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Handzus and Smyth

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Old
02-27-2012, 10:41 PM
  #1
MxH0CKEY
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Handzus and Smyth

Did these two players really affect this team that much? We often say Kings are never getting the lucky bounces but it always seemed that these two would gobble up all of those lucky bounces last year. We have seen how much one goal makes a difference this year and I think that these two are clutch in those situations which would have probably altared the way this season has gone drastically. With eight 1-0 games lost this season you would think that these two would have changed the way half of those would have gone. If we would have tied up half of those games and sent them to overtime we would own the 7th spot today and if we would have won 4 of those 8 we would be in 6th place today. You would think that older players would benefit more in the "old style systems" right? The Sharks seems to love Handzus as he is not only been playing solid defensively but chipping in more offensively as well and Smyth has shown signs of magic with the young Oilers team as well as being a solid mentor to their young stars. Could these two be key factors for this team this year?

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02-27-2012, 10:50 PM
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Herby
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The Kings should have gotten rid of Stoll and kept Handzus. He is better in all facets of the game except for skating and faceoffs, and it's not like Zues is a liability in the circle. This was a huge miscalculation by the Kings management in thinking Stoll could fill the role Zues had.

Smyth has pulled his yearly Houdini act after yet another fast start. He may have helped the Kings in October and November, but beyond that he is as useless as Penner with a bigger cap hit.

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02-27-2012, 11:20 PM
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Rorschach
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingsation8 View Post
Did these two players really affect this team that much? We often say Kings are never getting the lucky bounces but it always seemed that these two would gobble up all of those lucky bounces last year. We have seen how much one goal makes a difference this year and I think that these two are clutch in those situations which would have probably altared the way this season has gone drastically. With eight 1-0 games lost this season you would think that these two would have changed the way half of those would have gone. If we would have tied up half of those games and sent them to overtime we would own the 7th spot today and if we would have won 4 of those 8 we would be in 6th place today. You would think that older players would benefit more in the "old style systems" right? The Sharks seems to love Handzus as he is not only been playing solid defensively but chipping in more offensively as well and Smyth has shown signs of magic with the young Oilers team as well as being a solid mentor to their young stars. Could these two be key factors for this team this year?
In the past, yes. But even if we kept them, it's not likely they would help us much this year...just too old.

Also, Simmonds, we miss him a lot too.

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02-28-2012, 12:23 AM
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Johnny Utah
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We miss Simmonds and Handzus. I would've liked to seen what Sutter would have done with Simmonds, possibly using him in another role.

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02-28-2012, 12:26 AM
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I don't miss their grandma speed.

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02-28-2012, 12:27 AM
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KingLB
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Its funny how people are dying for Zues over here, on the SJ board they wanted him gone.

Grass is always greener.

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02-28-2012, 01:28 AM
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drugold
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does anyone remember how slow zues got in the last half of the season? smyth stopped caring until the playoffs.
in front of the net and along the boards, these two havent been replaced. everywhere else has been improved by moving them.
HANDZUS

"sometimes i laugh"

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02-28-2012, 01:29 AM
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KingPurpleDinosaur
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this team just is in a sick funk. You people think if we had handzus, if we had smythe, if we had simmonds, when in reality our lineup is FAR superior then anything we had last year and i'll stand by that. on paper, this may be THE best kings lineup i've ever seen.

i don't know what's going on behind the locker room. but there's just something eating away at this group

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02-28-2012, 06:55 AM
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Minor Boarding
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With Handzus and Smyth, the Kings still ended up in the bottom 5 in scoring for the past 3 out of 4 seasons.

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02-28-2012, 07:03 AM
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What they also brought other than net presence was leadership and mentorship. Could use some of that now, to help these guys out of their funk.

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02-28-2012, 07:38 AM
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Minor Boarding
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Originally Posted by BigBrown View Post
What they also brought other than net presence was leadership and mentorship. Could use some of that now, to help these guys out of their funk.
Smyth is playing 3rd line minutes right now in Edmonton and has been MIA since Christmas on ateam that is all offense and has shown zero desire to play in their own zone.
Handzus is a healthy scratch in SJ - the team that has about the same losing record as the Kings in the past 10 games. Some Sharks want him gone.

Like a guy mentioned the grass is always greener...

This team needs goalscorers, more depth at the bottom 6 and a coach that isn't stuck in the 90's era hockey.

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02-28-2012, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Minor Boarding View Post
Smyth is playing 3rd line minutes right now in Edmonton and has been MIA since Christmas on ateam that is all offense and has shown zero desire to play in their own zone.
Handzus is a healthy scratch in SJ - the team that has about the same losing record as the Kings in the past 10 games. Some Sharks want him gone.

Like a guy mentioned the grass is always greener...

This team needs goalscorers, more depth at the bottom 6 and a coach that isn't stuck in the 90's era hockey.
I just said the team might be missing some leadership and veteran mentorship, I didn't argue that they would be huge difference makers on the ice themselves. People complain all the time about Lombardi putting too much emphasis on mentors and leaders, character guys, instead of talent. Well look what happened when the Kings lost their two most important character veterans on the team. Is it a coincidence? Maybe, but it's at least interesting.

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02-28-2012, 10:26 AM
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Smyth doesn't care enough and isn't young enough to play 82 games. This was true last year as well. We should have kept him for the playoffs, maybe, but having him would not be the solution to any regular season problems at all.

