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Sports Illustrated Says: No Rebuild, Just a New GM + Retool

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Old
02-25-2012, 09:55 AM
  #76
HotPie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
A rebuild is not possible because it doesn't make sense from the point of view of ownsership and management to attempt one. No habs management will ever attempt one, because no ownsership will ever accept it, because nobody who is rich enough to buy the habs is stupid enough to make this kind of business mistake. And I blame the fans (or at least, the fans who demand for such a rebuild) for not understanding that, and for calling multiple management teams over more than a decade incompetent because they took into account something that you chose to ignore.

If you ask management to "to look at the long term" while ignoring the money portion of the equation, then yes, you have unrealistic expectations. Hockey is a business. If you have trouble with this fact then what the ***** do you expect me to say? It won't go away just because you feel like it.

For God sakes, just look at this season! Do you think the Molsons are happy about the results? About all the front pages they made for the wrong reasons? All the season ticket holders who are complaining? The sponsors who don't want to be associated with losers? Televised habs game being less popular? Do you see a lot of average fans being content over the thought of drafting high versus not making the playoffs? The Molsons know very well what happen when the team start to stagnate and miss the post-season a few time in a row. They don't want the franchise to look what it used to look circa 2000, when the Center Bell wasn't full every night, and team was the laughing stock of the city, and the franchise value less than half it is right now. They can't affort to ignore that.
Quite frankly making statements like no ownership would allow for a rebuild in montreal is just speculation and conjecture on your part, with no actual merit.

The concept of businesses taking a financial hit in return for significantly greater long-term security is not some kind of radical new concept, besides, I think you're severely inflating the loss they'd incur just to try and prove your point. Bottom line, the onus is on ownership and management, period.

To think the fans have anything to do with this is just downright hilarious. I'm so sick of this "blame the fans" rhetoric that seems to be the trendy thing to do nowadays.

The fans aren't the ones responsible for the make-up and organization of this team, end of story.


Last edited by HotPie: 02-25-2012 at 12:52 PM.
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Old
02-25-2012, 10:01 AM
  #77
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Obviously finishing last for a couple seasons will have a cost in attendance and merchandise sales, but all of those fans will come back, and then some, once the rebuild pays off and the team is a stanley cup contender with superstars on the roster.

Good businessmen are willing to invest in the long-term future of their club. The Molsons? They sold the team for ~150 million and then bought it back 10 years later for ~550 million. They didn't build their business empire, they inherited it. I'm not sure they have the saavy to think long-term.

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02-25-2012, 10:04 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
Ok listen.

You guys think habs management can affort a tank-and-rebuild strategy? You think it's just a matter of competence? You don't want to understand how ownership doesn't see it that way? Please, be my guess, continue to be disappointed. Continue to have unrealistic expectations. I couldn't care less. Have a nice day
The tank and rebuild strategy is being forced upon them by the fact they're finishing last.

If they "can't afford it", then I guess we'll see them file for bankruptcy?

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02-25-2012, 10:05 AM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
Ok listen.

You guys think habs management can affort a tank-and-rebuild strategy? You think it's just a matter of competence? You don't want to understand how ownership doesn't see it that way? Please, be my guess, continue to be disappointed. Continue to have unrealistic expectations. I couldn't care less. Have a nice day
All I'm saying is that there are ways to make it work monetarily by minimizing the loss of attendance with the right marketing and by accounting for the added revenues from superstar memorabilia sales.

Then, if you do it right, and you end up building a contender, then you will end up making more money in the long run although it's riskier than aiming for 8th. Risk in business can be acceptable at times. And let's not forget that patchworks also have the risk of not working and you can still fail to make the playoffs, you end up with the worst of both worlds then with maximum frustration from the fans with no playoffs revenue and no superstar boosted jersey sales. So, there are risks associated with both.

Also, have you ever stopped to think it might be you who is a bit close minded and refuses to see any other possibilities than what's always been done before ? What's always been done before isn't necessarily the right thing to do, or even what will always happen in the future.

That said, I doubt the habs ever do that. Their loss (and mine I guess). Thankfully, we might take the right path by mistake. But I'm also perfectly fine with a new GM coming in and building a contender via trades/signings. It's gonna have to be a truly good management team though, enough with the Gauthier/Gainey/ex-sens losers crap. Never ever gonna build a contender that way.

