. That doesn't make him the better player.
(This isn't an endorsement of Nashville trading away Wilson.)
And yet Roy has more points than Wilson. Wilson is viewed as more valuable than Roy because Roy hasn't lived up to higher expectations this season, while Wilson has been a pleasant addition under largely tempered expectations. That doesn't make him the better player.
(This isn't an endorsement of Nashville trading away Wilson.)
Trotz has used Wilson in both top and bottom 6 roles this year. He spent significant time playing alongside the likes of Tootoo and Spaling (which was, amazingly, our best line for about a month), and gets very little time on the PP.
That said, I believe Roy to be a better offensive player now, and probably in the future, but Wilson has developed into an incredibly valuable two-way forward, and I think his production will only go up as he gets more significant minutes in an offensive role.
Also worth saying, if I was Buffalo, Wilson would need to be a return for me to give up Roy, and as a Nashville fan, that's just a price I'm not willing to pay.
Trotz has used Wilson in both top and bottom 6 roles this year. He spent significant time playing alongside the likes of Tootoo and Spaling (which was, amazingly, our best line for about a month), and gets very little time on the PP.
That said, I believe Roy to be a better offensive player now, and probably in the future, but Wilson has developed into an incredibly valuable two-way forward, and I think his production will only go up as he gets more significant minutes in an offensive role.
Also worth saying, if I was Buffalo, Wilson would need to be a return for me to give up Roy, and as a Nashville fan, that's just a price I'm not willing to pay.
And yet Roy has more points than Wilson. Wilson is viewed as more valuable than Roy because Roy hasn't lived up to higher expectations this season, while Wilson has been a pleasant addition under largely tempered expectations. That doesn't make him the better player.
(This isn't an endorsement of Nashville trading away Wilson.)
Roy has 3 more points, all assists. Meanwhile, Wilson has 5 game winning goals (Roy none), and Wilson is a +5/Roy is a -6. Look, statistically they are comparable, and this is with Wilson playing on the third line or below for at least half the year before finally gaining Trotz's trust. Roy very well may outscore Wilson over the next few years, but I doubt it will be by much. I also know that Wilson will provide an element to the team that Roy will never be able to match, while being far cheaper with at least 4 more years of team control vs. 1.
Wilson holds more value than Derek Roy right now for those reasons. I like Roy. I have been a huge supporter of bringing him to the Predators, but dealing Wilson for him, not to mention adding more, is lunacy and a coup for the Sabres.
Roy has 3 more points, all assists. Meanwhile, Wilson has 5 game winning goals (Roy none), and Wilson is a +5/Roy is a -6. Look, statistically they are comparable, and this is with Wilson playing on the third line or below for at least half the year before finally gaining Trotz's trust. Roy very well may outscore Wilson over the next few years, but I doubt it will be by much. I also know that Wilson will provide an element to the team that Roy will never be able to match, while being far cheaper with at least 4 more years of team control vs. 1.
Wilson holds more value than Derek Roy right now for those reasons. I like Roy. I have been a huge supporter of bringing him to the Predators, but dealing Wilson for him, not to mention adding more, is lunacy and a coup for the Sabres.
I hate to use it, but...Wilson, AINEC. I think Smith is still adjusting to the rigors of an NHL season. He played a very valuable role for us early on, but hasn't been the same since he blew that 2-foot empty netter. He also hasn't gotten the top 6 TOI either. Wilson is strong on both ends of the ice, is a more physical presence, and is noticeable (in the good ways) even when he's not scoring.
Derek Roy played in the NHL while he was a youngster as well. If you compare their first three seasons against each other, Roy's were much better. Also, Roy has been playing some real good hockey the last few weeks. It is believed that the injury he suffered last year took some time to completely come back from.
Roy was a point a game player last season before the injury and his recent games look like he is completely back to form.
Also, Roy is only 28 and there is no reason to believe that he can't continue to be a 70 point a year player for quite some time.
