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Red Fisher "Habs fail to build for future"

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Old
02-28-2012, 05:33 PM
  #1
Habaneros
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Red Fisher "Habs fail to build for future"

http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/...945/story.html


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If Staubitz can't make it with the Wild, he can't make it anywhere other than filling a hole with the American HockeyLeague's Hamilton Bulldogs.
Quote:
Here's the point: the fact the Canadiens decided to make progress by standing still, as they have been in most of the first 63 games this season, means 29 other teams now consider this once-proud franchise irrelevant. Canadiens management is aware help is needed in a lot of areas, but what they learned to their dismay Monday was that D-Day stood for disinterest. Once, teams would line up looking for help from this franchise. The view was that if a player was good enough to wear the CH, he surely had something to offer. Now, the franchise is in disarray from the top down. Now, it's an embarrassment unworthy of attention. Where has the talent gone? Where has the pride?

Quote:
Gauthier's future with the organization. Some of the wild and crazy personnel decisions he's made this season have him skating on paper-thin ice at best, so does he stay or go?

Read more: http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/...#ixzz1nibynS7w


Last edited by Habaneros: 02-28-2012 at 05:39 PM.
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02-28-2012, 05:46 PM
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Lemons
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
This guy should stop writing now.


We failed. Gainey's plan, our new acquisitions, our experiment or whatever you want to call it. Thats because management has always put faith in this team to put up a perennial competing team. Things did not pan out. At least management have come to accept it. We traded away UFAs to the best of our abilities (AK, Gill). We KNOW we're a cellar team and the frustration that is going to build up in the locker room and on the ice. With that into account, getting a physical fighter helps on two things.

1) Ease the players frustration and give/build morale when a player fights for them.

2) Appease the crowd on a team not bound for the playoffs.

Our future is bright. Beaulieu, Tinordi, Gallagher, Patches, PRice, PK, Eller are great pieces to push the franchise into the future. All we are missing is a superstar potential player (Grigorenko/Yakupov)


Shut the **** up Red Fisher. Habs are not going to win while you're alive, sorry to break it to you.

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02-28-2012, 05:51 PM
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Em Ancien
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemons View Post
This guy should stop writing now.


We failed. Gainey's plan, our new acquisitions, our experiment or whatever you want to call it. Thats because management has always put faith in this team to put up a perennial competing team. Things did not pan out. At least management have come to accept it. We traded away UFAs to the best of our abilities (AK, Gill). We KNOW we're a cellar team and the frustration that is going to build up in the locker room and on the ice. With that into account, getting a physical fighter helps on two things.

1) Ease the players frustration and give/build morale when a player fights for them.

2) Appease the crowd on a team not bound for the playoffs.

Our future is bright. Beaulieu, Tinordi, Gallagher, Patches, PRice, PK, Eller are great pieces to push the franchise into the future. All we are missing is a superstar potential player (Grigorenko/Yakupov)


Shut the **** up Red Fisher. Habs are not going to win while you're alive, sorry to break it to you.
He's paid to write stuff in the papers.

He's right. We're a high profile franchise with a massive budget. We've managed to screw that up despite having the funds.

The article doesn't bring anything of value to the discussion though.

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02-28-2012, 05:57 PM
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JLP
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Maybe Red meant "Habs fail, to build for future" ?

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02-28-2012, 05:58 PM
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DAChampion
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Big budget?

Who cares.


Other big budget teams such as Toronto, Chicago, Boston and NYR have also had trouble.

NYR was mostly saved by a trade where they acquired Higgins, McDonagh and Gaborik for Gomez.

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02-28-2012, 06:00 PM
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Schwang
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
He's paid to write stuff in the papers.

He's right. We're a high profile franchise with a massive budget. We've managed to screw that up despite having the funds.

The article doesn't bring anything of value to the discussion though.
Rangers are too. They sucked for years and tried to buy a cup many times. Now look at them.

We are a big time centre away. Hopefully, this draft will be it.