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02-25-2012, 10:26 AM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
I'm not sure if a rebuild is necessary though. Columbus needs to rebuild because they have no pieces. The Habs have a lot of pieces, they just need a coach/GM who can make these pieces work together and bring in ones that fit and remove ones that don't.

You have 2/3's of a 4th line in Moen and White
You have a 3rd line in Eller, Leblanc, Bourque
You have 2/3's of a top 6 in Pleks, Gio, Max, Cole
I think DD should be moved, but that's another story

You have the best young goalie in the league in Price

You have a solid defensive Dman in Gorges and one of the better young dmen in the game in Subban. Emelin looks to be a gamer and then add in Markov.

Then the prospect pool looks pretty good, especially with a lottery pick in there.

This team can be quite good with a GM who can make a couple moves to fix the D (not difficult) and add to the top 6 (fairly difficult). A good coach can also help a great deal as well.

A retool is sufficient IMO
I'm kinda crapping on you in the Koivu/captain thread, but when you break it down like this, you're right. With significant improvement to just 3 spots in the forward lineup (as you highlight above), this team could really become something. At least something worth watching until some of those guys above come to the end of their days and have to be replaced as well. Most are in their late 20s/early 30s, though, so we have a few years before worrying about that.

The defense is another story, but I think there's a GM out there who could turn this franchise around with a "simple" re-tool, meaning a complete rebuild isn't necessary, imo. Might turn out to be a slower process than an aggressive rebuild, but it's possible, imo.

Having said that, on a micro scale, if you're last place by the trade deadline, there's no sense trying to claw your way out of a lottery pick, imo. Get the most out of a bad season (i.e. best pick and chance at a game-breaking talent possible), avoid the urge to tear it all down, and get to work for next year.

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02-25-2012, 10:39 AM
  #81
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Who in the Hockey World is Darren Eliot to think that he can read a few articles about the Habs and give the owner advice.This guy butters up the owner talks about the teams prospects like they already play here and puts the blame for the Habs situation on the GM.He has no idea about the salary cap or who brought in some players and names college hockey players so that he warms up to US readers.Booo and Hiss to this guy and PG is going to finally have a great draft position in a season from hell where the Habs are the most injured team in the league.Keep Gauthier or Canadien teams will be told what to do by American sportswriters in a Canadian sport.

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Old
02-25-2012, 11:29 AM
  #82
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A boss who believes that grabbing as many of the best employees possible for his organization AND FOR THE LONGEST PERIOD OF TIME is secondary to getting money in his coffers every year-- even at the expense of superstars who can net him a championship and money at the same time--is someone who does not give a crap about making a winning team. Being a contender for winning the CUP is the ultimate goal, not being a contender for 8th place and then getting smashed by guess what? Better teams.

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02-25-2012, 02:28 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
Of course they chose to try to make the playoffs, duh. That's my point. It's very important for them.
Right... 8th place is very important. Championships aren't. That's my point.
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
The fans reaction would be even worst if the team rebuilt. That you belief the contrary is your own little narrative. In practice all the fans are interested is the "right now", and they will spend accordingly.

Again, that's your little analysis, with no ground on reality. In practice, no ownsership will accept to see the value of its company go down - even just for a year - just on the remote possibility that it could go up latter. This is pure wishful thinking.
Tell that to Detroit. Go and actually read what their owners said and did when they took over the Detroit 'Dead Things' they are now the class of the league and we're a joke.
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All these things can happen without the team sucking for a while and risking massive lost in value. That it would be easier to get these kinds of players by tanking is beside the point.
Who the hell is saying we have to lose for a long time? Nobody. Not me, not anyone else. What we've said is that we have to rebuild. That can come via investing in picks and prospects. It can also come by not making stupid moves like picking up Thomas Kaberle and trading away McD for Gomez.

Those are moves designed for short term gains and no long term thinking.

Yes rebuilding may result in losing for a while or it may not. Bottom line though is that you invest in younger players and don't go for quick fixes like we did when we replaced our entire core three years ago.
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
'cause most of the time (including the last few years, and exceptionally not this year), this strategy has allow the team to make the playoffs and be very popular in Montreal - and when you make the playoffs, you don't know what will happen next. No franchise is going to risk its core value just for the possible chance of doing better latter. You problem is simple: you vastly understestimate how much a franchise value can fluctuate over the years if the team isn't competitive. You're doing this because it's the only way your tanking theory makes sense. If you remove this assumption, suddenly it's not workable anymore.
Not at all. I don't think a franchise value fluctuates much on a year by year basis at all. We've sucked for almost 20 years and we're still packing it in. What I will say though is that over time you don't have the same branding that you used to. The club is still going to be worth tons of cash though.. look at the Leafs.