Handzus kept getting slower and slower. There is a big difference in what you can accomplish when you are half a stride slower than average, and when you are a stride slower, and when you are a stride and a half slower...the ideal third liner now was the guy we were relying on as 2C years ago. I don't think keeping him was the answer, but replacing him should have been more of a priority.

IMO Richards makes up for the character if not the veteran presence or the role in front of the net.

Brown is showing signs of life, but it may be too late to save the season.

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02-28-2012, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingsation8 View Post
The Sharks seems to love Handzus as he is not only been playing solid defensively but chipping in more offensively as well

Not. Even. Close. He's the worst forward on the team. We all hate him.


But if you guys want him so bad we'll trade him to you guys for a 7th.

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02-28-2012, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Kingsation8 View Post
Did these two players really affect this team that much?
To some extent, yeah. It's odd to think, but the team does not really have the personnel to do what the coaches are preaching.

During the Nashville game, Bill Ranford kept stressing that the team needs more front net presence, but outside of the long goal the Kings managed, it just did not happen.

Smyth, Handzus, and Simmonds were the primary guys that made their living at the front of the opposition net. The three of them all did a good job of screening the goalie and being around to occupy an opposing defender to leave someone else free to pick up a loose puck.

If you go up and down the current roster there are only two players who even attempt to be a "front net presence" and that's Dustin Brown and Dustin Penner. Neither one of who are very good at doing it - evidenced by how often they are shown in replays to either mistime their screen, or jump or turn away from the shot to allow the goalie a clean look.

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02-28-2012, 01:15 PM
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Lol yea I think he actually might be a regular scratch now with Winnik and Galiardi arriving.

None the less. It's like Nashville last night. They don't have the most talented lineup by any means, but they have a great cohesiveness between player types, and system. We had great cohesion with the TYPES of players Smyth and Handzus were, and the way we played.

People have said it before, we changed the players and not the system. I think changing the players was the right thing to do, cause we are a way more talented hockey team, but we just aren't using them right right now. We used Smyth and Handzus correctly.

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02-28-2012, 02:01 PM
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Minor Boarding
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Lol yea I think he actually might be a regular scratch now with Winnik and Galiardi arriving.

None the less. It's like Nashville last night. They don't have the most talented lineup by any means, but they have a great cohesiveness between player types, and system. We had great cohesion with the TYPES of players Smyth and Handzus were, and the way we played.

People have said it before, we changed the players and not the system. I think changing the players was the right thing to do, cause we are a way more talented hockey team, but we just aren't using them right right now. We used Smyth and Handzus correctly.
yes, traded them away before they will need 2periods to manage to skate once around the ice rink.

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02-28-2012, 02:14 PM
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Herby
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Originally Posted by Mafoofoo View Post
Not. Even. Close. He's the worst forward on the team. We all hate him.


But if you guys want him so bad we'll trade him to you guys for a 7th.
Should have made a trade at the deadline..

Handzus for Stoll or a 7th round pick (not much difference in value)

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02-28-2012, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Mafoofoo View Post
Not. Even. Close. He's the worst forward on the team. We all hate him.


But if you guys want him so bad we'll trade him to you guys for a 7th.
Thank you for pointing out how ridiculous this thread is.

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02-28-2012, 02:24 PM
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kingsholygrail
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It's not Handzus and Smyth.


It's net presence.

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02-28-2012, 02:24 PM
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Minor Boarding
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Thank you for pointing out how ridiculous this thread is.
you know the saying that can be applied often on these boards now that the forwards are struggling to produce goals.
The Grass Is Always Greener On The Other Side

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02-28-2012, 02:39 PM
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Thrice
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Originally Posted by Minor Boarding View Post
you know the saying that can be applied often on these boards now that the forwards are struggling to produce goals.
The Grass Is Always Greener On The Other Side
Exactly! If you compare the "hate" that Ryan Smyth got during the 2nd half of last season to the actual hate currently being spewed by the Oilers fan base because of his tailed off play, it goes to show just how understanding and forgiving the majority of Kings fans truly can be.

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02-28-2012, 02:53 PM
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Herby
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Exactly! If you compare the "hate" that Ryan Smyth got during the 2nd half of last season to the actual hate currently being spewed by the Oilers fan base because of his tailed off play, it goes to show just how understanding and forgiving the majority of Kings fans truly can be.
I think a large reason is because of the lack of media coverage the Kings get.

Smyth was the Kings 2nd highest paid player last season, and it could be argued from about January on, he was one of, if not the worst player on the team. If a similar player for the Lakers or Dodgers played like he did that player would have been crucified by the media.

Smyth is now in a market where hockey is everything and his play is much more scrutinized by the media and thus the fans.

Couldn't happen to a nicer guy.

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02-28-2012, 03:05 PM
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Sydor25
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Handzus? He was slower than a turtle on ice.

Smyth? Yes, his play falls apart after December and he should really be given some rest during the season. He should play 60 games per season, he just can't handle the wear and tear of his style anymore for 82 games. I think Smyth is missed, but Gagne was worth the risk and the Kings had a lineup for a more dynamic offense this season, but Lombard/Murray/Sutter have a different view of the NHL.

The 25th ranked offense + no change in system with smaller, more skilled players = 30th in offense. Lombardi seems to bring in players that don't fit his mold and then wonders why they can't play the 2-1 grind-it-out style? Lombardi seems like all ego to me. Most GMs wouldn't keep hiring the same failed coaches and most GMs aren't even given a chance to hire 3 coaches during their tenure.

I don't think AEG will give him a 4th.

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