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02-28-2012, 06:03 PM
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domdo345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemons View Post
This guy should stop writing now.


We failed. Gainey's plan, our new acquisitions, our experiment or whatever you want to call it. Thats because management has always put faith in this team to put up a perennial competing team. Things did not pan out. At least management have come to accept it. We traded away UFAs to the best of our abilities (AK, Gill). We KNOW we're a cellar team and the frustration that is going to build up in the locker room and on the ice. With that into account, getting a physical fighter helps on two things.

1) Ease the players frustration and give/build morale when a player fights for them.

2) Appease the crowd on a team not bound for the playoffs.

Our future is bright. Beaulieu, Tinordi, Gallagher, Patches, PRice, PK, Eller are great pieces to push the franchise into the future. All we are missing is a superstar potential player (Grigorenko/Yakupov)


Shut the **** up Red Fisher. Habs are not going to win while you're alive, sorry to break it to you.
heh. classic case of a writer stirring up **** because the casual fan ( and the majority of the fans ARE casual, just not on HF) gets all emotional and approves.

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02-28-2012, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemons View Post
This guy should stop writing now.


We failed. Gainey's plan, our new acquisitions, our experiment or whatever you want to call it. Thats because management has always put faith in this team to put up a perennial competing team. Things did not pan out. At least management have come to accept it. We traded away UFAs to the best of our abilities (AK, Gill). We KNOW we're a cellar team and the frustration that is going to build up in the locker room and on the ice. With that into account, getting a physical fighter helps on two things.

1) Ease the players frustration and give/build morale when a player fights for them.

2) Appease the crowd on a team not bound for the playoffs.

Our future is bright. Beaulieu, Tinordi, Gallagher, Patches, PRice, PK, Eller are great pieces to push the franchise into the future. All we are missing is a superstar potential player (Grigorenko/Yakupov)


Shut the **** up Red Fisher. Habs are not going to win while you're alive, sorry to break it to you.

I agree with you. I respect what Red Fisher has meant to Montreal hockey journalism historically but I'm tired of the negative journalism. No ****, Sherlock. Things haven't worked out.....in part, because we kept thinking we were one player away from a cup contender or at other times injuries forced the team into bandaid solutions....consequently depleting our prospect resources (players and picks). Was Red expecting to make a blockbuster deal for Nash and that that would have turned a last place Eastern conference team into a cup contender? At some point, you have to accept that we have to do more and that can only come with the patience of seeing a draft or two through again, as well as a summer of free agency.
I appreciate how some think we are a centre and a defenseman away from contending from the cup. I think that's just the start. Likely, we are that and quality depth players away from contention.....just in case, injuries happen.....so that we don't start selling off resources if we hit a few bumps along the way.
I'm just tired of this negative journalism because I think it tells most Canadiens fans little we do not already know and maybe even B.S.'s us a bit too. It just serves to create an atmosphere that players don't want to play in. Compare comments about Montreal vs. Nashville from ex-Habs.
Can anything positive come out of this year from journalists even if the on-ice product has not produced many?

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02-28-2012, 06:04 PM
  #9
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All I have to say is that the Gainey-Gauthier Duo over the last what 10 years have tried and failed. The Habs have had ups and downs but they did NOTHING to address the future. Their foresight is very limited and they patch way too much. Bad trades, bad signings, bad hockey decisions across the board.

They were given their chance and failed. They weren't Columbus or Islander bad, but most years they barely make the play-offs. That's not good enough.

I'm hoping Molson and the other decision makers give someone else the chance to get this team back to at least being respected again. Most people I speak to at least had respect for Gainey. Not many people like MR. Gauthier at all.

I want to be able to watch a game and feel like the Habs can win against any team any day of the week. I've become used to them struggling to make the play-offs. I'm not asking for back to back Stanley cups like in the 70ies. I'm just asking for a team that plays 60 min on most nights and finishes in the top 5 in the conference every year to have a decent chance at reaching the finals.