Bottom line is though that it's in your best intersest to build contending teams and maintain that branding of excellence. Otherwise you may lose some of that intersest to soccer or some other sport down the line.
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
LOL.
Yeah, that's what I figured. You've had no exposure to C-level people at all.
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
Leonsis "tried" because that was the only thing he could do! The Capitals were a joke of a franchise back in their Jagr days. The value of the team couldn't be lower. So in these circumstances, yes, it makes sense to take some risk. Had Leonsis managed a rich team, he would never had go this route.

This is what happen to every team that goes the tanking route. They never starts as a rich bubble team - they start at the bottom, and then decide to stay there for a few years in order to try to draft super stars.
Leonsis had freakin' Jaromir Jagr and his huge contract. WTH are you talking about man? The guy decided that he'd had enough of bubble teams and wanted to win so he tried a different strategy. You can agree with that strategy or not but at least he tried to win.


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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
LG, I don't want to sound harsh, but nobody care if you find this acceptable or not. Especially not management. You're not a stakeholder here. I'm not trying to have a conversation here, I'm trying to explain to you something that is actually pretty obvious if you have any kind of business experience. Managers don't let the value of their company go down - period. The Molsons don't want to learn that their baby lost hundreds of millions because their manager believed it made sense to ran the team to the ground on the vague hope of getting better on the long term. That's why your stuff about "ROI" and "you never worked with CEO" is LOL worthy: you so obviously don't know what you are talking about, and you're trying to cover it with theoretical crap. And you're entire argumentation is built on this. You've devoted so much time making your point, it's just too late for you do admit your assumption was pure speculation and walk back a little. No, instead, every single manager of the Montreal Canadiens franchise must sucks because they don't do what you think they should do.
This is BS. Sorry but it is.

First, there's no doubt that ownership doesn't care. That's been my point all alone dude. It's shocking that you're actually using this as an argument when you've sat there blaming the fans for where we are. This alone is contradiction enough to blow your position right out of the water so thanks for that.

Secondly, in the arguments above you just finished saying that a teams' value doesn't change much from year to year but now you sit here and say "management won't let it's company value go down?" So if that's the case how the hell does rebuilding harm anything? Seriously dude.

Third the "we can't do it" argument is the last bastion of the apologist. We absolutely can and SHOULD rebuild. It makes no sense not to build a club that will improve your corporate branding and have a much better chance at having longer runs in the playoffs. Not rebuilding is a choice. We aren't Columbus or Carolina. We actually have fans paying top dollar, corporate sponsorship, TV deals and tons of other revenue streams that other clubs can only dream of. Look at the Leafs, they're rolling in cash and haven't made the playoffs in almost a decade so this argument is just chalk full of BS.

Bottom line is that we need an owner who cares about winning. It's not about 'spoiled' fans who feel their 'entitled' to cups. It's about having an ownership that actually cares about winning cups.

As for rebuilding itself... the reason I've argued is:

1. Superstars genereally don't become free agents
2. We've shown little ability to atttract them
3. We haven't had superstars since Roy left
4. We haven't had a cup since Roy left
5. Superstars are a main ingredient to cup winning teams

If we could go out and sign Sid Crosby, I'd be all for it. But we can't. So managment has to find ways around this. But we don't. We go out and get TK and deal for Scott Gomez. There is absolutely no vision from management at all.

You're okay with us icing losers. Good for you. Some of us aren't okay with this. That doesn't make us spoiled or bad fans. If you want to blame somebody for where we are at and how badly we've sucked for 15+ years point the finger elsewhere and stop coming up with this apologist crap.

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Old
02-25-2012, 02:40 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
A rebuild is not possible because it doesn't make sense from the point of view of ownsership and management to attempt one. No habs management will ever attempt one, because no ownsership will ever accept it, because nobody who is rich enough to buy the habs is stupid enough to make this kind of business mistake. And I blame the fans (or at least, the fans who demand for such a rebuild) for not understanding that, and for calling multiple management teams over more than a decade incompetent because they took into account something that you chose to ignore.
Yeah right... we'll go broke if we rebuild. Tell that to the Leafs who've missed the playoffs for a decade and light their cigars with hundred dollar bills.