I'm not taking anything away from Wilson but I believe his high draft status is a big reason he is being over valued. Can't say that I wouldn't feel the same if he played for my team but I am trying to be honest.
You have a an extremely solid team and I wish you well this spring.
The part I have in bold means nothing to this potential deal. If we were comparing the careers of two players to decide who was better, sure, but we are talking value of two players. The past does not matter anymore. It's right now and the future that matter. Right now I just don't see Wilson for Roy being a good trade for the Preds. Nashville is a very young team finding a new identity that it will run with for the next four or five seasons. Wilson fits into that perfectly. We do not know if Roy will fit into it or not. I'd rather keep Wilson and look elsewhere for a forward.
And I know the discussion has been good and on topic for the last bit, but I want to reiterate that a thread about Eklund is not an invitation to bag on Eklund. Keep your opinions of him to yourself. We're getting tired of having to warn people.
Roy is better than Wilson right now. In the future, Wilson may be better than Roy, but Roy is the superior player at the moment, and the Preds would like to win now, before they lose Suter or Weber. It won't happen, but it would be fair.
I hate to use it, but...Wilson, AINEC. I think Smith is still adjusting to the rigors of an NHL season. He played a very valuable role for us early on, but hasn't been the same since he blew that 2-foot empty netter. He also hasn't gotten the top 6 TOI either. Wilson is strong on both ends of the ice, is a more physical presence, and is noticeable (in the good ways) even when he's not scoring.
Wilson sounds like the type of player I would like the Sabres to acquire, but in Buffalo's situation, they are more in need of a Center especially if they dealt Roy. Would Nashville consider, Smith and a 1st for Roy? It wont happen but just for argument sake? It seems that if Roy were to get traded, Chicago would probably willing to give the most return for him at least in terms of prospects. Chicago also needs a defenseman and we could send Weber or Leopold in the deal.
Roy is better than Wilson right now. In the future, Wilson may be better than Roy, but Roy is the superior player at the moment, and the Preds would like to win now, before they lose Suter or Weber. It won't happen, but it would be fair.
The problem is that the gulf isn't that great. Wilson's been on the third line for defensive inadequacy and playing with offensive plugs for most of the season. I don't think it will be all that long before they're at least equal players, but trading Wilson for Roy is too near a lateral move to make sense.
I think Craig Smith would be a much better chance for the Sabres, if a first, a third and someone like Austin Watson didn't cut it
The problem is that the gulf isn't that great. Wilson's been on the third line for defensive inadequacy and playing with offensive plugs for most of the season. I don't think it will be all that long before they're at least equal players, but trading Wilson for Roy is too near a lateral move to make sense.
I think Craig Smith would be a much better chance for the Sabres, if a first, a third and someone like Austin Watson didn't cut it
It probably won't be that long, I agree, but if the Preds want to win now, they might consider this... A 1st, 3rd, and Watson might work, but isn't Watson a RW?
I don't see them trading Wilson for Roy when Roy is a UFA after next season. Wilson will give them quite a few years of good play at a good price before he qualifies as a UFA. You might trade that for a Roy-like player with 3+ years left on his contract, but not one year, IMO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobBrown4PM
Wasn't it just a day ago Eklund said Hemsky was going to the Preds?
No, he had the Preds showing a lot of interest in Hemsky and trying to trade for him. Ultimately, the Oilers chose to keep him. Now, with Hemsky unavailable, the Preds have turned their attention to Roy, instead. I'm not sure what about this doesn't make sense.
Wilson is a center, until the Preds.
Don't see the trade working for the Preds to move Wilson now.
Plenty of guys play centre in jnuior and then become wingers. That is Wilson. My point there is that Buffalo wouldn't want/need Wilson because he's not an NHL centre, and also that Nashville wouldn't move him for Roy because his value is higher (21 year old former top 10 pick who is having a very good year > a guy who will be a UFA in 16 months)
That was a good one. If Regier wants Wilson, he can, among other things, go jump in a lake.