It's one thing to cheer for a team when you think management is doing the right thing. It's another thing to believe your GM/Coach are brain dead, struggle to win and be 10th most of the season and the ownership keeps them on boards for years. If you can't see the staff you hired aren't making good hockey decisions, then I may start cheering for another team who can give you something to cheer about.

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02-28-2012, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Big budget?

Who cares.


Other big budget teams such as Toronto, Chicago, Boston and NYR have also had trouble.

NYR was mostly saved by a trade where they acquired Higgins, McDonagh and Gaborik for Gomez.
When did Gaborik play for the Habs? I fell asleep that season.

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02-28-2012, 06:06 PM
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DAChampion
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Originally Posted by Physical HABuse View Post
When did Gaborik play for the Habs? I fell asleep that season.
The day after the trade, the Rangers offered 7.5 million per year to Gaborik.

They're not just a better team because of McDonagh, they're a better team because Gomez' cap hit is gone.

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02-28-2012, 06:07 PM
  #12
llamateizer
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what you expect to do?

Commodore was traded for a conditionnal 7th
while Spacek and campoli werent traded

they have negative value.

Moen and Darche are injured and not tradeable
all the rest are RFA or under contracts

he wasnt able to do anything without touching the core
and the last thing we want is this.

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02-28-2012, 06:09 PM
  #13
Physical HABuse
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
The day after the trade, the Rangers offered 7.5 million per year to Gaborik.

They're not just a better team because of McDonagh, they're a better team because Gomez' cap hit is gone.
I know....but it was worded as if in one trade for Gomez those other players were given up by the other team.

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02-28-2012, 06:10 PM
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It's not like we haven't made good decisions for our future. Trading for Gorges and Eller will be huge. Getting rid of Cammalleri is a plus.

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02-28-2012, 06:13 PM
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So all the other teams that couldn't make a deal are in a shambles as well?

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02-28-2012, 06:17 PM
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Decent stuff from Fisher, who has a right to be old and crochety. Stuff has been comical this year. PG is amateur hour. Red was too quick to judge Staubitz who hasn't even taken a stride, but otherwise I agree with him (he gave BG a pass too).

Just a complete botchfest. Markov, 4th line C, defence (so much inexperience), asset management (Cammy and Kostitsyn, Gill are gone we got 2nds.... meanwhile Buf is acquiring 1st picks and Cody Hodgson), coach firings (also known as save my own ass tactics), and the massive PR nightmare known as the 2012 Habs. But things are good looking out with our prospects and potential lottery pick. Red is just thinking short term. He may really not have another 5 year plan left.

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02-28-2012, 06:19 PM
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Lemons, I'm not sure what your problem is with this article man. We're a cellar dwellar in spite of silly short term moves and I don't see how you could call our future 'great' right now. At best our future is 'uncertain'.

The club is a mess and we just unloaded AK for basically nothing. The club is serving it up and a lot of folks are just swallowing it down. You're eating a crap sandwich. I'm not sure why you want to tell us that it tastes good.

Be fair here, Red Fisher is right. The season has been a disaster and it's absolutely pathetic that other clubs didn't want anything to do with the guys we were trying to sell.


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02-28-2012, 06:27 PM
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People are oversensitive. The article even says other teams failed to do much and the teams in a mess. No one wants our players, our head coach is a goner, our GM may be a goner, etc...

Not sure why people dismiss the idea for no reason.

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02-28-2012, 06:52 PM
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I too, often disagree with Red. This time though, he is spot on.
I think a lot of the posters here are trying to convince themselves and others that things are not that bad. They are.

We draft well but when it comes to trades and player development, the PG/BG combo have been nothing short of abysmal. For every good move they've made, you can count multiple disastrous decisions.

Terrible signing, picking up some of the leagues worst contracts, letting go most of our prospects and seeing lots of them flourish elsewhere have made us a laughing stock in the league.

I mentioned in a a post yesterday, if I were a GM, I wouldn't trade with PG unless I was sure I was fleecing him.
It's time to face it. In terms of player development and trades, we are the new Islanders.