And then you go and defend these guys...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
If you ask management to "to look at the long term" while ignoring the money portion of the equation, then yes, you have unrealistic expectations. Hockey is a business. If you have trouble with this fact then what the ***** do you expect me to say? It won't go away just because you feel like it.
That's right it's a business. You also make more money when you ice winning teams and have superstars on it. Fortunately for us we're the Montreal Canadiens though so we'll make money no matter what.

So why the hell not rebuild?
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For God sakes, just look at this season! Do you think the Molsons are happy about the results? About all the front pages they made for the wrong reasons? All the season ticket holders who are complaining? The sponsors who don't want to be associated with losers? Televised habs game being less popular? Do you see a lot of average fans being content over the thought of drafting high versus not making the playoffs? The Molsons know very well what happen when the team start to stagnate and miss the post-season a few time in a row. They don't want the franchise to look what it used to look circa 2000, when the Center Bell wasn't full every night, and team was the laughing stock of the city, and the franchise value less than half it is right now. They can't affort to ignore that.
Do you think they'll lose money this year? Or next if we tank again? No.

They'll make a ton of cash like they always do.
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
First, the vast, vast majority of average fans don't care about prospects and drafts. They don't know who Yakupov or Grigorenko are, nor would they care if we draft them, until (and if) they become star players.

Second, the habs circa 2000 is evidence that fans don't think like that. Expectations were low, results were low, but it didn't stop fans from *****ing.

The Montreal forum on hfboards isn't representative at all of how the average fans in the street follow the team. Unfortunately, a lot of habs fans are band-waggoners, and won't watch the team if it's not doing well, period.
Yeah right... the fans don't know anything about prospects. C'mon dude...
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
Ok listen.

You guys think habs management can affort a tank-and-rebuild strategy?
Without a doubt they can.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
You think it's just a matter of competence?
No, it's a matter of desire and competence.
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
You don't want to understand how ownership doesn't see it that way?
I think we clearly understand that management only cares about 8th place. The difference between you and us though is that you're okay with this and will make excuses for it.
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
Please, be my guess, continue to be disappointed. Continue to have unrealistic expectations. I couldn't care less. Have a nice day
It's not about expectations. Nobody expects management to come to their senses. There's been no indication that we care about anything but 8th place.

But that's not the fault of the fans. That's the fault of ownership. Your blame is misplaced.

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Old
02-25-2012, 03:06 PM
  #85
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Lafleurs Guy:

Excellent thread ownage.



I will just add that not only should the Habs rebuild, but they're in a good position to do so. They wouldn't be building a team from scratch.

1) Subban, Gorges, Emelin and Diaz constitute half of a great NHL defense. Tinordi and Beaulieu may come on line in a few years. It's not a great defense now, but it could become one with feasible effort.
2) The combination of Eller, Desharnais, and Plekanec makes any one of them a treadeable asset, depending on what we're getting back. This is even more true if Leblanc progresses.
3) We have good draft picks this year and next, and we have Trevor Timmins, the most competent person in the organization.
4) We have a franchise goalie.
5) Pacioretty and Cole make half of a great top-6 winger core. Gionta pulls his weight and is a reliable 25 goal scorer, but he's injured this year.
6) The bottom-6 forwards core is garbage, but that's the easiest part of the team to build via free agency.

So there is no need for a New York Islanders or Pittsburgh Penguins style rebuild. We are not starting from zero. We just need a few, doable things:

1) Two years of good drafting. Don't trade the 1st rounder for Alex Tanguay. Don't trade the second rounder for Dominic Moore. Just trust Timmins. Yakupov/Grigorenko would go a long way.
2) Pick up a top-4 dman off the UFA market. Consider packaging one of our 2nd line centers to get a top-4 dman by trade.
3) Make Gomez and Kaberle disappear.
4) Get a real checking/defensive third line.

It's not easy, but it's not that hard. A real stanley cup contender could be on the scene in Montreal in as little as 3 seasons from now.

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02-25-2012, 03:07 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by hogtownhabsfan View Post
Honestly I think Gauthier is doing a heck of a job, pretty much every move has been a win, and a one year tank is exactly what we need to acquire that one elite forward that has been eluding us. The on ice results are obviously disappointing, but thats not the GMs responsibility. Not sold on RC though.
Someone can quote this with a 'Not sure if serious' joker pic? Too lazy to google it...

I mean really?? Every move has been a win, are you ****ing living under a rock or something? First off, Kaberle, Campoli, Nokelainen, are not exactly considered 'good moves'. In fact, they rank at the Top 10 worst moves of this season.