Last edited by Benning: 02-28-2012 at 07:13 PM.
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02-28-2012, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Lemons, I'm not sure what your problem is with this article man. We're a cellar dwellar in spite of silly short term moves and I don't see how you could call our future 'great' right now. At best our future is 'uncertain'.

The club is a mess and we just unloaded AK for basically nothing. The club is serving it up and a lot of folks are just swallowing it down. You're eating a crap sandwich. I'm not sure why you want to tell us that it tastes good.

Be fair here, Red Fisher is right. The season has been a disaster and it's absolutely pathetic that other clubs didn't want anything to do with the guys we were trying to sell.
Who else were they trying to sell besides campoli and the injured darche? AK didnt get a huge return but it seemed that D-men were the prize this trade season. Gaustad brought more to the table for a playoff team than AK does and Buffalo got a good pick for him.

He is just using this lackluster trade deadline to write a piece he has been mulling over for a while. Write about the downfall but dont talk about how people didnt want the 2 players the habs would trade for a sandwich and try to use it saying no one wants the habs players and they are all losers that people dont want.

"Where has the talent gone"....they arent trading the talent you ****ing moron that is what got them where they are now.

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02-28-2012, 07:03 PM
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"Where has the talent gone"....they arent trading the talent you ****ing moron that is what got them where they are now.
Doesn't this prove his point? If our talent gets us 15th in east, where has talent gone? Not saying I agree in the notion we have no talent, but merely suggesting this line does nothing to dispute his message. If the team is willing to trade a few players for a 'sandwich' as you say, it only proves the point that despite management valuing them low, everyone else does, and they ARE part of our organization and playing regular minutes.

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02-28-2012, 07:05 PM
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Lafleurs Guy
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Who else were they trying to sell besides campoli and the injured darche? AK didnt get a huge return but it seemed that D-men were the prize this trade season. Gaustad brought more to the table for a playoff team than AK does and Buffalo got a good pick for him.
Isn't it strange though that the guy we bring in as a backup plan for Markov generates zero interest? This is a guy we gave a raise to... why? And one of our best forwards only nets a 2nd rounder? C'mon man.

And btw, just as an aside... why were these the only guys we were looking to move? That made no sense either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Perrah View Post
He is just using this lackluster trade deadline to write a piece he has been mulling over for a while. Write about the downfall but dont talk about how people didnt want the 2 players the habs would trade for a sandwich and try to use it saying no one wants the habs players and they are all losers that people dont want.
Doesn't it say something to you though that nobody was beating down the door for our guys? I mean really apart from three or four players on our roster who would other clubs REALLY want to have? Pacman, Price, Subban, Cole and Pleks. We wasted one of our best assets in Cammy. They're the only guys who are going to net a premium. Bourque? Kaberle? Gomez? Even Gionta... nobody really wants those guys and even Eller wouldn't be a huge return. We've built a team of leftovers and folks don't want sloppy seconds. Most of those guys would generate ZERO interest and that's exactly what happened.

One of our best forwards is only worth a 2nd rounder? Sad.

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02-28-2012, 07:06 PM
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ashtraygirl
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Originally Posted by JLP View Post
Maybe Red meant "Habs fail, to build for future" ?
Well played!

I don't think that everything is quite so bleak. Obviously, this season is a write-off.

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02-28-2012, 07:06 PM
  #24
Myron Gaines*
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The habs are like "Crazy uncle Sam" in the NHL. They do everything in a very unorthodox way and the philosophy is pretty hippie like.

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02-28-2012, 07:18 PM
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If you're in your 30's 40's+ the Habs as they are right now are a pathetic excuse of an organization. You have to understand that these people saw great teams, great players, great coaches, cups, etc....so they have a right to be pissed/grumpy.

It's the younger crowd who were not around for the glory years and have nothing to compare the current team to that don't seem to think things are that dire.

The franchise is irrelevant and almost embarassing.

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