Telling your coach to show off Gomez on the PP and on ES is also a terrible idea since nobody's gonna pick him up anyway. This guy is a distraction to the team. They are wasting talent and the development of their younger players, ie. Eller, DD, Leblanc.

The Jacques Martin firing, even though overhyped by the media, was a classless move and a stupid one at that, as we were still 4 points close to the 8th spot and had a game plan that was still clear and solid, even if not well executed by the players.

The Bourque move was actually interesting when you look at what it brings (or remove) on the salary cap. But that's it. This player has no impact and looks to be yet another Kostitsyn/Pouliot kind of player... you know, the lazy ones Montreal seem so fond of. Still, I'll wait till next year for my final judgement on him but let's just say I'm really not impressed.

The Gill/Geoffrion move is quite good I must admit, but unless Geoffrion starts the season with the big club next year, this is yet another irrelevant move.

As for the tanking, for the last time, there will never be a team that's gonna lose games on purpose, and if you think it's the plan here, you have never played a competitive sport in your life sir.

The management in place is also very bad at coach/developping the guy who could become our franchise player for the next decade: Subban. They are destroying him, literally. I'm all for 'breaking' a player ect, but there are limits to holding his abilities and telling him not to go offense. HE is the guy who should transport the puck off the blue line, not ****ing Gomez! But yeah, I know Subban can be a ***** at times, don't worry I'm not defending him, I just think this guy should be developed differently. Take your time with him, and stop having the impression he should be our Lidstrom right away. Oh he'll be our Lidstrom. But not now when he's 22 years old and plays without an explary defensman like Markov and has ****** teammates.

Also, what's up with Plekanec? Can't Cunneyworth just disband the Cole-DD-Pac line for 2 games, just to see what Pleky can bring with them? After doing it all year long with Gomez while the Cole line was working and now that it's not as effective they let it in place? What the **** with this coaching staff.

Oh while I'm talking about coaching! Ladouceur! Get this moron out of this team ASAP. He's breaking what's left of optimism in this locker room.

Coaching? Larry Carrière. Nuff said. No experience as a coach as well. Good job PG.

--

So? Still think Pierre Gauthier has made awesome moves?

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02-26-2012, 05:56 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
Of course they chose to try to make the playoffs, duh. That's my point. It's very important for them.

The fans reaction would be even worst if the team rebuilt. That you belief the contrary is your own little narrative. In practice all the fans are interested is the "right now", and they will spend accordingly.

Again, that's your little analysis, with no ground on reality. In practice, no ownsership will accept to see the value of its company go down - even just for a year - just on the remote possibility that it could go up latter. This is pure wishful thinking.

All these things can happen without the team sucking for a while and risking massive lost in value. That it would be easier to get these kinds of players by tanking is beside the point.

'cause most of the time (including the last few years, and exceptionally not this year), this strategy has allow the team to make the playoffs and be very popular in Montreal - and when you make the playoffs, you don't know what will happen next. No franchise is going to risk its core value just for the possible chance of doing better latter. You problem is simple: you vastly understestimate how much a franchise value can fluctuate over the years if the team isn't competitive. You're doing this because it's the only way your tanking theory makes sense. If you remove this assumption, suddenly it's not workable anymore.

LOL.

Leonsis "tried" because that was the only thing he could do! The Capitals were a joke of a franchise back in their Jagr days. The value of the team couldn't be lower. So in these circumstances, yes, it makes sense to take some risk. Had Leonsis managed a rich team, he would never had go this route.

This is what happen to every team that goes the tanking route. They never starts as a rich bubble team - they start at the bottom, and then decide to stay there for a few years in order to try to draft super stars.

LG, I don't want to sound harsh, but nobody care if you find this acceptable or not. Especially not management. You're not a stakeholder here. I'm not trying to have a conversation here, I'm trying to explain to you something that is actually pretty obvious if you have any kind of business experience. Managers don't let the value of their company go down - period. The Molsons don't want to learn that their baby lost hundreds of millions because their manager believed it made sense to ran the team to the ground on the vague hope of getting better on the long term. That's why your stuff about "ROI" and "you never worked with CEO" is LOL worthy: you so obviously don't know what you are talking about, and you're trying to cover it with theoretical crap. And you're entire argumentation is built on this. You've devoted so much time making your point, it's just too late for you do admit your assumption was pure speculation and walk back a little. No, instead, every single manager of the Montreal Canadiens franchise must sucks because they don't do what you think they should do.
I'll sum up all of your posts by saying that the Habs don't sell Coca Cola. They are a pro sports CLUB, and your corporatist thinking does not apply. If you love corporate thinking so much, go chear for the Leafs.

And by the way, I would not be proud of any of our corporations or the way they are run the last 20 years. 20% youth unemployment throughout the west say lots about how effective they've been.

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02-26-2012, 06:03 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
First, the vast, vast majority of average fans don't care about prospects and drafts. They don't know who Yakupov or Grigorenko are, nor would they care if we draft them, until (and if) they become star players.

Second, the habs circa 2000 is evidence that fans don't think like that. Expectations were low, results were low, but it didn't stop fans from *****ing.

The Montreal forum on hfboards isn't representative at all of how the average fans in the street follow the team. Unfortunately, a lot of habs fans are band-waggoners, and won't watch the team if it's not doing well, period.
So what?

So most fans don't give a ****? Good excuse for not rebuilding then.

You know what, someone asked Mel Blanc, the creator and producer of Bugs Bunny cartoons and much other excellent work, if he thought of his viewers when he worked. He said no, we work to our own standards of excellence, and that's all.

I don't give a **** if most Habs fans don't care. I expect the Habs to care.

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02-26-2012, 06:10 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Goldthorpe View Post
A rebuild is not possible because it doesn't make sense from the point of view of ownsership and management to attempt one. No habs management will ever attempt one, because no ownsership will ever accept it, because nobody who is rich enough to buy the habs is stupid enough to make this kind of business mistake. And I blame the fans (or at least, the fans who demand for such a rebuild) for not understanding that, and for calling multiple management teams over more than a decade incompetent because they took into account something that you chose to ignore.

If you ask management to "to look at the long term" while ignoring the money portion of the equation, then yes, you have unrealistic expectations. Hockey is a business. If you have trouble with this fact then what the ***** do you expect me to say? It won't go away just because you feel like it.

For God sakes, just look at this season! Do you think the Molsons are happy about the results? About all the front pages they made for the wrong reasons? All the season ticket holders who are complaining? The sponsors who don't want to be associated with losers? Televised habs game being less popular? Do you see a lot of average fans being content over the thought of drafting high versus not making the playoffs? The Molsons know very well what happen when the team start to stagnate and miss the post-season a few time in a row. They don't want the franchise to look what it used to look circa 2000, when the Center Bell wasn't full every night, and team was the laughing stock of the city, and the franchise value less than half it is right now. They can't affort to ignore that.
When the Japanese began to kick our ***** designing cars, it took the geniuses in Detriot 10 years to stop trying quick fixes and start sweating the important and painful things, like starting from scratch and designing good cars again.

If you think long term thinking and short term loss have no place in the corporate world, you are wrong.

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02-26-2012, 08:28 AM
  #90
ECWHSWI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsl View Post
When the Japanese began to kick our ***** designing cars, it took the geniuses in Detriot 10 years to stop trying quick fixes and start sweating the important and painful things, like starting from scratch and designing good cars again.

If you think long term thinking and short term loss have no place in the corporate world, you are wrong.
get what you're trying to say but... your comparison is no good...

cause while not winning much, Habs are still making some $. (they,re still at the top in that aspect)

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02-26-2012, 10:20 AM
  #91
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Gainey was the tool, Gauthier was the re-tool

Time for a no-tool.

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02-26-2012, 02:13 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
What we need is a young assistant GM who has a fresh approach to the game. Who understands the new facets and what it takes to win. A real visionary.

Our new GM needs to be someone who is stoic. Does not get influenced by the politics and the pressure of the city. Someone who can stand stone-faced in the throng of reporters who are trying to make stories out of nothing; call them out for what they are and run the operation the way the organization dictates it should be. Not through what the public pressure is.
Hi Bob!

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02-26-2012, 02:20 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
Gainey was the tool, Gauthier was the re-tool

Time for a no-tool.
You know, part of being a good manager is getting the most out of your people. This is something people don't mention a lot and is something that Bob did and that Gauthier doesn't.

Both (Bob and Gauthier) are always put together but I think that the Habs would have had a better year with Bob and Pierre B. then with Gauthier and Molson.

I do think, however, that getting a top 3-5 pick is what this team needs since that new player will fit in with Price, subban, Pacior, etc.

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